Very hard not to look at this as a cash grab move.
Exectuive 1: "Folks, standard is failing and our profits are down. We can't just keep churning masters set to make people buy premium products, they're starting to notice our scheme".
Executive 2: "Standard has been bad for years, but you know what people like? Commander"
Executive 3: "Why don't we make Commander with only standard legal cards, so people are forced to buy into our new product even though it is bad?"
*Cheers in the room*
*End scene*
So much this.
Standard barely fires anymore lets add another format to compete with it.
Great plan.
Yay, sell more... cards...
The message is loud and clear; this change is NOT wanted and WOTC understands, so...that's a plus.
Good link thanks Lou.
For those that think Hasbro is doing great, don't forget the Toys R Us situation. And the reason Hasbro has the numbers they post is because they squeeze all their sub divisions to push money up. I don't know if they leveraged WotC to acquire it or not but the limited info they publish does not show the detailed numbers of each division. It's all a wash that equals positive numbers so they can support stock price.
It was already silly to put standard legal cards outside of boosters but everyone said 'oh the cards are crap anyways'. To do it in this very limited way is yet another step in the wrong direction but why is it surprising?
I said it when they put the 'legal' cards in starter decks, 'this is only the first step' and now we see they felt it was just fine and have made a more aggressive move in that same direction. What's the next step? Fatal Push type card printed exclusively in an 8 card mini standard set that you can only buy on pre-release day if you participate? Fortunately people have shown they don't like it this time.
A move to push box sales isn't a move to improve the game, why would they feel the need to do something different to push box sales? Logic says they're not selling the # of boxes they need to. This kind of exclusivity doesn't make cards cheaper, it makes them more expensive at a time when standard participation at the LGS level is still suffering. The cost of standard is MORE of a problem than ever before, little moves like this don't give me faith they're going to be fixing anything.
If you want to brew with that card you're just plain screwed unless you buy a box. At my large LGS there are a limited number of BAB promos, only the first X number of orders get them.
Just like with Standard we used to have quite a large contingent of people who play draft all the time. There's about 1/3 or less the number these days.
At my large store they said they get a lot fewer trades in with so many fewer people drafting. Yet another problem caused by design fails which adds to cost problems. Fewer cards = higher prices.
There used to be 40+ for draft every Friday. These days it's 16-20 if they're lucky.
Standard, if it fires, 7-12. Maybe fires once a month for FNM. Used to be 30+ every FNM.
Modern 48+ every FNM and used to be 12-16.
Sure numbers per LGS vary but even a single microcosm of this kind of player base loss should be alarming.
Isolated Chapel et al just had a reprint in standard. We didn't get the full set of fetches in standard because of Modern Masters. Breaking off Modern reprints to a special set has taken away value from standard. It used to be that at least if you're going to get cards and use them for Standard you could sometimes then get some eternal use or have trade/sale value after they rotate. Might even attract some Modern players to buy some product AND/OR get standard players to also play Modern as they build a collection. Nooooo, Modern Masters over priced packs.
Brilliant idea to spread their consumers thin and make their own products compete with each other.
Haven't they learned from flushing a large segment of standard players into Modern when they tried to shorten card life?
Looking at RIX prices I don't see a single card that's over $5 bucks that needs to be. Jadelight and Rekindling both go in the same deck!! All the rest of the cards don't see that much play. If they make standard cheaper people will play because they like to play magic. I've been hanging out trying to play through this 2 yr mess and after 2x in a row FNMs not firing yet again (RIX got a few to fire in the first month after release but now that's faded again) I can't imagine wasting any more money on getting new cards. Especially over priced ones.
They can't even get people who want to play engaged with flagging participation and a crappy dated rarity system in packs. Start putting out x2 rare slots and a foil per pack is what I say. Yes it will affect Limited in a big way but Limited can adjust. It might also get more people to play limited since they're more likely to get something out of it. Prices need to fall but they do nothing.
The card looks fine but changing blocking is not 'innovative'. That's apple brainwash speak for you will love it because we say so.
Interesting that at a time they're bringing back 'simple' with core sets they're going even more complicated with Sagas and a whole set of legendaries.
Someone got stepped on with spoiler release because they don't want to impact 25 sales/marketing. Here's an idea, stop releasing so many sets and focus on getting people into new, well designed product to save the game.
When you need more people to take up your game $30+ dollar cards are an impediment and for each person willing to buy a few packs to get lucky, there are 5 who will simply decline to play.
WotC has done crazy damage to themselves in the past 2 years and it looks like they don't understand the full extent of it or even how to staunch the bleeding.
