I think it's pretty much all some form of extravagant decoration.
But we see the exoskeleton is on the turntable, so it's doing.....something, but it's super unclear as to why which at that point just makes this a case of "just throw some tech in the art, who cares?"
The worst bit is the rope work holding it together... That just screams somebody said "It's high tech, but still samurai look!" at a board meeting. It's so dumb. Seriously some of the worst/dumbest art I've seen in Magic ever.
But it's just one card, and they do make tons of other amazing looking cards.
yes! this! i've been thinking this ever since it was spoiled. super high tech magical dj, but hey lets slap a chord of rope on them as a belt because we're a fantasy game with scifi elements and we need to remind people of that. its dumb as ****. like they can design a ******* mix table but not a belt buckle? its like they knew it didn't fit with whats been established for magic so they had to tack something on.
yeah magic has had mechs (the 9 titans) yeah its got body horror scifi (phyrexia) and sure kaladesh has all sorts of vehicles like trains and airships, but they've still always maintained an air of fantasy. cobbled together parts, fantasy elements, no computers or modern real world tech, that sort of thing, and now we just get a straight up dj with whats clearly computer screens. its dumb and i don't like it, no matter how far out of their way someone goes to justify it, to try and make it make sense. it doesn't matter, to me it will always be as jarring as sitting down across from someone who slaps down glen, or rick, or some other real world type card or cross ip thing. there is a certain atmosphere and style that has been established for the past 30 years, and this art feels way more like league of legends than magic the gathering.
for that, i don't like it and never will.
edit: heck thinking more about it i probably wouldn't have cared at all that it was a dj spinning fat beats or whatever the kids say these days if they had just not made it look like computer screens, and instead of a human made it a goblin, or a moonfolk, or some other species native to kamigawa that isn't a human. that would've been okay, that would've fit with the magic aesthetic... but nope!
But then why? In Dune lasers are rarely used anyway because of their interactions with the shield technology, and the focus is firmly on massive political plots and/or non-urban regions. But no one can tell me that DJs (or an equivalent job) don't exist at all in the Dune universe. So it must be instead the focus on it that feels wrong. This set is about cyberpunk though, a very deeply urban genre, as well as about the dichotomy of tradition vs progress. So the focus on something so urban and modern as a DJ doesn't strike me as odd or unfitting, but simply following through on that theme, same goes for motor bikes, computer, cyborgs (which most people would find extremely out of place in fantasy settings, but they were part of MtG since its beginning basically)... The line still feels arbitrary. In a multiverse with endless possibilities, where invasive cyborg viruses can potentially battle against lovecraftian horrors, where space-faring civilisations encounter almost almighty wizards from other planes of existence a DJ is somehow too much? Oh well, I will probably not get a satisfying answer to this. As long as it doesn't contradict anything, and doesn't feel totally out of place (which it would on say Ravnica or Ixalan but not on a cyberpunk world) I fail to see the problem. Stupid and childish are subjective terms here (especially since we so far only have the artwork without any background explanation).
Obviously finding it chidish is totally subjective, but still remains the fact that it feels out of place, like if it was taken from another game or from another visual/narrative univers and put into MTG. I think it's a matter of internal coherence in building a visual and conceptual style for a certain game/universe. If we take a character from the WOW universe, lets say a knight, and we put it into an high fantasy plane like bant or eldraine, it still feels out of place even if it is a kinght within a world made of castles, dragons and kings. To sum it up i think that partially is a subjective matter and partially not, and it's not a matter of technology is a matter of fitting or not into a brand that has some peculiar traits that distiguish it from others. Imho, a flying warship or a robot fits into MTG, while an airplane or a moto doesn't.
