You have that backwards. The old titans would be amazing reanimation targets. They come in and crush everyone with huge annihilator hits. If this happens early enough in the game, it is pretty much over.
Early enough, yes but while they would be powerful reanimation target, you wouldn't get the full use out of them, IMHO, unless you have haste or the like. As their extra abilities only happen upon cast. Also while 2 out of 3 of them have a form of protection, there's still ways to work around that.
Emrakul cannot be affected by colored spells but can still be affected by the abilities of creatures or planeswalkers, as they are permanents. Without her extra turn ability or again haste, your opponent or opponents have a bit of breathing to do something about her once she's on the battlefield.
Old Kozilek has no form of evasion and thus could be killed right away.
Ulamog, I think, in the sense you're speaking of, would be rather troublesome. Because, while he can still be affected by various cards, his indestructible eliminates the option of just destroying him outright. You have no choice but to stall him via some other method.
However, all of this would depend heavily on timing, board states and deck types and is, more or less, conjecture on my part due to limited experience with reanimation as a whole. I will concede that in most cases you would probably be right though about things would go.
Emrakul can't be countered.
Flying
Whenever Emrakul becomes the target of a spell or ability for the first time in a turn, counter that spell or ability.
When you cast Emrakul, Betrayal Incarnate, target opponent places up to one End Counter on three creatures they control. At the beginning of their upkeep, controller of a creature with an End Counter loses 1 life for every End Counter.
Whenever Emrakul attacks, each opponent loses 1 life for every End Counter on the battlefield. When the end is upon you, trust no one.
13/13
I tried to keep in line with Emrakul's theme of corruption. However, she doesn't effect none living things, so I didn't focus on lands. Emrakul is supposed to twist living things and inspire terror. As such, I had her affect creatures and thus, seemingly make your own creatures turn against you. At the same time, just by existing, Emrakul causes damage. This also makes it so that her ability powerful but not advantageous for every game or opponent. A creature heavy deck would have nightmare with her. Also, I wanted people to have a bit of clearer protection they could have against her. A Leyline of Sanctity won't protect you from all of her influence but at least you won't get those counters.
I gave her some evasion, to make it a pain to get rid of her but not impossible.
I wanted her last ability to make her user think about what they want to do. Do they use Emrakul to quickly obliterate the guy who haa the End Counters or do they attack others, using the End Counters to soften up all their opponents at once.
He's definitely worse, but not because of his abilities. He's worse because he costs something other than straight generic mana, making him a lot tougher to cast. But past that he is fantastic and definitely on par with his brethren. The ability to counter stuff is just extremely powerful, allowing him to immediately disrupt other "unfair" decks/plays in a way that most other fatties don't. I don't think he is better, but what he does is unique and very powerful in its own right.
Fixed that for you. Considering that this is the only card in existence where the distinction matters, it's worth using the correct terms.
I disagree, though. I don't want my disruption on a 10-drop, and I don't want the ability to trade 1-for-1 as the reward I get for ramping to this thing. The original Eldrazi were not hailed as particularly good cards in their day, but the fact that their on-cast effects were essentially uncounterable, combined with the fact that a deck with tutors could keep getting them, made them fill a unique role that no other card ever had, and people eventually found ways to abuse that.
The new Kozilek doesn't really do anything all that interesting. It fills the role of a classic control finisher, being relatively hard to kill and netting you cards while it does it, except it is far too expensive and inconsistent to fill that role as well as something like Dragonlord Ojutai (and older formats really don't go looking stuff to fill this role, since control decks have much less fair ways to end their games). It could have a place in a ramp deck except that it does a poor job of coming back from behind, which is what Ramp needs to ramp into more than anything.
It looks flashy with a pile of free counterspells and cards, but unless someone comes up with a reason to want to cast a 10-drop that doesn't end the game very well, that stuff just isn't going to mean that much. Ulamog ends the game in two hits every time, and comes from behind comparatively well. Ugin does it even better. Cosi is just not going to have a place, even if the <> mana ends up being a complete non-issue. That's not to say I think it's weak, but in a competitive environment it doesn't have to be weak to go unplayed. Just worse than one other card at everything, which it definitely is.
