A New and Exciting Beginning
 
The End of an Era
 
Exclusive: Sword of Truth and Justice
  • posted a message on Zada - Grinding Up An Arcane Storm
    Buyback is an additional cost and figured into the total cost of the spell even though it's not part of the casting cost. Medallions and the Helm have their affect on the total cost. So both Seething Anger and Haze of Rage would both get reduced the same. Having said that, my preference would be for Haze because of the storm aspect. It's not uncommon when going off to get 30-40 goblins from Empty the Warrens from the spell count. So storm and buyback are pretty fantastic if we're producing mana.

    I run a Cavern in my Norin deck (plenty of goblins there, too), but I think I only have the one. I might have to switch it and try that out.

    Zap hasn't done so well just yet. It sucks a lot when you haven't been able to make creatures in the double-digits and it's the only cantrip you've come across. The only things that'll save my creatures if I use it and let all copies resolve is Titan's Strength, Brute Force, and possibly Strange Inversion (which has to be handled carefully, doing at least one of the first two before doing it again). I'll probably try it again soon, but I tend to dislike Balduvian Rage just as much as a cantrip because it says target attacking creature.

    So far I'm looking at possibly Goblin Chirurgeon, Boots, Pyroblast, Beacon going in. Haven't started looking at slots for them, yet. I'll likely have to reduce my pump spell count to fit protection in.

    I had already swapped out Fists for Uncanny Speed for the haste-enabling.

    Edit: Regarding Iron Myr, testing will continue at some point. It's inclusion is about enabling that marginal edge in creatures and mana to help get the deck off the ground, at which point it isn't but a body.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
  • posted a message on Zada - Grinding Up An Arcane Storm
    It appears Zada gets a lot of countering and removal in my playgroups. She's fallen on her face pretty consistently of late. The other night not much else was done to me other than Zada getting quite hated on. I had Twinflame and two slow cantrips in hand and a handful of creatures including Young Pyromancer. One player event went so far as to use one card to bounce Zada and another to make me discard her. She ended up costing 10-12 total mana to cast and I scooped, leaving the player who two-for-oned at the mercy of the other player.

    So now it seems I'll have to approach this deck differently, with some protection for her. Command Beacon seems like it might be handy. Considering Pyroblast and Red Elemental blast as well.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
  • posted a message on Deck Building Challenge: Mill- Phenax, God of Deception
    paragonweapon and krichaiushii made some good suggestions, many of which I use in my own Phenax deck. Slagwurm Armor can be pretty handy. Milled 2 players completely out one particular game. King Macar, the Gold-Cursed wasn't particularly threatening, even with Slagwurm on. Then Phenax hit the field and Freed from the Real hit the field attached to Macar. The Gold tokens created by Macar's ability you can sac for U to keep untapping him.

    Mesmeric Orb is one of my favorites, especially with Eater of the Dead. I'll be milling myself a bit, but that just guarantees some extra fuel for Eater. Just be careful when you drop it into play. Piracy and Blustersquall are fun with the Orb, though Turnabout can help you untap your critters to mill more. Intruder Alarm can be much more helpful, especially if you can produce more than 1 token (such as with Gisa) and tap creatures in between each of the Alarm's triggers.

    Or use Infinite Reflection on Myr Galvanizer. That's fun, too. Just be careful that Phenax is not in play or does not have devotion when you do so, or he'll become a Galvanizer.

    I also can't recommend Chromatic Lantern enough.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
  • posted a message on Zada, the Coming Storm
    I see your point about Strionic Resonator. It's also good for drawing extra cards when we use a cantrip (especially the first one), but I could definitely see replacing it with another creature or creature source.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
  • posted a message on Zada - Grinding Up An Arcane Storm
    It might be worth testing, but for 1 or 2 more, casting Zada and then Twinflame or Heat Shimmer copies all the creatures.

    However, I am curious to test thermopod since it provides R. Sacrificing creatures also sacrifices the scope of other effects, so I think it's viewed as a more desperate option to make sure we go off.

