@Warden: As far as changes in the main deck, I really don't know how much I like the Decree of Justices. I'm not sure what else to run in their place though. I guess Jace kind of counts as a win condition so I could just drop them for more removal/set up.
As far as sideboard is concerned, the Meddling Mages were pretty useless all day. I think they would be much better as Spell Pierces. The only thing I like about Meddling Mages is against combo they speed up your clock.
And in reference to the Merfolk matchup, Engineered Plagues are pretty much plenty especially with the Humilities I run. That matchup really depends on keeping their Cursecatchers off the table. In the top 8 I would have stabilized with a Wrath of God except he played two Cursecatchers the turn before I was going to Wrath. I also didn't see Humility once against Merfolk unfortunately.
Just noticed the 21 lands when you pointed that out. I missed 3x Wasteland. It's 24 lands. Same amount of colored sources, but 24 is a pretty good count.
Vindicate was a huge help against Enchantress. I would not have won without them. I was lucky to have only seen Karmic Justice once and it was after I had control of the board, so it wasn't relevant by that point.
Engineered Plague was also nice as a way to take down Enchantresses.
Dredge is never fun. It was also round 5 and a must win to make top 8. Can't say I was happy when I realized what he was playing after knowing I had to win to make it. But Planar Void makes the match-up winnable. It's still an awful match-up, but Planar Void is just so much better than Crypt or Relic, because it stays on the field.
I don't know about your school, but in mine after the drop date you can still withdraw from a class. It'll show up as a W on your transcript, but it won't be an F. Something you should probably check in to.
10. Magical Mystery Tour - The Beatles - Strawberry Fields, I am the Walrus, Blue Jay Way, and more. Great, great abum.
9. Rids the World of the Evil Vampire Curse - Scientist - Great CD to just space out to.
8. 10,000 Days - Tool - Guess what my favorite band is. Rosetta Stoned is an awesome song.
7. Revolutionary Volume 2 - Immortal Technique - The production of this album gets an A+.
6. De-Loused in the Comatorium - The Mars Volta - My favorite Mars Volta album.
5. Black Mountain - In the Future - Heavily influenced Led Zeppelin, Black Sabbath, and the Beatles, but with a more psychedelic twist and it is evident when listening to the songs.
4. Dead Meadow - Dead Meadow - This one took a while to grow on me, because of the weird vocals, but the music was so strong that I kept listening.
3. Quest for Fire - Quest for Fire - I could listen to this album endlessly. Some songs are very relaxing and slow paced, while others are faster Every song has its own vibe. If you like psychedelic music I highly recommend this one.
2. AEnima - Tool - Everything I said about Lateralus I repeat for this. Third Eye is the standout song on this album, but every one is excellent.
1. Lateralus - Tool - Every song on this album is amazing and it has my favorite all time song on it: Lateralus. This album is perfection.
I'm a gigantic Tool fan especially of Lateralus. So if you're looking for some good bands check these out. The first three are fairly psychedelic while the last one is a math rock band. Crazy instrumentals.
10,000 days was only bad in relative terms. like, 4/5 as opposed to 6/5 for all the others. the first half of 10,000 was frankly awesome, and only the far too long rosetta stoned let it down IMO.
Dude Rosetta Stoned was the best song on that album without a doubt. The Vocals are just insane and the instrumental in the middle of the song is absolutely amazing. And I love the build up from Lost Keys.
Personally Lateralus is my favorite album because of all the clever things they did with it. Go back and listen to the song Lateralus. The first part of the song is done in a pattern. The syllables in the each line are in the Fibonacci sequence (1,1,2,3,5,8,13).
Black (1)
then (1)
White are (2)
All I see (3)
In my infancy (5)
Red and Yellow then came to me (8)
etc
I've listened to a little Puscifier, but didn't really get into it. Been meaning to give it another try, but I've been listening to other bands.. and Tool. (Tool is by far my favorite band)
Yah my last post was a little... long day at work and I went to play some pong afterwards. Not really an excuse but sorry about that nonetheless.
When I said beyond testing I didn't mean that I didn't test it anymore, I just meant I use it in tournaments so it's beyond just non-tournament settings. I'm not sure how to put it.
Engineered Explosives is good because even though it can hit my Tarmogoyfs sometimes, I'm not gonna set it at two unless I'm in the bad position where I'll be taking out more of my opponents permanents than my own.
