Quote from MagicMapleGirl »Okay first off thanks for giving me an actual answer as opposed to answering my question with a "that's just how things are"
The game has historically been balanced around the color pie. When cards like beast within are printed, they tend to break the game more often then not because you have one color that just runs away from the pack. This card was just recently recast as a white card in generous gift in MH1 for example. The green version isn't going anywhere, but destroying anything is something white does.
Okay that's a fair point I just think beast has lead to more interesting game states the few times I've had someone play it against me and causing a creature to go savage is kinda a neat thing I wish green did more but I can see why green doesn't do it as often.
A) the format breaks down to that deck, or decks that beat that deck. When the removal or payoffs are even too strong after that the format becomes that deck and versions of itself to beat itself. We started seeing this with the Hogaak bridgevine decks maiming 4 copies of leyline of the void.
But would expanding the pie for a few more colors cause that type of problem? From what I can tell hogaak is only doing what you would expect green/black decks to do.
B) distribution becomes an absolute nightmare. When a card is out of line like jace, the mind sculptor in standard it becomes increasingly harder to find product that is priced as it should be. There was a point before his standard ban that buying a box and pulling a Jace netted a gamestore money...excluding the rest of the contents. The product was drying up and it wasn't making it to the players. They also cut the print run eventually which causes more headaches. We are seeing this again with MH1 staples just absolutely skyrocketing to try and justify the cost of a box to the end consumer.
Again I don't see how this pertains to changing the color pie especially because Jace is a textbook blue card, just a ridiculously broken one at that.
C) every color can have each macro effect, but it has to have it in a way that is resonant in that color. The game leans hard on resonant themes that expect the player to have some knowledge of a thing or setting prior to sitting down. I don't have to teach you what a zombie is, and zombies that mechanical do something in the graveyard like gravedigger are easy to understand. The game builds on this further by its age, colors tend to dip into the same thematic waters over time. For example green does get creature removal, but it's the fight mechanic.
So moving this to my example: red shutting off enchantments for a turn would be resonant to reds them of impulsively ignoring rules out of anger since enchantments are often used to represent rules or a status quo right? the big examples I can think of are Blind obedience and Martial Law.
D) it actually entices players to go more than one color, which introduces more variance, and makes for better games. If you the have resources to answer all the threats or present the most potent threats then you're firmly the favorite to win before you even sit down. I'll point you to the khans of tarkir block as an example, the mana was so good that running 4-5 colors was actually the norm. It allowed players to play whatever the best suite of cards were and completely circumvent the weaknesses of each color. The result was the silly 4c collected company / rally the ancestors deck that could instant speed you out of nowhere the second you tapped out. The deck has mainboard answers to any relevant permanent type. The saheeli rai 4 color combo deck in kld/aer standard is another offender that had great mana and a very good threat suite. The deck ran almost no artifact gate because it didn't need to, there were no artifacts that really threatened it. It could have though, with little impact to its game plan.
Didn't this deck only work because Collected company was such a good card in the first place though. Again I'm not saying wizards should remove the color pie just that they should make it less rigid. Like could you say if red had temporary answers to enchantments people wouldn't run a boros deck? People still run azorous decks even though blue has an answer for basically everthing just because blue can't deal with things permanently if it misses it's window of opportunity and the white tends to burn it's hand out too quickly.
E) the cards you're looking for are printed, but they're sly about it. Generic hate for specific mechanical decks does show up in artifacts. pithing needle for activated abilities. dampening sphere for storm or xerox decks. relic of progenitus for graveyards. There are a bunch.
Only thing I can think of for red and blacks weakness to non-creatures is ratchet bomb unless I'm mistaken and often times it just takes long enough for the player who played the card ratchet bomb is being used as an out for to win (ignoring the fact that most of the time ratchet bomb gets blown to hell). So all this system does is give you a free win against certain colors. Source: I play pox and use leyline of sanctity to stop red decks completely.
F) card draw isn't something that should be stapled to every card. treasure cruise started warping legacy/modern in short order as everyone just started forcing a manabase that supported blue simple for the draw effect. dig through time wasn't far behind. Drawing extra cards is really a huge deal in the game and it's one of the effects new players tend to grossly undervalue.
I know I have a blue/green deck that's built around cards that give you free draws when played. I'm not saying white should get that, I'm talking about more explore or investigate style of effects when I say conditional card draw. Also I've been playing since Time spiral granted that was with my dad and I only started playing semi competitively since return to ravnica before taking a break for a bit.
