I'm not trying to rain on anyones parade with this post. Like I said, I didn't want to make it it the first place.
Will something happen? Probably not. Could it though? Tecnically, it could, and no one could argue with it.
I love sally, as do we all, and don't want to see anything happen. Now, I'm not being an alarmist; I'm simply asking cautionary questions to see how everyone else feels.
If you aren't taking a shot at anyone specific, or trying to be an alarmist, and are concerned about the issue, why not simply PM the moderators running the tournaments and/or the administrators? They probably have much more knowledge about the situation than random SYM readers.
I've addressed it. It is ridiculous. If you really want me to go back and pull out posts to make an analysis of myself I will.
The points that will be hit:
My attention to greymon before anyone else
My switching of votes being for a reason (a curse)
My suspicion of CharmMaster, contrary to what Cyan said
My argument and subsequent suspicion of Key.
If you'd like I can go an pull this out for you.
So much for paying attention, eh? Here's what I said:
N_A is right, you have been acting like Cyan's Mini-Me this game. There's no need to be beligerent, especially when you haven't exactly been Super Scum Detector this game. Cyan at least has some clout and a high appreciation of his own abilities. You only appear to be bullying people into agreeing with you.
You said you wanted 3 people lynched, and you didn't care in which order. You sure about that? If you had to put it in an order, could you?
I was referring to acting exactly like Cyan, not copying his votes or stances. I don't care if you barn Cyan, you can do what you want. I'm referring to your playstyle and tone while dealing with the other players.
Maybe a little more analysis, a little less playing Hall Monitor yelling at lurkers and bullying people into agreeing with your targets.
No, my point is that is a ridiculous accusation, and I question whether or not the two people with a combined 40 posts are really paying that much attention.
Why not address the actual accusation instead of resorting to third grade antics?
And if you'll only listen to me based on my post count, let me know, I have a day off tomorrow and would love to spam up my post count.
All right, seriously do you have some sort of problem? Is your plan to not do anything other than make snippy comments directed at me? If so please replace. All the replacements seem to be at least slightly constructive.
N_A is right, you have been acting like Cyan's Mini-Me this game. There's no need to be beligerent, especially when you haven't exactly been Super Scum Detector this game. Cyan at least has some clout and a high appreciation of his own abilities. You only appear to be bullying people into agreeing with you.
You said you wanted 3 people lynched, and you didn't care in which order. You sure about that? If you had to put it in an order, could you?
Another former LGS employee here, and what Yurei said is 100% spot on. I'd also not recommend haggling - you basically waving it in their face, and its very rude to do so.
Not to be rude, but if shop owner's are really struggling that much to make profit, then they should probably just close down anyway. You make it sound like that the card players must take pity on them and buy their stuff, so they can stay in business. Aren't businesses supposed to be, you know, a business, and not some charity case? At least, that's what how I felt after that rant.
But LGS also provide other services - mainly gaming space, events like FNM, etc. Sure, do the free market and buy from the most competitive price. But when brick and mortar stores go out of business, where will you play your FNMs or PTQs? Some eBay retailer's basement?
A similar thing happened to the travel industry in the early 2000s. Travel agents had a direct conduit to airlines and tour companies so they could sell those trips and vacations. Once Expedia, Priceline etc became popular, travel agents got cut out of their market share by these cheap online alternatives. Many people found, however, that if there was a problem with their Expedia plane tickets, they were pretty much up the creek. In the past, you could work with a real live travel agent who would be there if there were any problems, plus have the foresight to anticipate any problems to avoid them in the first place. That is a SERVICE - same as what a LGS provides. If you don't feel like paying the premium for that service, then don't complain when they aren't there to buy your collection when you stop playing, or host your tournaments, or provide you with free open gaming space.
This is not true. B&M stores can buy from WOTC Direct and WOTC distributors like GTS. They can get the boxes cheaper than any online store. WOTC locked the online stores out of their distribution network in late 2006. There is more information about this in The Card Wizard's Black Book, which is being discussed in another thread in this sub-board. Online stores aren't killing you... there are plenty of other issues that plague game shops that accomplish that result.