As for Werebear I don't like it and as Viroid said Dragonauts aren't a replacement for Werebear. Tarmogoyf is the replacement for Werebear. The only other creature I'd think of running in the Dragonauts spot is Mystic Enforcer. Why I chose Dragonauts over Enforcer:
a. Enforcer costs 4.
b. Dragonauts pitches to force.
Matchup against combo is good. Might not be neccesarily a bye, but its strongly in your favor. And against a deck such as Iggy Pop, why would you counter Tendrils? Besides the obvious of Storm still going on the stack. You counter the Ill-Gotten Gains, leaving them with an empty hand. Assuming they Lion's Eye Diamond into an Infernal Tutor.
Also as you said they may not have that turn 1/2 victory, but Thresh puts em on a decent clock so they have to find their answer quickly.
I'll be posting more at some point in the near future. INcluding finishing this post.
let me just clarify things this deck is beyond testing. This is my tourney deck. I was in class when I wrote up everything before thats why I didn't write much. This is more or less the deck I ran to win the tournament in Hadley for the Underground Seas only this has a more stable mana base.
I'll work on more analysis and what not, but I am pretty poor on writing it so you'll have to bear with me. Wasteland doesn't hurt me anymore than it hurts a normal thresh deck. Obviously recurring wasteland is a problem, but as I said that's just as much of a problem for a three color thresh deck.
And most combo is just pretty much a bye As long as your not dumb and you know what hand to keep discounting Manaless Ichorid. That deck is a pain, but I did have to face that down Match two and I came away the victor. That is pretty much the deck my board was designed to help mostly against because I knew I would have to face it in the tourney. Engineered Explosives and Echoing Truth are a house against the deck.
I had considered Meddling Mage, but haven't decided if I want to run it.
I would not trade Wee Dragonauts from this deck for any other creature around right now. The flying and being blue thing is what pushes it over the edge not to mention he can swing in for a lot as well. Werebear isn't even an option because I want something non-graveyard dependent and Quirion Dryad I just don't like. It's a preference thing. I am an advocate for the Dragonauts and advise you to play with them. If you have and did not like em then so be it, but I don't think I'd replace them.
This is more or less the list I ran to win a moderately sized tournament with in Hadley, the difference being is that for some reason I only ran 15 colored mana sources and 3 wastelands. Not sure what I was thinking, but I won nonetheless so it's irrelevant. This is the changes I have made and the sideboard is probably going to change a lil as well.
The four colors is never a problem.
With the amount of fetches that are being run getting the right colors is never really a problem. You need the green to cast your creatures then depending on if you have swords or burn in your hand you fetch up red or white first. It's fairly simple.
What I found with just the white splash of thresh was that the fast aggro decks were harder to take out, but swords is just too good of removal not to run.
With the red splash if they resolve a big creature it's hard to burn off the table without sideboarding in like Control Magic for instance.
With this you get swords and burn.
Card Choice:
Nimble Mongoose and Tarmogoyf are fairly self explanatory.
Wee Dragonauts: I wanted to have a non-graveyard dependant beater in the deck and this seemed like the best option in my choice. With Serum Visions, Brainstorms, and burn it is easy to be swinging in with 5 or 7 damage. It also evades with flying. It's blue so it pitches to force as well if need be. Wee Dragonauts has won me games so don't knock it.
Counterspell, Force of Will, and Daze are pretty standard. In a single splash color I would use three counterspells, but two seems to do fine with the swords to remove creatures instead of countering them sometimes.
Misdirection: Here is a preference card. This card is amazing against anything running spot removal more or less. Bouncing burn or a swords back to kill one of their creatures in a close game is back breaking. It's a reactive force of will in the counter wars as well. It's only a one of in the maindeck, so it's not too big.
Stifle: Maindeck Stifles are very good as well. Whether it be for countering fetches or for the ever neccesary countering wastelands. When running all non-basics and blue I think it's a must.
Swords to Plowshares = best removal in format. It warrants splashing white just for this spell.
Lightning Bolt: Removal and sometimes the finishing damage on a dying opponent. Allows you to eek by wins you might not neccesarily have won.
Fire//Ice: I run this because it is further removal and it pitches to Force. I use Ice almost as frequently as fire as well. Usually it seems to be good for tapping down Tarms while digging for a Tarm of your own or a swords. 2 for 1 potential as well is always good.