After reading everything you just said, I'm kicking myself for not seeing all of this. It's so clear: new Kozilek is trying to do too much. Is he trying to be a beater or is he trying to be disruption?
He's definitely worse, but not because of his abilities. He's worse because he costs something other than straight colorless mana, making him a lot tougher to cast. But past that he is fantastic and definitely on par with his brethren. The ability to counter stuff is just extremely powerful, allowing him to immediately disrupt other "unfair" decks/plays in a way that most other fatties don't. I don't think he is better, but what he does is unique and very powerful in its own right.
I wasn't going to bring up the mana cost because I, at the very least, am not aware of any real details about it and exactly what it means just yet.
I will agree, however, that in his own way the new Kozilek is unique and quite powerful.
Kozilek, the Great Distortion has the capability of being better than the original under the right circumstances. However, that is his greatest strength and biggest weakness.
His draw ability: It makes up difference. Yes, it can possibly get you a completely new hand. But only if he's the last card in you hand when you cast him. That's a 10 drop. That's quite the investment. You could get around that via reanimation. However, if you don't cast him, you don't get cards. You don't get cards, you can't fuel his evasion. Granted, you could have cards in your hand before that. Yet, you've opened him up to graveyard hate.
Menace: Menace will never replace or compare with Annihilator. Granted, there's many a reason why Annihilator doesn't need to be in the game any more than it is. I understand that. However, it doesn't really compare even to the ability Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger got. That type of ability, to some people I know, is far more devastating than even Annihilator as at least Annihilator can be halted with things like Tajuru Preserver and Sigarda, Host of Herons. There's really no counter to Ulamog's ability except to keep him from swinging in the first place. It's also worth mentioning that Pathrazer of Ulamog does the job better as it takes THREE to block him AND he has Annihilator 3.
His counter ability: This is his most notable ability and in many ways, it is CRAZY! However, it seems better suited to some formats than others. As some have said earlier in this thread, it better suited to a format where there are CMC's are closer together. That, however, puts a bit of a limiting bolt on him that I just don't feel you see with any of the other titans.
Overall: The new Kozilek can be crazy good, border-lining insane. However, that not always going to be the case and thus, leaves him inconsistent when compared to other Eldrazi titans. He may be better and crazier than a host of other cards, but that's not what we're talking about. We are talking about cards that he's supposed to be around the same level as. He may be an actual reanimation target, along with the new Ulamog, but guess what? NONE of the previous titans want be reanimation targets even if they could! Let's review:
Emrakul, the Aeons Torn: You cast her, you get an extra turn. Even if she was counter-able and not immune to colored spells, that's still worth it.
Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre: Cast him, you get to destroy a permanent. Yes, it can be stopped by hexproof, shroud and indestructible. But you still get the chance to get rid of something on the field that's causing you problems or just helping your opponent. Never underestimate that.
Kozilek, Butcher of Truth: He will get you four cards. Always. Yes, new Kozilek could get you more. But IMO, a certainty is better than a maybe any day.
NOTE: If you're running any of the big three, you've probably incorporated their recycling abilities into your strategy in some way and probably ruled out reanimation. So, I don't see how that's THAT big of a concern if you've thought it out.
Finally we come to the new guy:
Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger: Exile two target permanents. He got more targets and makes it harder to get back what he gets rid of. In most cases, the permanents won't be coming back.
Each of the abilities are more reliable and have more impact than what new Kozilek brings. The only debatable one is old Kozilek. Even then new Koz need certain things to happen to get more out of him for the same price that you could have play his old version for.
In terms of swinging, he still doesn't do that well. The original 3 have Annihilator, so them getting chumped is more an inconvenience. That still dealt a heft blow. New Ulamog will even start to put a person on the clock because even if they chump him, he still just removed a nice portion of their deck. While that can thin the deck out your opponent, the sheer volume of it still deprives them of good # of resources. That's on top of Ulamog probably already gotten rid of some important pieces of their board. In addition, it can only really be stopped by keeping Ulamog from swinging. The ability does not target and there's no protection that I know of that covers it.
So in conclusion, new Kozilek has his good points but when compared to the others of his kind, it's going to take so much more to make those points pay off. That's way I don't see him as good as the original. That's way I don't see him as good as the other titans.