Card prices for standard have been a problem for a long time. When you force out literally 3/4 (more) of your players with bad marketing decisions/bad design and there was a problem with card prices BEFORE the mass exodus you have an exponentially larger problem with prices when you need people to get back in (let alone bring in new players).
Standard is not firing in previously (2 years ago) healthy markets. Why should I buy any cards... (let alone $30+ cards) if I can't even play at FNM? I look at $30 phonixes and say to myself screw it, I won't even get to play them.
1. Failing participation due to WotC marketing stupidity (Standard Showdown/promos/zero store support) and failed design philosophy have led to less than 30% participation as compared to 2 years ago. If people can't use their cards to play they will not buy them. They will not get back into a game at any price.
2. Prices are driven up with lower sales. Fewer packs cracked, fewer trades, lower profit = higher prices which suppresses new and return investment.
They are in a really bad place and show no signs of taking any actions to improve their situation. Grudgingly bringing back promos isn't going to cut it.
If the top price on playables for standard was $5 a card they'd get more people back in. This is more important right now than languishing in their broken card economy.
They made an effort with the new standard buy and play decks but I already notice the only really good one is pre-sale $40+ on TCG with MSRP $30. That does not help.
Those who feel 'prices are fine' because you're ok with them need to realize you won't have a card game if WotC can't bring in more players and make standard healthy again. Yes Modern is great. WotC is making money off Modern with stupid special sets but their main influx comes from standard and limited through new releases. They are even screwing standard with their special releases, see printing the same lands again in DOM instead of enemy fetches. Modern also cannot change and move forward without new cards that change it's meta.
WotC created this mess and they need to do a lot more to fix it. Standard prices are a self inflicted barrier they need to change.
Standard is still in trouble and oh look $30 bucks for the stupid phoenix. High prices for the few bomb cards is preventing people from bothering with standard again.
It's double the trouble right now because the people who were playing standard refuse to pay to get back in. Phoenix is not worth 30 to most consumers.
Tolarian College did a video urging WotC to recognize that this is an opportunity to learn from what they did wrong and right with FNM promos and to get it right every time.
It doesn't hurt them one bit to keep printing playable FNM cards in fact it only helps them.
We will see if they're bitter and give us crap or they want to succeed and give us more Fatal Pushin'
Good promos drive up attendance.
Bad promos are crap
Tokens are worse than crap.
They need to learn from their mistakes (and successes) and give us promos people will participate to get.
Standard attendance sucks because standard sucks (thanks Maro) but taking things away and trying to send people away from FNM for no reason at all other than some moron's brilliant flash in marketing is killing the game completely.
Trying to force people out of their habits (standard FNM) and make them play a different night is so ill thought it's hard to see what the logic could have been. Out of touch from reality and their customers obviously.
You guys realize the paper vs digital is the same design?
The reason no one is playing standard is because it's designed poorly. That is the reason for decline.
Expensive + crappy + no one else playing = why bother?
MTGO is so old and such a crap interface there are a lot of players who refuse to use it. They are not planning to get rid of paper but they are planning to push the crap out of Arena.
i'd go so far as to say maro's 5 year plan was a resounding success, and i miss that kind of direction in design... but when it ended no one made a new plan and we're left with this continued mess.
Huh? Please explain what part of Maro's plan was a success. Am I missing the sarcasm?
So much this.
Standard barely fires anymore lets add another format to compete with it.
Great plan.
Yay, sell more... cards...
Poop.
Good link thanks Lou.
For those that think Hasbro is doing great, don't forget the Toys R Us situation. And the reason Hasbro has the numbers they post is because they squeeze all their sub divisions to push money up. I don't know if they leveraged WotC to acquire it or not but the limited info they publish does not show the detailed numbers of each division. It's all a wash that equals positive numbers so they can support stock price.
It was already silly to put standard legal cards outside of boosters but everyone said 'oh the cards are crap anyways'. To do it in this very limited way is yet another step in the wrong direction but why is it surprising?
I said it when they put the 'legal' cards in starter decks, 'this is only the first step' and now we see they felt it was just fine and have made a more aggressive move in that same direction. What's the next step? Fatal Push type card printed exclusively in an 8 card mini standard set that you can only buy on pre-release day if you participate? Fortunately people have shown they don't like it this time.
A move to push box sales isn't a move to improve the game, why would they feel the need to do something different to push box sales? Logic says they're not selling the # of boxes they need to. This kind of exclusivity doesn't make cards cheaper, it makes them more expensive at a time when standard participation at the LGS level is still suffering. The cost of standard is MORE of a problem than ever before, little moves like this don't give me faith they're going to be fixing anything.
If you want to brew with that card you're just plain screwed unless you buy a box. At my large LGS there are a limited number of BAB promos, only the first X number of orders get them.
