[quote from="Xaricore »" url="/forums/the-game/modern/established-modern/aggro-tempo/648255-merfolk?comment=9935"]As a Tron player myself I can tell you this is where Spell pierce and Deprive will help you much more than sea's claim.
You switch to being proactive and Pierce Stirrings, Sylvan scrying and even Expedition map in order to deny them T3/4 Tron. Echoing Truth helps as well to get an extra turn on an OStone.
If you seem to have trouble in a heavy Tron and Affinity meta you may want to consider ceremonious rejection, which pretty much hits all the cards of both archetypes.
I may next time keep in my two mainboard Chalice of the Void, instead of siding the out, thinking they are useless, to stop the play of Ancient Stirrings, Expedition Map, Chromatic Star, Chromatic Sphere, and any other 1 drop shenanigans. Ceremonious Rejection is not a bad idea to consider. It'll help my Affinity matchup and help with Tron as well. I have been particularly fond of 4 sideboard Sea's Claim is also really hurts Jund and Jund is always an annoying matchup being "removal.deck".
Elves has always been hard for me to defeat (running Fish.) the SB Gut Shots go a long way tho, taking out a turn 1 Llanowar Elf/Heritage Druid, while being able to drop Vial.
Elves is also another extremely hard matchup for myself. It is honestly just an aggressive race in who out aggros first and unfortunately Elves tends to get their first mainly because all of their creature synergy is mana production to the point where even though we have more lords for the matchup, they can just ramp faster and have ways in just vomiting their hand to the point where they can alpha strike and we just can't stop that amount of damage.
I think its still a perfectly fun deck to play and does decently enough. Just in general proactive is better than reactive in modern. Nice thing it really only has two matchups where i go this is a loss, boggles and bw tokens and you hardly see the latter nowadays. Fatal push has helped this deck in general quite alot. It also helps that we dont really care if our opponent has it. Everything we run that works with it gets killed by every other form of removal in the format anyways. Oh and if you havent picked up any ceremonious rejections yet get some they are absolutely house.
I have many Ceremonious Rejections lol, I definitely added them in because Tron is now a huge part of my current meta and just has been strong. B/W Tokens is an extremely annoying matchup and I completely agree with you on that one. I'm definitely gonna try one mainboard Jace, the Mind Sculptor, mainly because I can and it can either draw the hate from my opponent and/or help me with some synergy.
[quote] In more traditional lists i wouldnt but if your going AV and dont have delvers he seems fine. He may still be too mana intensive but worth the test.
As far as the meta goes I would say rough. Generally Death's Shadow grixis is just better. I prefer more reactionary play so ive stuck with delver but both decks have lots of variation and can easily overlap.
It is a bit sad that those that have played Grixis Delver have managed to switch to Grixis Death's Shadow due to the popularity and general better tournament outcome. I'm gonna play Delver one of these weeks and then try Death's Shadow version.
Wouldn't hurt to try with one mainboard Jace, the Mind Sculptor and see if it makes any difference.
How is Delver is the meta currently? I've had the deck built for just about 2 years and used to run it all the time before I expanded my collection and built other decks. Most of the time, I've seen most people that have piloted the deck covert it into Death's Shadow because all is really needed for the deck is the addition of Death's Shadow and Street Wraith.
What about the addition of Jace, the Mind Sculptor? I have only one and have been thinking about adding him just because he is available, just haven't really been convinced to do so.
I feel like Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas is just better. He ultimates the next turn after he comes out and usually ends the game on the spot. Not to mention both his +1 and -1 abilities are relevant. Just my 2 cents though
I like the idea of running Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas in Affinity, makes sense (and Tezzeret of my favorite planeswalker ). Only thing though is he can be a bit slow for us in, being a 4 drop that can make something a 5/5 artifact creature is nice, plus the option of filtering out the deck for needed artifacts. Dropping him on turn 4, maybe turn 3 is a bit risky and by that time, we should have the board in our favor to the point where he generally not really needed. The only 4 drop I am running in my deck is Hazoret the Fervent and she is super good synergy in our deck. Most of the time, people just don't know what to do against her.
