It doesn't have flash, but Doom Whisperer is a ******* crazy finisher
True, the stats are good. I think I'm spoiled by Gearhulk. Looking for something that does something busted on ETB, or has a messed up ability. I do also like Thief, because it will likely be good vs. green, which looks to be the week one deck of choice among pros. A flier that lets me cast their dudes to hold off their guys that resolve sounds like a winner.
Welp, looks like I'm still on "Esper" AKA UB with Teferi, until further notice. Jeskai has nothing on Teferi's power level. 90% of my old deck translated to the new, there's just no replacement for Torrential Gearhulk. Trying to figure out the best win cons besides Teferi. Right now I'm on 2 Eldest Reborn and 2 Thief Of Sanity, but I don't know if that's a solid enough plan.
This card is great. They sit in your graveyard waiting to be cashed in when you draw a brick. Not as strong as Glimmer, but way better than Illumination. Also, a lot of synergy with Surveil. It makes up nicely for Torrential Gearhulk being gone to recycle your draw spells.
Not sure if anyone is active but this is what I've decided on for the time being. Maybe it just suits my playstyle better, or maybe it's better for MTGO.
I felt super weak to Vine Mare and Carnage Tyrant, so The Eldest Reborn, Settle the Wreckage, Vizier of Many Faces, Yahenni's (for Vine Mare), and Detection Tower all help answer them. Tower is an easy swap for Field of Ruin.
The other bad matchup was Mono Red and R/B Aggro, so cutting all of the cycles from Wafo Tapa's list for a couple of Cast Down and a few more cards in the board help just dying to the redundant Goblin Pikers.
Been trying all of these. So far, I would say the Detection Tower should be a Vizier. WAY better vs. the green decks. Also helps vs. Chromium and control in general, where they can blow Tower up. It was very unimpressive to me.
While I can't claim to have a lot of experience running esper control in the current meta, I do have a lot of experience with Nexus of Fate, including multiple different variants. Nexus of Fate just runs smoother with more planewalkers. Teferi is probably best one available because of how he can ramp your mana for EoT instants, and he doubles as control. Karn is solid card advantage/deck thinning and a win con.
The real question is if you BOTHER with Nexus of Fate in Esper control, especially if you aren't going to be taking advantage of Planeswalkers. Lost Legacy (or its inevitable replacement) plus existing counterspells can already do well as anti-nexus tech. While I think standard is eventually going to hit a point where Nexus is a go-to card for any competitive blue deck (ala-Bogarden Hellkite), I don't think we're there yet. Also, it is going to be less effective in any deck that's not abusing it, hence why I think you want more Planeswalkers if you are going to run Nexus.
Just considering the example you've given, current Nexus lists don't care that much about Vinemare. They just ignore it with fog and build to infinite turns.
The idea of keeping to Gearhulk in Control makes sense. But, what are you trying to use nexus for? Card Draw and Land drops? Faster Closing? I'm not trying to be cynical. I am looking for the motivation for running the card. I also should point out that Nexus decks can have a serious problem if something happens to the few actual win-cons they have. I think there is merit to running Gearhulk along with some number of Karn. but I wouldn't cut Karn for Gearhulk exclusively.
Just as an example, Bant is using nexus to Ramp, draw more cards, bulk up planeswalkers and build to a point where they are taking all the turns. But Esper Control is not necessarily running on the same philosophy. Off-hand, the best use case I am seeing for Nexus in Esper Control is EoT Gearhulk for removal and then swinging for consecutive turns. That's not bad play, but it is also very narrow play based on being ahead or having an opening.
More importantly, if you are trying to chain nexus to get more than 2 consecutive turns, you might need to reevaluate the function of the rest of the deck... not slap in 4 Nexus just because. Its a good card, but it IS expensive to cast. Those card slots might be better served elsewhere if it is going to be a dead card in hand when you need control.
Agreed. We should be preying on Nexus decks as opposed to doing a bad impersonation of them.
I you wanna get funky, sideboard insidious will. I did it for fun and acutally got someone with it! Not sure that the number of banefires is up there to justify IW in a competitive setting like a GP, but the lulz when you do get them are real. But, in reality, your best hope is commit (perhaps with a shuffle effect like field of ruin) and kill them before they kill you.