If you read the next post I made after the one you just quoted, I explain my reasoning and viewpoint on the matter of Kozilek and the graveyard. In that same post, I also say I'm biased with a narrow experience of using Kozilek.
When I made my comments on new Kozilek, this is coming from an EDH perspective. That's way I made a point about the reshuffling him back in the deck. My EDH does not have a lot of reanimator or the like. So that form of recovery is kind of important for me.
This is interesting because I consider the new kozelik to much more closely follow the big bag of tricks that you say you like. Olk koz is a beast no doubt, it is hard to top him, but having free, repeatable counters built into a wincon that draws you cards and cannot be board stalled absolutely cannot be underestimated regardless of what it is compared to.
Also old koz shuffling in your gy is not gaining you recourses, it is losing them in most cases. Haven't you heard the ole "graveyard as a resource" saying?
I think you're right. They are both bags of tricks with different limits and thus, different considerations of those limits. I guess it just depends on how you look at things.
As for the graveyard, depends on what you're playing. However, I'm biased. Most of my dealings with Kozilek are through the lens of an Animar, Soul of Elements EDH. Hence, I prefer cards being put back in the deck so that I can take advantage of my high draw and tutor capability to get it back in my hand to be used again. So, I kind of fall outside of the most cases scenario. The graveyard is a resource, just not one I abuse all that often when compared to others.
At the end of the day: different strokes for different folks.
I think he is really good. I want to be surprised that someone thinks he sucks but I have come to terms that in magic someone will always hate any card. If his ability said counter with x or less he would just be completely beyond busted. I already hate tron in modern and that would just be a nightmare.
He will usually draw you between 4 and 7 cards on cast, is over the pt ratio you look for, can't be chump blocked by an indestructible creature/Gideon dudes/bitterblossom, and has a very powerful counter ability. I am not sure what else you could want.
I don't think he sucks, it just feels not as good as the original. Stand alone, he's still a good card IMO. I'll just lay out the comparisons that I'm really looking at.
The original:
Will net 4 cards no matter what.
Is a 12/12 with Annihilator 4. Even if he gets chumped, he still thinned out an opponent's field unless they have a good bit of fodder. Also, his high P/T means that he will kill just about anything he hits and will not go down that easy.
Even if he's killed, he recycles not only himself but also the entire graveyard.
Overall, Kozilek, the Butcher of Truth provides nothing but benefit almost no matter what he does. Cast him, you get cards. On the field, great blocker. On the swing, hurts the opponent even if he gets blocked. He dies, he recovers himself and the graveyard, giving you more resources. The card may not be the answer to everything, but he tries and does very well.
The new:
Can net you even more cards but can also net less. Draw power not as consistent. However, drawing feeds his evasion ability.
Still a 12/12 and can get through easier due to Menace.
Has evasion ability. However, ability requires specific fodder to function properly.
Can not recycle himself or the graveyard.
Overall, Kozilek, the Great Distortion is a good card. Given the right circumstances, can get you better results than the original. However, that is left far more to chance. He may get you more than 4 cards. You might have the right CMC to counter a spell. This Kozilek has given up consistency for a higher chance of hitting the enemy.
So really the question between the two is: Is it better to be really good at one thing or is it better to have a big bag of tricks? Personally, I side with the bag of tricks. But I understand if people disagree.
True but he now lacks the ability to recycle himself and the graveyard. He got some evasion but it's not that good when you think about it. It's very specific, so the chances of you having the exact CMC necessary is pretty slim. It be different if it said:
"Discard a card with converted mana cost X: Counter target spell is converted mana cost X or lower."
Then after reading his abilities: "What...the...heck??"
I don't know exactly what I was really expecting when I heard there was a new Kozilek. I was thinking more of the lines of 'different' and trying not to hope for 'better'. But this just falls short in my humble opinion. Especially, when you consider what they did when Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre became Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger. They improved him on most fronts and gave him a new ability to replace Annihilator.
This new Kozilek seems like a nice card in the "Cool-you-own-it" sort of way but he doesn't feel anyway on par with the original in the practical. Maybe I'm not seeing some possibilities here because he hasn't been distributed yet but what does everyone else think?