Haven't played Infect in a while, needless to say, it does manage to throw people off. Tonight at FNM I went 3-0-1 and came in 1st before top 8. Infect does manage to throw people off when someone plays it. The only bad thing right now if the current meta is that Jund is still the absolute worst match up. I 'loath' Jund when playing against it with this deck and honestly any of my decks. Jund is honestly "removal.deck", no question about it. With the loss of Gitaxian Probe and the introduction of Fatal Push, it makes this piloting Infect incredibly difficult.
It's been a while since I posted for this thread I made and I finally brought this deck into the spotlight at Modern tournament. First and foremost, here is the deck right now:
The original list had cards I simply had to change (Gitaxian Probe being the main one). That being said, this is how it went this time at the tournament...
Modern FNM 2-16-18
Deck played: Truth of the Orb
Round 1 - Free Win Red - I'm honestly amazing I beat Free Win Red, I figured that is an un-winable matchup. My creatures just managed to get there.
Game 1 - Win
===sideboard tech===
===taken in: 2 x Countersquall, 2 x Engineered Explosives, 1 x Hurkyl’s Recall, 1 x Spellskite
===taken out: 1 x Dust Elemental, 2 x Languish, 2 x Path to Exile, 1 x Thirst of Knowledge
Game 2 - Win
===sideboard tech===
===taken in: N/A
===taken out: N/A
Game 3 - N/A
Round 2 - Jund - My most hated deck in Modern, can't stand this deck. Nonetheless, I wanted to try and beat it. This matchup, they just had all the answers before I could manage to even set of a board state.
Game 1 - Loss
===sideboard tech===
===taken in: 1 x Countersquall, 2 x Path to Exile, 1 x Spellskite, 1 x Supreme Verdict, 1 x Timely Reinforcements
===taken out: 1 x Dust Elemental, 1 x Inverted of Truth, 1 x Serum Visions, 2 x Thirst for Knowledge, 1 x Trickbind
Game 2 - Loss
===sideboard tech===
===taken in: N/A
===taken out: N/A
Game 3 - N/A
Round 3 - R/G Tron - I figured that this matchup will honestly be who gets set up first. Game 1, I managed to outspend them by having huge creatures get in before they could do anything about it. The others were close, but they got there before I set up a board state before they got Tron.
Game 1 - Win
===sideboard tech===
===taken in: 2 x Countersquall, 2 x Stony Silence
===taken out: 2 x Languish, 2 x Thirst for Knowledge
Game 2 - Loss
===sideboard tech===
===taken in: N/A
===taken out: N/A
Game 3 - Loss
Round 4 - W/G Value Town - This deck is ETB trigger heavy and I managed to deny them to get there. Game 1 I messed up and forgot their was a Torpor Orb on the battlefield and they forgot too and they get a Path to Exile from their graveyard to get beat me before I could do it. Aside from that, this was a rather easy matchup.
Game 1 - Loss
===sideboard tech===
===taken in: 2 x Engineered Explosives, 1 x Grafdigger’s Cage, 2 x Path to Exile, 1 x Supreme Verdict, 1 x Timely Reinforcements
===taken out: 1 x Dust Elemental, 2 x inverter of Truth, 1 x Serum Visions, 2 x Thirst for Knowledge, 1 x Hunted Phantasm
Game 2 - Win
===sideboard tech===
===taken in: N/A
===taken out: N/A
Game 3 - Win
Round 5 - Abzan - Same of Jund in a way, essentially "removal.deck". I'm glad I got one game in a belt, the others, they just got there.
Game 1 - Win
===sideboard tech===
===taken in: 2 x Countersquall, 2 x Engineered Explosives, 1 x Grafdigger’s Cage, 1 x Relic of Progenitus
===taken out: 1 x Dust Elemental, 1 x Hunted Phantasm, 1 x Inverter of Truth, 2 x Thirst for Knowledge, 1 x Trickbind
Game 2 - Loss
===sideboard tech===
===taken in: N/A
===taken out: N/A
Game 3 - Loss
Tournament Standings - 11th out of 20
Here is what I get from playing this and honestly seeing how the meta is right now, ETB triggers (Enter the Battlefield) on creatures is huge right now in Modern. Denying an opponent to take advantage of these effects to the point that shuts down many decks, makes using this deck more viable.
