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  • posted a message on [Admin] bobthefunny's Strategic Chalkboard
    while lots of other people come to this gaming forums to AVOID politics and just focus on the game.


    I can agree with this. It appears I was “sucked in”, but it can be difficult to just cut some conversations off.

    I think the biggest takeaway here is, if everybody who’s clamoring for change went to the appropriate channels and put that energy there, rather than bicker with a bunch of nerdy *********s, we would probably be further along in this process. I think this year has been the most “actionable” I’ve seen from the groups that are most vocal, but Buffsam89 isn’t the one whose going to be making the changes. Vote. Get involved and play your part. Who cares what MTGSalvation censors or allows, aside from the obvious red flags. The energy directed here needs to be fed into the appropriate channels. And from there, a trickle down effect is certainly to ensue.
    Posted in: Staff Helpdesks
  • posted a message on [Admin] bobthefunny's Strategic Chalkboard
    The reason I said that you can’t talk politics in good faith is because it affects everyone differently, and you’ll always be in favor of policies and practices that benefit you(not personally, though technically). Are you really going to tell me you’d be in favor of policy that would negatively affect you? No, absolutely not. So, regardless of where you align on the political spectrum, you’re still looking out for numero uno when all is said and done. In almost every case, and it’s evident here, what people will be looking out for is their $$$. What is in their best interests. While it is true that not every policy has an impact on the dollars and cents, you most often aren’t getting those policy’s in isolation. There is give, and there is take. That’s why I can’t get behind the current divide in our country based on Liberal Vs. Republican. It’s deeper than that.

    Take me for instance. I was never in favor of Obama-care. As a manager in what would be considered a “small business” in terms of business practices and organizational makeup, it was a total net-negative on our operation and my staff. Were there positives? Certainly, but not for me and not for those close to me. So, why should I endorse a proposal like that? I know that the above is overly simplified but I think you get my point.

    Similarly, take the BLM movement. After the death of George Floyd, there was support from pretty much every group in the United States that something needed to change. It’s “systemic”, as I’m so often reminded. If a system is broken, you first need to identify the point of failure, and then proceed with the rebuild. A system as large as the police force in America isn’t something that is going to change over night. Hell, it can’t be changed in a year. It affects too many people to institute radical change. It requires people to Vote. Get involved. Become educated. But, it appears that many are unsatisfied with the speed at which the gears are turning. And destruction has followed. I can’t get behind that. I won’t. I’ll push for change, but I haven’t received any comfort from those asking for it that it just won’t be as bad, or worse than it already is, just for different people.

    Human nature dictates that, when push comes to shove, the vast majority are in it for ourselves.
    Posted in: Staff Helpdesks
  • posted a message on [Admin] bobthefunny's Strategic Chalkboard
    You may find my behavior to be problematic, similarly to how I find yours to be problematic as well.

    I don’t understand the point of representation without there being an effort for it to be meaningful. For instance, at our company we just hired a VP who’s of middle-eastern descent. He’s the only minority VP, and was hired for a newly created position to oversee an already established department in an attempt to spread the workload. That’s a checked box. There is absolutely *zero* meaning to his hire aside from optics. He wasn’t promoted internally, they created the position he filled, and he is basically a head-piece for an already functioning department. Then, to top it all off, they added him to our senior leadership team. I see zero value in that. It doesn’t persuade any of the minorities on staff to do anything differently. 2 of our black managers were miffed, considering the job was filled when 70%+ of the workforce had been furloughed. People want representation, but they also want the opportunity to be the representative.

    Admittedly, I hadn’t read the novels and wasn’t entirely educated on her character. But, the choice of being a black woman married to the king was just so incredibly PC that it sucked the fantasy element right out of the character, thus creating the “token” status. While Teferi has a much longer list of source material, he, his wife and daughter were fantastic additions to the MtG universe and full of flavor.

    edit: for the sake of clarity and to help illustrate my point. If Marvel made a White Black Panther, without the fleshed out story like they had for White Tiger, I would have a similar reaction. It would be criticized for different reasons, of course. But, it doesn’t take a White guy playing black panther for me to like the Black Panther character or story.
    Posted in: Staff Helpdesks
  • posted a message on [Admin] bobthefunny's Strategic Chalkboard
    So asking somebody to not look at everything politically is insinuating that you live in a bubble?


