*puts on Werewolf_Rawr puppet*
More Werewolves pls. *puts on Sliverologist puppet*
More slivers pls. *puts on Tiro of Miletus puppet*
More sea monsters pls.
Now that we’ve covered the obvious, does anyone have any creature type hopes or predictions that they don’t base their entire “brand” around?
Another double masters
Another commander legends
Another jumpstart
Another commander collection
…2022 seems to be Wizard’s attempt at a re-do for 2020 to see how much money they would have made if people were playing in stores. Kind of interesting to see.
The carpet of flowers one also has sanctum prelate, so that's something.
Kind of like these, honestly. Looks like they'll be available tomorrow as well.
I'm going to feel pretty sad if the announcement stream tomorrow has the speakers try to surprise us with the lairs being available "right now" as their big "shock and awe" moment. Makes me wonder if this advertisement was supposed to wait until tomorrow.
Edit: I also see heartless hidetsugu, Toshiro umezawa, one of the two ohran snow snakes, and sphere of safety hanging in there. The only card I can’t see for sure is the green kamigawa legend and I’m 99% sure that’s reki.
Are you gonna explain where this came from? 'Cause that Lotus art is pre-existing, so there's nothing particularly difficult to produce about this.
Twitter post.
1. The fact that people have to ask where it came from shows that it is not real. This Twitter post is pretending to be an advertisement… the type that wizards sends out to some of the biggest content creators. If this was real, it would have been reposted all over the paste hundreds of times and would be the most discussed topic on Reddit… but it’s not. An advertisement that you are “magically” the first one to find is fake.
2. Wizards isn’t dumb. If wizards ever released something like this, it wouldn’t be something whose entire existence is casually teased as part of an advertisement. A real “reserved masters” announcement would be the ultimate Mic drop moment, much like the announcement last year that enemy fetches would be reprinted at rare in modern horizons 2, turned up to 11. Why would anyone fully give away the most exciting product of the year in a teaser image? If you said that this was a leaked image, that might have caused a bit of discussion. The fact that it is an advertisement clearly designed to be shown BEFORE the announcement, however, shows that this is false.
Honestly, though, you really aren’t acting too mature in this thread. You started a thread that asked a question. The question was answered.
I don’t know why you seem so dissatisfied with the answer. I can understand wanting the reserved list to be broken but the ONLY thing you asked is if there was evidence for a rumor… and there isn’t.
If you want drama or controversy, feel free to make another thread to ask if the reserved list could/should be broken. The topic of this thread, though, has been firmly addressed.
In my opinion, having a terrible selection of cards is exactly how you would want to do a convention-specific secret lair. If this sort of secret lair had the great henge or parallel lives or some similarly valuable card, people would be blowing a gasket.
I will agree that a cat-themed secret lair could have had more cat-themed cards, though.
I post this topic because I heard some recent rumors about RL.
To reiterate
1. While I understand why you'd post here, I'd recommend putting this in Speculation or baseless speculation as the rumor mill itself no longer seems like the place for this type of thread. It's counterintuitive and annoying but I'm just letting you know in case you hear something else down the road that you want to verify.
2. There are two parts of every rumor: The content and the source. Hearing a claim from "someone" (or "multiple people"... or even "most people") is utterly meaningless if there is no source. There are plenty of people in America who probably think that another stimulus check is coming but I would not call that "a rumor" unless one of them is able to point to a solid source of information. This is what separates a rumor from speculation.
You said in the first post that you heard something might happen to the reserved list and asked if anyone could give a source. Nobody could. There is no identified source (even anonymous ones) that would explain why the people you are talkign to would have access to this information. Ergo, this is less "rumor" and more "speculation".
3. If your real question is "why are people talking about this now?", there are two reasons. First of all, this speculation literally never ends. There are always people talking about it for one reason or another. I have seen nothing to suggest a distinct "new wave" to rumors. Secondly, people who really want to believe something are more likely to latch onto the tiniest reasons to keep believing. Some people may see the approaching 30th anniversary and just think "If MTG ever broke the reserved list, it would be on a huge anniversary" (which you might recognize is not any sort of evidence). Other people may point to a post by Mark Rosewater within the past 2 weeks when he responded to a question about the RL by saying that breaking it was "An extreme longshot" instead of saying that it would "never" happen... but only after the person who asked the question specifically pointed out that Mark has made of point of "Never saying never" in the question, which doesn't exactly make this stick out as evidence, either.
So...
1. Future posts like this go in the speculation or baseless speculation section.
2. You asked if there was any evidence for this. There is not evidence for this at this time. Your question was answered.
I've been very vocal on my opinions of the Reserve List on these forums, but posts like this give me another new stance....
Just blacklist threads like this. Blacklist the phrase "Reserve List" in thread titles. Seriously, it's nonsense this thread has been allowed to exist for as long as it has.
