I normally give a little bit more credit to card designers during spoiler season, considering it's all one big puzzle on how the set will play out. However, this card is actually bad. The only reason I can see this as rare is because of the "devoid" mechanic. It hasn't been mentioned yet, but this taps for 2 for all "devoid" creatures, not just colorless mana ones. There has to be a non-basic fetch theme here, otherwise, it only fits within an EDH environment as that's the only place I can see you getting to 7 lands for more than a turn or 2.
It costs more than 0 mana, doesn't draw 5 cards on ETB, and can't win the game on your opponents turn. It's totally garbage, I wouldn't even waste a clothes pin on it for my huffy.
Am I really reading this right? We want to introduce an Infect commander into a Pre-con package?? The commander scene has already devolved into infinite combos and non-interactive gameplay, so why not throw one of the most degenerative mechanics into a deck packed full of support.
I didn't know that FRF/DTK and BFZ blocks were the last ever standard sets and we are only going to have these cards for the rest of our lives...
This is how standard works. Often if something isn't good before rotation the chances of it being good after rotation are very slim. I'll bet you this will see no standard play in the 6 months after Atarka rotates.
The only thing that will change this opinion of mine if some serious elemental synergy is printed that allows you to cheat this guy into play early in the game so you can actually get value from landfall triggers.
Too much synergy already exists for this card not to be a competitive curve topper. Zendikar's Roil pumps out Elementals. Animists Awakening helps with the ramp/token gen. He's best in a Jund topper to run Languish to turn those 2/2's into bolts to the face. As mentioned, creature ramp is being replaced with rampant growth-style ramp.
Funny, people knocking the Eldrazi king in BFZ already. Oh, he needs to stick around for a turn to do any thing... Blah blah blah. It REQUIRES an exile effect to do so. It costs 10 freaking mana, you honestly think when this hits the floor it will be Ulamog and 10 lands??? Be realistic people. He's a game ender, even more so than his ROE counterpart. From a game perspective, and with no crazy ramp shenanigans, he can hit the board between turn 7-10. He immediately exiles the most dangerous cards on the board. At that point, if your opponent isn't "cantriping" or digging like a boss, they will more than likely have less than 45 cards in their library when he attacks. Even if he's chumped, it's a 2 turn clock. If he's reanimated... Wow, just wow.
I get where you are coming from as I am a MTGO player myself. This is what needs to be understood about the virtual version of this wonderful game, there are no consequences for your actions. Nobody cares about "table manners". Why you ask? Because there is zero risk of the offender getting cold-cocked from across the table. However, I've learned to deal with it. The best part about MTGO is that there is always a game to be played. Maybe we'll cross paths some day.
I maintain that the objective should be to build a deck adapted to your meta
Cuthroat metas means that unless you come equipped properly you will not matter
Laid back metas mean if you do come with overkill you will get hated out
Just try to avoid making decks that make you the outsider; I don't buy the debate between casual and competitive in this format. At the end of the day this format is meant to be multiplayer (we have a one-on-one variant) and that means that what comes first is the playgroup, not the format
Decks don't make people outsiders, playgroups do. I also don't see any real debate between casual and competitive. Competitive players just want to play their decks. Casual players just want to make sure there are no competitive players. There's not much of a debate going on there. The playgroup isn't this holy ******* thing that we all have to abide by. It's a group of people. If history has taught us anything it's that groups of people are frequently wrong, oftentimes develop an echo chamber mentality, and usually wind up catering to the weakest and dumbest [read: loudest]. I'm perfectly fine establishing and maintaining a social contract with my playgroup that is utterly casual as I certainly enjoy Magic in all its forms. However, there's definitely a bigger thrill that I get from pulling a win out of nowhere or completing my cool new combo that I just got for my deck. Winning is fun but I'd much rather no one feel like a loser and the feel-bads are where I start to parse competitive from casual. Going back to the playgroup, I find it's part of the social contract that the playgroup also try to accommodate the player. Meaning, the playgroup can't expect me to put up with a bunch of 2-hour long casual nonsense games yet be thoroughly unwilling to ramp up the power levels from time to time. If I'm getting marginal enjoyment out of playing casually and have the ability to teach the playgroup about more competitive strategies that I enjoy (read: playing better cards and making less stupid decisions) then why would this be an issue? Why be mired in ignorance when there is knowledge to be had? Or, at the very least, why not extend out of one's comfort zone and play a little competitive commander? Playing casually is so limiting. I have "competitive" cards and knowledge on how to use those cards and how they function into the bigger picture of the game, so simply saying that they are unfair cards to play with effectively places limits on what knowledge and skills I'm allowed to bring to the table, much less the actual monetary investments I've made in cardboard that would certainly be arbitrarily banned in any type of casual setting. So, no, the playgroup shouldn't be seen as the end-all be-all of EDH since it's just a group of people with their own faults, motives, and opinions. Instead, maybe just trying to be an informed, knowledgeable, fair, and measured player is what comes first.