    Edit:
    And while I did use “You” and “You’re”, I wasn’t specifically speaking to you, personally. I’d same the same thing to Flossedbeaver, Theonlyone, and MikeyG.
    Posted in: Staff Helpdesks
  • posted a message on [Admin] bobthefunny's Strategic Chalkboard
    For reference, it was in regards to the Queen in Eldraine. Personally, I found that to be a bit “token”, as it strays from source material and historical accuracy. And furthermore, I find most “token” inclusions to be forced and unnatural without a significant attempt at fleshing out the character. I didn’t feel like they did enough to do so. So I used my daughter as a point of reference and how she could, and has, reacted to her complexion compared to others in the land of make believe and how she has, at times, felt forced to “like” a character because they share the same skin tone.
    Posted in: Staff Helpdesks
  • posted a message on [Admin] bobthefunny's Strategic Chalkboard
    Nice, following up with attacking my character.

    See you can't leave your political lense at home when it comes to certain subjects.


    No idea how that has anything to do with politics.
    Posted in: Staff Helpdesks
  • posted a message on [Admin] bobthefunny's Strategic Chalkboard
    Yeah, everything after “privilege“ was white noise. You don’t know me, and you don’t know my story. Yet, that didn’t stop you from making wild assumptions. Therefore, proving my point.

    Consider this conversation over.
    Posted in: Staff Helpdesks
  • posted a message on [Admin] bobthefunny's Strategic Chalkboard
    I can see where you’re coming from with that last point, but I have a hard time following the first.

    You’re right that it’s technically always been like this between the political parties. But, with the pandemic, it’s stripped away all other avenues for expression.

    Though where I don’t follow with your first point is, say you’re a Liberal/Republican. If you don’t put that aside, you’ll be looking for the political queues to help guide you in your exploration. Therefore, you’re journey has already been predetermined and you haven’t grown as an individual.
    Posted in: Staff Helpdesks
  • posted a message on [Admin] bobthefunny's Strategic Chalkboard
    It’s cynical to believe that is hardly productive to have any sort of political discussion? Specifically on the Internet?

    I’d just ask that you step outside and leave the political lens at home. There’s a large world out there just waiting to be explored, and tons of fascinating people that you’ll never have the pleasure of meeting if you expect to align with it all politically.

    It’s never been this bad before, and I will lay the blame at the feet of the pandemic. There’s not a ton going on, and aligning yourself with a political party is a sure-fire way to feel included in these times of isolation. Its very sad, really.
    Posted in: Staff Helpdesks
  • posted a message on [Admin] bobthefunny's Strategic Chalkboard
    No real dog in this fight, but wanted to give an outsiders opinion.

    I haven’t posted on this forum in quite some time. Many factors contributed to this, though I still lurk. Mostly here for the spoilers and what not. I don’t play paper magic much at all anymore, mostly playing Arena, and even then my time playing MtG in general is minuscule at best.

    With that out of the way, I wanted to address this take in that “Everything is political”. I honestly hear this take a lot, primarily on message boards or when a certain aspect of life doesn’t quite line up with your expectations. However, it couldn’t be further from the truth. You can inject politics into any discussion. It’s very easy, incredibly low effort, and sometimes signals ignorance on a particular subject, or at the very best an unnecessary reason to escalate the conversation beyond what it truly is.

    Where we are as society today, politics dominates everything, it’s inevitable to avoid political discussion entirely. However, IMO, it should be avoided at all costs no matter what side of political spectrum you fall under. Identity politics has gone off the rails recently and quite frankly is primarily the reason we are in the situation we are in. I never imagined a day where I’d visit an MtG forum and find #BLM or #Defundthepolice or #Bluelivesmatter or #MAGA or whatever listed at the end of an opinion on magic cards. Seeing that makes me incredibly unwilling to engage with that individual, especially in today’s political climate. Not a single political discussion is ever carried out in good faith, ever.

    In closing, I commend the mods for their approach. I find it asinine that folks have a problem with giving both movements equal representation, which is exactly the problem in today’s world, but it’s to be expected. I would argue that they shouldn’t allow any of it as it really has no place here, and there are hundreds, if not thousands, of other platforms for you to have those discussions with like minded individuals. But, WOTC has woven politics into some of their decision making of late, so it’s unavoidable I guess. I’d just say that, you’re more likely to alienate the folks this site was designed for, and attract the worst both political parties have to offer, as they attempt to demonize each other, evidence of which is in this very thread.