Even though I didn't have a winning record, the deck was fun and my opponent didn't have honestly any idea to honestly to do against it because it is so odd.
I've been playing affinity more or less casually since forever. The GBx matchup always felt 50/50, but since BBE unbanning and the resurrection of Jund feels much worst. Do you have any advice for the matchup?
Jund is a hard matchup to be fair, It is "Removal.deck" for a reason. I do admit that Shapers' Sanctuary is a fantastic choice of needing to sideboard against them. In my sideboard, I run 2 Blood Moons to really hurt against Jund. Most of the time for myself, once the mana type is destroyed (i.e., not black or green mana), they usually don't have any way to get back.
I am pretty new to the modern Dredge archetype and thinking about playing the deck at my fnm.
I have seen that there are 2 Dredge decks in modern
"normal" Dredge and Dredgevine
"Normal" Dredge seems to be a lot more poplular. What is the difference between dredge and dredgevine?
Normal Dredge is honesty more consistent than Dredgevine. I am a bit bias due to the fact I play normal Dredge. Both decks use the dredge mechanic however, the "normal" dredge deck using more the synergy of things coming back from the graveyard on their own and not so much from having to cast creature spells to get Vengevine to come back. Dredge honestly doesn't cast many creatures to get the deck working.
Dredgevine has a lot more synergy in wanting to cast creatures for the deck to work and then using the graveyard as a resource. "Normal" Dredge mainly wants to discard are dredgers so we can abuse the Dredge mechanic for our gain.
Am currently not having fun playing against Scarab God decks. Hoping that I'm making a mountain out of molehill and he'll fade from popularity.
Sadly, I think the Scarab God will be the King of Brawl...he is Meta Knight. Two Strong Colors, Get Value from every Graveyard, Sets up your Draws for you, and He slowly ticks away everyone's life.
If he gets the ban, I'll start playing. But as of now, eh. Too good for a sub-CMC10 creature.
I forgot he even cheats the commmander cost unless he is exiled...dang is there anything the Scarab God cant do?
I don't think he gets banned mostly cause he can only crush for a few months until rotation.
I do however, agree with you that nothing is likely to challenge him, although it should really be no surprise that the most dominant Legend in Standard is the most powerful Brawl Commander.
I concur in thinking that The Scarab God will dominate this format. Even in regular EDH, he is quite strong. Only a few months of his being in the format for Brawl, I sense that with Dominaria will make the format more open for options to where The Scarab God won't dominate for the short time it is legal.
I am pretty excited to see how this format will shape out to be! One of this aspects of this new format that I think is pretty strong that makes it unique is allowing Planeswalkers as your commander. With Dominaria around the corner, definitely gives a lot of spice for what can come for synergies that may bloom. I personally am thinking about running Rashmi, Eternities Crafter as my commander and making the random bulk of standard cards I have from buying too much lately some reason now viable. I do think it can fluctuate prices of some standard cards where it was considered not good enough for the actual competitive scene, could be amazing in Brawl!
This thread has been locked due to not pertaining to Modern, please remember to be up to date with the Modern Banlist what is legal within the Modern format.
Wise decision. Vs hollow one, you don’t board much — I bring the 3rd champion and a mountain out for 2 spellskite personally, but that’s just my hatred for ancient grudge
I've often thought about including Spellskite in the sideboard. You do make a really good point. Nonetheless, after this IQ, I have seen a lot of decks and played against some I have never seen in action and thus will know what to do in the future.
I may next time keep in my two mainboard Chalice of the Void, instead of siding the out, thinking they are useless, to stop the play of Ancient Stirrings, Expedition Map, Chromatic Star, Chromatic Sphere, and any other 1 drop shenanigans. Ceremonious Rejection is not a bad idea to consider. It'll help my Affinity matchup and help with Tron as well. I have been particularly fond of 4 sideboard Sea's Claim is also really hurts Jund and Jund is always an annoying matchup being "removal.deck".
