MTG Salvation

well that's a kick in the dick.

if that's your rare. i don't buy the they can't all be winners bull***** some people spew. at the cost per pack they sure as **** better all be winners, or at least playable.

Quote from WarMachinePrime »

Some new young teen non working age player scraps together the 16 bucks to pop for a pack at a box store with visions of Bitterblossoms and Lilianas dancing in their heads proceeds to open two chaff 25 cent rares and a worthless foil common. And gives up on the game forever.

How does this help get new players WotC?

i mean, this set isn't really designed with new players in mind, and that's a-okay.

its very clearly designed with edh players in mind, yet put at an exorbitant price so it just caters to whales.

edit: yeah yeah, you'll all say but its for legacy and modern players too! except outside of edh who the **** is playing muldrotha, mizzix, animatou, lord of extinction... you can't include chaff like that and then say you aren't trying to appeal to the edh crowd too. i hated the first time they pulled this *****, and i hate it even more the second time.

Quote from WarMachinePrime »

Quote from Xcric »

because this is what we want to see in the mythic slot here?

i wonder how much crap needs to appear in this set before people get aggravated at opening trash and stop buying into this model

This model they use is beyond tiresome isn't it? All the value in the mythic slot, gamble gamble gamble. It obviously works but I find myself wanting and buying LESS product all the time with this model of rarity gambling.

same. i've switched heavily to singles and as a result i buy even less than i did previously. its just harder and harder not to view it as gambling every single set. keep pushing value into alt arts and mythics - and even then its a gamble on a gamble because half the mythics/alt arts in any given set tend to also not be value. use to pick up rando packs at targets and walmarts sometimes, but i stopped doing that even. it also effects draft, when you pay your 16 bucks knowing you aren't going to get anywhere near that back, even if you win... you kind of just stop drafting. drafting this will be even more expensive and not necessarily worth it.

i'd give my condolences to anyone who opens these, but you knew exactly what kind of gambling you were doing when you bought the pack.

because this is what we want to see in the mythic slot here?

i wonder how much crap needs to appear in this set before people get aggravated at opening trash and stop buying into this model

this has been reprinted so much that its absolutely absurd to have it show up at rare in a premium reprint set like this.

should've been made a damn uncommon if it was going to be here.

Quote from Card Slinger J »

Unfortunately they commissioned the wrong artwork for the Dockside Extortionist reprint because it looks more like a Monkey Pirate than a Goblin Pirate. Did they forget that they were supposed to reprint Dockside Extortionist thinking they were actually reprinting Ragavan, Nimble Pilferer? Looks that way to me. Wonder If they'll correct the artwork for the second print run?

its clearly from ixalan, where goblins are more reminiscent of monkeys, its just leaning into the idea of thieving pirate instead of bureaucrat. they're not going to change the art at this point in the process.

really like that olvia mobilized for war, and the volkan baga one looks like really good value too.

hate all the arts for the queen marchesa one, really do not like this artists style.

wondering how long it'll be before 3 cards becomes the norm for these things since we're now apparently down to just 4. hate this sales model more and more.

for the past 20 years this has been suggested as a game improvement every 10 minutes.

if you're flooding/starving you didn't shuffle enough or your mana base is wonky.

Quote from Dragoon91 »

Quote from soramaro »

I guess in terms of flavor, UB is more like a strong color pie bend instead of a break. White can technically do tax counter spells, yet Wizards has decided to not print them simply because a lot of people don't like counterspells. UB has the same kind of thing going for it, except that Wizards decided that they actually do want to move into that space ... because there are more people who like it than those who don't. I belong to the latter group though.

UB occupies this weird overlapping region between flavor and gameplay. For me, even in terms of gameplay the creative cohesion of Magic as its own universe has always been a big thing. I guess I really bought into the "you are a planeswalker" thing. And that illusion is simply shattered when my opponent can cast Gandalf or a Space Marine at any time. But I guess a lot of people just don't care about that? The point is that if you do, there are now only a few ways left to avoid this kind of experience, like exclusively drafting premier sets.

That's a very valid opinion and I can understand your point of view, you just ended up in the minority this time, which sucks but c'est la vie.
You can always ask the people you're playing with to use decks without UB cards if possible, it's not like they represent the majority of the game.

this will probably end up being more of a thing for me as we move further into UB.

when someone sits down with a UB themed deck it puts me in a situation where i'm really not enjoying the experience because to me it just isn't magic.

yeah, people alter cards all the time, but it was a rare and fringe thing - that made it cool - by emphasizing UB that makes it more accessible and more abundant. that means at the end of the day the only uniqueness to magic is the card mechanics. magic has spent 30 years world building and for me its as much a part of the game as playing the game.

while i can ask someone to play something else because my experience will be hindered by facing off against space marines and gandalf, they'll end up having a bad experience too because i'm trying to get them to experience the game a different way - yet both ways are now part of the game. if i'm at an event and someone doesn't have a different deck, i have no choice, i play with a diminished less immersive experience, or i choose not to play at all.

i do foresee sitting down at edh pods and someone busting out the necrons precon, not having anything else, and me simply saying 'great okay, i'm going to sit this one out then' which should be a valid choice - but it won't be because of how feels bad and petty that will be for everyone else involved. its not quite like saying i don't want to play your stax deck, because here this is purely aesthetic.

really though, i've already noticed instead of putting people through that, or myself through that, i just you know... don't go to events any more. if i'm going to be forced to experience UB polluting the core experience that is 30 years of magic worldbuilding, game design, and experience... i kind of just, won't bother to be in that situation at all.

here think of it this way: the thomas the tank engine mod for skyrim is fun, once or twice. every single time you turn the game on and without any choice to turn it off? that stops being skyrim, and it stops being an enjoyable experience.

yeah, there are a lot of people who are for this UB stuff, but there are a lot who aren't and the ones who aren't just end up walking away feeling trampled and ignored. frustrated that the game is evolving into a novelty without an identity of its own after having established one for decades. UB would've been fine as silver border optional content.