Looking back at Animar, Soul of Elements, I never got bored as much as I realized that the deck itself didn't seem to excite me when I played it last. I actually had a few documents left over to when I first put the deck together and I think I saw what happened. Originally, my Animar deck was so fun because it I was able to play lots of creatures while still being highly productive. I think as time went on, I started to try too hard. Just like you pointed out that The Mimeoplasm is usually built boring but doesn't mean it has to be. I think this is what happened to my Animar. It's gone too far and needs to be toned down a bit. I need to add back in some of the more fun cards I've taken out of it over these last few months.
I think this also shows how my mindset has shifted over the last couple of months. I think I'm viewing everything down the lenses of efficiency: my decks are working better but have no soul anymore.
I'm really glad that I made this thread. Not only have I gotten some good advice but I've to realize where I went wrong in my deck buildings and thinking. I don't think I'll go back to Slivers anytime soon but I've got some thinking to do.
The Mimeoplasm, Dragonlord Ojutai and Glissa, the Traitor. All of them I'm going to look into. I'll look for a nice foundation for each of them to base around and then I'll look for some fun cards to throw in with them to make them personalized.
My Animar deck. There's a lot of differences between now and when it was first made. I'm going to go back and re-personalize it.
Also a little inspiration hit me. A card I've thought about using before but never looked into: Sakashima the Impostor as a general.
See this is what I'm talking about. I completely forgot about Glissa the Traitor! I remember first looking at her and thinking "Man, she's deadly in combat." Her artifact recursion ability on top just begs for some interesting interactions. Thank you for reminding me!
If I were you, I might be looking more towards Maelstrom Wanderer, The Mimeoplasm or Dragonlord Ojutai. Kaalia and Rafiq can - though not necessarily if you set your deck right - tend to be a little linear and play out the same game to game. The question then becomes are you looking at combo, control or interactivity as your main play style for the deck. Maelstrom tends to play out as either goodstuff.Dec or combo-focused. Ramp into maelstrom, cast some big things, get him back to command zone, rinse repeat. You can add some interesting combos in there to just go for the kill, such as Tooth and Nail and Craterhoof Behemoth, if you wish to call that a combo, but usually it'll just turn into hit my goodstuff and win or hit nothing. I built one for a while that focused on Possibility Stormcombos, but it didn't last long. Ojutai seems more focused on control/voltron. Keep things clear and locked down so ojutai can connect, grab the best thing to keep the board in your favor, and keep hitting people with an ice dragon. Azorius is the right colors for such a strategy, too. It seems like that would be fun to an extent, but like most voltrons, you kind of have to enjoy the ability of the card and have enough fun pieces around the general to get enjoyment out of it. Lastly is Mimeoplasm, who is the most interactive of the 3. From the one player in my group to play the deck, and from others I've seen, Mimeoplasm can be pretty fun and offer different experiences each game. Put a bunch of group mill effects and Buried Alive type effects in, pick out the most interesting creatures in everyone's grave and blob you together some monstrosity. Not necessarily the most reliable general, but can be the most fun, if you ask me. You also get to put some big creatures with fun effects in the deck to have fun with, and have access to the best 3 edh colors.
As always though, the choice is yours, just based on where you'd like to go and how you'd like to play games.
Thank you very much. Based on what you said The Mimeoplasm seems the most interesting and offers the most intriguing and interactive play. As you said, he's a little different each game and can take advantage of my graveyard and my opponents'. I think he'll be a little difficult to build. There's so many possibilities with him but that will make him fun. That also give me room to experiment. I'll be honest he scares me a bit with how much he could do, but he sounds worth it.
I was afraid that Kaalia and Rafiq were too linear. Kind of hoping someone knew something that was a little different but I guess I have to expect that they are built to do what they do and that's not too much. Dragonlord Ojutai...I was interested in him but I think that things would get to stale to quickly. There just sounds like too much would have to added to keep him interesting. It also sounds like he lends himself to too much of the mentality "I have to win!".
You know what they say about putting words in another's mouth? Your replay is basically: "Stop whining and try this!"
The reason that I stopped with Sliver Overlord was because it got stale to me, this is true. I stepped away from Animar, Soul of the Elements not because it was boring but because I realized that my enjoyment of it came from the fact it was winning, not because I liked the deck. I'm not asking for you to outline everything about each of these commanders, I asked for experiences so that I could a better idea of how they operate. I literally have no experience with those commanders that I've listed. I'm more or less looking for general advice.
