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  • posted a message on Alara Unbroken Discussion (links to summary in first post)
    Quote from GrevenIl-Vec
    I just feel you should be grateful for what was done for the book, Im not saying the book is bomb diggity the best in years im just saying its not absolutely terrible. Its like a "Meh" on a scale from Suck to Whoa.

    I haven't read Ari Mammels yet as I find the people in that storyline unappealing but as stated before and from your comments I prolly will buy it now Cool


    In short im not saying this book is awesome im saying give the guy a break hes been writing flavor text all his life =P

    Im sure he will learn from this and Yea, I hope he dosent write another one either.


    why give anyone a break when they write something uninteresting and boring? all other entertainment is held to a high standard, why treat this book differently? bad tv shows are canceled, bad games aren't played, etc. terrible books don't get published all the time for no other reason that they're terrible.

    i hate how wizards stopped caring about their product and just throw out a novel to make a quick buck without even editing it properly in most cases, let alone forcing the author to write an engaging story.
    Posted in: Magic Storyline
  • posted a message on [ARB] Madrush Cyclops
    Quote from Seth Dracovitch
    And I know this, but there is one big difference, the enviroment has changed a hell of a lot. I did take that into consideration. Trust me, if we still had a "fires" enviroment in standard, I'd be calling this card drap in every post I made in this thread.


    theres too much removal in the environment today to make it viable its a neat concept, but this was the wrong set to print it in. theres a multitude of ways for any competent deck, even in limited, to deal with this thing. what makes it even worse is that at minimum its coming out on turn 3. that gives ample opportunity for just about any deck to set up a way to keep it from staying in play long enough to be beneficial.

    fires worked because it was so fast and the card was an enchantment which is considerably harder to get rid of when compared to a creature. this thing is just too slow and too easily dealt with. i want to like it, i use to play a fires deck, but i just can't see it being worth it.
    Posted in: The Rumor Mill
  • posted a message on Alara Unbroken Discussion (links to summary in first post)
    that excerpt definitely doesn't grab my attention at all. just makes me roll my eyes and think 'another typical magic book'. i've been holding out the hope for years that they'd return to the quality they once were...everything just seems so cliche now.
    Posted in: Magic Storyline
  • posted a message on Possibly not done with Alara after ARB
    Quote from Maybe Eid
    You could get around the Homelands-hate. I guarantee if you did a set built around the Ulgrothan invasion of Ravnica, you would have so much win on your hands you wouldn't know what to do with it all. You'd literally have to give win away daily, you'd just have too much of it.


    yeah but they did an ivasion of a plane thing already...and it was win...
    Posted in: Magic Storyline
  • posted a message on Just started playing again; a few questions
    perfect. thanks a ton.

    i figured the mycoloth thing was different counters but someone was telling me i was wrong, so why not ask.

    with fact or fiction i'd always played it so that i got to see what was in each pile, as did most of my friends, but the last game i used it in my opponent kept insisting that they were hidden despite reveal being clearly stated on the card.

    edit: and as for the unearth thing, the dude was trying to counter it with a powersink, definite difference from stifle.
    Posted in: Magic Rulings Archives
  • posted a message on Just started playing again; a few questions
    So I played the game for a long time, roughly 9 years. I quit with the release of Mirrodin and didn't really keep up with the rules at all during that time. The other day I saw some people playing and so I put together a deck. I had a few questions that came up in the course of the day that I was hoping could be clarified.

    1. If I'm at 1 life, have Worship in play, control a creature, and my opponent casts Banefire for 5 making it uncounterable/unpreventable, and targets me, do I die or am I reduced to 1 health?

    2. When I cast Fact or Fiction and my opponent seperates the drawn cards into 2 piles, do I get to see whats in each pile before I make my choice? If I don't get to see them, why not?

    3. When I have a Creakwood Liege in play giving my green creatures +1/+1 and I play a Mycoloth; devouring 1 creature giving it +2/+2, do I get 2 saprolings during my next upkeep or 3?

