So this was my first Legacy tournament ever, so I am very green with the deck and format. I definitely learned a lot, and had a ton of fun despite the results. I ran the RG list, which seems a lot easier to play for a beginner than the rug version.
I definitely think I need to work on knowing other deck's sideboards, and could probably mulligan more often (I think I mulled once all day). Some of the sideboard choices below might not be 100% accurate as I sometimes played 2-3 rounds between writing down my results. I never felt like I was out of any matches except d&t.
Rd. 1 vs MUD w/12 post?
Game one I make tons of mistakes due to nerves. He makes turn 1 chalice on one but I keep him off mana long enough to make Lage. He goes off on his turn and plays and attacks with a lightning greaves blightsteel forcing me to block with Lage shrinking her. I get him to 3 on my turn thanks to some earlier punishing fires and drop chasm...he copies chasm on his turn with vesuva. I forget my chasm trigger losing it on my turn...I waste his chasm, block with Lage on blightsteel and double punishing for the win...should not have been this close.
In 4 grip, 1 depths
Out 2 punishing fire, Karakas, bog, 1 manabond
We both keep and I drop turn 1 exploration, mox, and cast loam he does nothing but accelerate for a couple turn while I dredge eventually finding the combo on turn 6 with him having sundering Titan in play. Key play was gripping his turn 2 metalworker, as turn 3 Titan would have done me in I think (though I had chasm in hand).
1-0
Rd. 2 MUD
Game 1 He wins the roll...duh duh duhnnnnn. He makes a turn 1 Golem, I lose. I punted as I should have rotated into maze but not sure if I would have won even if I had as he had metalworker in play as well.
Same sides as prev.
Game 2 I make turn 2 Lage and win.
Game 3 I wasted his first 2 lands but he gets chalices on 0 and 1. I make a Lage on time but he's gained 2 life off of post so I get him to 2 when he makes infinite life with metalworker/staff of domination.
1-1
Rd. 3 Infect
Game 1 I waste his first inkmoth, he plays another and we take turns doing nothing until I find the green mana source to rotate into the combo.
In 4 grip, 2 chalice, pfire can't remember what came out.
Game 2 I turn 1 exploration, turn 2 combo...he submerges the token. Turn 3 I happen the have the combo in hand again (plus loam backup) and he scoops. Not too exciting but it gave me time to grab lunch.
2-1
Rd. 4 RUG Delver
Game 1 I win with turn 3 Lage.
In chalices, pfire, Don't remember exactly what I sided out, but the chokes came in when I was on the play.
Game 2 he gets a really fast start with delver and 2 mongoose...I can't lock him out in time.
Game 3 I drop my hand on the table and he counters loam for a few turns til one sticks and I am able to combo off
3-1
Rd. 5 Death and Taxes
This matchup is rough...game 1 he goes mom, Stoneforge, flickerwhisp, and I have no interaction.
I side in 4 grip, depths, and pfire
Game 2 he leads with rest in peace vs my literally 4 Ports and tabernacle. He flickerwhisps my first lage and I eventually grip his rest in peace allowing me to start loaming. I find chasm to stall a couple turns but he eventually vials in mangara and blows it up for the win.
3-2
Rd. 6 vs charbelcher
Game one he makes 10 goblins turn 1. I survive 3 turns thanks to punishing fire and maze, but don't find tabernacle in time.
I side in basically everything but the chokes and punishing fire...out come the punishing fires, mazes, bog, Karakas, and 3 other cards I can't remember.
Game 2 I turn one mox, chalice on zero, port and sphere of resistance basically locking him out of the game.
Game 3 He makes 8 goblins turn 1. I have a very fast hand with manabond and the combo, but if I cast it turn 1 I give him a life and can't make Lage til turn 2 anyway. I decide to play thicket first and if I draw a land I'll be able to Lage turn 2 either way without him getting the life. I don't draw the untapped land and go to 4. My loam finds chasm which I play. My opponent then makes a comedy of errors...he tries to cast tendrils for 3 on 3 of his goblins (illegal)...so he goes for my face instead just trying to gain life...he didn't even realize he had won and I had to explain it to him.
3-3
Rd. 7 UR Delver
Game 1 he has a fast start with delver and 2 swiftspears. I stall a little with chasm but can't keep it forever.
Game 2 is a turn 2 Lage for the win.
Game 3 I stick a turn 1 chalice on 1, but he has blood moon into vortex into price of progress to finish me off. My lack of knowledge of his sideboard cost me as I had only brought in one grip against him.
None of us are happy about it; we don't want to be disappointed. But Magic's power level has been on a downward slope since GTC/DGM, and those of us who dislike underpowered blocks are just trying not to get our hopes up.
