Magic Market Index for July 13th, 2018
 
Magic Market Index for July 6th, 2018
 
Treasure Cruisin' Modern UR Control
  • posted a message on Commander 2018 themes and art
    Starting the spoiler engine now and getting people excited is a double edged sword, though. If they start now, than the window of opportunity on getting the decks at a lower price is also shortened. Commander decks tend to always punch above their weight on the market once they are spoiled, with one or two often spiking due to demand.
    Posted in: The Rumor Mill
  • posted a message on Commander 2018 themes and art
    I'll say one thing: The ONE product that I've never been disappointed in is the commander decks. Even last years decks were good and I've made it a habit of just automatically pre-ordering every set when it goes up. 2017 felt a bit on the weak side, but I'm keeping my fingers crossed we'll see more things like Chromatic Lantern, Lightning Greaves, Sakura-Tribe Elder, Eternal Witness, and of course Command Beacon.
    Posted in: The Rumor Mill
  • posted a message on Saheeli & Naban OTP - Izzet Tempo
    I don't know if I would want to stretch it out to 3 colors, but I do like Time of Ice. That looks like the blow out card this deck will need by turn 6. Here's my deck now.



    I really like Siren's Ruse since it's the only spell that protects my creatures from removal and there's some nifty combat tricks with it.


    The only reason I was trying white for Jeskai was due to Ajani, Adversary of Tyrants since he is as close to Resurrection as we will ever get in white these days. Basically, I went white for options that help keep the gas going into the mid and late game like Teferi, Hero of Dominaria.

    I'm not sure you need to run 8x enhancement cards, though. The deck should be able to stand on it's own with just 6 to 7. Naban, Dean of Iteration is really important to land, but he is also legendary along with Saheeli.
    Posted in: Deck Creation (Standard)
  • posted a message on Saheeli & Naban OTP - Izzet Tempo
    Quote from D90Dennis14 »
    Interesting idea (though not effective) but what does it have to with this thread ?


    Neban and Saheeli double the impact of wizards like trickster and watertrap weaver, as well as Viashino pyromancer. In a game of numbers the impact of Time of ice with those cards is significantly greater than Cast Out or even Seal Away.
    Posted in: Deck Creation (Standard)
  • posted a message on Saheeli & Naban OTP - Izzet Tempo
    To be honest, I kind of like the idea of running a sort of Time of Ice style tap down and bounce deck. Tap down effects make Seal Away better than it normally is and turns Ice over into a pretty good option for removal as well.
    Posted in: Deck Creation (Standard)
  • posted a message on Modern Spirits
    Anyone else here use celestial Kirin? I've found it to be rather interesting vs opposing vial listings, especially given we run Selfless Spirit. Usually when it lands it has hexproof thanks to Drogskol captain and it sort of turns the deck into a board wipe spamming nightmare. I guess my mind set in those match ups is that they only have four vials. Spirits has eight max (sort of).
    Posted in: Aggro & Tempo
  • posted a message on Cards that you wish were always Standard Legal
    The problem I'm seeing with what cards people want legal all the time, is that people aren't seeing the forest for the trees right now. The problem with standard is that they created a lot of removal and then granted specific creatures the ability to recur or blank that removal. As a result, the most playable creatures in the format became Rekindling Phoenix, embalm and eternalize creatures, and things with hexproof like Bristling Hydra and Carnage Tyrant. Muldrotha and all the big game toppers die too easily to point removal such as Vraska's Contempt, Ravenous Chupacabra, and Unlicensed Disintegration. Not to mention Abrade, Wizard's Lightning, and Lightning strike alone already empower red enough that it's difficult to play any kind of creature with less than 3 toughness. Giving the format an unconditional one mana removal that can kill anything with up to 3 toughness would be about as bad as Fatal Push right now.

    If people want more non-creature spell strategies, what Wizards has to do is make ETB enchantments that have effects as well. History of Benalia and Legion's Landing are two of the most playable enchantments in ages because they don't just sit there granting a passive effect. If Ajani's Welcome had flash and could prevent the next 3 damage target creature would deal this turn, it would actually see play.

    The pandora's box that got opened by Wizards was the invention of ETB creatures ages ago, and once they did that it forced games to run faster because now cards could give an immediate effect while also doing something else, such as build the board up. Since creatures were the primary target of ETB type triggers, this increased the power of removal such as Lightning Bolt due to more creature heavy decks being common, which is why they started making weaker Lightning Bolt type cards.

    Ultimately, I believe Richard Garfield moved to other games because developing for MTG just got boring. It went from a game where you could do all sorts of things to a game of creatures vs removal spells. Enchantments and combat tricks basically became too weak to really do anything in constructed. Giant Growth used to be good, but now it takes something on the level of Blossoming Defense to see constructed play due to the creature vs removal formula.