    4. When my opponent announces that he's casting a spell during his main phase, can I respond by casting Orim's Chant to keep that spell from being able to resolve and enter play?

    5. When I use a creature's Unearth ability, can that creature be countered? (I said that its not counterable, but he said it was.)
    Posted in: Magic Rulings Archives
  • posted a message on Planar Chaos - Blob
    Quote from Maybe Eid
    Yeah, but that's not that unusual. I'm more interested in filing my taxes than in the Time Spiral plot. "What is that?! My God, a tax empt status? And a notable contribution to my 401k? Wow, twist ending on that one!"


    hahahahaha, that just made my day a lot less sucky.
    Posted in: Magic Storyline
  • posted a message on So, besides MtG books what are you reading right now?
    guns germs and steel
    the ceren site
    my anatomy text book
    faust
    Posted in: Magic Storyline
  • posted a message on How Well Are the Books Doing - Then and Now
    which novels are which on the graph?

    and wow did you put a lot of time into that

    edit: i suppose i should not be lazy and actually download the spreadsheet to see for myself
    Posted in: Magic Storyline
  • posted a message on Where would you take the Magic storyline?
    Quote from Dunjohn
    Just for the record, Mr. King hasn't written anything for Magic for years.



    yeah i know, but he was getting pretty bad with it there at the end. the new writers aren't much better in that regard, or at least, up until futuresight. i gave up after that. too much filler thats nothing more than stabbing things.
    Posted in: Magic Storyline
  • posted a message on Where would you take the Magic storyline?
    in retrospect i should have made this post in this thread, but i kind of got going...and well here's a link at least

    http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showpost.php?p=2882609&postcount=23


    edit: i mistakenly forgot to comment on the level of fighting/gore in the series as of late. that needs to end. yes its fantasy, but i want some talking between page after page after page of slaying. gets boring. gets redundant. i'm looking at you mr. king.
    Posted in: Magic Storyline
  • posted a message on Are the books really any good?
    bradywalkers while crappy, can work.

    rather than simply focus on characters that weren't planewalkers ala brothers war/the thran/the gathering dark, they were destroyed and reinvented. ok, sure, fine, ridiculous, but it could be workable.

    the major problem is that, while they might be fairly interesting on the cards. where are the stories? the novels should be focusing on them. there was no point in changing the nature of planeswalkers to make it easier to write about, and then not writing about them. where is the logic to that? potentially beautiful characters were created, and then not explored. at all. in favor of alternative characters.

    so why not have just left things alone and gone the way the new storylines went? why revamp everything and then forget about it?

    my biggest gripe is changing it at all. i hate to continually use the same novels as examples, but, the brothers war had no planeswalker protagonist nor a planeswalking antagonist, nor a planeswalker coming and being like 'no' and changing the entire story like is so often referenced by the staff. neither did the gathering dark, nor the thran. even the books dedicated to urza didn't do this. so why is this constantly referenced as a reason why the entire system was changed?

    why are the few books that did have planeswalkers showing off the true extent of their power the standard instead of the exception? aren't planeswalkers supposed to be incredibly rare throughout the multiverse? why would they even care what was going on anyway (except in the case of the invasion which effected everything) why is the focus on them at all? behind the scenes players is fine (the way it once was), afterall thats part of what made just about all the storylines prior to invasion pretty satisfying, focusing on a major character that was still fallible in mortal ways. why was that changed, then abandoned for being too difficult in the first place?

    give me a reason to care about the story. make it about the bradywalkers if thats the thing thats being touted. this is honestly as silly as say (to use references that geeks might get), creating the enterprise and its crew, then focusing on some unknown alien species on a planet unrelated to the federation. or creating the x-men and instead writing stories about normal humans and only vaguely referencing mutants. what was the point. change for the sake of change is almost never a good thing, and it makes clear that money was the true motivator in this decision.