That's because Ravnica was ridiculously overpowered. I came in during the Theros block and started to look at Ravnica cards and go, what really ? The fact is right now a 5/5 Trample for 4 at instant speed isn't powerful enough, a 4/4 Uncounterable for 3 is NOT being played in standard. When is enough enough, when people see creatures that are 12/12 and go oh that's just a vanilla 12/12 for 6 ? The problem with going infinitely up is that you hit a point where it's just dumb. If you don't ever power down the sets how will you know what's powerful. I'd actually be alot happier if we had lower power set's where everything was a viable strategy and each week you had to go in not knowing which strategy was the best. The fact is there are some ridiculously awesome cards in Theros that just went ignored because of Ravnica.
RTR was powerful. But it was less powerful than Innistrad, Zendikar, and arguably Scars. It is only broken compared to Theros, which is the weakest block in the history of the game.
Lol. I'd like to introduce you to Masques block and Kamigawa.
By their contributions to larger formats, Kamigawa and Masques were more powerful than Theros. Masques had Daze. Kamigawa has Glimpse, Blazing Shoal, Top, Jitte, and a large amount of other playable cards. While I do admit that Masques is close to Theros, Kamigawa has much stronger cards.
Considering Theros has been out for less than a year, it's hard to quantify it's impact on eternal formats...we'll have a better idea in a few years.
Those are certainly fine budget options. The Shadowmoor filter lands are also good (next best option after the big 3).
In my opinion the painlands are better than the checklands, but it's close, and depends on how averse to self inflicted damage your playgroup is. Once the full cycle of scrye lands are available they might be better than either the checklands or painlands.
I have official tokens where available, and for most 2 of each (to represent tapped and untapped state) with dice on them the represent the number of the token. Some tokens that are produced by multiple cards in the cube (soldier, zombie, goblin, beast) I have more than 2 of in case multiple people need them. I sort them by color then alphabetical. I have them in green sleeves (vs. black for the cube) so they don't accidentally get shuffled in. I also have 4 extra copies of pack rat for pack rat tokens, and a second copy most of the transform cards so we don't have to unsleeve every time they flip.
Sort of, but that results in what amounts to skipping your land drop too. It enables some explosive plays, but to pretend that the legendary status is not a drawback is to overvalue this card.
If this hype dies down a bit and the value settles to something reasonable, this will definitely be a card to keep in mind next year when both mutavault and the best multi-color deck enabling lands since revised edition rotate out.
I was just replying to the previous poster that said it won't be played as a 4-of, which is false.
Nykthos is up to $14 at the cheapest on tcgplayer, though foils are only $5 more. Is it a good time to sell? It's hard to imagine the land going higher since it's not run as a 4 of, being legendary at all, but it can fit in to quite a few decks. Thoughts?
A lot of decks were playing 4 at the pro-tour. It works as a ritual with the new legendary rules.
There is a minimum of a year before they would be reprinted (and I personally doubt they will reprint them that soon). They will NOT go down unless they are reprinted. I am pretty sure even if they are reprinted in a year, you will get $162 of play value out of them, so I would buy them if you have the money.
I personally think we are 3 years off from fetches being reprinted. There were 7 years between Onslaught and Zendikar, and there were 7 years between Ravnica and Return to Ravnica. I personally don't believe that's a coincidence.
I would sell any non-foil I had now if I had any, but I would not sell any foils. This card is going to be played in Modern, and pretty much every cube is going to want a foil as well. I find the Liliana comparison apropos. She isn't as good as Liliana, but I could easily see her holding $25 long term. Of course she will likely be reprinted next year, so as soon as that happens, well, Baneslayer anyone?
In all seriousness, with offset printing, variations like this are bound to exist...the sheet was likely slightly off when the black was added. I wouldn't be worrying.
I do find the corners on your "real" lotus suspect though. I don't doubt it came from the wizards printer mind you, but it's definitely an oddball.
So this was my first Legacy tournament ever, so I am very green with the deck and format. I definitely learned a lot, and had a ton of fun despite the results. I ran the RG list, which seems a lot easier to play for a beginner than the rug version.
I definitely think I need to work on knowing other deck's sideboards, and could probably mulligan more often (I think I mulled once all day). Some of the sideboard choices below might not be 100% accurate as I sometimes played 2-3 rounds between writing down my results. I never felt like I was out of any matches except d&t.
[cards]
4 Rishadan Port
4 Wasteland
4 Thespian's Stage
2 Dark Depths
4 Grove of the Burwillows
3 Maze of Ith
2 Tranquil Thicket
2 Taiga
1 Forest
1 Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale
1 Horizon Canopy
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Ghost Quarter
1 Karakas
1 Windswept Heath
1 Wooded Foothills
1 Misty Rainforest
1 Verdant Catacombs
[cards]
4 Mox Diamond
4 Life From the Loam
4 Exploration
2 Manabond
4 Gamble
3 Crop Rotation
3 Punishing Fire
[cards]
4 Krosan Grip
4 Sphere of Resistance
3 Choke
2 Chalice of the Void
1 Punishing Fire
1 Dark Depths
Rd. 1 vs MUD w/12 post?