    I'm currently testing with Lotus Bloom and Iron Myr for those extra bits of mana to go off. Just got a Chrome Mox to try that. I'm a bit wary of exiling a card though. Also going to be testing with Zap in place of one of the slow cantrips. Mob Rule was quite helpful tonight. Not totally sold on it, but it seems like a good surprise.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
  • posted a message on Stacking Soulbond and fight triggers
    I have Gruul Ragebeast and Defense of the Heart on the battlefield. My opponent has 5 7/7 creatures on the battlefield.

    At the beginning of my upkeep I sac DoH into Wolfir Silverheart and Terastodon. I put triggers on the stack like this:
    • Terastodon's trigger
    • Silverheart's trigger from Terastodon
    • Silverheart's trigger from Ragebeast
    • Ragebeast's trigger for Silverheart
    • Ragebeast's trigger for Terastodon
    I resolve Terastodon's trigger, destroying 3 of my own lands to make 3/3 Elephant's under my control. Ragebeast and Silverheart trigger again for these 3 and I add them to the stack to yield this:
    • Silverheart's trigger for Elephant #3
    • Ragebeast's trigger for Elephant #3
    • Silverheart's trigger for Elephant #2
    • Ragebeast's trigger for Elephant #2
    • Silverheart's trigger for Elephant #1
    • Ragebeast's trigger for Elephant #1
    • Silverheart's trigger from Terastodon
    • Silverheart's trigger from Ragebeast
    • Ragebeast's trigger for Silverheart
    • Ragebeast's trigger for Terastodon
    I then resolve the soulbond with Elephant #3 so that it's a 7/7 when it then fights another 7/7. Since it died, I can resolve the soulbond with Elephant #2, have it fight and die to another 7/7, and so on to take out 3 of my opponent's 7/7s, leaving me to soulbond Silverheart finally with either Ragebeast or Terastodon before having them fight and kill the remaining 2 7/7s.

    This is all correct and works I expect, yes?
    Posted in: Magic Rulings Archives
  • posted a message on Mizzix's Mastery and Splice onto Arcane
    Let's say I have Desperate Ritual and Overblaze in my hand and some Arcane spells in my graveyard such as Unnatural Speed, Blazing Shoal and Path of Anger's Flame.

    If I overload Mizzix's Mastery, exiling the above 3 and copying them, can I splice Desperate Ritual and Overblaze onto each of them as I cast the copies? (I understand the copy of Blazing Shoal will not pump power, X will be 0.)

    If so, I need enough mana to do all the splicing during the resolution of Mizzix's Mastery, correct? 9 generic mana and 9 red mana, or 3 generic mana and 9 red mana if I have both Helm of Awakening and Ruby Medallion in play?
    Posted in: Magic Rulings Archives
  • posted a message on Zada - Grinding Up An Arcane Storm
    Quote from crazy monkey »
    Mortorpod is interesting, but if I'm paying two mana for a creature, I usually want more than one of them. It would basically play like a mogg fanatic that costs more and lacks the goblin synergy. That's not terrible, but it's also not quite what I'm looking for in a creature/creature source.

    Exactly. The biggest advantage to P&K, SGC, and Fanatic is they're repeatable at instant speed. I realized that Fanatic's advantage over Spikeshot Elder is if you've Twinflamed/Shimmered and have multiple Fanatics.

    In a goldfish practice run last night, I reached:
    Edit: I may have goofed in my math on the 576,000. Can't seem to get above 528,000 with what I think my sequence of plays was. That would result in 72 trillion damage.

    My opening hand had Lotus Bloom, Titan's Strength, and no mountains or cantrips.

    It's occurred to me that it's pretty important to save Strionic Resonator for something big like Path of Anger's Flame (spliced with DR and OB) or a hugely pumped Blazing Shoal (also spliced). Also, early in the process of going off I had 28 cards left in the library and 27 creatures. Rather than draw all of those with an immediate cantrip (had 3 in hand), I used the scrying from Portent (before tapping Krenko again) to get to the last few needed cards (including 2 Arcane spells), responding to that scry with a cantrip targeting somebody other than Zada to draw 1 card, then continue resolving the scrying.