    The cards standard needs are things like Sylvan Library, Static Orb, Rancor, Counter spell, Benevolent Bodyguard, Humble, etc. If they do that, then they probably can do Lightning Bolt again, since spells got better and there can be non-creature strategies again. That's my own opinion, though, given the way the game has played out in standard the last few years. It's why people still cling to legacy.

    Well, that's my rant for the day. :p
    Posted in: Standard (Type 2)
  • posted a message on Do you just collect cards? Or always play?
    Anyone else had issues with an LGS due to allergies and such? I know I've had to stop going to the closest LGS to me because of the air quality being bad. Every time I go there to pick up cards my throat basically goes raw, which usually isn't a good sign. It's kind of annoying because the owner of the LGS is actually great. I believe it's because some of the people who go there smoke, so it kind of reminds me of my old uncles house where I basically had to arm myself with throat lozenges and wash everything I wore after visiting.
    Posted in: Magic General
  • posted a message on Arena Unique Cards
    Maybe they want to switch things up and make the digital game the main thing and the paper game the secondary thing. Basically, do what Blizzard did with the World of Warcraft TCG and replacing it with hearthstone.
    Posted in: The Rumor Mill
  • posted a message on Theorycraft - BW Midrange Control
    What deck are you talking about Colt? Looks like maybe you have an interesting deck in mind, but none of your cards are black or white.


    I was mostly throwing up some building advice since mid-range is in a tough spot. I think I mentioned earlier I've been brainstorming Wx mid-range for a bit now mostly because my favorite card from the new set is Ajani, Adversary of Tyrants and all the three drop options for card advantage. My biggest disappointment of the set has probably been Leonin Warleader. I was a big fan of Hero of Bladehold, and unfortunately the cat just doesn't do enough.
    Posted in: Deck Creation (Standard)
  • posted a message on Theorycraft - BW Midrange Control
    After messing around on Deckstats forever, I think I've started to identify some of the build restrictions we are left with given what the top tier decks look like right now.

    On the low end there is the mono-red match up. Mono-red itself is a very fragile deck, but it is also incredibly efficient at what it does and is a master at early game field control. The main threats posed from Mono-red is it's ability to remove creatures through Lightning Strike, Magma Spray, Abrade, and rarely Sweltering Suns, while simultaneously swinging in with small, efficient creatures capable of trading against most early creatures drops on a one to one basis. If they can't win early from those threats they usually try to drop a Hazoret the Fervent, with their final gasping breath being to land a Glorybringer or other big dumb 5 drop.

    On the high end there's control with Teferi. Those decks don't even want to attack early. The only thing they want to do is sit there and stare at you until you try to do something, then counter that with a removal spell or literally counter it with a counter spell.

    So ultimately, the deck has two key things to worry about. Against aggro the deck has to have a way to go over 3 damage or make one for one removal on the low end really bad. I think my favorite (and completely underappreciated gem) is River Hoopoe. Also, yes it is a real bird, see This handy article for details. It's a 1/3 that can go over turn 1 removal spells and with some help, can be boosted over turn 2 removal like Abrade. Because it has that high defense it can wall early attackers and can kill a lot of them in one on one fights. It also draws cards after the onslaught and give some life.

    However, River Hoopoe does nothing against a control match up. It has a bad clock, so it isn't good on offense, and the card draw + life gain wont help against their end game, which usually is to play something like Torrential Gearhulk, Approach of the Second Sun, and The Scarab God. In these situations the idea is to try to win faster than they can, so you want early drops like Warkite Marauder. They aren't playing removal that cares about toughness, so the price for getting that higher power stat is less an issue in these matchups.

    So how does this play into the Mid-range deck strategy? Well, a decision has to be made, because there is no way to build a deck to make both matchups good. Either one prepares for the control match up and has red be the bad one, or one prepares for the red match up and control gets more advantage.

    Also, to consistently cast certain spells at a given turn with a certain number of mana symbols, see attachments. These were taken some time ago from Franks analysis found here.

    Posting this since a lot of people using deck stats use the mana ratio thingy that gets posted with the deck analysis, which isn't actually all that accurate on it's own. Also, the charts below are not about how many lands to have in the deck, but merely how many of those lands must be of the given color to reliably cast a spell on each given turn. Turn 2 double on color mana is really, really rough. One catch is that you don't really need 100% consistent mana for most two drops on turn 2 since they typically are more powerful than other drops at that point in the curve, so they fair okay as turn 3 drops in multi-color decks. Plus, with ETB type creatures that act as spells, something like Merfolk Trickster isn't intended to get dropped so early on turn 2 all that often.
    Posted in: Deck Creation (Standard)
  • posted a message on Thoughts on not getting a rare land cycle in M19
    Quote from Melkor »
    I'm actually really hoping that RtRtR doesn't have shocks, and they do something else. The RtR supply was so huge, they are still plentiful, and prices have barely gone up at all since they were in. I absolutely believe in reprinting cards, price and availability should not be obstacles, but there are so many other things they could do, ZEN fetches first among them. I just don't think that $10 lands that still have SO MUCH supply would be a wise move. Look at the M15 pain land cycle, or the Filters. Supply is higher than demand is even thinking about being, and a pain land is usually not worth a pack. If Shocks got another huge printing, I think it would crash the prices and it would actually backfire, they wouldn't sell the set because they wouldn't be chase cards. I can still get a box of anything in RtR block for the same prices as when they were new, and that's with a GREAT draft format.