I've been looking at Insidious Will, Sanguine Sacrament (crazy, I know), Lost Legacy and Fountain Of Renewal. I don't trust Commit/shuffle, I don't like a two card combo, especially one that they can just luck up out of. As wild as it sounds, I think my next test will be Sacrament. It's instant, a good mana sink, can be found with Azcanta, and can be used multiple times. Also, it's playable against all of the aggro decks. I'm trying Lost Legacy now, but against aggro, it doesn't actually DO anything, and is a terrible topdeck mid-late game.
Banefire is absolutely filthy. I am testing a grixis build and I draw it almost every game as a 1 of. Get them down to 7-10 and banefire ftw.
I'm seeing more and more Banefire every week. People are tired of losing to me and the one or two other controls players Settling them out of the tournament. Even R/B aggro is playing it now, not just midrange.
What do you guys think is the best way to deal with mono black zombies? I know it's going to be a thing at my local FNM, so I need some graveyard hate.
Is the best thing just to find room for two scavenger grounds?
My deck has tons of spot removal and I run 2 Settle main and 1 fumigate side, but having some graveyard hate will be crucial.
I'm only running one Field of Ruin, but I've actually never really had a use for it, so I'm thinking Scavenger ground will be better.
As always, Vraska's Contempt will be key. I am going back to Fumigate in the SB due to the Knight matchup. Settle can work, but it they are smart and play around it, you may lose anyway. Also, The Scarab God should wreck them, you just need to untap with it. I think smart board management and sequencing will be most important.
Is anyone looking at Tez? Seems decent to me. I mean obviously Teferi is better...
I tried 1 at FNM. Only played it twice. It was good, but I think I have to reconfigure the deck overall, as just sticking him in there was an error. I think the card has a bright future, though. One game, I got Teferi to 8 with Tez at 8 and 3 Thopters. My opponent unfortunately scooped before I got the chance to remove all of his permanents lol. If Teferi didn't exist, he'd be the control king.
I also tried Chromium, btw. I like it, but I think it's overrated. Too easy to work around. Unless you have a control heavy metagame, I think he sits out until rotation. We have to worry about the various aggro decks, Knights and Grixis.
@NTSC, Do you still have problems getting lands on time with your build?
Very few land problems now that I'm not running Lyra. A mulligan for lands every once in a while, but that's it. I have flooded once or twice. I have been tempted to run a 3rd Search For Azcanta, but I don't thuink that's the move right now.
Also, won a PPTQ Saturday. It was 5 rounds top 4 (16 people), and I squeaked in at 4th at 3-2, then avenged both losses (flood one match, deck check when I happened to accidentally presented an illegal deck due to rushing to deboard in the other smh) for the win.
I am trying something very similar to this version, tweaked to my meta. I love Settle, but the mana base is still ugly, and I have an SCG IQ for money I want to win tomorrow, so we'll see. If i do well, I'll post whatever list I play and some thoughts.
Went 3-1-1 (29 people), lost in Top 8. I don't take notes, but from memory:
Beat Mostly Black Control 2-1,
Beat Jeskai Control 2-0,
Lost to Rb Aggro 0-2 (to the winner),
Beat Rb Aggro 2-1 in a nail biter that involved him bricking for 3 turns game 3 while 2 Vraska's Contempt and 2 Gearhulks wrecked his board and got me out of burn range.
Drew to Top 8.
Lost to the same Red player in Top 8 1-2. here is where not having all 4 Push hurt. Round 3, I lost a game to Kari Zev single-handedly . In top 8, I also missed double white for Lyra. In hindsight, I wish the Lyras were Essence Extractions.
This is basically Brad Nelson/Guillame Matignon's (sp?) version with some tweaks:
MD
3/3 Push/Cast Down - I, foolishly, changed this. Wasn't the end of the world, but contributed to my two losses. I say foolishly, because damn near the whole room was control and red variants, so I should have maxed on Push.
3 Torrential Gearhulk, 1 Scarab God main - I wanted the easy win, and it's a trump in the control mirror if you can stick it. Won me a couple game ones.
