The emry number 5 to 8 will be retractation helix allowing the same kind of combo with 0 mana artifacts. The other creatures we'll play i'm afraid it needs to be be mana creatures, it's annoying because i wanted to play only 3 colors. But we still have some options.
Either we play 4 colors and mana creatures, it allows once jeskai is into play to dig for helix or Emry by chaining cantrips.
Either we play 3 colors and utility legendary creatures with ccm 1, allowing to us mox amber more easily for turn two combo.
I'm still in brainstorming mode and i did not saw any thread on a jeskai combo deck so, let's think through this together.
I'm leaning more and more on slaughter pact than on pact of negation. I love PoN, but there is more and more cases when i would prefer something else, even if this something cost 1 mana rather than 0.
I’ve been brewing a long time with eldricht evolution, but the card alone in a combo shell never get me good results because there was only four of them.
But things have changed and as a good new combo deck brewer I decided to try something new with eldritch evolution, combined with neoform
Nothing tested yet, but here’s the list as I see it, it’s a blue/green deck using the interaction between allosaurus rider / summoner’s pact + neoform and eldritch evolution to search for griselbrand with a lot of consistency (you actually have with that 8 copies of each part of the combo.)
We then combo of with shoal as a classic griselbrand deck, only difference we play 2 autochthon wurm that we can tutor with summoner’s pact instead of the classic worldwspine wurm.
Basically, we need a maximum of green cards (either for shoal, or either for allosaurus riders)
Why simian? Good question, it allows us to kill in the turn, but also to pay a pact the next turn as a 8/8 griselbrand T1/T2 can be enough to win I think. Ultimately allow us to cast an eldricht t2.
Basically, the play neoform t2 into Grisel, draw and shoal into 2 ssg to pay the pact the next turn IS a winning play.
The 8 to 11 slots I’d play a maximum of green cards, either protection, either disruption, either mana accelerator, either cantrips, the experience will tell us which option is better.
I personally think that chancellors are good in this version , at worst it’s a green card for shoal or allosaurus, at best It allows you to cast neoform t1, or eldricht with a ssg.
Let’s brew together, i have good instincts to break things and neo+ eldricht seems to be broken as ****!
Good new, in reality we never have any problem to draw the entire deck and i will explain why.
And for those who don't understand what i'm talking about, i will re-explain how the whole deck is working and that will be the base for a primer (this deck needs one)
DredgeBrand'z (AKA DBZ) is a deck using the interactions between griselbrandgoryo's vengeanceand the dredge ability.
Using the dredge as a tutor engine:
It got multiple layers of interactions, the first one being to use a dredge engine to bin griselbrand into the graveyard much more constantly than any other deck, in combination with secrets of the mausoleum which makes good use of the dredge too to catch [card]goryo's vengeance[/card, the deck is really able to reanimate griselbrand in a constant manner and fast too.
Basically, if you have mausoleum, goryo's vengeance or the one copy of footstep of the goryo in hand, the only thing you have to do i dredge until griselbrand hit the yard, easy no?
But you will ask me why do we want grisel on the battlefield if we're not playing shoals like the other versions? Well the funnier part is coming!
We are now in a state where griselbrand is into play, and we have some dredgers in the graveyard, it's time to draw! We pay 7 life then draw, but each draw will be replaced by a dredge, we have two goals to achieve, either we chain the dredgers, either we dredge a phantasmagoriansometime none of the two options will be realized but it's for another topic as it's somewhat rare.
The main engine here isgolgari brownscale, the more you dredge, the more cards will be in your grave, phantasmagorian or golgari brownscale, and if you dredge a brownscale, when you resolve it's ability, you will have payed 7 life, but will regain 2 by brownscale you dredged.
You will then be able to discard the brownscales and other dredgers with the phantasmagorian ability you just dredged, and you will do that again in response to the phantasmagorian ability in the stack.
During the process, we will probably dredge emrakul, no problem we continue to dredge and discard with phantasmagorian in response to it's ability. (keeping in mind the rakul ability, it will come handy )
Ultimately (i swear!) you will find yourself with this gamestate:
Griselbrand in play, we have 2 Blightsteel colossus in library, 4 Golgari brownscale 1 dakmore salvage and 1 phantasmagorian in graveyard, and 1 phantasmagorian in hand.