I'm not trying to pioneer a whole new type of deck. Been there, done that, wasn't pretty. I'm just exploring other types of strategies, that are known but not really present in my playgroup, and kindly asking for a little help that's all.
And now you gave a flippant summary of my post, and I have no problem with that because it can be part of a good dialogue.
But you definitely said "All help, advice, and discussion is welcomed and appreciated." And the correct advice is "You're doing it wrong!" Kaalia, Rafiq, Mimeoplasm, and Maelstrom Wanderer will do nothing interesting for you other than winning. I've played against every one of those extensively, and it's groan worthy. Ojutai seems interesting, but that's beside the point. You're trying to find a deck you can enjoy for what it is rather than how much it wins, and then you list a bunch of commanders who have only one thing in common: they win. And at the suggestion you try something totally different, you say you're not trying to pioneer a new type of deck because when you tried that it wasn't pretty, which I take to mean that it lost a lot. Everything screams that you're just trying to build a winning deck, which is just circling back around to the problem you're already facing.
You say that all the commanders that I chose simply scream "win". It takes more than that. If was really looking for that, I wouldn't be here asking for advice or ideas, I'd be looking a competitive deck lists and thinking about how long and how much money it it would take me to get everything I need.
In addition, you take it that my experiments in non-traditional deck building resulted in not winning? Oh, how I wish it had been that simple. Those little delves into my more creative/experimental mindset resulted in decks that did not function on all but the most basic levels and the amount of fixing it would've taken came with a price tag way out of range of what I considered acceptable or doable.
I did not make this thread to find a new way to win. I made this thread with the hope that I could get to the point having a solid idea for a new deck. From there I could iron out and refine what exactly I could do that idea.
Nothing more, nothing less. I apologize if everything I've said up to this point gave you such impression.
Early enough, yes but while they would be powerful reanimation target, you wouldn't get the full use out of them, IMHO, unless you have haste or the like. As their extra abilities only happen upon cast. Also while 2 out of 3 of them have a form of protection, there's still ways to work around that.
Emrakul cannot be affected by colored spells but can still be affected by the abilities of creatures or planeswalkers, as they are permanents. Without her extra turn ability or again haste, your opponent or opponents have a bit of breathing to do something about her once she's on the battlefield.
Old Kozilek has no form of evasion and thus could be killed right away.
Ulamog, I think, in the sense you're speaking of, would be rather troublesome. Because, while he can still be affected by various cards, his indestructible eliminates the option of just destroying him outright. You have no choice but to stall him via some other method.
However, all of this would depend heavily on timing, board states and deck types and is, more or less, conjecture on my part due to limited experience with reanimation as a whole. I will concede that in most cases you would probably be right though about things would go.
Emrakul, Betrayal Incarnate - 5<><><><><>
Emrakul can't be countered.
Flying
Whenever Emrakul becomes the target of a spell or ability for the first time in a turn, counter that spell or ability.
When you cast Emrakul, Betrayal Incarnate, target opponent places up to one End Counter on three creatures they control. At the beginning of their upkeep, controller of a creature with an End Counter loses 1 life for every End Counter.
Whenever Emrakul attacks, each opponent loses 1 life for every End Counter on the battlefield.
When the end is upon you, trust no one.
13/13
I tried to keep in line with Emrakul's theme of corruption. However, she doesn't effect none living things, so I didn't focus on lands. Emrakul is supposed to twist living things and inspire terror. As such, I had her affect creatures and thus, seemingly make your own creatures turn against you. At the same time, just by existing, Emrakul causes damage. This also makes it so that her ability powerful but not advantageous for every game or opponent. A creature heavy deck would have nightmare with her. Also, I wanted people to have a bit of clearer protection they could have against her. A Leyline of Sanctity won't protect you from all of her influence but at least you won't get those counters.
I gave her some evasion, to make it a pain to get rid of her but not impossible.
I wanted her last ability to make her user think about what they want to do. Do they use Emrakul to quickly obliterate the guy who haa the End Counters or do they attack others, using the End Counters to soften up all their opponents at once.
