Just had a few matches in which I tested hexdrinker. I liked it in control match ups.
More tests are needed, but it may be worth.
Yeah, Control and BGx is where I found them to be at their best. They are a pretty solid draw against anything we have to race, which is a very good point in adding consistency to the deck, but they also shine in grindfests.
That's why I'm so high on Hexdrinker. It's a turn 1 threat against the combo matchups we're supposed to beat, and a great topdeck against the decks we tend to struggle against. And no reliance on the yard.
I've thought about playing the UR one in place of my second Steam Vents, but then also about playing UG in place of Breeding Pool, which I almost never fetch. Not sure yet.
Well that sucks. Been posting here since the early days of cube. Although less so recently, I've still been checking for spoiler reactions. Thanks to all the regulars and not-so-regulars for years of enjoyment.
Please everyone let us know where are folks migrating to, will miss a friendly cube community.
Can folks provide or pm me the discord link, i don't have twitter so will be out of the loop!
As I keep saying, I'm just going to test it. I'm replacing Mandrills with it because I want to see it enough to see how it does. Worst case scenario is that I get my teeth kicked in for a few weeks before going back to Mandrills. Best case is that this deck gets a makeover. I see it as zero downside for me to test it, and you all do as you please and continue crushing with this deck.
Tolarian Community College just spoiled Magmatic Sinkhole
Magmatic SInkhole 5R
instant
Delve
Magmatic Sinkhole deals 5 damage to target creature or planeswalker.
I think our deck is too overtaxed with delve and graveyard matters cards already for this card to be effective.
If Hexdrinker ends up being the way forward, and that's a big if, I think this card could replace the 1 of Dismember or Roast I've often run in the board. Hitting walkers is no joke, especially considering how much harder our control matchups have gotten in the last year, and especially considering the little Teferi, which wrecks us.
I like them pretty well so far. They're not going to last forever, but for $25, they give a little extra coating of durability and make the beginning of a draft very easy.
Agreed that little Teferi is busted. The big one is hard enough, but this new one might just be more important for us to keep off the table. Force should help with that.
Curious to see how this turns out. I follow many of your on twitter, which is great, and I'm semiactive on the reddit cube community. I know there are many who are apprehensive about reddit, but as someone who used to feel that way, I can say that it's not nearly as rough as it's made out to be.
Keep in mind neither of the decks hexdrinker got there are exactly known for their removal.
Sure, sure. But let's look at the top 15 decks in the meta, as of today.
Humans: no removal save Reflector Mage, which blows out everything we play except Goyf and Snapcaster anyway. Goose may be better here, but it's a chump blocker, realistically. UW Control: 5 removal spells and wraths. Tons of grave hate means Goose probably isn't great here, and attacking for a few turns before they have their removal online seems fine to me. Tron: no removal, maindeck Relics. I'm all about chipping for 2 starting turn 2, Forcing whatever they do on their turn, and beating face. I think this matchup is already solid and gets better post Horizons. UR Phoenix: removal for sure, but again, attacking for a few points before they flip Thing seems fine to me. Dredge: no removal. Burn: all removal, but anything they're pointing at creatures is fine by me. I appreciate the Hexdrinker trading with Goblin Guide here. Especially since they've usually hit us for 4-6 with it by the time Hoots comes down. Goose seems fine here, too, but gravehate is a concern. Amulet: no removal, and hitting them for 2-4 while they're durdling around seems just fine by me. Matchup is a bye anyway. Red Phoenix: all removal, although I find this a rough matchup anyway. I do think that Force of Negation may help turn this around, though. We'll see. Affinity: the one piece of removal they play kills Mandrills just as much as it kills an unleveled Hexdrinker. Goose seems rough here, especially since I'm almost always boarding out air for artifact hate. That said, this is a horrible matchup in my experience. Grixis Death's Shadow: much removal, but a levelled Hexdrinker seems problematic for them, and an ultimated one wins in a swing. The Rock: much removal, and Push is a problem. That said, I find that these games get into topdeck wars, and I'd 100% rather topdeck a Hexdrinker than a Mandrills or Mongoose here. Titanshift: dealing early damage is a thing here. I think Force of Negation is going to be good here, although the matchup feels pretty good. Infect: no removal, good matchup anyway. Jund: 6 pieces of removal that kills Hexdrinker but not Mandrills. That's a thing. Mongoose seems terrible here because of the board stalls this matchup leads to makes a 3/3 irrelevant. Mandrills is solid here because it shrinks Goyfs at a whim. But again, in a topdeck war, Hexdrinker wins the game. You play it, level it up to 3 or 4 or whatever, pass, level the rest of the way next turn, attack with a 6/6, GG. Hollow One: 6 pieces of removal main that kills Hexdrinker but not Mandrills, which is solid here because they fill our grave for us. But again, you can cast the Hexdrinker and chip in a few points while they're durdling around. Getting the creature out of your hand to protect it against Goblin Lore is relevant. Matchup isn't great, but it isn't because of our creatures.
Just looking at these, it sure seems like there are a few decks where just being able to crack in to force the removal spell seems good. I'm also planning to play 2-of Spell Pierce to buy a few turns early on, because you can level it, or before Force of Negation gets hardcast.
Maybe a 2/2 split with Hexdrinker and Mandrills would be best? I'm not sure. I'm going to test 4 just to get a feel for it, though.