SB
2 The Eldest Reborn - One of my new favorite cards. I wanted this as a hedge against Carnage Tyrant (there were none), since I gave up Settle to play this version. It's also great against midrange in general (again little to none smh). I hate Jace's Defeat, so out it went, along with the Cast Downs and Scarab God, since they were in the main. Also a bomb in control mirrrors. The issue is siding out that many cards. Stealing someone's Teferi, or getting back your countered Scarab God without exiling him is really good.
2 Lyra Dawnbringer - wanted a bomb against red since there was so much. Should have been a cheap life gain removal, Moment or Essence Extraction. She mainly ate Disintegrations, though she won a game in top 8.
Note: UW is now almost non-existant, and there were no History Of Benalia decks that I saw, so Knight got sided in exactly zero times. I think he's done. Will probably be more anti- Red cards, maybe a Settle or two. And at least a second Duress. Playing one felt terrible...
Interesting side note: My bro came in 4th with Esper Cycling. This is by FAR the hardest match for control right now. I never beat that deck. He wanted to avoid red and play control all day. He lost to the same guy I did. We agreed later he misconfigured his board. The Lyra and the Sunscourge Champions (he's actually good here, the discard triggers the cycling enchantments/Archfiend) should have been 4 Authority Of The Consuls. All that deck needs is time and it wins. IMO, arguably the real best deck in the format. Also, The Approach was unneeded. Should have been the 4th Renewed Faith .
I don't get why people have a problem with the protection ability. No, you aren't supposed to abuse the unblovkability. Hexproof is what you're using the ability for, to protect your 7/7 beater which kills in 3 turns. Everything else is just fluff. Nobody said "ugh! why does it become tapped?" when they talked about Prognostic Sphinx.
So then Esper Control is worth playing to your mind?
You make a good point about it being good in mirrors but I am not sure I be especially worried about winning the Mirror if I am playing control.
Esper AKA UB with a white splash for Teferi, Hero Of Dominaria, is the most played Standard control deck right now, and IMO, easily the best. Having flash AND being uncounterable makes it great against ANY control variant. I'd probably play it against midrange, too. What do they do about it? Worst case scnario, it's a flying 7/7 wall.
True, the stats are good. I think I'm spoiled by Gearhulk. Looking for something that does something busted on ETB, or has a messed up ability. I do also like Thief, because it will likely be good vs. green, which looks to be the week one deck of choice among pros. A flier that lets me cast their dudes to hold off their guys that resolve sounds like a winner.
Welp, looks like I'm still on "Esper" AKA UB with Teferi, until further notice. Jeskai has nothing on Teferi's power level. 90% of my old deck translated to the new, there's just no replacement for Torrential Gearhulk. Trying to figure out the best win cons besides Teferi. Right now I'm on 2 Eldest Reborn and 2 Thief Of Sanity, but I don't know if that's a solid enough plan.
Been trying all of these. So far, I would say the Detection Tower should be a Vizier. WAY better vs. the green decks. Also helps vs. Chromium and control in general, where they can blow Tower up. It was very unimpressive to me.
Agreed. We should be preying on Nexus decks as opposed to doing a bad impersonation of them.
I've been looking at Insidious Will, Sanguine Sacrament (crazy, I know), Lost Legacy and Fountain Of Renewal. I don't trust Commit/shuffle, I don't like a two card combo, especially one that they can just luck up out of. As wild as it sounds, I think my next test will be Sacrament. It's instant, a good mana sink, can be found with Azcanta, and can be used multiple times. Also, it's playable against all of the aggro decks. I'm trying Lost Legacy now, but against aggro, it doesn't actually DO anything, and is a terrible topdeck mid-late game.
Not an option, I'm not switching archetypes.
I'm seeing more and more Banefire every week. People are tired of losing to me and the one or two other controls players Settling them out of the tournament. Even R/B aggro is playing it now, not just midrange.
As always, Vraska's Contempt will be key. I am going back to Fumigate in the SB due to the Knight matchup. Settle can work, but it they are smart and play around it, you may lose anyway. Also, The Scarab God should wreck them, you just need to untap with it. I think smart board management and sequencing will be most important.