Game one I make tons of mistakes due to nerves. He makes turn 1 chalice on one but I keep him off mana long enough to make Lage. He goes off on his turn and plays and attacks with a lightning greaves blightsteel forcing me to block with Lage shrinking her. I get him to 3 on my turn thanks to some earlier punishing fires and drop chasm...he copies chasm on his turn with vesuva. I forget my chasm trigger losing it on my turn...I waste his chasm, block with Lage on blightsteel and double punishing for the win...should not have been this close.
In 4 grip, 1 depths
Out 2 punishing fire, Karakas, bog, 1 manabond
We both keep and I drop turn 1 exploration, mox, and cast loam he does nothing but accelerate for a couple turn while I dredge eventually finding the combo on turn 6 with him having sundering Titan in play. Key play was gripping his turn 2 metalworker, as turn 3 Titan would have done me in I think (though I had chasm in hand).
1-0
Rd. 2 MUD
Game 1 He wins the roll...duh duh duhnnnnn. He makes a turn 1 Golem, I lose. I punted as I should have rotated into maze but not sure if I would have won even if I had as he had metalworker in play as well.
Same sides as prev.
Game 2 I make turn 2 Lage and win.
Game 3 I wasted his first 2 lands but he gets chalices on 0 and 1. I make a Lage on time but he's gained 2 life off of post so I get him to 2 when he makes infinite life with metalworker/staff of domination.
1-1
Rd. 3 Infect
Game 1 I waste his first inkmoth, he plays another and we take turns doing nothing until I find the green mana source to rotate into the combo.
In 4 grip, 2 chalice, pfire can't remember what came out.
Game 2 I turn 1 exploration, turn 2 combo...he submerges the token. Turn 3 I happen the have the combo in hand again (plus loam backup) and he scoops. Not too exciting but it gave me time to grab lunch.
2-1
Rd. 4 RUG Delver
Game 1 I win with turn 3 Lage.
In chalices, pfire, Don't remember exactly what I sided out, but the chokes came in when I was on the play.
Game 2 he gets a really fast start with delver and 2 mongoose...I can't lock him out in time.
Game 3 I drop my hand on the table and he counters loam for a few turns til one sticks and I am able to combo off
3-1
Rd. 5 Death and Taxes
This matchup is rough...game 1 he goes mom, Stoneforge, flickerwhisp, and I have no interaction.
I side in 4 grip, depths, and pfire
Game 2 he leads with rest in peace vs my literally 4 Ports and tabernacle. He flickerwhisps my first lage and I eventually grip his rest in peace allowing me to start loaming. I find chasm to stall a couple turns but he eventually vials in mangara and blows it up for the win.
3-2
Rd. 6 vs charbelcher
Game one he makes 10 goblins turn 1. I survive 3 turns thanks to punishing fire and maze, but don't find tabernacle in time.
I side in basically everything but the chokes and punishing fire...out come the punishing fires, mazes, bog, Karakas, and 3 other cards I can't remember.
Game 2 I turn one mox, chalice on zero, port and sphere of resistance basically locking him out of the game.
Game 3 He makes 8 goblins turn 1. I have a very fast hand with manabond and the combo, but if I cast it turn 1 I give him a life and can't make Lage til turn 2 anyway. I decide to play thicket first and if I draw a land I'll be able to Lage turn 2 either way without him getting the life. I don't draw the untapped land and go to 4. My loam finds chasm which I play. My opponent then makes a comedy of errors...he tries to cast tendrils for 3 on 3 of his goblins (illegal)...so he goes for my face instead just trying to gain life...he didn't even realize he had won and I had to explain it to him.
3-3
Rd. 7 UR Delver
Game 1 he has a fast start with delver and 2 swiftspears. I stall a little with chasm but can't keep it forever.
Game 2 is a turn 2 Lage for the win.
Game 3 I stick a turn 1 chalice on 1, but he has blood moon into vortex into price of progress to finish me off. My lack of knowledge of his sideboard cost me as I had only brought in one grip against him.
3-4 drop
Considering Theros has been out for less than a year, it's hard to quantify it's impact on eternal formats...we'll have a better idea in a few years.
In my opinion the painlands are better than the checklands, but it's close, and depends on how averse to self inflicted damage your playgroup is. Once the full cycle of scrye lands are available they might be better than either the checklands or painlands.
I was just replying to the previous poster that said it won't be played as a 4-of, which is false.
A lot of decks were playing 4 at the pro-tour. It works as a ritual with the new legendary rules.
I personally think we are 3 years off from fetches being reprinted. There were 7 years between Onslaught and Zendikar, and there were 7 years between Ravnica and Return to Ravnica. I personally don't believe that's a coincidence.
In all seriousness, with offset printing, variations like this are bound to exist...the sheet was likely slightly off when the black was added. I wouldn't be worrying.
I do find the corners on your "real" lotus suspect though. I don't doubt it came from the wizards printer mind you, but it's definitely an oddball.