What do you guys think about Call the Gatewatch? It's can be almost as strong as Wargate in this deck.
It's also more flexible than Wargate if you are grabbing a planeswalker, as you can split up the cost between turns, and it's less colour intensive.
It's obviously worse than wargate if you need to grab an enchantment, but I think it is worth testing. The real question would be what to cut for it.
I think that call the gate watch is a little to narrow. Granted it's a great top deck late game but wargate can help you develop your mana early and is also a great late game to top deck as well. Not to mention being able to get any kind of permanent.
It may be better then enlightened tutor if your running it.
I think that Samuts combo with doubling season makes her too good not to try. She just wins the game by getting Ugin and whatever other value guy you want. Like liliana.
Bolas is certainly interesting. He is cheaper and his ultimate effects every opponent instead of just killing 1 person. The hand disruption is kinda meh. The free cascade is swingy. But with looping chain veil activations it is a legitimate win condition.
Also being able to just bug anything for 7 is not terrible.
I think og Bolas might be better in a vacume while god pharaoh might have more synergy with a super friends build.
Bontus last reckoning is an interesting wrath. Being 3 mana makes it more likely that you can cast a walker and the reckoning in the same turn. I think I will test it over supreme verdict.
Yeah, there are lots of interesting creatures that work well with planeswalkers. But personally, the total lack of creatures is what pulled me to this list in the first place! I've designed quite a few EDH decks for my meta, and over the years, I've felt more and more intrigued by using powerful, symmetric effects and breaking them (or at least make them hurt me the least). And OP's creatureless list runs them all! (Well, except maybe Mindslicer...) So, creature discussions aside, if anyone has new ideas for the creatureless version, let's hear them! I'm building that one, but I'm skimping out on six of the more expensive cards for now. So I'm toying around with some replacements, right now they are: The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale -> Wasteland Moat -> Ensnaring Bridge Capture of Jingzhou -> Savor the Moment The Abyss -> Tainted Aether Imperial Seal -> Beseech the Queen Temporal Manipulation -> Temporal Mastery
Suggestions for better replacements? Considering trying Pendrell Mists for the Tabernacle effect, just having a hard time finding one to buy. Bridge doesn't do the trick quite as Moat, but I like it more than Dueling Grounds. Although Moat wouldn't stop the Gisela deck in my playgroup...
Going to pick up the Manipulation and the Seal when I see what's left of this months salary. Found a crappy Italian Abyss quite cheap in the country too, maybe snagging that one as well.
Trav_Ragnar, have you ever thought about Bitterblossom? To tough on the life? Always thought of that one as a classic PW defense card.
Savor the moment is a good sub for capture. It has done some work and at worst it's a 3 mana explore which is fine.
I actually think dueling grounds is superior to moat. Some of your walkers make chump blockers and maze or kor haven is better against a guy then all the fliers.
Pendrel mist seems like a fine card and if it were foil I'd probably run it.
Beseech the queen seems like garbage praetors grasp while being semi random lets you search any players deck since you are 5c. Tainted aether seems better then the abyss. I know. Crazy.
My meta are kind of jerk wads. Lol. They will harass me despite me not being an actual danger in game cause of what my deck does. I rarely get to untap with a walker. Even something as inocus as a garruk wildspeaker. This kind of forces me to get more combo-y or wait till I can board wipe and play a walker in the same turn.
I also know that my build restriction makes my deck not as good as it could be. My kingdom for a foil humility!
In my build I think that newest nissa is a little bland by herself but unassuming. With chain veil though it's another cog to get untapped mana in the loop.
Is too bad that online this dumb deck is like 500-800 tickets. Build a second version or get more pimp stuff? It's always gonna be pimp stuff!
Is your meta tolerant to your deck? Does it have a bullseye from t1?
It seems like your build is decent at strangling the table with your more dedicated control/prison cards. Does that ring true?
""Right now I'm currently at 23 planeswalker, and I would like to get to 25, possibly with Chandra, Flamecaller (nice wrath effect with Humility out) and Kiora, the Crashing Wave (and I'm sure I'll run the new Nicol Bolas when it comes out, so I'll drop a lucklaster planeswalker for him). Any opinions on what to drop?""
I am not a fan of JtMS. It's always been a 4cmc Brainstorm. People tend to kill it at great cost even though he's a little lack luster in multiplayer. I think JAoT is strictly better.
I'm also not so high on any Gideon. Although trials could be good vs a combo group if they can't just kill it.
I am excited to try out nissa steward of elements over kiora in my list.
I kind of feel like the new nicol bolas will be pushed and I'm tentavly going to swap them depending on what he does.
i try to maximize doubling season and chain veil wins which reflects some of my choices of walkers that generate mana. Like xenagos which I find to be fantastic in my deck with the token making he generates absurd amounts of mana to chain chain veil activations.
It isnt a wrath, but By Force from AMK looks to be good artifact removal, especially when you don't want to blow up yours.
Main reason why I said artifact removal also was just because it's the two things I would be okay dealing with simultaneously. That's why I dropped Akroma's Vengeance, was because it blew up my enchantments.
