One thing just keeps me wondering. How it is possible that people are having such many problems just installing this. There must be something else behind that, cause I really see just two options: 1. Lack of skills using their OS and/or computers altogether. 2. Lack of aspiration to even use this program.
Also it is funny that people think that ANYONE they see in open, totally free IRC- or chatroom is related to this program being its producer, programmer or something similar. Being there as workers (doing their job).
And after they don't get an answer (after one minute or so) they give up.
I also wonder, but in my case it's how you only see two options, and why you attempt to inflate your ego by accusing others of ignorance. Why keep wondering when all you have to do is read this thread, where your questions are answered not only thoroughly, but ad nauseam?
I really wish my experience building, repairing, and supporting PC users for over 20 years (since before DOS 5) could add up to your genius at installing Octagon, but I must bow to you. You really have it going on. One day I'll have to figure out how this chatroom thing works too.
@Jorbes: Don't feel sorry for Jods, he knows exactly what's going on. He could have posted here years ago, just like you and so many other developers have; why should he wait? Because he wants to stay underground. Still, as developer, he's responsible for documentation and access to updates, etc., not anyone else. So, all this confusion is ultimately his responsibility and could easily have been avoided, but he has decided to handle things differently. He's decided to stay where he is, concentrate on programming, and abrogate those other responsibilities. That's his prerogative and more power to him. I'm not passing judgment and don't care one way or the other how he or anyone else handles their business. But feeling sorry is a waste of emotion better spent elsewhere.
And I'm pretty sure I read of the MWS exploit you discovered a long time ago.
@Gaspare: Thank you for your thoughtful and well considered response. I know what it took to write it, believe me. I'm sure your revised and updated procedure will be of great benefit to new Octagon users.
You and I both know a bit about making a program usable and are eminently qualified to speak on the subject. I wrote the official MWS guide almost six years ago and it has been viewed hundreds of thousands of times. It's out of date, but it answers questions still being asked today, which proves some people don't read it. You have made some nice videos and are in the same situation. We know about training people to use software.
I've written guides for other programs too that are considered standards, the best available. Why are they the best? Because they are accurate, up-to-date, and don't leave out details or assume prior knowledge from their intended audience.
If anyone is qualified to figure out how to use a software, and be able to judge whether the documentation for it is appropriate, it is us. I'm not bragging, I'm making a point.
I've followed Octagon since before it was called Octagon. Is that long enough to have formed a valid opinion? Apparently not. Has my successful guide writing for many different programs (and machines) qualified me to judge an install procedure? Apparently not. In the how-to file, you found ambiguous statements and incorrect directories. But in spite of that my difficulty means, obviously, I have tried an outdated version of the program or "haven't tried anything".
Maybe keflex's procedure is accurate, but who wants to try it now?
Every guide I've written has taken days or weeks to produce, then weeks of feedback are taken into account as every tiny source of possible misunderstanding is eliminated. The feedback is welcome as an indispensable part of the process, it's not to be bristled at.
MTG Salvation is the biggest forum of its type. If I wanted people to try my program, I would come here and be minding my P's and Q's. If someone had a problem with my install procedure, I would ask them how I could make it better. It's a simple matter to edit a text file, much easier than expecting readers to overlook my mistakes and omissions.
That's all I have to say on this subject, I've given enough free advice to those wise enough to glean it.
@Gaspare: Trolls are rude. I wasn't and you were. You are the troll, troll.
You are competing with LackeyCCG and OPT and MWS and a good handful of other programs. People (as in, more than one person) tell you that Octagon (version 2, not version 1, we do know the difference) is hard to install properly, after trying more than once, and they are all wrong and you are right. You have been given a direct quote of a disgraceful chatroom correspondence, but it's just an anomaly to you. It is not an anomoly, it is business as usual.
The whole marching band is on the other foot, and yet you are the only person in step. Are you insane? This friendly attitude is typical of you Octagon salesmen, and yet another reason why Octagon is doomed to languish in obscurity. Good luck converting the unwashed with your attitude. I'll stick with <another program>, you know, the program where the developer politely responds, and doesn't take a month to do it. Yes, I know what I'm talking about. I've been to your forum, your blog, your website, your chatroom, and I've been doing so for years. I know EXACTLY what I'm talking about.
And saying "troll" and "fail" over and over doesn't emphasize your point, it shows you are a cliched hack writer who needs a thesaurus. I'm quite sure that insulting me will result in the whole world abandoning their favorite apps now, and rushing to install Octagon. Good luck with that, and thanks for putting such a friendly face on a wonderful program.
Dude, you are the only one who is having so many problems with octgn 2, really.
said that, I'm interpreting your posts as pathetic tentatives of trolling against a program that clearly you don't like or you don't want to.
You are wrong, CXA26483 is not the only person who has a problem, or have you forgotten the rest of this thread? Why are you blaming him for your confusing directions?
