I expected to face a lot of aggro matchups such as Human, Affinity, Mardu Midrange and stuff, that´s why i´ve decided to cut Gearhulk for a second Snapcaster, added a second Ugin and a second O-Stone.
All in all I was pretty happy with the list above, thinking about how good all is dust could be instead of a second stone.
Sadly, G3 of the last match was not winable, he was on the go and had 8 mana in turn 4 for double scapeshift cast.., so sad to lose against nutdraw, especially bc I had summary dismissal in hand, just one mana short because I was on the draw.
All in all I am happy with the result and with the changes I made to my previous lists (will post my list on monday, bc I will play Standard Mainevent tomorrow as well).
I actually replaced the 2nd Ugin with the Bridge in my "mental construction" of this list. I thought tutoring Ugin into play is possible, and when adding Emrakul, the cheat becomes important for most of times, you can have 8 mana but 15 is still a way to go (and to survive).
Well, I like the approach in general and if it works for you, stick with it!
But what I was thinking about is, if Trophy Mageis really worth it, especially mainboard. In G1 it can only tutor O-Stone so it can be a dead draw really, really fast. The first option would be putting him SB and boarding him along with the other 3cmc artifacts you put in.
The second option would be replacing him with a fabricate, which also improves tutoring all other artifacts - I don´t think the 2/2 body is that important in your specific list with Hangarback walker and stuff.
You are right, there is a variance with Gemstone Caverns - but there is even a variance in 4-offs! I personally am happy enough to have 2 in my 60 after boarding (when on the draw ofc.) sometimes you hit, sometimes you don´t. The worst thing that can happen is that you either have a colorless source or have a discard target for Thirst for Knowledge.
Since I have 2 Ugin, the Spirit Dragon Main, there is no need for more sweepers tbh. At least not what I´ve experienced over the last weeks whilst testing it. Another E.E. is debateable - but I would rather cut something else if really needed.
I have now tested the exact same list i´ve mentioned in #13454 for the complete last week, did 3 competitive leagues online and one 80 man tourney offline. It really did AMAZING.
I´ve finished:
Online:
4-1
vs UR Storm 2-0
vs Nahiri bring to light 0-2
vs Burn 2-0
vs Skek Red 2-0
vs Grixis Ctrl 2-0
4-1
vs Burn 2-0
vs Jeskai Tempo 2-0
vs Burn 0-2
vs Thopter Foundry 2-0
vs UW Ctrl 2-0
4-1
vs UR Storm 2-1
vs UR Delver 2-1
vs Mono W DnT 0-2
vs Goblins 2-1
vs Griselshoal 2-0
Offline: ~80 Players, finished 16th
4-2
vs Combo Elves 2-0
vs E-Tron 1-2
vs Jeskai Tempo 2-1
vs Jund 2-0
vs UW Ctrl 2-0
vs Vizier Company 0-2
I really have no Idea when I was satisfied with my list like that in the past. Sure - SB is depending on the meta, but for me it feels like the mainboard split´s work really well. Even 2/2/2 Remand/Supreme/Dismember.
E: The only thing I am thinking about is to add a second chalice to the side, so a total count of 3 in my 75.
Wow, your 60 is, like 99% the same as mine, but I got back to my couple talismans. They've been really good with EE, blows up blood moons & other 3 drops, really good vs that Mono-Red Prison that's been running around.
And 2 of Dismember, Remand, Supreme Will, and Repeal is feeling great also. What's your opinion on this split?
Sounds good, even tho I thought we are not really on the same boat since you "hated" a lot against Gemstone Caverns. :-P
How does your Land/Talisman split looks like then?
I currently really enjoying the split, sometimes I personally think that it may be a bit to slow.. but that is very situational. I think it is at least debateable to do a 3 remand / 1 will split.
Is Spell Burst worth running? Every list i see posted does not play Spell Burst.
Was thinking of switching it for a Spell Snaresince it works well with Talisman of Dominance
Yes, i will try and get an Explosives if/when i can.
I figured Chalice is nice for the Trinket Mage package but yeah.