Every B&M store I deal with sells their boxes for $85-90 with a discount if you buy a case.
WOTC doesn't know who is an online store and who isn't. Take a look at eBay, and search for "alara reborn preorder box". Are you telling me all of these people are buying their boxes for full retail? No. These people are still getting through the cracks, and there isn't anything WOTC can do about it.
And sure they can get their boxes cheaper than an online store - they all get them for the same price. But selling a single box of cards for ~10% profit (if you are that lucky) is not sound business practice.
Support your local stores. They are not bloodthirsty corporations, so by denying them business you aren't "sticking it to the man" like people do when they download pirated music. And every region has the good store with the nice employees and nice atmosphere as well as the crappy store with rude employees and bad lighting. Go support the good store.
Is there a place where mafiachat would be available to read?
And you really thought about killing me on n0? I'm sort of honored....why? With my anti Cyan-wagon behavior i imagine i'd be a great possible lynch push, not a night kill target?
I think that this is the worst idea possible. But because it is obvious to me that we won't get a Sandsoft blue lynch, I will go along with this because no lynch = worse than, a bad one. I also, think that some of the people that got us off the sandsoft wagon are scum, and are protecting him. Unvote Vote Eleven
@DC I want investigations. Specifically on sandsoft.
This is the entire post you are referring to. Here's your post in this game.
It is kind of like what happened, with the eleven lynch in VR mafia. I was dead against lynching Eleven and then I voted for him. Mostly because the rest of the town wanted to lynch him. And it turned out to work well.
So randomly lynching people is fine, as long as they come up mafia?
I'm not seeing your point here. I *think* you are trying to say that "it is a pretty crappy plan, but its worked in the past, so why the hell not?" Is that true?
It is kind of like what happened, with the eleven lynch in VR mafia. I was dead against lynching Eleven and then I voted for him. Mostly because the rest of the town wanted to lynch him. And it turned out to work well.
Me too. Even though I am against this lynch. I have found that I am have been wrong against people before. Like me being directly against Elevens lynch.
You are against the lynch, but wish you could cast the hammering vote?
I kinda fell into a sulk Day 1 because Cyan was so obvious, not much to do about that. Then one-shot cop on Some One, and Goatrevolt sees me trying to off Dagger...bad luck for the Mafia, I'd say.
On Day 3 I just tried to throw out as many false leads as possible I also thought that Roja should have Mafiakilled ME on night 2 and then claim vig, but he got squeamish
Alright, I sort of like doing PBPAs, but I usually get beaten to the punch by someone with a little more foresight. This one ended up a little long, but I think it can help.
Response to the initial replacement posts. Asks about favor points. Makes sense now, he already had the inside track and wanted to see how much the replacements knew.
Minor suspicion on skander, supports Callaway wagon for the popular reasons. Also pushes for an answer on his replacement questions. Calls out kpaca for dodging questions.
Says he's willing to hammer because of shaky claim and poor defense in general. Later says that the lynch is happening too fast. A little contradictory in such a short post. Seems to me that the "lynch is happening too fast" is a cliche townie comment that is tacked on at the end.
More claim questioning. Says that the lynch is basically done, but there is a lot of information flowing so day should continue (I agree, but didn't seem like it had to be said at the point)
Nothing else of consequence on Day 1, just a couple of one sentence posts and votes for Callaway. Not too incriminating I'd say, and pretty similar to the consensus attitude about Callaway. Had an interest in the replacements early on, so that ties in with his claim
Votes for Skander, thinks he's scum, etc. Wants a claim from Skander.
This might be semantics, but I'll throw it out - in his previous post he said he had only really skimmed Day 2, and didn't vote Skander. In this post he votes Skander, but without any reference to a reread or further examination of past posts. Says that he suspected Skander for a while (true, based on Day 1 posts). Not saying its anything, just something I noticed. Most people seem like they would acknowledge a reread or some other reference to past posts.