    Posted in: Staff Helpdesks
  • posted a message on [ELD] Mothership spoilers 9/16— Queen Linden and her retinue
    Quote from Xeruh »
    I mean, at best what you should be advocating for is more PoC instead of calling the Queen out of place, because you're in a thread where people are calling her out of place because Eldraine should be white people only. At worst you're being disingenuous or other negative traits with your argument and it's just an attempt to mask the insincerity.

    And there isn't any reason for backstory because the intent is to not treat it as a special thing. Different people will respond to that in different ways, but making a huge deal about it isn't something that would be met with positive acclaim either. It's pretty close to a no win situation.


    This is a special thing. It’s a legendary card. She is a queen. Married to the King. Who is the father of our 2 main characters. All 3 or which do not share similar characteristics. Is it a big deal? Yeah, it kind of is. My point, again, that “‘Cuz Fantasy” just doesn’t cut it. Beyond the fact that there is source material, there is also actual real world implications. Black people aren't black just because that’s the way it is.

    If there isn’t a reason for her existence, then why does she? Being able to relate doesn’t just go skin deep. Then, peeps like my daughter could have an actual reason to gravitate towards her.

    So, you wrote that but you expected us to interpret it in this context as something other than "I want my fantasy card game to be all white people"? C'mon.


    For real? So saying fantasy shouldn’t dip too much into realism means I wish it was all white? Was it because I took issue with the point of this character being “needed”? As that means it’s forced? I think that spin would give sir mix-a-lot a run for his money.
    Posted in: The Rumor Mill
  • posted a message on [ELD] Mothership spoilers 9/16— Queen Linden and her retinue
    Quote from H3RAC71TU5 »
    [quote from="Buffsam89 »" url="/forums/magic-fundamentals/the-rumor-mill/814047-eld-mothership-spoilers-9-16-queen-linden-and-her?comment=69"]Please, I beg you, call me a racist. No need to tiptoe around me with that nonsense. I’ll go to bat for my beliefs and not be shouted down by anybody. You shamed the other user for refusing to engage, you will not get that same luxury here.


    Well, I'd like to applaud you for your conviction. It goes without saying I consider it misguided, but it's something. I would venture to say you could even be a good man, if only you chose a better principle to live by than "adamantly maintain at all costs that I'm totally not racist." So don't go saying I never gave you any credit. Wink

    That said, there's no tiptoeing going on here. Just asserting that you're racist is not how it works. The personal biases or prejudices that you may or may not have against PoC is kind of small fry compared to the bigger issue: whether the argument you're making is racist. Excessive focus on whether an individual is racist misses the important relationship between the underlying ideas being expressed and the systems in place in society.

    Why be ok with just a sprinkle of PoC if you’re so adamant that this is fantasy and you can make that whatever you wish? Why not give relevant back story as to how a singular black woman was able to achieve royalty status and become knighted in the 4 courts, as she is clearly of a minority race on her own home plane? @gutterstorm makes a valid point, but not in the way they had expected. They could literally be any color, so what is the significance here? Why not a Latino? Asian? Or anything in between? What separates her from her peers?
    I can assure you that PoC would choose relevance over existence. I’m glad your ok with simply making sure the boxes are checked, but I’m not.
    Again, sh***y human beings, all of you. Hell, you judged me and you don’t even know me. That tells me all I need to know about you.


    Now, when you went to say that your ideal fantasy world meant no black people, then maybe you were being just a little overconfident about your ability to stand your ground...


    Ah yes. More character assassination based purely on assumptions. Please, point to where I said this. I’ll be more than happy to wait.

    You see, I’m a 30 something White male. What I also am is a father of 2 children, one of which is a 7yo stepdaughter who is black. We live in a small town, mostly white peeps. She just started second grade and is currently the only child in her grade that is “caramel” as she calls it.

    A few things I’ve experienced first hand, that I’m 100% certain none of you SJW’s(yeah, flag me) have ever had to experience is trying to explain to a 7yo why she isn’t white. Why all of her friends are white. Why all of the things she likes feature mostly white people. She has 2 Disney princesses to choose from, or she immediately questions if she should be that character for Halloween or not. My 7yo has chosen to be Minnie Mouse. She could have been Moana, or that one from Princess and the frog, but she chose Minnie Mouse. She adores the other Disney princesses, so the only reason I can assume she chose neither is because she feels she can’t. Why does she get 2 choices?

    Same here, how is “normal” 4 choices(sorry sap, like 3 of those are actually recognizable as PoC, the others are for sure reaches). You took the opportunity to make female Knights feel normal(coincidently, they are all White) by pushing them hard enough into your fantasy setting that it feels normal. Why not do the exact same with PoC?