What about vandalblast? Strictly better other then politics? Or no?
I mainly need a creature wrath, but I don't want to just run a strictly creature wrath, but overall I think the deck is probably fine as is.
Hey there guys long time follower as I also run the super friends. My list is a little different since I have an only foils stipulation for my deck. Been running this for about 4-5 years at this point.
Take a look and please offer suggestions maybe or ask questions about odd card choices.
Lethal vapors seem bad but what's the groups experience?
I have 5 board wipes. I generally find that to be enough. Is evection worth it at 6cmc?
I've thought of torpor orb before but was sent sure if it was really worth it. I feel like something as simple as StP might be better?
Forgot Wargate was a thing. Think I have to pick one up!
Kor Haven seems like a strict upgrade to Tectonic edge, and it's a masterpiece to boot!
Kher keep seems okay but as you guys no the deck is super mana hungry and it seems a little weak. Thoughts?
Austere command is one I was thinking of cause it's an invocation now but it seems worse then the wipes I already run.
I was running Regrowth until Nissa Vital force came out. That and seasons past have been great!
Thanks for the replies!
@johhnychr
While there are deff expensive cards in here grim monolith is way pricey in foil. Maybe something to save up for. Plus I would have to be able to play blue suns zenith multiple times to win with it. At the point that I'm generating infi mana I can do infi chain veils or just loop d tutor seasons past and a time walk to kill the table.
Hey there guys long time follower as I also run the super friends. My list is a little different since I have an only foils stipulation for my deck. Been running this for about 4-5 years at this point.
Take a look and please offer suggestions maybe or ask questions about odd card choices.
I think that call the gate watch is a little to narrow. Granted it's a great top deck late game but wargate can help you develop your mana early and is also a great late game to top deck as well. Not to mention being able to get any kind of permanent.
It may be better then enlightened tutor if your running it.
Bolas is certainly interesting. He is cheaper and his ultimate effects every opponent instead of just killing 1 person. The hand disruption is kinda meh. The free cascade is swingy. But with looping chain veil activations it is a legitimate win condition.
Also being able to just bug anything for 7 is not terrible.
I think og Bolas might be better in a vacume while god pharaoh might have more synergy with a super friends build.
Bontus last reckoning is an interesting wrath. Being 3 mana makes it more likely that you can cast a walker and the reckoning in the same turn. I think I will test it over supreme verdict.
Savor the moment is a good sub for capture. It has done some work and at worst it's a 3 mana explore which is fine.
I actually think dueling grounds is superior to moat. Some of your walkers make chump blockers and maze or kor haven is better against a guy then all the fliers.
Pendrel mist seems like a fine card and if it were foil I'd probably run it.
Beseech the queen seems like garbage praetors grasp while being semi random lets you search any players deck since you are 5c. Tainted aether seems better then the abyss. I know. Crazy.
I also know that my build restriction makes my deck not as good as it could be. My kingdom for a foil humility!
In my build I think that newest nissa is a little bland by herself but unassuming. With chain veil though it's another cog to get untapped mana in the loop.
Is too bad that online this dumb deck is like 500-800 tickets. Build a second version or get more pimp stuff? It's always gonna be pimp stuff!
Is your meta tolerant to your deck? Does it have a bullseye from t1?
It seems like your build is decent at strangling the table with your more dedicated control/prison cards. Does that ring true?
I am not a fan of JtMS. It's always been a 4cmc Brainstorm. People tend to kill it at great cost even though he's a little lack luster in multiplayer. I think JAoT is strictly better.
I'm also not so high on any Gideon. Although trials could be good vs a combo group if they can't just kill it.
I am excited to try out nissa steward of elements over kiora in my list.
I kind of feel like the new nicol bolas will be pushed and I'm tentavly going to swap them depending on what he does.
i try to maximize doubling season and chain veil wins which reflects some of my choices of walkers that generate mana. Like xenagos which I find to be fantastic in my deck with the token making he generates absurd amounts of mana to chain chain veil activations.
Lethal vapors seem bad but what's the groups experience?
I have 5 board wipes. I generally find that to be enough. Is evection worth it at 6cmc?
I've thought of torpor orb before but was sent sure if it was really worth it. I feel like something as simple as StP might be better?
Forgot Wargate was a thing. Think I have to pick one up!
Kor Haven seems like a strict upgrade to Tectonic edge, and it's a masterpiece to boot!
Kher keep seems okay but as you guys no the deck is super mana hungry and it seems a little weak. Thoughts?
Austere command is one I was thinking of cause it's an invocation now but it seems worse then the wipes I already run.
I was running Regrowth until Nissa Vital force came out. That and seasons past have been great!
Thanks for the replies!
@johhnychr
While there are deff expensive cards in here grim monolith is way pricey in foil. Maybe something to save up for. Plus I would have to be able to play blue suns zenith multiple times to win with it. At the point that I'm generating infi mana I can do infi chain veils or just loop d tutor seasons past and a time walk to kill the table.
Take a look and please offer suggestions maybe or ask questions about odd card choices.
Thanks for the time!
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/progenitus-super-pimps/