After reading everything you just said, I'm kicking myself for not seeing all of this. It's so clear: new Kozilek is trying to do too much. Is he trying to be a beater or is he trying to be disruption?
Maybe WotC was trying to work in too much flavor?
I wasn't going to bring up the mana cost because I, at the very least, am not aware of any real details about it and exactly what it means just yet.
I will agree, however, that in his own way the new Kozilek is unique and quite powerful.
Kozilek, the Great Distortion has the capability of being better than the original under the right circumstances. However, that is his greatest strength and biggest weakness.
His draw ability: It makes up difference. Yes, it can possibly get you a completely new hand. But only if he's the last card in you hand when you cast him. That's a 10 drop. That's quite the investment. You could get around that via reanimation. However, if you don't cast him, you don't get cards. You don't get cards, you can't fuel his evasion. Granted, you could have cards in your hand before that. Yet, you've opened him up to graveyard hate.
Menace: Menace will never replace or compare with Annihilator. Granted, there's many a reason why Annihilator doesn't need to be in the game any more than it is. I understand that. However, it doesn't really compare even to the ability Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger got. That type of ability, to some people I know, is far more devastating than even Annihilator as at least Annihilator can be halted with things like Tajuru Preserver and Sigarda, Host of Herons. There's really no counter to Ulamog's ability except to keep him from swinging in the first place. It's also worth mentioning that Pathrazer of Ulamog does the job better as it takes THREE to block him AND he has Annihilator 3.
His counter ability: This is his most notable ability and in many ways, it is CRAZY! However, it seems better suited to some formats than others. As some have said earlier in this thread, it better suited to a format where there are CMC's are closer together. That, however, puts a bit of a limiting bolt on him that I just don't feel you see with any of the other titans.
Overall: The new Kozilek can be crazy good, border-lining insane. However, that not always going to be the case and thus, leaves him inconsistent when compared to other Eldrazi titans. He may be better and crazier than a host of other cards, but that's not what we're talking about. We are talking about cards that he's supposed to be around the same level as. He may be an actual reanimation target, along with the new Ulamog, but guess what? NONE of the previous titans want be reanimation targets even if they could! Let's review:
Emrakul, the Aeons Torn: You cast her, you get an extra turn. Even if she was counter-able and not immune to colored spells, that's still worth it.
Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre: Cast him, you get to destroy a permanent. Yes, it can be stopped by hexproof, shroud and indestructible. But you still get the chance to get rid of something on the field that's causing you problems or just helping your opponent. Never underestimate that.
Kozilek, Butcher of Truth: He will get you four cards. Always. Yes, new Kozilek could get you more. But IMO, a certainty is better than a maybe any day.
NOTE: If you're running any of the big three, you've probably incorporated their recycling abilities into your strategy in some way and probably ruled out reanimation. So, I don't see how that's THAT big of a concern if you've thought it out.
Finally we come to the new guy:
Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger: Exile two target permanents. He got more targets and makes it harder to get back what he gets rid of. In most cases, the permanents won't be coming back.
Each of the abilities are more reliable and have more impact than what new Kozilek brings. The only debatable one is old Kozilek. Even then new Koz need certain things to happen to get more out of him for the same price that you could have play his old version for.
In terms of swinging, he still doesn't do that well. The original 3 have Annihilator, so them getting chumped is more an inconvenience. That still dealt a heft blow. New Ulamog will even start to put a person on the clock because even if they chump him, he still just removed a nice portion of their deck. While that can thin the deck out your opponent, the sheer volume of it still deprives them of good # of resources. That's on top of Ulamog probably already gotten rid of some important pieces of their board. In addition, it can only really be stopped by keeping Ulamog from swinging. The ability does not target and there's no protection that I know of that covers it.
So in conclusion, new Kozilek has his good points but when compared to the others of his kind, it's going to take so much more to make those points pay off. That's way I don't see him as good as the original. That's way I don't see him as good as the other titans.
I think you're right. They are both bags of tricks with different limits and thus, different considerations of those limits. I guess it just depends on how you look at things.
As for the graveyard, depends on what you're playing. However, I'm biased. Most of my dealings with Kozilek are through the lens of an Animar, Soul of Elements EDH. Hence, I prefer cards being put back in the deck so that I can take advantage of my high draw and tutor capability to get it back in my hand to be used again. So, I kind of fall outside of the most cases scenario. The graveyard is a resource, just not one I abuse all that often when compared to others.