How many counters d you usually run? And i like having for example a spell snare after playing the Talisman. I was first thinking.of playing a Spell Pierce instead/or in addition to Spell Snare.
If i cut Spell Snare and Chalice it'll open up my mainboard a bit.
Maybe a Epiphany at the Drownyard and another Dismember?
I`m sorry. I did a mistake with the "," - I wanted to say that you could add another(!) chalice instead of Snare. Chalice is currently one of the best cards against certain matchups.
We usually run 7-9 counters Mainboard. Currently, I would add a Dismember as I said.
I´ve just started trying Epiphany online and starting to like it - but I´ve tested too less with it to make recommendations.
your list looks solid at first sight. Oboro, Palace in the Clouds is kinda "pricy" and is just adding the last percentage of flexibility, so it´s fine for the start I think.
For my personal feeling your counter count is a bit too high and you can probably cut the Spell Snare for another Dismember or Chalice of the void, just move it to SB.
Besides that, all the cards you have mentioned are suitable for a SB if it is right for your meta. My all time fav. for the SB is the good old Squelch.
On another note, am I the only one who feels like Mindslaver is "almost" too slow for the meta? I mean I resolved it (the combo) like 1 time in probably 45 matches. The land hate is really present, meaning after assembling I usually play something big and then "lands die". That and I usually win with [card »
sundering titan[/card] or Ugin before even putting Mindslaver on the table; that or I loose before. I mean, the possibility is there so I'm not going to remove it, but it feels like often Mindslaver is gonna be a simple turn-stealer, and the game will go on.
All that said, I used to play 2 Mindslaver MB, then switched to 1 MB 1 SB and now it's only 1 MB. This card is simply bad against all CoCo and other aggro decks or ones that quickly empty their hand.
Was just wondering what you guys felt about it. I am not thinking about statistical theorical argument here, simply about the feeling you get from the meta.
I can share your experience here regarding the online meta, I am currently playing a 1-main 1-sb splitof Mindslaver and I am currently testing a lot of things online for the next bigger tournament (>500ppl) in January like a second Ugin, Gearhulk and even Karn.
My FNM meta is perfect for slaver, a lot of mid-lategame Decks. I finished 3-1 last Friday and won 3 games with slaver..
@GrimDucky I am currently running 2 Dismember MB (mainly against E-Tron) and 2 Contortion SB.
But this brings us to my unanswered question from earlier this week, What are the big benefits of gemstone cavern when we hit them on the draw.
I am new to this deck i havnt any expirience about them.
with 3 or 4 dismember urborg could be an option? maybe?
Hitting those Gemstones on the draw really helps against aggro, at least in my experience.
Exactly.
Quick example: Chalice, any Land, Gemstone Cavern against Burn on the draw. T1 Chalice instead of T2 can make a big difference here, kills at least 16 Cards out of a regular RW version and you avoid a potential 9dmg turn2. That is just one of many examples that can be made.
4 Condescend
1 Cyclonic Rift
3 Remand
3 Repeal
4 Thirst for Knowledge
2 Spatial Contortion
1 Supreme Will
Walker:
2 Ugin, the Spirit Dragon
Creatures:
2 Snapcaster Mage
1 Treasure Mage
1 Solemn Simulacrum
1 Platinum Angel
1 Wurmcoil Engine
1 Walking Ballista
1 Chalice of the Void
4 Expedition Map
2 Mindslaver
2 Oblivion Stone
Lands:
1 Academy Ruins
1 Field of Ruin
1 Gemstone Caverns
1 Tolaria West
1 River of Tears
7 Island
4 Urza's Mine
4 Urza's Power Plant
4 Urza's Tower
2 Chalice of the Void
1 Wurmcoil Engine
1 Sundering Titan
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Spreading Seas
1 Relic of Progenitus
2 Dismember
2 Summary Dismissal
1 Ratchet Bomb
1 Engineered Explosives
I expected to face a lot of aggro matchups such as Human, Affinity, Mardu Midrange and stuff, that´s why i´ve decided to cut Gearhulk for a second Snapcaster, added a second Ugin and a second O-Stone.