Brainstorm doesn't need explanation.
Serum Visions: I choose this over Portent because I prefer to draw the card that turn. It also goes better with Wee Dragonauts. This is a preference card though. Maybe Ponder from Lorwyn may be good enough to replace it.
Fact or Fiction: I find the one of to do the job of refilling a hand rather well. Too expensive to run more than one, but resolving the only one always seems to help.
Engineered Explosives: The one of main deck will randomly come to use as well as pumping Tarm. Not neccesary, but I like it.
Match-ups:
Goblins: Should be almost an auto-win. Plenty of maindeck removal as well as god knows how many answers to a turn 1 lackey. Sideboard more than two Pyroclasms if you expect to face a lot of goblin decks and just watch out for wastelands.
UGr Thresh: You should have a good match-up just because of swords. Just stick a Tarm and ride it to victory.
UGw Thresh: Should play much the same way, but a little harder. Still in your favor. Just play smart.
Update on this in the future after more testing. What I have is pretty bad, but I'm trying.
Haven't poste the forums consistently in a while, but thought I'd make my return. Anyway..
I'm trying to think up where green can come in with conrol-esque cards. All I can really think of is things like Plow Under and its ilk. What I have so far is:
Canopy Riders 3G
Creature - Human Druid Uncommon
When Canopy Riders comes into play, put target land on top of its owner's library.
1/3
Nantuko Ranger 1G
Creature - Insect Druid Rare
Whenever Nantuko Ranger deals combat damage to a player, that player returns a land he or she controls to its owner’s hand unless he or she pays 1.
2/1
If anyone would like to give me any ideas they would be appreciated.
Also another random card:
Power Short XU
Instant Rare
Split Second
Counter target spell unless its controller pays . If he or she doesn’t, that player taps all lands he or she controls and empties his or her mana pool.
Ya know what they should reprint? The wishes or is that too complicated for a core set? I do remember liking them when i first started playing and now I like them because of how good some of them are. If i had to choose one though I'd say Living Wish. Mainly because I'm greedy and already have a playset of Cunning Wish.
As far as sideboard is concerned, the Meddling Mages were pretty useless all day. I think they would be much better as Spell Pierces. The only thing I like about Meddling Mages is against combo they speed up your clock.
And in reference to the Merfolk matchup, Engineered Plagues are pretty much plenty especially with the Humilities I run. That matchup really depends on keeping their Cursecatchers off the table. In the top 8 I would have stabilized with a Wrath of God except he played two Cursecatchers the turn before I was going to Wrath. I also didn't see Humility once against Merfolk unfortunately.
Vindicate was a huge help against Enchantress. I would not have won without them. I was lucky to have only seen Karmic Justice once and it was after I had control of the board, so it wasn't relevant by that point.
Engineered Plague was also nice as a way to take down Enchantresses.
Dredge is never fun. It was also round 5 and a must win to make top 8. Can't say I was happy when I realized what he was playing after knowing I had to win to make it. But Planar Void makes the match-up winnable. It's still an awful match-up, but Planar Void is just so much better than Crypt or Relic, because it stays on the field.
3x Tundra
2x Underground Sea
1x Scrubland
3x Flooded Strand
2x Polluted Delta
1x Marsh Flats
2x Island
2x Plains
1x Swamp
3x Mishra's Factory
1x Academy Ruins
3x Wasteland
//Planeswalkers//
2x Jace, the Mind Sculptor
2x Elspeth, Knight Errant
3x Engineered Explosives
1x Crucible of Worlds
//Enchantments//
3x Standstill
1x Humility
//Spells//
4x Force of Will
3x Spell Snare
2x Counterspell
4x Swords to Plowshares
2x Wrath of God
3x Brainstorm
3x Vindicate
1x Fact or Fiction
2x Decree of Justice
3x Planar Void
3x Engineered Plague
3x Blue Elemental Blast
3x Meddling Mage
2x Perish
1x Humility
Round 1: Win over Dragon Storm 2-0, 1-0
Round 2: Loss to Merfolk 0-2, 1-1
Round 3: Win over CounterTop 2-0, 2-1
Round 4: Win over Ninjitsu Landstill 2-0, 3-1
Round 5: Win over Dredge 2-1, 4-1
Round 6: Intentional Draw
Top 8:
Round 1: Win over Enchantress 2-0
Round 2: Loss to Merfolk 1-2
9. Rids the World of the Evil Vampire Curse - Scientist - Great CD to just space out to.
8. 10,000 Days - Tool - Guess what my favorite band is. Rosetta Stoned is an awesome song.