Again, quite shocked at the overall ignorance. Your logic is backwards. In a team sport, you truly are as strong as your weakest link. However, Magic isn't a team sport. If you bring a deck to casual playing, that rivals competitive play, you will be the outsider. The group of players with the lower power will rally around each other and focus their combined power on you, not just in game, but social interaction as well. If your response was "play better cards", you probably wouldn't be welcome back to that group, and if you were, you'd more than likely wear out your welcome incredibly fast. You make it sound like Magic is a game of skill, and it's not. It is solely luck based, from the moment you roll the die until the end of the game. You want to "teach" strategies by introducing powerful cards? No, you want to show people how to stack their deck with more expensive cards. That is an attitude that will destroy the game itself. Commander was designed to play with cards you already own.
Somebody needs to forward this thread to Wizards. This is Commander we are talking about here. Competitive or not, the goal should not be to combo out at turn 4 "Consistently". I play commander regularly, primarily online as I don't have time to visit LGS or put a group together. I honestly spend more time in the queue initiating games than I actually do playing them. It's disappointing. The game is supposed to be a casual break from the cut-throat Vintage/Legacy/Modern world, that you can enter without ponying up the cash to stay up on Standard. I digress. OP, find a commander that suits you, as in it fits your play style and personality, then go from there. I'll gladly lose 100 games with a deck I enjoyed building, with my own personal touch, than just to copy some crazy combo-out with cards I'll never afford to own.
A deck made with your own personal touch (The irony of you using this phrase while playing online is palpable) from cards that you looked up online and saw other people using or saw them using while playing against them. You say as if it should make you seem original but you're just lying to yourself and everyone else about your own "creativity". You think you're being authentic but, when you're not simply just taking other people's ideas, you're really just durdling into things people have already discovered. Why can't a T4 combo deck have a commander that fits someone's playstyle and personality? Why should T4 combos be anathema when combo players markedly don't care what kind of jank you're playing? If you're so salty about losing, why not try actually playing with powerful cards? Oh right, they don't have flavor because once a card hits a certain price/power threshold it loses its flavor automatically. I mean, how could I enjoy playing with powerful cards, right? They almost never have cool flavor or cool effects...Anyway, You imply comboing out early is disrespectful and that EDH should be a "casual break" from cutthroat formats. I'd argue that playing some janky deck that doesn't stand a chance against a real deck is similarly disrespectful since it removes all spirit of competition from the game. Why shouldn't EDH have a competitive side? It gives me the ability to invest in a multiplayer eternal format with both competitive and casual players that isn't a boring rat-race for PWP or 4-of's of whatever the newest bomb is. If you've done your homework in 60 card constructed then you'll know how ~90 percent of your games are going to play out after you make your first draw. Commander has a lot more variance, both in the card pool and due to the 100 card singleton format, and is much more fun to play because of that variance. I'm sure you'll agree to that last point, so it can't be that much of a stretch for you to imagine it being fun for people to play competitively but in a seemingly more refreshing format.