This post is pretty interesting. Questions Skander not using his night talk on Night 1, because it can only help him later to confirm his claim. Interesting parallels with his own decision not to use his favor/flavor/whatever it is point ability on Night 1.
Believes Some One's claim, says its not necessarily pro-town but not scum either. Wants to get maximum usage out of it before killing SO (interesting choice of words)
Again agrees with Some One that SO should get the most use out of his ability before being lynched/Cyan'd. Maybe a subclaim about wanting his true name?
Very interesting post considering recent events. Says that he doubts there is a favor point role based on killing. AGAIN asks his question of the replacements.
During the discussion of why EP didn't use his ability on Night 1, it was theorized it could be a vig role, and that explained the selectiveness/reluctance to have guns blazing. This post would seem to contradict that. He could have been trying a little of protective misdirection, but I find most people that do this to be untrustworthy.
Another replacement post. All these posts point to one thing - EP is concerned about secondary abilities of the replacements. He seems to be worried that giving them favor points may turn on other, more sinister abilities. This could also explain the reluctance to hand them out willy-nilly Night 1.
I'm going through this post by post. I'm leaning town at this point, as the cautiousness suggests a townie mindset.
Calls out greymon for the "faerie" comment. Also uses the term "flavor points" for the first time I've seen. MIDPOST EDIT - Just did a search for flavor as in flavor points...EP is the first to mention it in the post where he bets there aren't any favor point killing roles. This makes it look a lot better, IMO - he never mentioned favor points to this point, and his only other mention of the subject he typed flavor instead. I think we just have an honest slip here.
Accuses Grey of backpeddling, and (subclaim?) says that power roles could be entwined with the favor point mechanic.
A couple of posts here with Greymon back and forth, pretty short and pretty much just rehashing the same things.
Part 1 - it appears that he does have a role that works with favor points, and that he is almost paranoid about giving them out in a way that could harm the town. Big townie points for this.
First nuggets of a claim. The last line seems strange, considering that the replacements are the only ones so far who have actively (or even passively) courted favor points.
All about favor point scarcity and mechanics of how favor points work.
Most of the rest of the posts are very recent, so I'm going to stop now. They are more of the same.
At the end, I think EP is town, based mostly on his underlying concern for what the replacements can/would do once they have favor points. Whether it is another ability they aren't claiming, an ability that is turned on by receiving favor points, anything. In his posts since the claim, he has also been very patient answering questions about his role, and they seem to be authentic.
The flavor point thing seems like an honest typo/mixup/whatever to me.
I'm going to organize my thoughts about everything else and post them tomorrow. Unvote
If you aren't taking a shot at anyone specific, or trying to be an alarmist, and are concerned about the issue, why not simply PM the moderators running the tournaments and/or the administrators? They probably have much more knowledge about the situation than random SYM readers.
So much for paying attention, eh? Here's what I said:
I was referring to acting exactly like Cyan, not copying his votes or stances. I don't care if you barn Cyan, you can do what you want. I'm referring to your playstyle and tone while dealing with the other players.
Maybe a little more analysis, a little less playing Hall Monitor yelling at lurkers and bullying people into agreeing with your targets.
Why not address the actual accusation instead of resorting to third grade antics?
And if you'll only listen to me based on my post count, let me know, I have a day off tomorrow and would love to spam up my post count.
N_A is right, you have been acting like Cyan's Mini-Me this game. There's no need to be beligerent, especially when you haven't exactly been Super Scum Detector this game. Cyan at least has some clout and a high appreciation of his own abilities. You only appear to be bullying people into agreeing with you.
You said you wanted 3 people lynched, and you didn't care in which order. You sure about that? If you had to put it in an order, could you?
But I need you alive to keep my wild accusations in check
But LGS also provide other services - mainly gaming space, events like FNM, etc. Sure, do the free market and buy from the most competitive price. But when brick and mortar stores go out of business, where will you play your FNMs or PTQs? Some eBay retailer's basement?