And now the program is converting to python. Why don't you let us know when it's finished? Because Octagon is not ready for prime time now, just like it wasn't years ago. It's underground for a good reason: It's hard to use, and the support is weak. The leet cognoscenti like the fact that they have figured it out and the rest of the world is too dumb to do so. So be it, but quit saying how it's better than MWS. Online Playtable is also much easier to use, and there are other apps also.
You're welcome. I just found out about that program myself and it's the best free screen recorder I've ever seen, but it's almost unknown and hard to find by googling. Hopefully that will change with time.
I really wish my experience building, repairing, and supporting PC users for over 20 years (since before DOS 5) could add up to your genius at installing Octagon, but I must bow to you. You really have it going on. One day I'll have to figure out how this chatroom thing works too.
@Jorbes: Don't feel sorry for Jods, he knows exactly what's going on. He could have posted here years ago, just like you and so many other developers have; why should he wait? Because he wants to stay underground. Still, as developer, he's responsible for documentation and access to updates, etc., not anyone else. So, all this confusion is ultimately his responsibility and could easily have been avoided, but he has decided to handle things differently. He's decided to stay where he is, concentrate on programming, and abrogate those other responsibilities. That's his prerogative and more power to him. I'm not passing judgment and don't care one way or the other how he or anyone else handles their business. But feeling sorry is a waste of emotion better spent elsewhere.
And I'm pretty sure I read of the MWS exploit you discovered a long time ago.
@Gaspare: Thank you for your thoughtful and well considered response. I know what it took to write it, believe me. I'm sure your revised and updated procedure will be of great benefit to new Octagon users.
You and I both know a bit about making a program usable and are eminently qualified to speak on the subject. I wrote the official MWS guide almost six years ago and it has been viewed hundreds of thousands of times. It's out of date, but it answers questions still being asked today, which proves some people don't read it. You have made some nice videos and are in the same situation. We know about training people to use software.
I've written guides for other programs too that are considered standards, the best available. Why are they the best? Because they are accurate, up-to-date, and don't leave out details or assume prior knowledge from their intended audience.
If anyone is qualified to figure out how to use a software, and be able to judge whether the documentation for it is appropriate, it is us. I'm not bragging, I'm making a point.
I've followed Octagon since before it was called Octagon. Is that long enough to have formed a valid opinion? Apparently not. Has my successful guide writing for many different programs (and machines) qualified me to judge an install procedure? Apparently not. In the how-to file, you found ambiguous statements and incorrect directories. But in spite of that my difficulty means, obviously, I have tried an outdated version of the program or "haven't tried anything".
Maybe keflex's procedure is accurate, but who wants to try it now?
Every guide I've written has taken days or weeks to produce, then weeks of feedback are taken into account as every tiny source of possible misunderstanding is eliminated. The feedback is welcome as an indispensable part of the process, it's not to be bristled at.
MTG Salvation is the biggest forum of its type. If I wanted people to try my program, I would come here and be minding my P's and Q's. If someone had a problem with my install procedure, I would ask them how I could make it better. It's a simple matter to edit a text file, much easier than expecting readers to overlook my mistakes and omissions.
That's all I have to say on this subject, I've given enough free advice to those wise enough to glean it.
@Gaspare: Trolls are rude. I wasn't and you were. You are the troll, troll.
You are competing with LackeyCCG and OPT and MWS and a good handful of other programs. People (as in, more than one person) tell you that Octagon (version 2, not version 1, we do know the difference) is hard to install properly, after trying more than once, and they are all wrong and you are right. You have been given a direct quote of a disgraceful chatroom correspondence, but it's just an anomaly to you. It is not an anomoly, it is business as usual.
The whole marching band is on the other foot, and yet you are the only person in step. Are you insane? This friendly attitude is typical of you Octagon salesmen, and yet another reason why Octagon is doomed to languish in obscurity. Good luck converting the unwashed with your attitude. I'll stick with <another program>, you know, the program where the developer politely responds, and doesn't take a month to do it. Yes, I know what I'm talking about. I've been to your forum, your blog, your website, your chatroom, and I've been doing so for years. I know EXACTLY what I'm talking about.
And saying "troll" and "fail" over and over doesn't emphasize your point, it shows you are a cliched hack writer who needs a thesaurus. I'm quite sure that insulting me will result in the whole world abandoning their favorite apps now, and rushing to install Octagon. Good luck with that, and thanks for putting such a friendly face on a wonderful program.
And now the program is converting to python. Why don't you let us know when it's finished? Because Octagon is not ready for prime time now, just like it wasn't years ago. It's underground for a good reason: It's hard to use, and the support is weak. The leet cognoscenti like the fact that they have figured it out and the rest of the world is too dumb to do so. So be it, but quit saying how it's better than MWS. Online Playtable is also much easier to use, and there are other apps also.
One of these days maybe, but certainly not today.
http://www.magic-league.com/guide/play_magic_online.php
http://www.slightlymagic.net/software/pda