It might not fit into Eldraine or Bant, but if the WoW universe suddenly became a plane in the multiverse (ignoring its own multiversal cosmology for now), the style would simply be the way it is distinct from other worlds. Goblins from Kylem would look totally out of place on Mirrodin too. Kaladesh technology would stand out on Ravnica (and it did visually when Dovin Baan introduced Thopters to the Azorius). Pretty much everyone on original Mirrodin would stand out on any of the other planes we have seen so far, perhapos with the exception of Esper (and even there the styles would be clashing). I came to MtG specifically because of this kind of variety. Each plane can be entirely different from each other (with the obvious exception of the five mana colors system), including in style. Perhaps that's why I don't get where the fundamental problem lies. The execution on the other hand is another matter, but I will withhold my judgement on that until we get more information.
you can try to analyze it all you want, you can try to justify it all you want, but at the end of the day for some of us its just too modern and out of place with what magic has defined itself as for the past 30 years. much like seeing rick wield lucille. the artist did a wonderful job, but the concept is just too "not magic" for a lot of people and analysis won't change that.
Yeah, "Not every Magic product is for every player" should be a mantra repeated every day, everywhere in the MtG community. Who think otherwise it's a compulsive collector, and the problem in that case it's not of WotC but exclusively of their own.
totally disagree here. if you're playing in events you're playing the best cards. if those best cards are in a specific set you bet your ass they're for you. its extremely misleading to tout the mantra of not everything is for everyone when that's a grim reality of the game. you aren't going to show up to an event without an optimized deck, you simply can't and also expect to win. thats not counting your edh pods, but legit events. no one goes to a modern event hoping to win with random bull*****, they play the best cards.
products like this one are perfect imo, despite the predatory nature of secret lairs. these are basics. who cares. basics are literally thrown into the garbage sometimes, so you're not going to be hurting for playing a different version of a swamp. you can opt out of this one easily without any harm to your deck in a competitive environment.
this is exactly how all secret lairs should be. an optional product that you don't feel obligated into in order to compete.
I cant help but to be frustrated with this product.
Not because of the predatory nature of secret lairs, not for the card choice, or the relatively bad art, not even over the price. Nor even the theme.
No, i can simply opt out of this. Big deal.
What frustrates me is that with every basic land secret lair the masses *****ed and *****ed about how expensive it is to get 5 of any 1 basic since theyre sold as a kit with all 5.
Now that we have a kit where you get 5 of a single basic, making it easy to get enough for your fart themed edh deck...
...the masses complain its 5 swamps and not all 5 basics
i'm not a big fan of legends like this clearly designed with commander in mind, and the impact they have on the speed of a pod.
he's going to be an obnoxious powerhouse in your average pod. he won't be strong enough to cut it in true cedh.
i think we'll see some really oppressive builds that are very fast and very consistent at knocking out people quickly. part of that is the lack of removal in most people's builds. part of that will also be the colors enabling high amounts of protection via counterspells, coupled with the ability dig, and also having small cost effective evasive bodies. i think he's going to end up in a similar vein to tergrid - or at least close to it - where no one wants to sit down against him in a pod but he doesn't cut it in a true cedh pod. don't forget its not just blightsteel that can run away with a game, he can ***** out a vilis, razaketh, con sphinx, jin gitaxias the list goes on and on and they all run away with games when slapped down early. he's also in colors that enable fantastic reanimation as a backup plan.
they keep pumping out legends like that, and they're just not fun to play against. i don't think its healthy for the format.
all of that said, what he does is very in your face and most tables are going to see that right away and gang up on him, justified or not. that 3v1 scenario may also make him very unfun to pilot too, so really no one is enjoying the game and that isn't healthy.
anyway thats my snap judgment. lets hope i'm dead wrong on this one.
excessive as hell, but neat. if it was anything other than a treasure token i might be irritated, but with such limited quantities and it tied to money spent... well honestly even if it was a unique card i still wouldn't care that much
No really, this isnt a format for me, i wont be playing or supporting it. They can do whatever they want with it, ill never bother. I can opt out, thats okay.