G) you mentioned some specific card types/colors like black and artifacts. It's so some decks can present a threat that is harder to answer. If black just 1-1 or 2-1 you all day with removal, you probably aren't going to be able to stick anything meaningful. Having an artifact that can cause a speedbump for then helps because then it's an actual game. That artifact shouldn't win the game on the spot, but it needs to help. Same with red and enchantments. Note that GB can deal with anything in a number of cards.
Like I said earlier more often than not artifacts tend to be more of a brick wall rather than a speed bump the same thing goes for red.
To be fair I was just trying to quote an example for each point off the top of my head, I wouldn't even say these are the best examples to prove the point. I just think that when the restrictions are compromised the game becomes very homogenous.
Coco and baby Jace are great magic cards, but rally is what set the deck over in my eyes. The deck could have just run flash creatures if it needed bodies for the same effect. If the deck couldn't go green creature, black creature, coco, rally with no mana issues then it wouldn't have been as oppressive. Fetching in that deck was actually kinda hard.
The JTMS comment was more centered around breaking the pie has historically led to tournament staple if it's priced to move. It creates a burden on the supply of demand spikes. Jace let blue handle a TON of situations all in one card. It screwed with the board, it screwed with their draws, it dig you 3 deep to find an answer to a question, it was a win condition. It checked too many boxes in one card (advantage, control, win condition).
Black is getting artifact removal added to its toolbox. Mark rosewater (Maro) posts a ton of great articles describing why the color pie is so important, and the ramifications of a bending a break. Colors do get to play around in each other's space, but it has to be done in a way that color cares about.
A bonus for a color doing something in a way it cares about is that the gameplans start synergizing well. I used the example of fight being greens removal mechanic. Well yeah it sucks having to have a creature out, but green wants creatures out anyway. When you start stapling the fight mechanic to creatures you can get some very interesting board states and the creatures become more impactful. You start actively looking for keywords like deathtouch or lifelink to bring up the value of the fight spell. For example sedge scorpion is great in core 2020 limited, but it makes fight cards phenomenal veause now you can snipe your opponents bomb if it has flying. If this were a kill spell like murder you just bank it until the flyer comes down and continue to turn dudes sideways. Not as interactive.
I also think it's important to note that a lot of your concerns are being addressed or are on the radar. Maro's articles and blogatog are great resources for reading about them. White has never historically needed much card advantage until formats like edh were introduced. Same with red and dealing with enchantments. This refocus gave us stuff like choas warp or modal spells like abrade. (Which btw I have a saheeli deck with liqumetal coating and altar of the brood!that uses abrade as small-medium creature removal or permanent removal if I use coating. The card is just great in that deck and it's removal of all types after t3 most games.)
Generally though rule of thumb seems to be:
White can deal with any permanent type. Usually destroy or exile. Whites versatility can requires addiotnal conditions (like destroy a tapped creature). Tons of grave hate, usually as a bonus.
Blue can counter, bounce, or steal any permanent type. Blue has issues dealing with the board. The best blue board wipe is engulf the shore lol. Next to no grave hate.
Black can discard any permanent type and destroy most. Not really lands and artifacts have just recently been added to the mix. Blacks versatility comes at a cost.l very often. Tons of grave hate.
Red can destroy artifacts and lands directly. Red can deal damage to any permanent type. Red cannot easily deal with enchantments by itself. Red has zero grave hate pretty much.
Green can deal with artifacts, enchantments, lands, and creatures with flying. It can deal with creatures by fighting. Green does have some grave hate sometimes.
There are exceptions to all these. Cards like fulminator mage can do a lot of work in a mono black shell who is threatening something black can't normally do. Add blacks recursion and it becomes pretty aggravating to play against.
I personally like the color pie because it frames and shepherds in my expectations when I sit accross from someone so I can make partially informed decisions. I don't like getting blindsided by weird one ofs like psionic blast. There are enough variables in the game Imho. I have been a huge proponent of modal cards in general. I will also say that I'm not a fan of the volume of card draw/advantage green has received in the last few years. courser of kruphix and tireless tracker provide too much velocity if you stumble against them and can't get them off the field. Courser can represent 2-3 draws and 3-4 life before I can remove it sometimes and that's insane for 3 mana and a decent toughness.
The community has been clamoring for red to get more steal efffects where possible.