The burden of proof relies on the one making the claim. YOU are the one making claims of reasons to believe the list is going to be changed without providing evidence. The evidence against it, on the other hand, has been made abundant over this forum for YEARS now.
So what's the problem? Don't you like this topic? Just pass over and have a nice day.
I'd say that there's two real things going on.
1. This thread is kind of in the wrong place. While this is technically the "rumor mill", even a short look at the other threads in this forum should indicate that it isn't 'actually' used for rumors. Most of the threads here are about spoilers. This thread actually belongs in the speculation section within the rumor mill (or even the baseless speculation section within speculation) and there are a fair amount of threads even then that had an identifiable source of a potential leak rather than "I've heard people talking about it".
2. The leak and rumor community is a bit more robust and substantial than rumors in most other areas, to the point where most "I heard people talking about it" rumors don't even register. Most of the rumors that people spend time on come from sources. People may spoil miscellaneous info on reddit threads. Some people e-mail Rudy from Alpha Investments random leaks and hints that they have heard and those that he hears multiple times are sometimes mentioned in videos. While some of these sources are fake and some are real, there is always a source.
I want to commend you for hearing a rumor from other people and actually posting on here to see if there is a specific source rather than taking it at face value. The fact that no source has been found, however, should lead you to question what you have heard. If you heard that the manager at your LGS was sent an internal memo by accident (or something like that) or that this news came from a reddit user who has supplied specific user has supplied accurate information in the past, this would be a rumor with legs. As there seems to be no such source, however, this "rumor" seems largely speculative.
If there is no source, that doesn't mean that the Reserve List isn't going away (even if I find it unlikely), of course. It just means that your hope for it to go away is not based on any actual leaks or hints at this time. If you want to have a conversation about whether the reserved list should go away or if you think that it would make sense/be cool for it to be done at a specific milestone (such as Magic's Upcoming 30th anniversary), that is again something that should go in a new thread in Speculation or Baseless Speculation.
TLDR:
1. The rumor mill forum isn't actually for this kind of rumor any more (it annoys lots of people, trust me). Use Speculation/Baseless Speculation.
2. Your initial question (were there any recent leaks to substantiate this rumor?) was answered (no). If you want to talk more about the RL and if/how it should be broken, feel free to start a new thread in Speculation/Baseless Speculation.
Wanted to make one quick point that I feel gets lost in discussions of the reserved list.
Whenever people dream about Wizards finally kicking down the banlist, people always bring up the idea that a product with the banlist would have to make Wizards enough money for it to be worth the risk. Most sets for MTG sell pretty well. Premium sets like Double Masters or Modern Horizons 2 with big chase cards likely sell even better. It is very tempting to predict that further increases in power would lead to corresponding increases in sales... but does it really?
Lets say that wizards needs to make twice or triple their normal income for the loss of reprint equity in masters sets to be worthwhile. I can afford to spend that much additional money on a premium set every now and then, though it's a bit of a stretch.
Now, let's say that Wizards needs to make ten times the normal income for the risk of a class-action suit from a reserve-list breaking product to be worthwhile. I can't afford to spend ten times the normal amount of money I spend on a set on any magic product. Ever. That would not fit in my budget unless I refrained from all MTG-related purchases for a good many months. Many other people would be in a similar boat as me. I doubt that such a product would be trying to make up the difference by appealing to brand new players, either. To make income of 10 x the normal amount, Wizards would be relying on the purchasing behaviors of extreme whales to go far above that 10x mark to make up for every player who can't reach that point... except that players with that amount of cash to spend on a regular product can afford to get virtually every card from the reserved list already. In fact, those are likely the players "hurt" most by the reprints of reserved list cards.
If the only people in a position to spend "enough" money on a product are those who are least likely to want or like the product, that is a problem.
tldr: I do not feel that wizards could reasonably earn enough money from a reserved list breaking product to fend off and potentially pay out on a class-action suit without making an amount of money from the product that would all but require the wealthy and enfranchised group of players who will likely be the ones suing them.
Honestly don’t think this guy works for modern. Look at creatures with tap abilities in modern and what do you get...
Dauthi Voidwalker: an unblockable beater with a leyline of the void built in that flat out steals an emrakul or Ugin and wins the game every now and then. stone forge mystic: simply better for living weapons than Oswald as you can skip straight to Kaldra/Batterskull without takihn a large number of steps (and you get something on ETB if your opponent just kills it). Tonsofonedrops: because at that incredible speed, having your card live through one turn is somewhat possible.
Oswald is a 2 drop legendary creature that needs to live at least one turn to do anything.
Acolyte of ChaosR Creature — Elemental
At the beginning of your upkeep, you may have Acolyte of Chaos' base power and toughness become 3/2 or 1/4.