I dont care about any of the cards as a result, but i do hope it helps reveal and push some concepts for paper
Have they replaced other reprint sets with SLs? Seems to me SLs just inject MORE reprints into the market. And as I've mentioned before--every LGS I've been to in the last year is reselling SLs, so if you're down to pay a little more you can still support your LGS. Petitioners and Apostle are super niche, and are only worth what they are because the handful of people who want them want a ton, so I don't consider them necessary reprints.
Also not sure where you're getting that they only release masters/supplemental products once per year. In about the last year, we've had Commander Legends, the rerelease of the Mystery Boosters, Modern Horizons 2, Time Spiral Remastered, Commander Collection: Green, Signature Spellbook: Chandra, a ton of Commander decks, Pioneer and Standard Challenger decks, and it's not like there's NO reprints in Standard sets.
I'm still very much on Team Secret Lair. I just buy the ones I like and ignore the others.
The problem with Local Game Stores (LGSs) reselling Secret Lairs is that most of them are either from drops that are less popular or failed to be purchased through the limited online window that Wizards of the Coast / Hasbro has setup on the official website where you can order Secret Lair drops. They also created a scenario where Local Game Stores (LGSs) are forced to order these Secret Lair drops online through eBay / Amazon therefore losing money in hopes of recouping the losses, or hope that their local distributor will be able to get some in stock so they're intentionally lowering the amount of supply for these Secret Lair drops to increase demand for them. So If you're hoping your LGS will get in a specific Secret Lair chances are you're never going to get it unless you buy it directly online and sadly that's just how things are right now.
As for the supplementary products you mentioned yes we did get lots of good reprints but the reason why they didn't add as much was because it would've made the products more expensive to purchase to justify it's market value within the MTG Secondary Market. Most Secret Lair drops normally have a $40+ price tag to justify the cards they reprint and when they hire old school artists like Dan Frazier or Rebecca Guay to illustrate the cards for these high-end reprints it adds to the monetary value of these products as well. This is why we're forced to settle for bad art on good reprints for Standard and supplementary sets solely so that the original printings appreciate in value more. The Great Reset caused by the pandemic has literally given Wizards of the Coast / Hasbro the green light to bankrupt over 3,000 LGSs nationwide solely to sell Secret Lair drops to increase Hasbro's profit margins.
can we get some citations on that 3,000 lgs figure?
also your lgs can do what most of them do and you know, just buy the product in quantities greater than zero during the window where everyone can buy it. after that point its the same as any other out of print product. no conspiracy here.
Maros explanation for why they shifted to black border and the acorn stamp sounds like very convoluted way to say "corporate needed these sets to make more money, so this is how we did it." To me this means that these sets will have less wacky designs (what Un-Sets were once known for) and a lot more cards that are just "merely funny" based on art and concept alone.
I don't like how much all the different Secret Lairs, Universes Beyond, and now black-bordered Un-Sets are starting to detract from Magic's core aesthetic. I guess I'm the minority here and most players just don't care, but to me it kind of feels like pumping SpongeBob Squarepants skins into a Lord of the Rings game.
this is how i feel too, so you're not alone.
its become a real turn off for new product for me, and honestly its had a small but noticeable negative impact on my gameplay experience. there's just too much weird ***** going on with frames now so i constantly have to ask 'what is that?' at a table. i never had to in the past and it creates a fairly negative experience to not know half the crap coming down because it has some alt art, alt frame, or completely different name (that isn't actually different) now. its also kind of made it difficult to be anti proxy which has in turn made proxies explode in popularity locally because when a magic card stops looking like a magic card who gives a crap whats real
the lands are pretty enough, but they just feel... off. idk maybe its the whole space scifi thing, or maybe its that they depict whole planets, i'm just not into them. its kind of the same with the shocklands, they're neat, but i just have no desire to collect them and they don't really evoke the feeling of lands in some cases.
i'm also not super keen on the whole rope-a-doped into buying into the set just to get singles playable in other formats, and that acorn symbol better be ******* huge and obvious or its going to cause a whole lot of casual problems
this feels like an excessive amount of secret lairs all at once.