7. Revolutionary Volume 2 - Immortal Technique - The production of this album gets an A+.
6. De-Loused in the Comatorium - The Mars Volta - My favorite Mars Volta album.
5. Black Mountain - In the Future - Heavily influenced Led Zeppelin, Black Sabbath, and the Beatles, but with a more psychedelic twist and it is evident when listening to the songs.
4. Dead Meadow - Dead Meadow - This one took a while to grow on me, because of the weird vocals, but the music was so strong that I kept listening.
3. Quest for Fire - Quest for Fire - I could listen to this album endlessly. Some songs are very relaxing and slow paced, while others are faster Every song has its own vibe. If you like psychedelic music I highly recommend this one.
2. AEnima - Tool - Everything I said about Lateralus I repeat for this. Third Eye is the standout song on this album, but every one is excellent.
1. Lateralus - Tool - Every song on this album is amazing and it has my favorite all time song on it: Lateralus. This album is perfection.
A Quest for Fire - Strange Waves
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_43mmz0AxmU
Black Mountain - Wucan
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3hgFJH0Auak
Dead Meadow - Beyond the Fields We Know
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7fTUg77uybk&feature=related
Giraffes? Giraffes! - When The Catholic Girls Go Camping, The Nicotine Vampires Rule Supreme
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JZqZCS0rCmE
Dude Rosetta Stoned was the best song on that album without a doubt. The Vocals are just insane and the instrumental in the middle of the song is absolutely amazing. And I love the build up from Lost Keys.
Personally Lateralus is my favorite album because of all the clever things they did with it. Go back and listen to the song Lateralus. The first part of the song is done in a pattern. The syllables in the each line are in the Fibonacci sequence (1,1,2,3,5,8,13).
Black (1)
then (1)
White are (2)
All I see (3)
In my infancy (5)
Red and Yellow then came to me (8)
etc
I've listened to a little Puscifier, but didn't really get into it. Been meaning to give it another try, but I've been listening to other bands.. and Tool. (Tool is by far my favorite band)
When I said beyond testing I didn't mean that I didn't test it anymore, I just meant I use it in tournaments so it's beyond just non-tournament settings. I'm not sure how to put it.
Engineered Explosives is good because even though it can hit my Tarmogoyfs sometimes, I'm not gonna set it at two unless I'm in the bad position where I'll be taking out more of my opponents permanents than my own.
As for Werebear I don't like it and as Viroid said Dragonauts aren't a replacement for Werebear. Tarmogoyf is the replacement for Werebear. The only other creature I'd think of running in the Dragonauts spot is Mystic Enforcer. Why I chose Dragonauts over Enforcer:
a. Enforcer costs 4.
b. Dragonauts pitches to force.
Matchup against combo is good. Might not be neccesarily a bye, but its strongly in your favor. And against a deck such as Iggy Pop, why would you counter Tendrils? Besides the obvious of Storm still going on the stack. You counter the Ill-Gotten Gains, leaving them with an empty hand. Assuming they Lion's Eye Diamond into an Infernal Tutor.
Also as you said they may not have that turn 1/2 victory, but Thresh puts em on a decent clock so they have to find their answer quickly.
I'll be posting more at some point in the near future. INcluding finishing this post.
Once again sorry.
I'll work on more analysis and what not, but I am pretty poor on writing it so you'll have to bear with me. Wasteland doesn't hurt me anymore than it hurts a normal thresh deck. Obviously recurring wasteland is a problem, but as I said that's just as much of a problem for a three color thresh deck.
And most combo is just pretty much a bye As long as your not dumb and you know what hand to keep discounting Manaless Ichorid. That deck is a pain, but I did have to face that down Match two and I came away the victor. That is pretty much the deck my board was designed to help mostly against because I knew I would have to face it in the tourney. Engineered Explosives and Echoing Truth are a house against the deck.