    I’m done. You people go right ahead and sit up there on your high-horses. Cool beans. But you don’t know me. You don’t know who I am. And you certainly don’t know the life I’ve lied. So go ahead and be fine with a this showing here. I guarantee if my daughter was old enough, she would be underwhelmed with the showing of people who share her characteristics.

    <snip>
    Posted in: The Rumor Mill
  • posted a message on [ELD] Mothership spoilers 9/16— Queen Linden and her retinue
    This is hilarious.

    So, normal is, in a world full of Fae, Giants, Elves, etc., there is exactly one black woman who is Queen? That’s out of place. There is no context. Where the hell did she come from? If she was a purple elf, and there were no other elves present, I would be asking the same damn question.

    So to reiterate, for those in the back, where the f*** are the rest of the people that share her characteristics? That’s the point. That is what leads me to believe she is only there to check a damn box. In what world is there exactly one person who looks/acts as they do?

    Color aside, let’s say she speaks freaking French. Would that make a lick of sense? I’d want to know why.

    My question isn’t why is she black, it’s why is she the only black person depicted in this set. That’s normal? There’s what, ~250 cards in this set? It’s normal to reserve 1-3 card slots for art with PoC? By my count, there exactly 3 that clearly depict a PoC in the art. None in crowds.

    You people sit up here and bang the drum of “good job wizards”, yet I’m like, ok you could’ve done more. You don’t normalize anything by introducing in small doses. Give this women some staying power here. Give her a reason to exist.
    Posted in: The Rumor Mill
  • posted a message on [ELD] Mothership spoilers 9/16— Queen Linden and her retinue
    Quote from Boreez »
    Quote from Buffsam89 »
    Again, sh***y human beings, all of you. Hell, you judged me and you don’t even know me. That tells me all I need to know about you.


    You truly have been on the receiving end of some pretty big injustices here. I'm just sitting here shaking my head at what you had to go through. If there's anything I can do, let me know. You've been through some s****y stuff on this thread page, been judged and whatnot. Shame on all these people. Shame on them.


    Thank you, your thinly veiled sarcasm truly adds to this discussion. I mean, by all accounts, you truly are a beacon of support here and we should all learn a thing or two from it.

    Quote from Gutterstorm »
    Quote from Buffsam89 »
    @gutterstorm makes a valid point, but not in the way they had expected. They could literally be any color, so what is the significance here? Why not a Latino? Asian? Or anything in between? What separates her from her peers?


    No actually that’s exactly the point I was making. Her race isn’t relevant. It’s not relevant to her individual character or any tropes she could be portraying. The same way it’s fine to have female knights because gender isn’t relevant to them or the dictions that inspire them. They could be any race, gender or sex and it wouldn’t matter. It’s not like, because she’s dark skinned she’s been through the same thing black people in our world have. I’m not going to go into the ridiculousness of “representation other than to say that if you need someone to look like you in order to empathize with their struggles and journey or to think that you could achieve similarly then that’s a deficiency in you and no one else. Skin color doesn’t matter.


    So this makes the point I was making. I’m not saying that she needs a tragic backstory. But, is it not reasonable to ask why she is who she is? She is a legendary creature after all. There has to be a reason they chose a black woman to be the Twins step-mother, meaning she’s queen. Married to a white man. I’m not suggesting there be incredible detail, but you’ve chosen to cross a handful of barriers, there should be a level of significance to it. If you’re cool with checked boxes, that’s fine. But, I can assure you that’s not the same as respresentation.
    Posted in: The Rumor Mill
  • posted a message on [ELD] Mothership spoilers 9/16— Queen Linden and her retinue
    Please, I beg you, call me a racist. No need to tiptoe around me with that nonsense. I’ll go to bat for my beliefs and not be shouted down by anybody. You shamed the other user for refusing to engage, you will not get that same luxury here.

    Why be ok with just a sprinkle of PoC if you’re so adamant that this is fantasy and you can make that whatever you wish? Why not give relevant back story as to how a singular black woman was able to achieve royalty status and become knighted in the 4 courts, as she is clearly of a minority race on her own home plane? @gutterstorm makes a valid point, but not in the way they had expected. They could literally be any color, so what is the significance here? Why not a Latino? Asian? Or anything in between? What separates her from her peers?

    I can assure you that PoC would choose relevance over existence. I’m glad your ok with simply making sure the boxes are checked, but I’m not.

    <snip>
    Posted in: The Rumor Mill
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