the fblthp one is silly, i won't buy it, but i like it
the pixel art swamp is gorgeous, but i still won't bother with the kit because i can't get behind the idea of shelling out that kind of cash for one of each basic instead of like 5 of a single one
far out has some great reprints, and the arts aren't terrible... but they're way too busy for me to actually want to bother
the dracula one is neat, but suffers the same problem as the pixel art one.
the commander deck is a cool idea, theres some value reprinted there and its a very cohesive deck. i'm not sure coin flipping theme should've been the best idea to test the waters of this product. i can get behind the cost, its the theme i don't like. coin flipping is obnoxious as a mechanic and thats a big turn off for a lot of potential buyers, but it'll probably sell heaps regardless
i love the black and white treatments, i really do, that said i'm just not interested in spending 6+ on a pack which i'd be surprised if they clock in under that
so kamber went from forgettable but potentially interesting to build around
to junk
neato keen. sure would be nice if they used the money they rake in to make sure things like this don't happen any more, then again it'd have also been nice if blood tokens were mechanically interesting instead of a *****ty clue variant so whatever **** me i guess
yes! this! i've been thinking this ever since it was spoiled. super high tech magical dj, but hey lets slap a chord of rope on them as a belt because we're a fantasy game with scifi elements and we need to remind people of that. its dumb as ****. like they can design a ******* mix table but not a belt buckle? its like they knew it didn't fit with whats been established for magic so they had to tack something on.
yeah magic has had mechs (the 9 titans) yeah its got body horror scifi (phyrexia) and sure kaladesh has all sorts of vehicles like trains and airships, but they've still always maintained an air of fantasy. cobbled together parts, fantasy elements, no computers or modern real world tech, that sort of thing, and now we just get a straight up dj with whats clearly computer screens. its dumb and i don't like it, no matter how far out of their way someone goes to justify it, to try and make it make sense. it doesn't matter, to me it will always be as jarring as sitting down across from someone who slaps down glen, or rick, or some other real world type card or cross ip thing. there is a certain atmosphere and style that has been established for the past 30 years, and this art feels way more like league of legends than magic the gathering.
for that, i don't like it and never will.
edit: heck thinking more about it i probably wouldn't have cared at all that it was a dj spinning fat beats or whatever the kids say these days if they had just not made it look like computer screens, and instead of a human made it a goblin, or a moonfolk, or some other species native to kamigawa that isn't a human. that would've been okay, that would've fit with the magic aesthetic... but nope!
you can try to analyze it all you want, you can try to justify it all you want, but at the end of the day for some of us its just too modern and out of place with what magic has defined itself as for the past 30 years. much like seeing rick wield lucille. the artist did a wonderful job, but the concept is just too "not magic" for a lot of people and analysis won't change that.
then they revealed that ******* dj (not pictured here), and i am completely turned off from the set.
totally disagree here. if you're playing in events you're playing the best cards. if those best cards are in a specific set you bet your ass they're for you. its extremely misleading to tout the mantra of not everything is for everyone when that's a grim reality of the game. you aren't going to show up to an event without an optimized deck, you simply can't and also expect to win. thats not counting your edh pods, but legit events. no one goes to a modern event hoping to win with random bull*****, they play the best cards.
products like this one are perfect imo, despite the predatory nature of secret lairs. these are basics. who cares. basics are literally thrown into the garbage sometimes, so you're not going to be hurting for playing a different version of a swamp. you can opt out of this one easily without any harm to your deck in a competitive environment.
this is exactly how all secret lairs should be. an optional product that you don't feel obligated into in order to compete.
Not because of the predatory nature of secret lairs, not for the card choice, or the relatively bad art, not even over the price. Nor even the theme.
No, i can simply opt out of this. Big deal.