I would not trade Wee Dragonauts from this deck for any other creature around right now. The flying and being blue thing is what pushes it over the edge not to mention he can swing in for a lot as well. Werebear isn't even an option because I want something non-graveyard dependent and Quirion Dryad I just don't like. It's a preference thing. I am an advocate for the Dragonauts and advise you to play with them. If you have and did not like em then so be it, but I don't think I'd replace them.
This is more or less the list I ran to win a moderately sized tournament with in Hadley, the difference being is that for some reason I only ran 15 colored mana sources and 3 wastelands. Not sure what I was thinking, but I won nonetheless so it's irrelevant. This is the changes I have made and the sideboard is probably going to change a lil as well.
With the amount of fetches that are being run getting the right colors is never really a problem. You need the green to cast your creatures then depending on if you have swords or burn in your hand you fetch up red or white first. It's fairly simple.
What I found with just the white splash of thresh was that the fast aggro decks were harder to take out, but swords is just too good of removal not to run.
With the red splash if they resolve a big creature it's hard to burn off the table without sideboarding in like Control Magic for instance.
With this you get swords and burn.
Card Choice:
Nimble Mongoose and Tarmogoyf are fairly self explanatory.
Wee Dragonauts: I wanted to have a non-graveyard dependant beater in the deck and this seemed like the best option in my choice. With Serum Visions, Brainstorms, and burn it is easy to be swinging in with 5 or 7 damage. It also evades with flying. It's blue so it pitches to force as well if need be. Wee Dragonauts has won me games so don't knock it.
Counterspell, Force of Will, and Daze are pretty standard. In a single splash color I would use three counterspells, but two seems to do fine with the swords to remove creatures instead of countering them sometimes.
Misdirection: Here is a preference card. This card is amazing against anything running spot removal more or less. Bouncing burn or a swords back to kill one of their creatures in a close game is back breaking. It's a reactive force of will in the counter wars as well. It's only a one of in the maindeck, so it's not too big.
Stifle: Maindeck Stifles are very good as well. Whether it be for countering fetches or for the ever neccesary countering wastelands. When running all non-basics and blue I think it's a must.
Swords to Plowshares = best removal in format. It warrants splashing white just for this spell.
Lightning Bolt: Removal and sometimes the finishing damage on a dying opponent. Allows you to eek by wins you might not neccesarily have won.
Fire//Ice: I run this because it is further removal and it pitches to Force. I use Ice almost as frequently as fire as well. Usually it seems to be good for tapping down Tarms while digging for a Tarm of your own or a swords. 2 for 1 potential as well is always good.
Brainstorm doesn't need explanation.
Serum Visions: I choose this over Portent because I prefer to draw the card that turn. It also goes better with Wee Dragonauts. This is a preference card though. Maybe Ponder from Lorwyn may be good enough to replace it.
Fact or Fiction: I find the one of to do the job of refilling a hand rather well. Too expensive to run more than one, but resolving the only one always seems to help.
Engineered Explosives: The one of main deck will randomly come to use as well as pumping Tarm. Not neccesary, but I like it.
Match-ups:
Goblins: Should be almost an auto-win. Plenty of maindeck removal as well as god knows how many answers to a turn 1 lackey. Sideboard more than two Pyroclasms if you expect to face a lot of goblin decks and just watch out for wastelands.
UGr Thresh: You should have a good match-up just because of swords. Just stick a Tarm and ride it to victory.
UGw Thresh: Should play much the same way, but a little harder. Still in your favor. Just play smart.
Update on this in the future after more testing. What I have is pretty bad, but I'm trying.
I'm trying to think up where green can come in with conrol-esque cards. All I can really think of is things like Plow Under and its ilk. What I have so far is:
Canopy Riders 3G
Creature - Human Druid Uncommon
When Canopy Riders comes into play, put target land on top of its owner's library.
1/3
Nantuko Ranger 1G
Creature - Insect Druid Rare
Whenever Nantuko Ranger deals combat damage to a player, that player returns a land he or she controls to its owner’s hand unless he or she pays 1.
2/1
If anyone would like to give me any ideas they would be appreciated.
Also another random card:
Power Short XU
Instant Rare
Split Second
Counter target spell unless its controller pays . If he or she doesn’t, that player taps all lands he or she controls and empties his or her mana pool.
Edit: Eternal Witness wouldn't be bad either.
I will most likely take you up on that offer thank you very much. And thanks to those who also offered their assistance and ideas.