I pay 7 for a draw 7, i dredge the 4 golgari brownscale and the dakmore salvage, then draw 2 the 2 blighsteel colossus
I then gain 8 life with brownscale, i use phantasmagorian's ability, discarding 4 brownscale 1 dakmore salvage and the phantasmagorian in hand, i resolve the ability phantasmagorian return in hand. (still the first one is now in the grave)
I then have 2 blightsteel colossus and phantasmagorian in hand, i use the ability of phantasmagorian again discarding the two blightseel and phantasmagorian, the blightsteels colossus are shuffled in library, i resolve, phantasmagorian is back in hand.
we then are back to the Initial state except we now have one more life.
The loop have been demonstrated, you just have to say you're doing this 1 million times, and we go now to the emrakul trigger, you forgot it?
Calculate and draw your library!
The main point here is to, by resolving emrakul ability, create a 7 multiple to be able to draw our entire library without randomness, we don't like random.
Actually, the best way to picture the number of cards you will have in your library is to count the cards in your library+ the cards in your graveyard, and to consider the cards you discard with phantasmagorian as +3 cards in your future library and any card leaving your grave as -1 card in your future library.
The two "tricks" are, discard gorian for gorian+2 other cards +2 cards in library, and the second trick is discards 3 and in response to the ability discard gorian +2 other cards, it's doing a +5 cards in future library.
I will ask you to trust me on this one, we did the math and we are able with two phantasmagorian to do:
+2 cards in future library / 3 cards in hand minimum
+4 cards in future library / 5
cards in hand minimum
+5 cards in future library / 6 cards in hand minimum
+6 cards in future library / 7 cards in hand minimum
+7 cards in future library / 8 cards in hand minimum
+8 cards in future library / 9 cards in hand minimum
+9 cards in future library / 10 cards in hand minimum
+10 cards in future library / 11 cards in hand minimum
Ok so now for the persons already aware of the deck, do you see that? In fasct the initial phase of comboing will ALWAYS get us to have more than 11 cards in hand, and here the +8 cards in grave can replace our inability to do a +1, as the +10 cards can replace the +3, in short:
as long as we have 11 cards in hand at this point (read = always) of the game, we can do a multiple of 7 only with phantasmagorian
Still lightning storm is the "easy kill" i's say for me it's more like the "nobrain" kill (not insulting, it can be really useful to just say "i kill you" without thinking more) but it's suboptimal and plunge is a way better kill in term of utility out of combo.
I'm still tweeking the list, not stable enough for me, ideally the deck shouldn't "fizzle" in goldfish mode more than 10% of the time, actually we're between 15 and 20% i guess (i consider "fizzle" the fact to combo off after t5 or to not combo at all)
And btw good news for DBZ KCI got the banhammer, actually i think that the decks are REALLY similar, they have nearly the same speed and fear the same things, so basically the gravehate will be less prevalent sooo good thing!
Aaaaaand it's here, i bought the deck entirely and will play it soon in tournaments, my actual list doesn't kill in the turn anymore, i kill with gutshot during the cleanup step replaying it infinitely.
I'm thinking of cutting the SSG for more stability, they're not providing such acceleration considering our line of play is generally either faithless T1 ==> goryo t2 OR discard t2 ==> goryo t3 we need 3 lands so, maybe i will cut them.
So the deck just gain infinite life and the hand of your choice (either instant speed with goryo's vengeance, or sorcery with footsteps of the goryo) generally something like goryo x3 faithless looting griselbrand land land, or emrakul if you want to kill with an emrakul alpha strike.
You then wait a turn, reanimate grisel EOT, and use gutshot infinitely during the cleanup step.
There may be a more elegant win condition I haven't seen, but this one uses less pieces while forfeiting comboing off at instant speed.
Hehe yep that's the point, actually i did not test the deck in a tournament, so i don't know if the instant kill is necessary. But there is two problems, the first and biggest one, you sacrifice griselbrand at the end step. The second, not really a problem but still, we will not cut the noxious because they are "reanimation spell tutor" in this shell.
For the second question nope not played in a tournament, but i will, i bought all the deck (if that can be a proof of my faith in the combo haha) so i will soon play it during a tournament.
I must say that if i had to forfeit the instant speed part, i would go more to a version going infinite mana with pyretic ritual (you can replay it 4 time with noxious, then pay R to discard emrakul and go infinite like that) and cast blightsteel x2 and emrakul for an alpha strike (wich is, cute i'd say )
After brainstorming a bit i think the fastest kill that can be achieved realistically frequently is a t2 kill, using Jeskai ascendency in combo with either emry, lurker of the loch and 0 mana artifacts mox amberx2 or simply tormod's crypt
The emry number 5 to 8 will be retractation helix allowing the same kind of combo with 0 mana artifacts. The other creatures we'll play i'm afraid it needs to be be mana creatures, it's annoying because i wanted to play only 3 colors. But we still have some options.