This Friday I'll run 2 Sea's Claim and 2 Ceremonious Rejection and see how it goes.
Elves is also another extremely hard matchup for myself. It is honestly just an aggressive race in who out aggros first and unfortunately Elves tends to get their first mainly because all of their creature synergy is mana production to the point where even though we have more lords for the matchup, they can just ramp faster and have ways in just vomiting their hand to the point where they can alpha strike and we just can't stop that amount of damage.
Only thing about Tron that annoys me is three cards: Ancient Stirrings, Oblivion Stone, and Ugin, the Spirit Dragon. Ancient Stirrings is honestly what makes the deck hard to deal with. The can find their answers to our board too quickly. Sure, I run 4 sideboard Sea's Claim but usually is not enough to deal with.
Affinity is really just a match to where can I out aggro the other aggro deck? Games 2 and possibly 3 is, I need to draw sideboard hate and fast.
What does everyone else think is the bane for Merfolk in our current meta?
I have many Ceremonious Rejections lol, I definitely added them in because Tron is now a huge part of my current meta and just has been strong. B/W Tokens is an extremely annoying matchup and I completely agree with you on that one. I'm definitely gonna try one mainboard Jace, the Mind Sculptor, mainly because I can and it can either draw the hate from my opponent and/or help me with some synergy.
It is a bit sad that those that have played Grixis Delver have managed to switch to Grixis Death's Shadow due to the popularity and general better tournament outcome. I'm gonna play Delver one of these weeks and then try Death's Shadow version.
Wouldn't hurt to try with one mainboard Jace, the Mind Sculptor and see if it makes any difference.
What about the addition of Jace, the Mind Sculptor? I have only one and have been thinking about adding him just because he is available, just haven't really been convinced to do so.
I like the idea of running Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas in Affinity, makes sense (and Tezzeret of my favorite planeswalker
4x Torpor Orb
Creatures (18):
1x Dust Elemental
4x Eater of Days
4x Hunted Horror
1x Hunted Phantasm
4x Hushwing Gryff
4x Inverter of Truth
Instant (9):
2x Mana Leak
2x Muddle the Mixture
2x Path to Exile
2x Thirst for Knowledge
1x Trickbind
3x Concealed Courtyard
1x Godless Shrine
2x Hallowed Fountain
2x Island
4x Marsh Flats
1x Plains
4x Polluted Delta
3x Swamp
3x Watery Grave
Sorceries (6):
2x Languish
4x Serum Visions
2x Countersquall
1x Dispel
2x Engineered Explosives
1x Grafdigger's Cage
1x Hurkyl's Recall
2x Path to Exile
1x Relic of Progenitus
1x Spellskite
2x Stony Silence
1x Supreme Verdict
1x Timely Reinforcements
The original list had cards I simply had to change (Gitaxian Probe being the main one). That being said, this is how it went this time at the tournament...
Modern FNM 2-16-18
Deck played: Truth of the Orb
Round 1 - Free Win Red - I'm honestly amazing I beat Free Win Red, I figured that is an un-winable matchup. My creatures just managed to get there.
Game 1 - Win
===sideboard tech===
===taken in: 2 x Countersquall, 2 x Engineered Explosives, 1 x Hurkyl’s Recall, 1 x Spellskite
===taken out: 1 x Dust Elemental, 2 x Languish, 2 x Path to Exile, 1 x Thirst of Knowledge
Game 2 - Win
===sideboard tech===
===taken in: N/A
===taken out: N/A
Game 3 - N/A
Round 2 - Jund - My most hated deck in Modern, can't stand this deck. Nonetheless, I wanted to try and beat it. This matchup, they just had all the answers before I could manage to even set of a board state.