What frustrates me is that with every basic land secret lair the masses *****ed and *****ed about how expensive it is to get 5 of any 1 basic since theyre sold as a kit with all 5.
Now that we have a kit where you get 5 of a single basic, making it easy to get enough for your fart themed edh deck...
...the masses complain its 5 swamps and not all 5 basics
The magic community is ******* nuts.
he's going to be an obnoxious powerhouse in your average pod. he won't be strong enough to cut it in true cedh.
i think we'll see some really oppressive builds that are very fast and very consistent at knocking out people quickly. part of that is the lack of removal in most people's builds. part of that will also be the colors enabling high amounts of protection via counterspells, coupled with the ability dig, and also having small cost effective evasive bodies. i think he's going to end up in a similar vein to tergrid - or at least close to it - where no one wants to sit down against him in a pod but he doesn't cut it in a true cedh pod. don't forget its not just blightsteel that can run away with a game, he can ***** out a vilis, razaketh, con sphinx, jin gitaxias the list goes on and on and they all run away with games when slapped down early. he's also in colors that enable fantastic reanimation as a backup plan.
they keep pumping out legends like that, and they're just not fun to play against. i don't think its healthy for the format.
all of that said, what he does is very in your face and most tables are going to see that right away and gang up on him, justified or not. that 3v1 scenario may also make him very unfun to pilot too, so really no one is enjoying the game and that isn't healthy.
anyway thats my snap judgment. lets hope i'm dead wrong on this one.
excessive as hell, but neat. if it was anything other than a treasure token i might be irritated, but with such limited quantities and it tied to money spent... well honestly even if it was a unique card i still wouldn't care that much
No really, this isnt a format for me, i wont be playing or supporting it. They can do whatever they want with it, ill never bother. I can opt out, thats okay.
I dont care about any of the cards as a result, but i do hope it helps reveal and push some concepts for paper
can we get some citations on that 3,000 lgs figure?
also your lgs can do what most of them do and you know, just buy the product in quantities greater than zero during the window where everyone can buy it. after that point its the same as any other out of print product. no conspiracy here.
this is how i feel too, so you're not alone.
its become a real turn off for new product for me, and honestly its had a small but noticeable negative impact on my gameplay experience. there's just too much weird ***** going on with frames now so i constantly have to ask 'what is that?' at a table. i never had to in the past and it creates a fairly negative experience to not know half the crap coming down because it has some alt art, alt frame, or completely different name (that isn't actually different) now. its also kind of made it difficult to be anti proxy which has in turn made proxies explode in popularity locally because when a magic card stops looking like a magic card who gives a crap whats real
the lands are pretty enough, but they just feel... off. idk maybe its the whole space scifi thing, or maybe its that they depict whole planets, i'm just not into them. its kind of the same with the shocklands, they're neat, but i just have no desire to collect them and they don't really evoke the feeling of lands in some cases.
i'm also not super keen on the whole rope-a-doped into buying into the set just to get singles playable in other formats, and that acorn symbol better be ******* huge and obvious or its going to cause a whole lot of casual problems
the fblthp one is silly, i won't buy it, but i like it
the pixel art swamp is gorgeous, but i still won't bother with the kit because i can't get behind the idea of shelling out that kind of cash for one of each basic instead of like 5 of a single one
far out has some great reprints, and the arts aren't terrible... but they're way too busy for me to actually want to bother
the dracula one is neat, but suffers the same problem as the pixel art one.
the commander deck is a cool idea, theres some value reprinted there and its a very cohesive deck. i'm not sure coin flipping theme should've been the best idea to test the waters of this product. i can get behind the cost, its the theme i don't like. coin flipping is obnoxious as a mechanic and thats a big turn off for a lot of potential buyers, but it'll probably sell heaps regardless
singles ahoy!
to junk
neato keen. sure would be nice if they used the money they rake in to make sure things like this don't happen any more, then again it'd have also been nice if blood tokens were mechanically interesting instead of a *****ty clue variant so whatever **** me i guess