At the end of the day: different strokes for different folks.
I don't think he sucks, it just feels not as good as the original. Stand alone, he's still a good card IMO. I'll just lay out the comparisons that I'm really looking at.
The original:
Overall, Kozilek, the Butcher of Truth provides nothing but benefit almost no matter what he does. Cast him, you get cards. On the field, great blocker. On the swing, hurts the opponent even if he gets blocked. He dies, he recovers himself and the graveyard, giving you more resources. The card may not be the answer to everything, but he tries and does very well.
The new:
Overall, Kozilek, the Great Distortion is a good card. Given the right circumstances, can get you better results than the original. However, that is left far more to chance. He may get you more than 4 cards. You might have the right CMC to counter a spell. This Kozilek has given up consistency for a higher chance of hitting the enemy.
So really the question between the two is: Is it better to be really good at one thing or is it better to have a big bag of tricks? Personally, I side with the bag of tricks. But I understand if people disagree.
"Discard a card with converted mana cost X: Counter target spell is converted mana cost X or lower."
After seeing this guy, I have several thoughts:
First: "That art is awesome!"
Next: "Cool flavor text too!"
After that: "Is that a new mana symbol?"
Then after reading his abilities: "What...the...heck??"
I don't know exactly what I was really expecting when I heard there was a new Kozilek. I was thinking more of the lines of 'different' and trying not to hope for 'better'. But this just falls short in my humble opinion. Especially, when you consider what they did when Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre became Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger. They improved him on most fronts and gave him a new ability to replace Annihilator.
This new Kozilek seems like a nice card in the "Cool-you-own-it" sort of way but he doesn't feel anyway on par with the original in the practical. Maybe I'm not seeing some possibilities here because he hasn't been distributed yet but what does everyone else think?
I think this also shows how my mindset has shifted over the last couple of months. I think I'm viewing everything down the lenses of efficiency: my decks are working better but have no soul anymore.
I'm really glad that I made this thread. Not only have I gotten some good advice but I've to realize where I went wrong in my deck buildings and thinking. I don't think I'll go back to Slivers anytime soon but I've got some thinking to do.
The Mimeoplasm, Dragonlord Ojutai and Glissa, the Traitor. All of them I'm going to look into. I'll look for a nice foundation for each of them to base around and then I'll look for some fun cards to throw in with them to make them personalized.
My Animar deck. There's a lot of differences between now and when it was first made. I'm going to go back and re-personalize it.
Also a little inspiration hit me. A card I've thought about using before but never looked into: Sakashima the Impostor as a general.
Thank you very much. Based on what you said The Mimeoplasm seems the most interesting and offers the most intriguing and interactive play. As you said, he's a little different each game and can take advantage of my graveyard and my opponents'. I think he'll be a little difficult to build. There's so many possibilities with him but that will make him fun. That also give me room to experiment. I'll be honest he scares me a bit with how much he could do, but he sounds worth it.
I was afraid that Kaalia and Rafiq were too linear. Kind of hoping someone knew something that was a little different but I guess I have to expect that they are built to do what they do and that's not too much. Dragonlord Ojutai...I was interested in him but I think that things would get to stale to quickly. There just sounds like too much would have to added to keep him interesting. It also sounds like he lends himself to too much of the mentality "I have to win!".
Again, I thank you for the insights.
You say that all the commanders that I chose simply scream "win". It takes more than that. If was really looking for that, I wouldn't be here asking for advice or ideas, I'd be looking a competitive deck lists and thinking about how long and how much money it it would take me to get everything I need.
In addition, you take it that my experiments in non-traditional deck building resulted in not winning? Oh, how I wish it had been that simple. Those little delves into my more creative/experimental mindset resulted in decks that did not function on all but the most basic levels and the amount of fixing it would've taken came with a price tag way out of range of what I considered acceptable or doable.
I did not make this thread to find a new way to win. I made this thread with the hope that I could get to the point having a solid idea for a new deck. From there I could iron out and refine what exactly I could do that idea.
Nothing more, nothing less. I apologize if everything I've said up to this point gave you such impression.