1/1
Originally wanted to do this:
Acolyte of Chaos1R Creature — Elemental
At the beginning of your upkeep, you may have Acolyte of Chaos' base power and toughness become 4/3 or 2/5.
1/1
idk, then I wanted to try and match CryptidKarp
So it’s a 1 mana 3/2. While 1 damage or a -1/-1 effect can technically kill this before it transforms, there are no used kill spells right now that would kill a 1/1 and not a 3/2.
Not balanced, though I will respect that it follows the rules.
The idea is indeed that both sides are simultaneously drafted as though they were a single card and for packs with them to be collated so both parts will always appear together. The idea here is that having only one version is literally illegal in the same way that you can't avoid transforming an average TDFC by saying that you "didn't bring" the other half. You have both or you have neither as the two cards represent a single game object that can (pre-transforming) be switched out interchangeably.
I am now seeing that this effect is too counterintuitive to realistically see the light of day, though I think that the rules could technically support it.
Possible artificer and/or golem/construct tribal in brother’s war.
*puts on Werewolf_Rawr puppet*
More Werewolves pls.
*puts on Sliverologist puppet*
More slivers pls.
*puts on Tiro of Miletus puppet*
More sea monsters pls.
Now that we’ve covered the obvious, does anyone have any creature type hopes or predictions that they don’t base their entire “brand” around?
Another double masters
Another commander legends
Another jumpstart
Another commander collection
…2022 seems to be Wizard’s attempt at a re-do for 2020 to see how much money they would have made if people were playing in stores. Kind of interesting to see.
Kind of like these, honestly. Looks like they'll be available tomorrow as well.
I'm going to feel pretty sad if the announcement stream tomorrow has the speakers try to surprise us with the lairs being available "right now" as their big "shock and awe" moment. Makes me wonder if this advertisement was supposed to wait until tomorrow.
Edit: I also see heartless hidetsugu, Toshiro umezawa, one of the two ohran snow snakes, and sphere of safety hanging in there. The only card I can’t see for sure is the green kamigawa legend and I’m 99% sure that’s reki.
1. The fact that people have to ask where it came from shows that it is not real. This Twitter post is pretending to be an advertisement… the type that wizards sends out to some of the biggest content creators. If this was real, it would have been reposted all over the paste hundreds of times and would be the most discussed topic on Reddit… but it’s not. An advertisement that you are “magically” the first one to find is fake.
2. Wizards isn’t dumb. If wizards ever released something like this, it wouldn’t be something whose entire existence is casually teased as part of an advertisement. A real “reserved masters” announcement would be the ultimate Mic drop moment, much like the announcement last year that enemy fetches would be reprinted at rare in modern horizons 2, turned up to 11. Why would anyone fully give away the most exciting product of the year in a teaser image? If you said that this was a leaked image, that might have caused a bit of discussion. The fact that it is an advertisement clearly designed to be shown BEFORE the announcement, however, shows that this is false.
Honestly, though, you really aren’t acting too mature in this thread. You started a thread that asked a question. The question was answered.
I don’t know why you seem so dissatisfied with the answer. I can understand wanting the reserved list to be broken but the ONLY thing you asked is if there was evidence for a rumor… and there isn’t.
If you want drama or controversy, feel free to make another thread to ask if the reserved list could/should be broken. The topic of this thread, though, has been firmly addressed.
There is no reason to think we are getting any spoilers/clues for innistrad tomorrow. At least, no reasons based on things we’ve been explicitly told.
I will agree that a cat-themed secret lair could have had more cat-themed cards, though.
To reiterate
1. While I understand why you'd post here, I'd recommend putting this in Speculation or baseless speculation as the rumor mill itself no longer seems like the place for this type of thread. It's counterintuitive and annoying but I'm just letting you know in case you hear something else down the road that you want to verify.
2. There are two parts of every rumor: The content and the source. Hearing a claim from "someone" (or "multiple people"... or even "most people") is utterly meaningless if there is no source. There are plenty of people in America who probably think that another stimulus check is coming but I would not call that "a rumor" unless one of them is able to point to a solid source of information. This is what separates a rumor from speculation.
You said in the first post that you heard something might happen to the reserved list and asked if anyone could give a source. Nobody could. There is no identified source (even anonymous ones) that would explain why the people you are talkign to would have access to this information. Ergo, this is less "rumor" and more "speculation".
3. If your real question is "why are people talking about this now?", there are two reasons. First of all, this speculation literally never ends. There are always people talking about it for one reason or another. I have seen nothing to suggest a distinct "new wave" to rumors. Secondly, people who really want to believe something are more likely to latch onto the tiniest reasons to keep believing. Some people may see the approaching 30th anniversary and just think "If MTG ever broke the reserved list, it would be on a huge anniversary" (which you might recognize is not any sort of evidence). Other people may point to a post by Mark Rosewater within the past 2 weeks when he responded to a question about the RL by saying that breaking it was "An extreme longshot" instead of saying that it would "never" happen... but only after the person who asked the question specifically pointed out that Mark has made of point of "Never saying never" in the question, which doesn't exactly make this stick out as evidence, either.