    I've begun to wonder if it's possible to go rather infinite with Shimmer Myr and Elixir of Immortality in the middle of drawing through the deck to repeatedly cast cantrips to continue the drawing, rituals, arcane and pump spells etc. No matter how many card draws are left, are left, one should have the Myr and the Elixir in hand to resolve those, cast some more spells if necessary, and dump the graveyard back into the library to continue drawing. I still like the idea of being able to do as much as we do without infinite combos, but I appreciate that this one takes awareness and timing (compared to Dualcaster Mage + Twinflame).

    Happy splicing, folks.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
  • posted a message on Zada - Grinding Up An Arcane Storm
    So since they're similar effects to some of the ones we use, I'm curious if anybody has tried these:

    Mortarpod: similar effect to Pia and Kiran Nalaar, Siege-Gang Commander, and Mogg Fanatic.
    Mana Flare: does it help out opponents too much if we have to play it the turn before the one we go off?

    Edit: Nevermind Mortarpod, that wouldn't work at all at instant speed.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
  • posted a message on [[Primer]] Norin the Wary - Heads I win, Tails you lose.
    Blade is not something I'd run in this deck. There just doesn't seem to be any creatures in this deck that explode when equipped and attack [with multiple opponents, of course].

    Some of our creatures are moderate with myriad, such as Duplicant, but I'd rather be able to keep doing that every turn with the Closet than risk losing that card to the graveyard just for two extra triggers. Also wouldn't want to give the blade to my opponent with Confusion. That'd be bad.

    Edit:
    Actually, perhaps the best creature in this deck for the blade would be Goblin Assassin (6 triggers, though, if you have 3 opponents and make 2 tokens). The formula for the number of triggers, assuming you create a token for each opponent not being attacked by the equipped one: N * (N - 1), where N is the number of opponents. This applies to creatures with the "Whenever <card name> or another <type/subtype> enters the battlefield" pattern. (you can search this on magiccards.info with: t:creature o:"whenever ~ or another" o:"enters the battlefield")
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
  • posted a message on Zada - Grinding Up An Arcane Storm
    Quote from Kumlekar »
    I didn't understand how you were getting high numbers with path. I guess you're splicing a targeting effect onto it, but even so I'd rather not have to draw into a two card combo to have it not be a bad Rouse the Mob. I've cut virtually all of the pump spells that don't give trample or haste with exceptions for ones that are free, or fulfill other things the deck needs. Haze of Rage is still in as a way to repeatedly trigger slide/pyromancer in a pinch, and it can easily hit +8/+0 or higher. I'm still trying to work in better ramp, or mana that can be played mid combo. I'd like to get to a point where I can fairly safely keep two land hands.
    A bad Rouse the Mob? Not sure you've understood it's effect.

    If you have Zada and 4 other creatures and splice a target creature effect onto Path of Anger's Flame the "Creatures you control get +2/+0 until end of turn" effect happens 5 times to your creatures. They each get +10/+0 for a combined power boost of +50/+0. If you have Zada and 9 other creatures, they each get +20/+0 for a combined power boost of +200/+0. If you have 49 other creatures and Zada, they each get +100/+0 (+5000/+0 together).

    And the two-card combos with splicing are not hard when you've drawn most of your library, as is the point of the deck. It's a great buff when you need the arcane spells and splicing anyway for Desperate Ritual and Overblaze.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
  • posted a message on Zada - Grinding Up An Arcane Storm
    Much better circumstances. We just have to make sure the inversion happens an even number of times and we're golden.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
  • posted a message on Zada - Grinding Up An Arcane Storm
    Quote from crazy monkey »
    The largest issue strange inversion has given me is a headache from calculating and tracking power when it was my only splice available for path of anger's flame. It was hard to tell if I had lethal or not.

    Indeed, it's ugly. But you probably did have lethal, especially if you did that early and did more power boosting later. I coded up some examples and at least there are calculable patterns to it. For those wanting to know more detail about this interaction and why it's a bloody mess, open the spoiler below.