Either we play 4 colors and mana creatures, it allows once jeskai is into play to dig for helix or Emry by chaining cantrips.
Either we play 3 colors and utility legendary creatures with ccm 1, allowing to us mox amber more easily for turn two combo.
I'm still in brainstorming mode and i did not saw any thread on a jeskai combo deck so, let's think through this together.
Bad players everywhere it's damn incredible.
Well atm i'm trying this list:
You got it i'm trying to not play any cantrips as i hate that (wildly prefer tutors)
I’ve been brewing a long time with eldricht evolution, but the card alone in a combo shell never get me good results because there was only four of them.
But things have changed and as a good new combo deck brewer I decided to try something new with eldritch evolution, combined with neoform
Nothing tested yet, but here’s the list as I see it, it’s a blue/green deck using the interaction between allosaurus rider / summoner’s pact + neoform and eldritch evolution to search for griselbrand with a lot of consistency (you actually have with that 8 copies of each part of the combo.)
We then combo of with shoal as a classic griselbrand deck, only difference we play 2 autochthon wurm that we can tutor with summoner’s pact instead of the classic worldwspine wurm.
4 eldricht evolution
4 neoform
4 summoner’s pact
4 allosaurus rider
4 shoal
4 chancellor of the tangle
4 simian spirit guide
1 lightning storm
8 to 11 slots to fill.
Basically, we need a maximum of green cards (either for shoal, or either for allosaurus riders)
Why simian? Good question, it allows us to kill in the turn, but also to pay a pact the next turn as a 8/8 griselbrand T1/T2 can be enough to win I think. Ultimately allow us to cast an eldricht t2.
Basically, the play neoform t2 into Grisel, draw and shoal into 2 ssg to pay the pact the next turn IS a winning play.
The 8 to 11 slots I’d play a maximum of green cards, either protection, either disruption, either mana accelerator, either cantrips, the experience will tell us which option is better.
I personally think that chancellors are good in this version , at worst it’s a green card for shoal or allosaurus, at best It allows you to cast neoform t1, or eldricht with a ssg.
Let’s brew together, i have good instincts to break things and neo+ eldricht seems to be broken as ****!
A way too wide hate, and a permanent one.
No thanks, cp is way too powerful for modern.
Good new, in reality we never have any problem to draw the entire deck and i will explain why.
And for those who don't understand what i'm talking about, i will re-explain how the whole deck is working and that will be the base for a primer (this deck needs one)
DredgeBrand'z (AKA DBZ) is a deck using the interactions between griselbrandgoryo's vengeanceand the dredge ability.
Using the dredge as a tutor engine:
It got multiple layers of interactions, the first one being to use a dredge engine to bin griselbrand into the graveyard much more constantly than any other deck, in combination with secrets of the mausoleum which makes good use of the dredge too to catch [card]goryo's vengeance[/card, the deck is really able to reanimate griselbrand in a constant manner and fast too.
Basically, if you have mausoleum, goryo's vengeance or the one copy of footstep of the goryo in hand, the only thing you have to do i dredge until griselbrand hit the yard, easy no?
But you will ask me why do we want grisel on the battlefield if we're not playing shoals like the other versions? Well the funnier part is coming!
Using the dredge and golgari brownscale as a combo engine:
We are now in a state where griselbrand is into play, and we have some dredgers in the graveyard, it's time to draw! We pay 7 life then draw, but each draw will be replaced by a dredge, we have two goals to achieve, either we chain the dredgers, either we dredge a phantasmagoriansometime none of the two options will be realized but it's for another topic as it's somewhat rare.
The main engine here isgolgari brownscale, the more you dredge, the more cards will be in your grave, phantasmagorian or golgari brownscale, and if you dredge a brownscale, when you resolve it's ability, you will have payed 7 life, but will regain 2 by brownscale you dredged.
You will then be able to discard the brownscales and other dredgers with the phantasmagorian ability you just dredged, and you will do that again in response to the phantasmagorian ability in the stack.
During the process, we will probably dredge emrakul, no problem we continue to dredge and discard with phantasmagorian in response to it's ability. (keeping in mind the rakul ability, it will come handy
Using golgary brownscale , griselbrand , phantasmagorian and blighsteel colossusto go infinite!