I tried 1 at FNM. Only played it twice. It was good, but I think I have to reconfigure the deck overall, as just sticking him in there was an error. I think the card has a bright future, though. One game, I got Teferi to 8 with Tez at 8 and 3 Thopters. My opponent unfortunately scooped before I got the chance to remove all of his permanents lol. If Teferi didn't exist, he'd be the control king.
I also tried Chromium, btw. I like it, but I think it's overrated. Too easy to work around. Unless you have a control heavy metagame, I think he sits out until rotation. We have to worry about the various aggro decks, Knights and Grixis.
Very few land problems now that I'm not running Lyra. A mulligan for lands every once in a while, but that's it. I have flooded once or twice. I have been tempted to run a 3rd Search For Azcanta, but I don't thuink that's the move right now.
Also, won a PPTQ Saturday. It was 5 rounds top 4 (16 people), and I squeaked in at 4th at 3-2, then avenged both losses (flood one match, deck check when I happened to accidentally presented an illegal deck due to rushing to deboard in the other smh) for the win.
As far as 2019, I'm looking at Chromium, the Mutable, Millstone, and Patient Rebuilding. I can see myself playing Tezzeret, Artifice Master somewhere down the line, also.
Luckily, SCG did it for me
http://www.starcitygames.com/decks/121804
Went 3-1-1 (29 people), lost in Top 8. I don't take notes, but from memory:
Beat Mostly Black Control 2-1,
Beat Jeskai Control 2-0,
Lost to Rb Aggro 0-2 (to the winner),
Beat Rb Aggro 2-1 in a nail biter that involved him bricking for 3 turns game 3 while 2 Vraska's Contempt and 2 Gearhulks wrecked his board and got me out of burn range.
Drew to Top 8.
Lost to the same Red player in Top 8 1-2. here is where not having all 4 Push hurt. Round 3, I lost a game to Kari Zev single-handedly
This is basically Brad Nelson/Guillame Matignon's (sp?) version with some tweaks:
MD
3/3 Push/Cast Down - I, foolishly, changed this. Wasn't the end of the world, but contributed to my two losses. I say foolishly, because damn near the whole room was control and red variants, so I should have maxed on Push.
3 Torrential Gearhulk, 1 Scarab God main - I wanted the easy win, and it's a trump in the control mirror if you can stick it. Won me a couple game ones.
SB
2 The Eldest Reborn - One of my new favorite cards. I wanted this as a hedge against Carnage Tyrant (there were none), since I gave up Settle to play this version. It's also great against midrange in general (again little to none smh). I hate Jace's Defeat, so out it went, along with the Cast Downs and Scarab God, since they were in the main. Also a bomb in control mirrrors. The issue is siding out that many cards. Stealing someone's Teferi, or getting back your countered Scarab God without exiling him is really good.
2 Lyra Dawnbringer - wanted a bomb against red since there was so much. Should have been a cheap life gain removal, Moment or Essence Extraction. She mainly ate Disintegrations, though she won a game in top 8.
Note: UW is now almost non-existant, and there were no History Of Benalia decks that I saw, so Knight got sided in exactly zero times. I think he's done. Will probably be more anti- Red cards, maybe a Settle or two. And at least a second Duress. Playing one felt terrible...
Interesting side note: My bro came in 4th with Esper Cycling. This is by FAR the hardest match for control right now. I never beat that deck. He wanted to avoid red and play control all day. He lost to the same guy I did. We agreed later he misconfigured his board. The Lyra and the Sunscourge Champions (he's actually good here, the discard triggers the cycling enchantments/Archfiend) should have been 4 Authority Of The Consuls. All that deck needs is time and it wins. IMO, arguably the real best deck in the format. Also, The Approach was unneeded. Should have been the 4th Renewed Faith .
This man gets it.
Check out top 8s for Standard on SCG's page from anything in the last 2-3 weeks. For example...
http://www.starcitygames.com/decks/121574
Esper AKA UB with a white splash for Teferi, Hero Of Dominaria, is the most played Standard control deck right now, and IMO, easily the best. Having flash AND being uncounterable makes it great against ANY control variant. I'd probably play it against midrange, too. What do they do about it? Worst case scnario, it's a flying 7/7 wall.