    The simplest pattern to it -- if you're getting targeting on Path with something better like Overblaze -- is that if you have X creatures your boost per creature will be a double of X squared (i.e., 2(X^2)). However, with the stepped pattern produced by using Strange Inversion you end up with an average boost per creature of half that, or just X^2. The very first creature to have it applied has the most power, and Zada (always being last) gets all those pumps and then swaps it to her toughness. So you can just assign creatures to attack opponents round-robin style and it should work out with marginal difference.

    So when you cast Path of Anger's Flame and splice Strange Inversion onto it for the targeting effect, the text of the spell on the stack reads like this:
    Creatures you control get +2/+0 until end of turn.
    Switch target creature's power and toughness until end of turn.
    So you target Zada with it and she radiates it to all your creatures. Let's say you have nine 1/1 creatures in addition to her:
    1/1
    1/1
    1/1
    1/1
    1/1
    1/1
    1/1
    1/1
    1/1
    3/3 (Zada)
    You'll end up with the original targeting Zada and nine copies of the spell targeting each 1/1. The copies resolve first, so Zada is at the bottom of the list and we'll be working from the top down.

    Effects happen in the order of text on the spell, so first all your creatures get +2/+0. Now you have 3/1s and a 5/3. Then that creature's power and toughness flip and he's a 1/3:
    1/3
    3/1
    3/1
    3/1
    3/1
    3/1
    3/1
    3/1
    3/1
    5/3 (Zada)
    The next resolves, granting your critters +2/+0 and flipping P/T on the second creature:
    3/3
    1/5
    5/1
    5/1
    5/1
    5/1
    5/1
    5/1
    5/1
    7/3 (Zada)
    After all of this is done, you're left with a state like this:
    19/3
    17/5
    15/7
    13/9
    11/11
    9/13
    7/15
    5/17
    3/19
    3/23 (Zada)

    Quote from crazy monkey »
    In the option to use it as a ritual, it becomes especially effective to remember that each one resolves individually, in the order that you chose. By ordering the copies that zada creates properly, you may be able to use the sudden access to colorless mana to cast something else and keep the critical creatures alive. This application is admittedly narrow, but leaving some of the spells on the stack to respond to comes up surprisingly often.
    This is one of the things I need to remember while practicing and playing. I've been tempted to write a program to help keep track of stuff (especially mana and creatures), but it's possibly too complicated even without working things like this use of the stack into it.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
  • posted a message on [[Primer]] Norin the Wary - Heads I win, Tails you lose.
    I think he's referring to other things that could get stolen. Like "ok so norin doesn't work, but what about this convenient Kiki-Jiki next to him?"
    Ah, I see that now. Apologies.

    There's solutions for stealing it back, of course. Smile
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
  • posted a message on [[Primer]] Norin the Wary - Heads I win, Tails you lose.
    Quote from Legion564 »
    Quote from Meecht »
    Quote from Legion564 »
    Hey guys quick question. If Norin gets stolen and then he blinks after, who's control does it come back under?

    Norin the Wary says "owner's control." There is no way for the owner of a card to change, so Norin will always come running back to you Smile


    OK thanks. So for anything else like if it gets stolen then that controller blinks it with Deadeye Navigator he gets to keep it?

    1. You brought that card to the game, so you're still the owner. You could always cast a spell yourself to make Norin blink with his own trigger.
    2. This is very improbable. They would have to steal Norin without casting a spell to void triggering him. Then because Norin is already on the field they would have to have Navigator enter the battlefield without casting it to avoid Norin's trigger and for the soulbond trigger to go off. Then if they did all this, then sure, they could flicker Norin for 1U. But Norin's trigger will always bring him back to you.
    3. Who in their right mind would do #2 at all? They wouldn't get anything out of stealing and flickering Norin. If they do that, laugh at them because they're wasting mana doing incredibly unhelpful things with their Navigator. Which is to your benefit, but it would still be dumb.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
  • To post a comment, please or register a new account.