So...
1. Future posts like this go in the speculation or baseless speculation section.
2. You asked if there was any evidence for this. There is not evidence for this at this time. Your question was answered.
I'd say that there's two real things going on.
1. This thread is kind of in the wrong place. While this is technically the "rumor mill", even a short look at the other threads in this forum should indicate that it isn't 'actually' used for rumors. Most of the threads here are about spoilers. This thread actually belongs in the speculation section within the rumor mill (or even the baseless speculation section within speculation) and there are a fair amount of threads even then that had an identifiable source of a potential leak rather than "I've heard people talking about it".
2. The leak and rumor community is a bit more robust and substantial than rumors in most other areas, to the point where most "I heard people talking about it" rumors don't even register. Most of the rumors that people spend time on come from sources. People may spoil miscellaneous info on reddit threads. Some people e-mail Rudy from Alpha Investments random leaks and hints that they have heard and those that he hears multiple times are sometimes mentioned in videos. While some of these sources are fake and some are real, there is always a source.
I want to commend you for hearing a rumor from other people and actually posting on here to see if there is a specific source rather than taking it at face value. The fact that no source has been found, however, should lead you to question what you have heard. If you heard that the manager at your LGS was sent an internal memo by accident (or something like that) or that this news came from a reddit user who has supplied specific user has supplied accurate information in the past, this would be a rumor with legs. As there seems to be no such source, however, this "rumor" seems largely speculative.
If there is no source, that doesn't mean that the Reserve List isn't going away (even if I find it unlikely), of course. It just means that your hope for it to go away is not based on any actual leaks or hints at this time. If you want to have a conversation about whether the reserved list should go away or if you think that it would make sense/be cool for it to be done at a specific milestone (such as Magic's Upcoming 30th anniversary), that is again something that should go in a new thread in Speculation or Baseless Speculation.
TLDR:
1. The rumor mill forum isn't actually for this kind of rumor any more (it annoys lots of people, trust me). Use Speculation/Baseless Speculation.
2. Your initial question (were there any recent leaks to substantiate this rumor?) was answered (no). If you want to talk more about the RL and if/how it should be broken, feel free to start a new thread in Speculation/Baseless Speculation.
Whenever people dream about Wizards finally kicking down the banlist, people always bring up the idea that a product with the banlist would have to make Wizards enough money for it to be worth the risk. Most sets for MTG sell pretty well. Premium sets like Double Masters or Modern Horizons 2 with big chase cards likely sell even better. It is very tempting to predict that further increases in power would lead to corresponding increases in sales... but does it really?
Lets say that wizards needs to make twice or triple their normal income for the loss of reprint equity in masters sets to be worthwhile. I can afford to spend that much additional money on a premium set every now and then, though it's a bit of a stretch.
Now, let's say that Wizards needs to make ten times the normal income for the risk of a class-action suit from a reserve-list breaking product to be worthwhile. I can't afford to spend ten times the normal amount of money I spend on a set on any magic product. Ever. That would not fit in my budget unless I refrained from all MTG-related purchases for a good many months. Many other people would be in a similar boat as me. I doubt that such a product would be trying to make up the difference by appealing to brand new players, either. To make income of 10 x the normal amount, Wizards would be relying on the purchasing behaviors of extreme whales to go far above that 10x mark to make up for every player who can't reach that point... except that players with that amount of cash to spend on a regular product can afford to get virtually every card from the reserved list already. In fact, those are likely the players "hurt" most by the reprints of reserved list cards.
If the only people in a position to spend "enough" money on a product are those who are least likely to want or like the product, that is a problem.
tldr: I do not feel that wizards could reasonably earn enough money from a reserved list breaking product to fend off and potentially pay out on a class-action suit without making an amount of money from the product that would all but require the wealthy and enfranchised group of players who will likely be the ones suing them.
Dauthi Voidwalker: an unblockable beater with a leyline of the void built in that flat out steals an emrakul or Ugin and wins the game every now and then.
stone forge mystic: simply better for living weapons than Oswald as you can skip straight to Kaldra/Batterskull without takihn a large number of steps (and you get something on ETB if your opponent just kills it).
Tonsofonedrops: because at that incredible speed, having your card live through one turn is somewhat possible.
Oswald is a 2 drop legendary creature that needs to live at least one turn to do anything.
So it’s a 1 mana 3/2. While 1 damage or a -1/-1 effect can technically kill this before it transforms, there are no used kill spells right now that would kill a 1/1 and not a 3/2.
Not balanced, though I will respect that it follows the rules.
I am now seeing that this effect is too counterintuitive to realistically see the light of day, though I think that the rules could technically support it.