It was a great games, though the eldrazi player flooded out at the end. The Mardu player also often played Lingering Souls from his hand before flashing back - is that the right call? I prefer to keep LS in my hand using the graveyard ones first, so that I have more cards in hand and to avoid a 2 for 1 if they exile my graveyard. Am I wrong here?
It really depends on mana and matchup. I agree that the player on camera made misplays with Lingering Souls.
Game 1:
* T1-3: Play three Blackcleave Cliffs
* T4: Top deck Arid Mesa, fetch Plains, play Lingering Souls
* T5: Play Lingering Souls from hand, leaving open only {R/B}
I'd have flashed back Lingering Souls, leaving open {R/B}W, allowing Lightning Helix to be cast to finish off a TKS after blocking with a single token.
And yes, against Eldrazi, Lingering Souls in hand is better against Reality Smasher, but worse against Thought Knot Seer.
The molten rains main are a concession to tron, since matchup is so bad to start with.
Nail on the head. Don't play it main deck. Tron is always going to be a bad matchup here. Stony Silence is the best two-drop we can play against Tron. It's good against Affinity, too. Put more in your sideboard.
Cards that do not belong in the main deck: Molten Rain, Crackling Doom, (and probably Soulfire Grand Master).
Cards that you should have 4 of but don't: Lightning Bolt, Lingering Souls.
One Stony Silence in the SB isn't going to do very much - you'll hardly ever draw it. When you bring in Stony, you want to draw it early.
4x Sacred Foundry is almost certainly wrong, too. The most important colors to have early are black and red, for discard and Lightning Bolt. 2 or 3 Blackcleave Cliffs is good.
Yes, shutting off Lingering Souls isn't too bad. Goyf is a pretty big headache, combat-wise. If you don't have removal for it, it's gonna start swinging. We can't often trade profitably with a goyf in combat.
How are you sideboarding? I talked to the player after the match and realized i was sideboarding wrong (I took out Anguished Unmaking for Rest in Peace, which we decided was wrong). I'm currently planning on: -4 Inquisition, -2 Thoughtseize, +3 Fulminator Mage, +3 Brave the Elements.
Actually, I think it's correct to keep Rest in Peace against Jund. I usually do a 1/1 split with RiP and Relic of Progenitus.
What are your targets for Anguished Unmaking? Jund doesn't often have any problematic non-creature permanents for our deck. Goyf is really the most problematic creature. RiP hoses all of their 4 Goyfs.
So it's a little ahead of time but if the new cycle of rare lands is finished up to include enemy colors; would you agree that they would replace Isolated Chapel in Token? Upside would be that they would be able to be played untapped turn 1 to a revealed shock or basic. Downside would be they can't be played untapped later on if we don't hold onto a basic. I think the ability to be played turn 1 untapped alone would solidly cause it to replace chapel.
Such land would be ridiculous trap. We often keep 2-3 land hands and hope for land topdeck: such topdeck lands is definitely not what we want. Our deck is already pretty wierd on mana, painful and sometimes slow. I don't think showland/handland will be playable in modern for that reason.
Also, much worse than Chapel in a hand that has two fetchlands or a fetchland and a Fetid Heath in it.
@michaelvogler - can you add the Reid Duke quote back to the top of the primer?
Quote from Reid Duke »
BW Tokens is a difficult deck to classify; it has aspects of control, aggro, and combo. It wins with creatures, but there's no need to be discouraged if the opponent is still at twenty by turn 5. In fact, the longer the game goes, the more confident I feel about winning. For this reason, I tend to treat BW Tokens as a control deck that puts its efforts into creature advantage rather than mana, cards in hand, or defensive planeswalkers (as more traditional control decks do).
Someone else mentioned it in the first page of replies, but "aggro-swarm" is a bit of a strange descriptor for the deck. The Reid Duke quote is pretty spot on, though, I think!
It really depends on mana and matchup. I agree that the player on camera made misplays with Lingering Souls.
Game 1:
* T1-3: Play three Blackcleave Cliffs
* T4: Top deck Arid Mesa, fetch Plains, play Lingering Souls
* T5: Play Lingering Souls from hand, leaving open only {R/B}
I'd have flashed back Lingering Souls, leaving open {R/B}W, allowing Lightning Helix to be cast to finish off a TKS after blocking with a single token.
And yes, against Eldrazi, Lingering Souls in hand is better against Reality Smasher, but worse against Thought Knot Seer.
Here are the two decks and a few interesting points from each:
29th by Emmanuel Ramirez: https://www.mtggoldfish.com/deck/506259
Nail on the head. Don't play it main deck. Tron is always going to be a bad matchup here. Stony Silence is the best two-drop we can play against Tron. It's good against Affinity, too. Put more in your sideboard.
A few thoughts.
Cards that do not belong in the main deck: Molten Rain, Crackling Doom, (and probably Soulfire Grand Master).
Cards that you should have 4 of but don't: Lightning Bolt, Lingering Souls.
One Stony Silence in the SB isn't going to do very much - you'll hardly ever draw it. When you bring in Stony, you want to draw it early.
4x Sacred Foundry is almost certainly wrong, too. The most important colors to have early are black and red, for discard and Lightning Bolt. 2 or 3 Blackcleave Cliffs is good.
How many rec sage/pridemages do those decks run? Not many, I think. They'd need to draw them.
Grafdigger's Cage is still absurd against them.
What did we come up with? I'm considering Westvale Abbey purely as sweeper protection and to generate value if flooded/top decking late in the game.
I'm not sure what to take out, either a land or a spell.
Actually, I think it's correct to keep Rest in Peace against Jund. I usually do a 1/1 split with RiP and Relic of Progenitus.
What are your targets for Anguished Unmaking? Jund doesn't often have any problematic non-creature permanents for our deck. Goyf is really the most problematic creature. RiP hoses all of their 4 Goyfs.
Add Grafdigger's Cage to the SB help combat Chord and Company. Opponent tutoring an Orzhov Pontiff is very, very annoying.
Gavony Township out of a KoTR is also very annoying. I'm not sure how to beat that. We need removal to beat the combo and to beat Knight.
Also, much worse than Chapel in a hand that has two fetchlands or a fetchland and a Fetid Heath in it.
Quote from Reid Duke »
Someone else mentioned it in the first page of replies, but "aggro-swarm" is a bit of a strange descriptor for the deck. The Reid Duke quote is pretty spot on, though, I think!
What's your deck list looking like now? I also just bought a few Lilianas and I'm keen to give her a try.
Here's my list:
http://tappedout.net/mtg-decks/24-07-15-wb-tokens/
I'm thinking...
-1 Gideon
-1 Thoughtseize
+2 Lily
And in the sideboard:
-1 Duress
+1 Engineered Explosives
I only have one comment on your deck (other than lack of Auriok Champion, which I think is a house):
You don't need two basic swamps. Two swamps and two vaults do not play very nicely with Spectral