Edit: Lastly, WoTC doesn't manage EDH. The RC does. Wizards only does Commander supplementary products.
I am honestly shocked. No where in your "rant" did you actually speak to what I said. You think spewing word from your fingertips makes you sound intelligent, but it does not. You contradict your shot at me and my "creativity" by saying you'd rather play with "stronger" cards. Said "strong cards" are only strong because they have been play tested, and confirmed powerful. Therefore, you are copying the play-tester, and are just another sheep in the herd. So the guy who forked over 39.99 msrp for Commander 2014, and brings that deck to every match is "disrespectful" to the game because there are no insane combos or over-powered cards? This is what I read... "If you don't want to spend money, a lot of money, don't play Commander, or Legacy, or Standard, errr don't play Magic because it's disrespectful to me" What's even funnier, is that playing online allows me access to all the "powerful cards", with a click of a button and usually half the price. However, I prefer to spend my free-time playing Magic and invest my hard earned money into a more rewarding activity.
Prowess is essentially useless without Non-Creature cards. Ingest is a self-sustaining mechanic in that the only thing required is to connect on an opponent to trigger. No activation cost of any sort.
This argument is....kind of meaningless. Most magic games have non-creature spells. Further, even the threat of prowess has an impact on the game, because your opponent doesn't know if you have an instant. Most magic games do not have mill, and most magic games do not end because of the empty library rule. Thus, in the vast majority of games outside of BFZ, ingest will not matter. Please explain how, in an average game, whether you had 2 3/3's in play with ingest vs two without ingest would make a difference outside of essentially being soldier of fortunes.
Isn't what you just argued proving my point? Apples to apples comparison here. Desecrator Drone is a 3cmc Ingest creature with 3/2 stats and a conditional ETBA at common. You get nothing like that at common with prowess. So let's use Shu Yun. Same stats, with prowess and tacked on Activated ability. For Shu Yun to take advantage of Prowess it needs to survive a turn and you need NCS in hand. You attack and cast an instant, maybe even activating his ablility. Let's say you bolt and activate, 3 total mana. Opponent casts Doom Blade or the like in response and your left 3 mana short and no creature. Destroying the ingest creature is still a 1 for 1. Sure, Ingest requires support for the exiled cards to be relevant, but removing a prowess creature will almost always be a 2-1. It's all about tempo, Prowess is useless with an empty hand or no NCS. An Ingest creature will always be x/x and, depending what else rolls out to assist, demand removal. I'm not saying prowess is a terrible ability, it's not, but discounting ingest for the reasons you stated just doesn't make sense.
I think they introduced Ingest as a keyword for recognition reasons and because they like to name mechnics that appear on several cards. Prowes iss a mechnic that could easily be written out on each creature, but it is there in order to immidiately indentify the creature as Jeskai (and to provide a names mechnic ed and blue share). The same is true for unleash.
I like these named mechnics, because they add flavor and give the cards unique identity when looking at magic as a whole. Also, learning a new keyword might be more complicated to learn a t first for new players, but the amount of reading it spares in subsequent games is relevant.
But prowess does something on its own. It's a good, interesting, interactive ability. A 3/3 with ingest and a 3/3 without ingest are literally exactly the same in an average game of magic, as the "mill" will be completely irrelevant without other cards that support ingest. Most keywords are not like this.
Prowess is essentially useless without Non-Creature cards. Ingest is a self-sustaining mechanic in that the only thing required is to connect on an opponent to trigger. No activation cost of any sort.
Ingest will be extremely powerful, IMHO. It's attached to a common 3 drop, which makes me think it can/will scale. With a Double-striker, it's 2 cards a turn. It's not like mill, where the card in your GY are pseudo-playable, the cards are gone (pending some new cards that work against it.) I like it a lot already. It also makes playing AoKK a little risky when exiling Top-Deck.
Forerunner of Slaughter is junk. Costs RB and Dies to doom blade.