    There will be rioting in the streets if they don't do shocks and the shock + checkland mana base is what made Innistrad + RTR fun for a lot of people. They have every reason to reprint the shocks and I'm 100% on board with a third reprint, since we likely wont get another one for years. They need to save the BFZ lands for the return to Kamigawa that is coming up later after Ravnica. Shock lands are a modern staple and people do not trade out of them unless they are strictly draft players or standard players. Plus, even though there were many copies printed, a huge number are just sitting in sealed boxes no one is opening because the box EV of RTR and Gate Crash.
    Posted in: Magic General
  • posted a message on Why is there no "new card frame" format?
    Quote from Perodequeso »
    Someone tried, ever hear of Frontier? It's an Origins on format. Didn't quite gain much traction. Not sure why WOTC didn't embrace it, maybe because they didn't come up with it, maybe because Khans block has fetchlands, who knows really.

    Possibly because there's not enough of a card pool yet. I think that between Standard, Modern, Commander, and Pauper, there might just be enough formats.
    Then you add Draft, Sealed, Legacy, Vintage, and Old School formats to the mix and you have quite a bevy to choose from. Not to mention those who just play
    casual constructed at home.

    The answer is that everyone is waiting for WOTC to come out with another format and they've been quiet about it. Maybe they're waiting for a specific reason,
    but "we" don't know why. If some else has more info about this please share.


    New Frontier was m15 frame and up. I'm saying just do everything modern card frame and up. Frontier flopped because it was created to address a supply issue for one region. The format was interesting in the USA, but it had no legs here because it forced people to have to decide between modern or frontier, which is what I was hoping wouldn't happen. The problem in the US is the singles market being prone to extreme highs and lows with little moderation to keep the spikes from happening too quickly. It's fine to have prices climb with demand and decrease when demand wanes, but having it happen as fast as it does makes it difficult for the end buyer. This got caused by them using masters sets for reprints, ironically. If masters sets were like the original 2013 version in price it might have worked, but when they boosted the box prices and started reprinting cards, they realized they couldn't just put the same high priced cards in the same box year in and out. Hence they rationed out the cards over the last few years, put filler in for draft, and eroded consumer confidence, hence the long, slow, agonizing price drops on many of the modern cards over the period of 2016-2017.

    The only reason prices surged suddenly is that the last year of masters sets flopped so hard, it made people confident in wizards being incompetent. Laughing Now their big sales pitch is that we are living in the "age of feedback" and "we are listening to you" even though they are still mostly listening to twitter and reddit, which is driving a lot of the core players nuts.
    Posted in: Magic General
  • posted a message on Why is there no "new card frame" format?
    I was just thinking about this, but people are always complaining about modern not getting cards reprinted in standard because the cards are too good for standard, so why is it nobody is just tossing their arms up and doing a format that's all modern frame sets? It's basically legacy light, avoids the reserved list, and ultimately it's probably going to get all the non-RL cards eventually since wizards doesn't have an issue with reprinting those cards via commander, conspiracy, Battlebond, etc. Is it just because they are afraid the format will make the game too expensive? It's not like a ban list can't exist for it and such.
    Posted in: Magic General
  • posted a message on Commander 2018 themes and art
    Quote from Watchwolf »
    What a waste of time. I think WotC just convinced me not to buy any M19 OR C18 with that train wreck.

    Seriously, they call this the "Era of Feedback" while they delete chat messages because they mention a desire to see C18 stuff instead of stupid M19 crap. They clearly have no clue how to handle feedback that isn't unconditional praise.

    And the art here is extremely disappointing. They might have shown us the art of six random commons from M19 for how much we can speculate about them. Sure, we got maybe one piece of cool planeswalker art, but it's not any recognizable character, so there's no reason to get at all excited.

    Terrible way to hype a product.


    Meanwhile, no one is talking about Battlebond, which is arguably another one of the most surprising successes they've had in a while. I'd rather open a box of that set than a box of M19, to be honest. The art is just so out of this world unique in that set and there are some really good reprints.
    Posted in: The Rumor Mill
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