A similar thing happened to the travel industry in the early 2000s. Travel agents had a direct conduit to airlines and tour companies so they could sell those trips and vacations. Once Expedia, Priceline etc became popular, travel agents got cut out of their market share by these cheap online alternatives. Many people found, however, that if there was a problem with their Expedia plane tickets, they were pretty much up the creek. In the past, you could work with a real live travel agent who would be there if there were any problems, plus have the foresight to anticipate any problems to avoid them in the first place. That is a SERVICE - same as what a LGS provides. If you don't feel like paying the premium for that service, then don't complain when they aren't there to buy your collection when you stop playing, or host your tournaments, or provide you with free open gaming space.
WOTC doesn't know who is an online store and who isn't. Take a look at eBay, and search for "alara reborn preorder box". Are you telling me all of these people are buying their boxes for full retail? No. These people are still getting through the cracks, and there isn't anything WOTC can do about it.
And sure they can get their boxes cheaper than an online store - they all get them for the same price. But selling a single box of cards for ~10% profit (if you are that lucky) is not sound business practice.
Support your local stores. They are not bloodthirsty corporations, so by denying them business you aren't "sticking it to the man" like people do when they download pirated music. And every region has the good store with the nice employees and nice atmosphere as well as the crappy store with rude employees and bad lighting. Go support the good store.
Hi Ged
What mafia chat? Half of the game was just Roja talking to himself
I have PMs I can post.
That's fine, but actually voting the person you don't want to lynch implies you are lying through your teeth
This is the entire post you are referring to. Here's your post in this game.
So randomly lynching people is fine, as long as they come up mafia?
I'm not seeing your point here. I *think* you are trying to say that "it is a pretty crappy plan, but its worked in the past, so why the hell not?" Is that true?
What does this even mean?
You are against the lynch, but wish you could cast the hammering vote?
I kinda fell into a sulk Day 1 because Cyan was so obvious, not much to do about that. Then one-shot cop on Some One, and Goatrevolt sees me trying to off Dagger...bad luck for the Mafia, I'd say.
On Day 3 I just tried to throw out as many false leads as possible
Good game, everyone
Emo_Pinata PBPA
Day 1
#126
Response to the initial replacement posts. Asks about favor points. Makes sense now, he already had the inside track and wanted to see how much the replacements knew.
#192
Minor suspicion on skander, supports Callaway wagon for the popular reasons. Also pushes for an answer on his replacement questions. Calls out kpaca for dodging questions.
#196
Voices his concern over skander sticking his neck out. More replacement discussion.
(at this point, all of his content posts involved the replacements and their abilities. Certainly fits his claim)
#198
More replacements.
#208
Wants a claim from Callaway but doesn't want to push him into speedlynch territory.
#235
Says he's willing to hammer because of shaky claim and poor defense in general. Later says that the lynch is happening too fast. A little contradictory in such a short post. Seems to me that the "lynch is happening too fast" is a cliche townie comment that is tacked on at the end.
#242
More claim questioning. Says that the lynch is basically done, but there is a lot of information flowing so day should continue (I agree, but didn't seem like it had to be said at the point)
Nothing else of consequence on Day 1, just a couple of one sentence posts and votes for Callaway. Not too incriminating I'd say, and pretty similar to the consensus attitude about Callaway. Had an interest in the replacements early on, so that ties in with his claim
Day Two Part 1
#351
Suspects Skander, pending further review
#433
Votes for Skander, thinks he's scum, etc. Wants a claim from Skander.
This might be semantics, but I'll throw it out - in his previous post he said he had only really skimmed Day 2, and didn't vote Skander. In this post he votes Skander, but without any reference to a reread or further examination of past posts. Says that he suspected Skander for a while (true, based on Day 1 posts). Not saying its anything, just something I noticed. Most people seem like they would acknowledge a reread or some other reference to past posts.