Game 1 - Loss
===sideboard tech===
===taken in: 1 x Countersquall, 2 x Path to Exile, 1 x Spellskite, 1 x Supreme Verdict, 1 x Timely Reinforcements
===taken out: 1 x Dust Elemental, 1 x Inverted of Truth, 1 x Serum Visions, 2 x Thirst for Knowledge, 1 x Trickbind
Game 2 - Loss
===sideboard tech===
===taken in: N/A
===taken out: N/A
Game 3 - N/A
Round 3 - R/G Tron - I figured that this matchup will honestly be who gets set up first. Game 1, I managed to outspend them by having huge creatures get in before they could do anything about it. The others were close, but they got there before I set up a board state before they got Tron.
Game 1 - Win
===sideboard tech===
===taken in: 2 x Countersquall, 2 x Stony Silence
===taken out: 2 x Languish, 2 x Thirst for Knowledge
Game 2 - Loss
===sideboard tech===
===taken in: N/A
===taken out: N/A
Game 3 - Loss
Round 4 - W/G Value Town - This deck is ETB trigger heavy and I managed to deny them to get there. Game 1 I messed up and forgot their was a Torpor Orb on the battlefield and they forgot too and they get a Path to Exile from their graveyard to get beat me before I could do it. Aside from that, this was a rather easy matchup.
Game 1 - Loss
===sideboard tech===
===taken in: 2 x Engineered Explosives, 1 x Grafdigger’s Cage, 2 x Path to Exile, 1 x Supreme Verdict, 1 x Timely Reinforcements
===taken out: 1 x Dust Elemental, 2 x inverter of Truth, 1 x Serum Visions, 2 x Thirst for Knowledge, 1 x Hunted Phantasm
Game 2 - Win
===sideboard tech===
===taken in: N/A
===taken out: N/A
Game 3 - Win
Round 5 - Abzan - Same of Jund in a way, essentially "removal.deck". I'm glad I got one game in a belt, the others, they just got there.
Game 1 - Win
===sideboard tech===
===taken in: 2 x Countersquall, 2 x Engineered Explosives, 1 x Grafdigger’s Cage, 1 x Relic of Progenitus
===taken out: 1 x Dust Elemental, 1 x Hunted Phantasm, 1 x Inverter of Truth, 2 x Thirst for Knowledge, 1 x Trickbind
Game 2 - Loss
===sideboard tech===
===taken in: N/A
===taken out: N/A
Game 3 - Loss
Tournament Standings - 11th out of 20
Here is what I get from playing this and honestly seeing how the meta is right now, ETB triggers (Enter the Battlefield) on creatures is huge right now in Modern. Denying an opponent to take advantage of these effects to the point that shuts down many decks, makes using this deck more viable.
Even though I didn't have a winning record, the deck was fun and my opponent didn't have honestly any idea to honestly to do against it because it is so odd.
Jund is a hard matchup to be fair, It is "Removal.deck" for a reason. I do admit that Shapers' Sanctuary is a fantastic choice of needing to sideboard against them. In my sideboard, I run 2 Blood Moons to really hurt against Jund. Most of the time for myself, once the mana type is destroyed (i.e., not black or green mana), they usually don't have any way to get back.
Normal Dredge is honesty more consistent than Dredgevine. I am a bit bias due to the fact I play normal Dredge. Both decks use the dredge mechanic however, the "normal" dredge deck using more the synergy of things coming back from the graveyard on their own and not so much from having to cast creature spells to get Vengevine to come back. Dredge honestly doesn't cast many creatures to get the deck working.
Dredgevine has a lot more synergy in wanting to cast creatures for the deck to work and then using the graveyard as a resource. "Normal" Dredge mainly wants to discard are dredgers so we can abuse the Dredge mechanic for our gain.
I concur in thinking that The Scarab God will dominate this format. Even in regular EDH, he is quite strong. Only a few months of his being in the format for Brawl, I sense that with Dominaria will make the format more open for options to where The Scarab God won't dominate for the short time it is legal.
I've often thought about including Spellskite in the sideboard. You do make a really good point. Nonetheless, after this IQ, I have seen a lot of decks and played against some I have never seen in action and thus will know what to do in the future.