Lame duck format update: went 2-1 last night, beating Abzan and UR Pyromancer, losing to Grixis Control. My list feels really good right now. One thing I worry about with losing Mandrills is that Simic Charm doesn't work with Mongoose or Hexdrinker, and that card is a 3-of house in my deck right now. I'd say it's about the best thing I can draw against the fair decks. But then again, part of the reason I'm running it is because we need ~28 blue cards for Shoal, and with only needing ~23 or so for Force, we can afford to play harder removal to deal with big Goyfs and whatnot.
A thought I had as far as pitch cards and removal: maybe 3 copies of Force, 2 Spell Pierce for extra spell backup, 2 Spell Snare for countering creatures and whatnot, and a copy of Lightning Axe for extra hard-nosed removal, to fill around Bolt, Tarfire, and possible Forked Bolt?
Let us know how the proxy tournament works. I liked the singleton idea and used it myself when I was between iterations of this deck.
if the green stony silence bear becomes a thing, just transition to vanilla affinity which runs actual removal spells. hell you dont even need metalcraft to galv blast it.
As someone who loses hard to Affinity, I thought that, too, and then I thought about how many ways Affinity has to make red mana when this creature is out. I think it's 4. For 2 mana, I'll take it.
That's why I'm so high on Hexdrinker. It's a turn 1 threat against the combo matchups we're supposed to beat, and a great topdeck against the decks we tend to struggle against. And no reliance on the yard.
Thanks. Just the excuse I was waiting for to join you all.
If Hexdrinker ends up being the way forward, and that's a big if, I think this card could replace the 1 of Dismember or Roast I've often run in the board. Hitting walkers is no joke, especially considering how much harder our control matchups have gotten in the last year, and especially considering the little Teferi, which wrecks us.
A quick look over there for the first time in a few years. Yikes. They actively don't want us. Reddit or a new forum it is.
Sure, sure. But let's look at the top 15 decks in the meta, as of today.
Humans: no removal save Reflector Mage, which blows out everything we play except Goyf and Snapcaster anyway. Goose may be better here, but it's a chump blocker, realistically.
UW Control: 5 removal spells and wraths. Tons of grave hate means Goose probably isn't great here, and attacking for a few turns before they have their removal online seems fine to me.
Tron: no removal, maindeck Relics. I'm all about chipping for 2 starting turn 2, Forcing whatever they do on their turn, and beating face. I think this matchup is already solid and gets better post Horizons.
UR Phoenix: removal for sure, but again, attacking for a few points before they flip Thing seems fine to me.
Dredge: no removal.
Burn: all removal, but anything they're pointing at creatures is fine by me. I appreciate the Hexdrinker trading with Goblin Guide here. Especially since they've usually hit us for 4-6 with it by the time Hoots comes down. Goose seems fine here, too, but gravehate is a concern.
Amulet: no removal, and hitting them for 2-4 while they're durdling around seems just fine by me. Matchup is a bye anyway.
Red Phoenix: all removal, although I find this a rough matchup anyway. I do think that Force of Negation may help turn this around, though. We'll see.
Affinity: the one piece of removal they play kills Mandrills just as much as it kills an unleveled Hexdrinker. Goose seems rough here, especially since I'm almost always boarding out air for artifact hate. That said, this is a horrible matchup in my experience.
Grixis Death's Shadow: much removal, but a levelled Hexdrinker seems problematic for them, and an ultimated one wins in a swing.
The Rock: much removal, and Push is a problem. That said, I find that these games get into topdeck wars, and I'd 100% rather topdeck a Hexdrinker than a Mandrills or Mongoose here.
Titanshift: dealing early damage is a thing here. I think Force of Negation is going to be good here, although the matchup feels pretty good.
Infect: no removal, good matchup anyway.
Jund: 6 pieces of removal that kills Hexdrinker but not Mandrills. That's a thing. Mongoose seems terrible here because of the board stalls this matchup leads to makes a 3/3 irrelevant. Mandrills is solid here because it shrinks Goyfs at a whim. But again, in a topdeck war, Hexdrinker wins the game. You play it, level it up to 3 or 4 or whatever, pass, level the rest of the way next turn, attack with a 6/6, GG.
Hollow One: 6 pieces of removal main that kills Hexdrinker but not Mandrills, which is solid here because they fill our grave for us. But again, you can cast the Hexdrinker and chip in a few points while they're durdling around. Getting the creature out of your hand to protect it against Goblin Lore is relevant. Matchup isn't great, but it isn't because of our creatures.
Just looking at these, it sure seems like there are a few decks where just being able to crack in to force the removal spell seems good. I'm also planning to play 2-of Spell Pierce to buy a few turns early on, because you can level it, or before Force of Negation gets hardcast.
Maybe a 2/2 split with Hexdrinker and Mandrills would be best? I'm not sure. I'm going to test 4 just to get a feel for it, though.
Lame duck format update: went 2-1 last night, beating Abzan and UR Pyromancer, losing to Grixis Control. My list feels really good right now. One thing I worry about with losing Mandrills is that Simic Charm doesn't work with Mongoose or Hexdrinker, and that card is a 3-of house in my deck right now. I'd say it's about the best thing I can draw against the fair decks. But then again, part of the reason I'm running it is because we need ~28 blue cards for Shoal, and with only needing ~23 or so for Force, we can afford to play harder removal to deal with big Goyfs and whatnot.
Let us know how the proxy tournament works. I liked the singleton idea and used it myself when I was between iterations of this deck.
As someone who loses hard to Affinity, I thought that, too, and then I thought about how many ways Affinity has to make red mana when this creature is out. I think it's 4. For 2 mana, I'll take it.