At my large store they said they get a lot fewer trades in with so many fewer people drafting. Yet another problem caused by design fails which adds to cost problems. Fewer cards = higher prices.
There used to be 40+ for draft every Friday. These days it's 16-20 if they're lucky.
Standard, if it fires, 7-12. Maybe fires once a month for FNM. Used to be 30+ every FNM.
Modern 48+ every FNM and used to be 12-16.
Sure numbers per LGS vary but even a single microcosm of this kind of player base loss should be alarming.
Brilliant idea to spread their consumers thin and make their own products compete with each other.
Haven't they learned from flushing a large segment of standard players into Modern when they tried to shorten card life?
Looking at RIX prices I don't see a single card that's over $5 bucks that needs to be. Jadelight and Rekindling both go in the same deck!! All the rest of the cards don't see that much play. If they make standard cheaper people will play because they like to play magic. I've been hanging out trying to play through this 2 yr mess and after 2x in a row FNMs not firing yet again (RIX got a few to fire in the first month after release but now that's faded again) I can't imagine wasting any more money on getting new cards. Especially over priced ones.
They can't even get people who want to play engaged with flagging participation and a crappy dated rarity system in packs. Start putting out x2 rare slots and a foil per pack is what I say. Yes it will affect Limited in a big way but Limited can adjust. It might also get more people to play limited since they're more likely to get something out of it. Prices need to fall but they do nothing.
Interesting that at a time they're bringing back 'simple' with core sets they're going even more complicated with Sagas and a whole set of legendaries.
Someone got stepped on with spoiler release because they don't want to impact 25 sales/marketing. Here's an idea, stop releasing so many sets and focus on getting people into new, well designed product to save the game.
WotC has done crazy damage to themselves in the past 2 years and it looks like they don't understand the full extent of it or even how to staunch the bleeding.
Card prices for standard have been a problem for a long time. When you force out literally 3/4 (more) of your players with bad marketing decisions/bad design and there was a problem with card prices BEFORE the mass exodus you have an exponentially larger problem with prices when you need people to get back in (let alone bring in new players).
Standard is not firing in previously (2 years ago) healthy markets. Why should I buy any cards... (let alone $30+ cards) if I can't even play at FNM? I look at $30 phonixes and say to myself screw it, I won't even get to play them.
1. Failing participation due to WotC marketing stupidity (Standard Showdown/promos/zero store support) and failed design philosophy have led to less than 30% participation as compared to 2 years ago. If people can't use their cards to play they will not buy them. They will not get back into a game at any price.
2. Prices are driven up with lower sales. Fewer packs cracked, fewer trades, lower profit = higher prices which suppresses new and return investment.
They are in a really bad place and show no signs of taking any actions to improve their situation. Grudgingly bringing back promos isn't going to cut it.
If the top price on playables for standard was $5 a card they'd get more people back in. This is more important right now than languishing in their broken card economy.
They made an effort with the new standard buy and play decks but I already notice the only really good one is pre-sale $40+ on TCG with MSRP $30. That does not help.
Those who feel 'prices are fine' because you're ok with them need to realize you won't have a card game if WotC can't bring in more players and make standard healthy again. Yes Modern is great. WotC is making money off Modern with stupid special sets but their main influx comes from standard and limited through new releases. They are even screwing standard with their special releases, see printing the same lands again in DOM instead of enemy fetches. Modern also cannot change and move forward without new cards that change it's meta.
WotC created this mess and they need to do a lot more to fix it. Standard prices are a self inflicted barrier they need to change.
It's double the trouble right now because the people who were playing standard refuse to pay to get back in. Phoenix is not worth 30 to most consumers.
It doesn't hurt them one bit to keep printing playable FNM cards in fact it only helps them.
We will see if they're bitter and give us crap or they want to succeed and give us more Fatal Pushin'
Bad promos are crap
Tokens are worse than crap.
They need to learn from their mistakes (and successes) and give us promos people will participate to get.
Standard attendance sucks because standard sucks (thanks Maro) but taking things away and trying to send people away from FNM for no reason at all other than some moron's brilliant flash in marketing is killing the game completely.
Game Day was a better deal.
The reason no one is playing standard is because it's designed poorly. That is the reason for decline.
Expensive + crappy + no one else playing = why bother?
MTGO is so old and such a crap interface there are a lot of players who refuse to use it. They are not planning to get rid of paper but they are planning to push the crap out of Arena.
What exactly were their expectations???
Tokens instead of playable... people will totally rush standard FNM to get these. We are geniuses!
Standard participation nose dives. Hmm, lets go back that'll fix everything!
Huh? Please explain what part of Maro's plan was a success. Am I missing the sarcasm?