    further more the cards and stories need to have greater cohesion, or none at all. its an all or nothing or it doesn't work. just like an abundance of places and people in the cards, that don't exist in the story, in favor of characters that don't exist in the card game is counter-productive and creates a conflict of ideas which in turn makes the stories very boring. part of the draw is to see elements of the game in action and not leave everyone with questions of 'what is this things part in it all why does it have a card and not a story, why does it have a story and not a card'. by creating stories about the cards the player is immersed even further in the game or yet further into the story, because its easier to relate to. to compare it to the world of warcraft ccg, theres a card game that borrows almost all of its elements from the video game, and it serves a dual purpose to draw in anyone familiar with either. of course by the same token i shouldn't have to play the game to understand the story, so optimally the novels should be treated as independent devices with elements from the card game meant simply to further the story, which is something that was originally captured fantastically well, when we again use the brothers war, the gathering dark, and the thran as examples.

    so having said all of that in favor of greater cohesion, if we make the books and cards have no cohesion, we can treat the novels as novels without a single element from the cards other than taking place in the same universe. this leaves quite a bit of area to explore. this also allows them to be treated as true novels, as legitimate works of literature rather than a quick way to make a dollar and simply set them in the magic universe. for instance use the examples of the original core set of alpha/beta. all about the gameplay. no story. with stories set in the universe when the time for novelization came. however the problem at that time was lack of consistency between the novels, and the cards, at all. what went on in one story made no sense with another, made no sense with anything going happening in the universe by way of the cards, and just made it all generally overly confusing. hence the original retcon and shift. personally, i feel this is the direction that should not be taken with the storylines or game, ever again.

    regardless, things need to be explained at least a little. why did this event happen, why did this character act this way. piecing it together from flavor texts (which are also very poorly written and overly cliche) and novels and rumor on the internet defeats the point of the novel. if it can even be explained by those means. typical trends show that the majority of things can't be. a great many plot devices just don't work and make no logical sense. the original books left things open to interpretation, but in ways that sparked discussion in terms of potentiality, rather than simply wtf? which is so often the case with these new stories.

    that brings up another point. the flavor text. the old style of flavor text helped explain the story and the world. it let the player know what was going on without reading the book, and it gave a basis to go on for the novels as well. the general trend in flavor text recently, explains nothing. they are simply cliche quips, or independent events that have no bearing on the next. this is the wrong kind of flavor, as in it has none. its tasteless and unmemorable. not everything needs to be super descriptive, sure, but there still should be a greater degree of this going on.

    in short, think for a minute about the people playing the game and reading the stories rather than about the almighty dollar, or the game will continue to dwindle on into nothing. ending up in the end as nothing more than another failed ccg.
    Posted in: Magic Storyline
  • posted a message on Where would you take the Magic storyline?
    what eid said.

    also, it bothers me that the weatherlight saga is touted as a failure by wotc. have they explained why? i don't remember seeing that anywhere. just that 'it was a lot of hard work for little pay off' yeah well no ****, thats how making a coherent story goes. did they expect some kind of global endorsement with the magic logo being stuck on everything as a result?

    regardless, it was infinitely better than the pile of garbage that is the new story line. i mean, how many years now of people complaining about it? dwindling book sales? less people even noticing? this new direction is an obvious success, right? right? yeah...way to not want to admit you've made a mistake or take appropriate action to correct it...nope, just keep shoveling the same **** out there, making it worse with each new set, limiting the plot even further...wait, are we even including plot any more or is it just random strings of events? i sure as hell can't tell.