Please explain how said black creature dies to Doom Blade.
Edit: Well, does devoid counteract the black in the casting cost?
Yes, yes it does. You still have to pay black and red to cast it, of course, but for the sake of things like doom blade or protection from black/red and probably some other stuff, it is a colorless creature. As far as standard is concerned, this also means none of these "devoid" creatures are exiled by Ugin's -x, which could make him significantly weaker moving forward.
Thanks, brain fart on my part. I guess I stooped to "Troll Level" considering Kozilek also dies from DB...
Correct if it truely does target "up to" and not "two target" creatures. Otherwise it doesn't work.
Too much synergy already exists for this card not to be a competitive curve topper. Zendikar's Roil pumps out Elementals. Animists Awakening helps with the ramp/token gen. He's best in a Jund topper to run Languish to turn those 2/2's into bolts to the face. As mentioned, creature ramp is being replaced with rampant growth-style ramp.
I didn't know that FRF/DTK and BFZ blocks were the last ever standard sets and we are only going to have these cards for the rest of our lives...
Again, quite shocked at the overall ignorance. Your logic is backwards. In a team sport, you truly are as strong as your weakest link. However, Magic isn't a team sport. If you bring a deck to casual playing, that rivals competitive play, you will be the outsider. The group of players with the lower power will rally around each other and focus their combined power on you, not just in game, but social interaction as well. If your response was "play better cards", you probably wouldn't be welcome back to that group, and if you were, you'd more than likely wear out your welcome incredibly fast. You make it sound like Magic is a game of skill, and it's not. It is solely luck based, from the moment you roll the die until the end of the game. You want to "teach" strategies by introducing powerful cards? No, you want to show people how to stack their deck with more expensive cards. That is an attitude that will destroy the game itself. Commander was designed to play with cards you already own.
I am honestly shocked. No where in your "rant" did you actually speak to what I said. You think spewing word from your fingertips makes you sound intelligent, but it does not. You contradict your shot at me and my "creativity" by saying you'd rather play with "stronger" cards. Said "strong cards" are only strong because they have been play tested, and confirmed powerful. Therefore, you are copying the play-tester, and are just another sheep in the herd. So the guy who forked over 39.99 msrp for Commander 2014, and brings that deck to every match is "disrespectful" to the game because there are no insane combos or over-powered cards? This is what I read... "If you don't want to spend money, a lot of money, don't play Commander, or Legacy, or Standard, errr don't play Magic because it's disrespectful to me" What's even funnier, is that playing online allows me access to all the "powerful cards", with a click of a button and usually half the price. However, I prefer to spend my free-time playing Magic and invest my hard earned money into a more rewarding activity.
Isn't what you just argued proving my point? Apples to apples comparison here. Desecrator Drone is a 3cmc Ingest creature with 3/2 stats and a conditional ETBA at common. You get nothing like that at common with prowess. So let's use Shu Yun. Same stats, with prowess and tacked on Activated ability. For Shu Yun to take advantage of Prowess it needs to survive a turn and you need NCS in hand. You attack and cast an instant, maybe even activating his ablility. Let's say you bolt and activate, 3 total mana. Opponent casts Doom Blade or the like in response and your left 3 mana short and no creature. Destroying the ingest creature is still a 1 for 1. Sure, Ingest requires support for the exiled cards to be relevant, but removing a prowess creature will almost always be a 2-1. It's all about tempo, Prowess is useless with an empty hand or no NCS. An Ingest creature will always be x/x and, depending what else rolls out to assist, demand removal. I'm not saying prowess is a terrible ability, it's not, but discounting ingest for the reasons you stated just doesn't make sense.
Prowess is essentially useless without Non-Creature cards. Ingest is a self-sustaining mechanic in that the only thing required is to connect on an opponent to trigger. No activation cost of any sort.
Thanks, brain fart on my part. I guess I stooped to "Troll Level" considering Kozilek also dies from DB...