Ultimately (i swear!) you will find yourself with this gamestate:
Griselbrand in play, we have 2 Blightsteel colossus in library, 4 Golgari brownscale 1 dakmore salvage and 1 phantasmagorian in graveyard, and 1 phantasmagorian in hand.
I pay 7 for a draw 7, i dredge the 4 golgari brownscale and the dakmore salvage, then draw 2 the 2 blighsteel colossus
I then gain 8 life with brownscale, i use phantasmagorian's ability, discarding 4 brownscale 1 dakmore salvage and the phantasmagorian in hand, i resolve the ability phantasmagorian return in hand. (still the first one is now in the grave)
I then have 2 blightsteel colossus and phantasmagorian in hand, i use the ability of phantasmagorian again discarding the two blightseel and phantasmagorian, the blightsteels colossus are shuffled in library, i resolve, phantasmagorian is back in hand.
we then are back to the Initial state except we now have one more life.
The loop have been demonstrated, you just have to say you're doing this 1 million times, and we go now to the emrakul trigger, you forgot it?
Calculate and draw your library!
The main point here is to, by resolving emrakul ability, create a 7 multiple to be able to draw our entire library without randomness, we don't like random.
Actually, the best way to picture the number of cards you will have in your library is to count the cards in your library+ the cards in your graveyard, and to consider the cards you discard with phantasmagorian as +3 cards in your future library and any card leaving your grave as -1 card in your future library.
The two "tricks" are, discard gorian for gorian+2 other cards +2 cards in library, and the second trick is discards 3 and in response to the ability discard gorian +2 other cards, it's doing a +5 cards in future library.
I will ask you to trust me on this one, we did the math and we are able with two phantasmagorian to do:
+2 cards in future library / 3 cards in hand minimum
+4 cards in future library / 5
cards in hand minimum
+5 cards in future library / 6 cards in hand minimum
+6 cards in future library / 7 cards in hand minimum
+7 cards in future library / 8 cards in hand minimum
+8 cards in future library / 9 cards in hand minimum
+9 cards in future library / 10 cards in hand minimum
+10 cards in future library / 11 cards in hand minimum
Ok so now for the persons already aware of the deck, do you see that? In fasct the initial phase of comboing will ALWAYS get us to have more than 11 cards in hand, and here the +8 cards in grave can replace our inability to do a +1, as the +10 cards can replace the +3, in short:
as long as we have 11 cards in hand at this point (read = always) of the game, we can do a multiple of 7 only with phantasmagorian
It's making the biggest problem disappear !
Still lightning storm is the "easy kill" i's say for me it's more like the "nobrain" kill (not insulting, it can be really useful to just say "i kill you" without thinking more) but it's suboptimal and plunge is a way better kill in term of utility out of combo.
I'm still tweeking the list, not stable enough for me, ideally the deck shouldn't "fizzle" in goldfish mode more than 10% of the time, actually we're between 15 and 20% i guess (i consider "fizzle" the fact to combo off after t5 or to not combo at all)
And btw good news for DBZ KCI got the banhammer, actually i think that the decks are REALLY similar, they have nearly the same speed and fear the same things, so basically the gravehate will be less prevalent sooo good thing!
If possible would you recreate the topic "DredgeBrand'Z" in the same time?
thanks in advance!
Thanks in advance
I'm thinking of cutting the SSG for more stability, they're not providing such acceleration considering our line of play is generally either faithless T1 ==> goryo t2 OR discard t2 ==> goryo t3 we need 3 lands so, maybe i will cut them.
So the deck just gain infinite life and the hand of your choice (either instant speed with goryo's vengeance, or sorcery with footsteps of the goryo) generally something like goryo x3 faithless looting griselbrand land land, or emrakul if you want to kill with an emrakul alpha strike.
You then wait a turn, reanimate grisel EOT, and use gutshot infinitely during the cleanup step.
Hehe yep that's the point, actually i did not test the deck in a tournament, so i don't know if the instant kill is necessary. But there is two problems, the first and biggest one, you sacrifice griselbrand at the end step. The second, not really a problem but still, we will not cut the noxious because they are "reanimation spell tutor" in this shell.
For the second question nope not played in a tournament, but i will, i bought all the deck (if that can be a proof of my faith in the combo haha) so i will soon play it during a tournament.
I must say that if i had to forfeit the instant speed part, i would go more to a version going infinite mana with pyretic ritual (you can replay it 4 time with noxious, then pay R to discard emrakul and go infinite like that) and cast blightsteel x2 and emrakul for an alpha strike (wich is, cute i'd say