    ...yes i'm bitter.
    Posted in: Magic Storyline
  • posted a message on Are the books really any good?
    Quote from Maybe Eid
    My opinions:

    The Colors of Magic - C+
    The Myths of Magic - C-
    The Dragons of Magic - D-
    The Secrets of Magic - B
    The Monsters of Magic - F

    Weatherlight Saga:
    The Thran - A
    The Brothers' War - A+
    Planeswalker - C
    Time Streams - B-
    Bloodlines - B+
    Rath and Storm - C
    Mercadian Masques - C+
    Nemesis - B+
    Prophecy - F
    Invasion - C-
    Planeshift - C-
    Apocalypse - C-

    Ice Age Cycle:
    The Gathering Dark - A
    The Eternal Ice - B+
    The Shattered Alliance - B-

    Magic Legends Cycle:
    Johan - F
    Jedit - D-
    Hazezon - D+

    Magic Legends II Cycle:
    Assassin's Blade - B
    Emperor's Fist - B+
    Champion's Trial - D-

    Otaria Crapfest:
    Odyssey - F
    Chainer's Torment - B+
    Judgment - C+
    Onslaught - D+
    Legions - F
    Scourge - F

    Mirrodin Cycle:
    The Moons of Mirrodin - D-
    The Darksteel Eye - F
    The Fifth Dawn - C

    Kamigawa Cycle:
    Outlaw: Champions of Kamigawa - B
    Heretic: Betrayers of Kamigawa - B
    Guardian: Saviors of Kamigawa - B

    Ravnica Cycle:
    Ravnica, City of Guilds - B+
    Guildpact - B
    Dissension - C+

    Time Spiral Cycle:
    Time Spiral - F
    Planar Chaos - F
    Future Sight - F

    Lorwyn Cycle
    Lorwyn - F
    Morningtide - F
    Shadowmoor - C



    i agree with those ratings almost entirely. except i would've been more harsh on the newer books.

    i stopped playing the game after apocalypse, and kept up with the story instead for a time. the majority of the books after apocalypse i at least read, i didn't like them, but i could get through them (ravnica was the best of the new lot by far).

    for some reason i keep picking up the books when they come out. i keep trying to read them. i get about five pages in, then end up skipping ahead to see if it improves any. they don't. completely unreadable. after the ravnica cycle everything took a major turn for the worse. (though everything between apocalypse and ravnica was pretty bad too)

    i've read a lot of bad books, but these have become worse than trash. the storylines are convoluted and poorly written. nothing is explored. nothing is explained. we move from one pointless fight to another with very little in the way of actual plot or dialogue. its a quick buck, and an easy way out of actually having to produce quality and depth to a game that had more than any other, because that takes effort.

    anyway, that all being said, i absolutely loved the older books, i end up rereading brothers war, the gathering dark, and the thran at least once a year. then die a little inside when i have to put them back on the shelf next to such trash as the mirrodin, otraria, time spiral, and lorwyn cycles.
    Posted in: Magic Storyline
  • posted a message on Question about 'walkers/TS
    i thought part of the reason planeswalkers had so much power was not so much because of the spark, yes that allows them to have greater access to those powers and travel the planes, but more so that they could indeed travel the planes

    part of the theory was that the longer you live, the more places you visit, the more familiar you become with the land, the more land you're familiar with the greater your options for drawing mana from it, similar to say putting more cards in your deck, you have access to more

    given that the spark made planeswalkers immortal, and allowed them to traverse the planes, wouldn't part of the power come from that ability? if you can visit countless worlds, you have countless worlds to be familiarized with and thus draw mana from

    so in changing the nature of the spark, haven't they also changed the very nature of the theory of mana?

    look at jodah and barrin for instance, ancient, powerful, while not as powerful as planeswalkers they still have the ability to give almost anyone a run for their money

    anyway, if this is all true, isn't it still theoretically possible for these neowalkers to do the same thing? use their ability to visit various planes and gather the resources to be as gods?

    so essentially the wizards storyline staff became lazy and figured they'd just scrap everything, they've grown worse and worse about this over the years, part of what made the storyline good in the past was its consistency, intricacy and coherency

    but hey who cares what characters do, we can just make news one when we don't want to think things out any more

    yeah i kinda got caught up in my own feelings there toward the end, so what, point is they have no idea what they're doing any more and the storyline has become trash, generic fantasy novel bin here we come!
    Posted in: Magic Storyline
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