UB plus all the absurd variants you can open in packs now really does make it feel as if the game is transition to be more of a collectors piece like sports cards than an interactive, immersive, gaming experience.

there's a lot more to magic than just the card back and card mechanics. its not like monopoly where that doesn't play into some greater story/world building experience. this won't be healthy but it's going to take time to really rot from the inside out.

Quote from ThyLordQ »

It'd sort of be like putting creature type Goat Demon on a depiction of Satan.

I don't see anything inherently wrong with that. Just like how "Cerberus" was an entire group of multi-headed dogs on Theros, I could theoretically see a "race" of demons called Satans that have the creature type Goat Demon in some magic plane. Sure, it'd sound a bit silly to us but it's not problematic.

The Rakshasa of Tarkir are just based on the mythological ones, just like literally every single other creature in Magic. I absolutely don't understand how this change is necessary. And whether DnD does it or not doesn't matter. If it was done for real world cultural reasons then DnD faces the same issue. And if it doesn't, then why does Magic.

Also, the tribal thing continues to baffle me. When has "tribal" ever had a negative connotation? Savage I can understand but tribal???

Finally get an energy commander and it's in the ******* Fallout set... and not temur...

"Doctor Who is extremely suited for mtg and Planechase, they keep hopping from planet to planet like planeswalkers hop from plane to plane!"
Half of these new planes are set on Earth...

I feel like they put the reminder text on the wrong chapter. Who can remember what a wicked role is? But I want reminder text on everything because I like when cards say what they do.

Get a room you guys lol

I for one am actually feel that planeswalkers need to take a background role like they were in Magic up to Lorwyn. The emphasis should be on the player being an interplanar traveller and the exploits we dare to endeavour.

If ordinary beings can planeswalk akin to how Gerrard and his crew did during the Weatherlight saga then I'm all for it.

I just hope they don't put the power balance emphasis into the design of the planeswalkers in spite of the rest of the cards in the set.

and no-one is forced to play against Universes Beyond cards

I'm not sure what are supposed to be the implications of this statement. If you gonna face UB cards in tournament setting, what you will do? Instantly forfetting the match at the view of a UB card? And what you will do if I casually pull a UB card in the middle of a casual game? You gonna just stop to play with me immediately just because I got a UB card? and with refusing to play with UB you mean the mechanicaly unique cards or also just the reskinned versions of normal magic cards? And you will refuse to play with me even if I got cards from Arabian Nights or Portal 3 Kingdoms or Dungeons and Dragons in my EDH decks since those aren't in the magic canon either? And what about cards having real-world quotes like Shakespear, the Bible or Roman proverbs? Either way doesn't seems to me a very healthy way to approach the spirit of the game.

This just in: People legally not allowed to dislike Universes Beyond.

... Like, guys, are you really that mystified by how tastes and personal preferences work? Do you really think telling someone "well, ackshually" is going to change their opinion on whether or not they like a creative decision?

People liking or not liking something is purely emotional and often they may not be aware of why they like or dislike it. Sometimes things don't mesh and it's difficult to put into words. Telling someone they are wrong in disliking a thing (or by extension the reason why they dislike it) is just completely pointless.

The second fallacy is saying that just because there's precedent for it in Magic that means it can't be disliked. People brought up Capenna. Guess what? I actually dislike Capenna, because I think it's crossing the boundary too much. That doesn't mean I hate Magic as a whole.

UB is too not-Magic or not-fantasy or whatever to me. It's not something I can put into objective terms, and I don't have to, because it isn't an objective issue.

Let people like things. Let people dislike things.

PS: Are you guys really comparing the Urza power suits with the Tardis, that says POLICE BOX at the top??? Are you even pretending to be arguing in good faith?

Quote from Crispen_Smith »

Quote from Simto »

Stuff like this should be limited to some Secret Lair variant. Modern and scifi stuff looks so wrong on Magic cards it's crazy. Can't tell you how much I dislike Dr. Who.

This is just never a good look on anyone. It's great that you are passionate about MTG, and about your MTG experience, and saying you are not into this product is actually awesome.

But the way you say it.. it's like saying that grocery stores shouldn't be allowed to sell mangos because yellow foods are wrong.

I don't think your grocery store example makes any sense here, but if it did, it'd be more like "who put these Steven Seagal dvd's in the the middle of the fruit and vegetable section? Who even stocked these movies in the first place?? we sell food here"
And lol, "it's not a good look on anyone" to say a game that has only featured fantasy settings for 30 years puts modern and scifi stuff in? I think it's perfectly reasonable to think that. Not a good look? lol come one man.

Too much universes beyond all at once! I feel like next week is gonna be the reveal of the Clifford the Big Red Dog commander precons.

But if "time travel" is just messing with time counters, that's SO much less irritating than something like "the ring tempts you" or "the initiative" or even "the monarch".

I was never into universes beyond, but it feels like they're hitting that note way too hard all at once. I find myself not even reading new cards.