#451
This post is pretty interesting. Questions Skander not using his night talk on Night 1, because it can only help him later to confirm his claim. Interesting parallels with his own decision not to use his favor/flavor/whatever it is point ability on Night 1.
#516
Believes Some One's claim, says its not necessarily pro-town but not scum either. Wants to get maximum usage out of it before killing SO (interesting choice of words)
#543
Again agrees with Some One that SO should get the most use out of his ability before being lynched/Cyan'd. Maybe a subclaim about wanting his true name?
#554
More replacement prodding. Definitely a trend here, I'd say his role seems accurate.
Has a couple more one sentence posts asking Cyan if he can shoot the replacements and elaborating why.
#564
Very interesting post considering recent events. Says that he doubts there is a favor point role based on killing. AGAIN asks his question of the replacements.
During the discussion of why EP didn't use his ability on Night 1, it was theorized it could be a vig role, and that explained the selectiveness/reluctance to have guns blazing. This post would seem to contradict that. He could have been trying a little of protective misdirection, but I find most people that do this to be untrustworthy.
#576
Another replacement post. All these posts point to one thing - EP is concerned about secondary abilities of the replacements. He seems to be worried that giving them favor points may turn on other, more sinister abilities. This could also explain the reluctance to hand them out willy-nilly Night 1.
I'm going through this post by post. I'm leaning town at this point, as the cautiousness suggests a townie mindset.
#616
Says he's concerned about the replacements having other, role based motives. Also disagrees with a SO lynch.
#622
I take this as a non-confirmation confirmation of the Azrael way that favor points work, as opposed to the Bilbroxain unbalanced way.
#636
Calls out greymon for the "faerie" comment. Also uses the term "flavor points" for the first time I've seen. MIDPOST EDIT - Just did a search for flavor as in flavor points...EP is the first to mention it in the post where he bets there aren't any favor point killing roles. This makes it look a lot better, IMO - he never mentioned favor points to this point, and his only other mention of the subject he typed flavor instead. I think we just have an honest slip here.
#644
Back and forth with Greymon. Doesn't like that Greymon is trying to flush out more player with favor point interactions.
#705
Accuses Grey of backpeddling, and (subclaim?) says that power roles could be entwined with the favor point mechanic.
A couple of posts here with Greymon back and forth, pretty short and pretty much just rehashing the same things.
Part 1 - it appears that he does have a role that works with favor points, and that he is almost paranoid about giving them out in a way that could harm the town. Big townie points for this.
Day 2 Part 2
You are still reading! And I'm still typing!
#765
Ande calls out EP for a quick reversal of opinion, EP explains it out. Mildly scummy, but he doesn't back down from it. Neutral to me.
#779
More paranoia about replacements. They are definitely a hot button issue for KP.
#790
First nuggets of a claim. The last line seems strange, considering that the replacements are the only ones so far who have actively (or even passively) courted favor points.
#793
Admits why he claimed so quickly, but it seems odd. Cyan's post immediately after this sums it up perfectly.
#802
Defense replies. Nothing of note to me here.
#809
Pretty good defense vs Cyan here. His posts make sense when you look at his curiosity about the replacements and what they may be hiding.
#812
Explains why he didn't do anything Night 1.
I'm running out of gas here, but a lot of the posts are pretty recent and straightforward.
#814
First brings up favor point scarcity. Makes sense to me, but I'm taking an ECON course this semester
#816
#819
#820
#823
#825
#828
All about favor point scarcity and mechanics of how favor points work.
Most of the rest of the posts are very recent, so I'm going to stop now. They are more of the same.
At the end, I think EP is town, based mostly on his underlying concern for what the replacements can/would do once they have favor points. Whether it is another ability they aren't claiming, an ability that is turned on by receiving favor points, anything. In his posts since the claim, he has also been very patient answering questions about his role, and they seem to be authentic.
The flavor point thing seems like an honest typo/mixup/whatever to me.
I'm going to organize my thoughts about everything else and post them tomorrow. Unvote