All in all I was pretty happy with the list above, thinking about how good all is dust could be instead of a second stone.
BR
Max
today was a blast. I went 6-4 even with some very bad MU's, close to go 7-3 and top64.
R1: Bye 1-0
R2: BW Eldrazi Taxes 1:2; 1-1
R3: UW Geist 2:0; 2-1
R4: Affinity 2:1; 3-1
R5: Vizier Combo 2:0; 4-1
R6: DnT 1:2; 4-2
R7: Scapeshift 2:1; 5-2
R8: Humans 0:2; 5-3
R9: Nahiri Combo 2:1; 6-3
R10: Scapeshift 1:2; 6-4
Sadly, G3 of the last match was not winable, he was on the go and had 8 mana in turn 4 for double scapeshift cast.., so sad to lose against nutdraw, especially bc I had summary dismissal in hand, just one mana short because I was on the draw.
All in all I am happy with the result and with the changes I made to my previous lists (will post my list on monday, bc I will play Standard Mainevent tomorrow as well).
Greets,
Max
Played trials today, finished 3-0-1 and now heading with one bye into the 500 man mainevent tomorrow.
Played as follows:
2-0 Eldrazi Taxes
2-0 Nahiri Combo
1-1 UW Ctrl
2-0 Burn
Now looking forward to play 9 Rounds tomrrow. Decklist and MU from tomorrow will follow.
Greets
Max
Well, I like the approach in general and if it works for you, stick with it!
But what I was thinking about is, if Trophy Mageis really worth it, especially mainboard. In G1 it can only tutor O-Stone so it can be a dead draw really, really fast. The first option would be putting him SB and boarding him along with the other 3cmc artifacts you put in.
The second option would be replacing him with a fabricate, which also improves tutoring all other artifacts - I don´t think the 2/2 body is that important in your specific list with Hangarback walker and stuff.
What do you think?
BR
Max
Since I have 2 Ugin, the Spirit Dragon Main, there is no need for more sweepers tbh. At least not what I´ve experienced over the last weeks whilst testing it. Another E.E. is debateable - but I would rather cut something else if really needed.
I have now tested the exact same list i´ve mentioned in #13454 for the complete last week, did 3 competitive leagues online and one 80 man tourney offline. It really did AMAZING.
I´ve finished:
Online:
4-1
vs UR Storm 2-0
vs Nahiri bring to light 0-2
vs Burn 2-0
vs Skek Red 2-0
vs Grixis Ctrl 2-0
4-1
vs Burn 2-0
vs Jeskai Tempo 2-0
vs Burn 0-2
vs Thopter Foundry 2-0
vs UW Ctrl 2-0
4-1
vs UR Storm 2-1
vs UR Delver 2-1
vs Mono W DnT 0-2
vs Goblins 2-1
vs Griselshoal 2-0
Offline: ~80 Players, finished 16th
4-2
vs Combo Elves 2-0
vs E-Tron 1-2
vs Jeskai Tempo 2-1
vs Jund 2-0
vs UW Ctrl 2-0
vs Vizier Company 0-2
I really have no Idea when I was satisfied with my list like that in the past. Sure - SB is depending on the meta, but for me it feels like the mainboard split´s work really well. Even 2/2/2 Remand/Supreme/Dismember.
E: The only thing I am thinking about is to add a second chalice to the side, so a total count of 3 in my 75.
Greets
Max
Sounds good, even tho I thought we are not really on the same boat since you "hated" a lot against Gemstone Caverns. :-P
How does your Land/Talisman split looks like then?
I currently really enjoying the split, sometimes I personally think that it may be a bit to slow.. but that is very situational. I think it is at least debateable to do a 3 remand / 1 will split.
Spell burst is a really good spell - I normally play it in my 75 all the time, but currently I just don´t feel that I have enough space for it sadly.
BTW.: I just did a 4-1 finish @competitive league with the deck I´ve mentioned above. Matchups were:
vs UR Storm 2-0
vs Nahiri bring to light 0-2
vs Burn 2-0
vs Skek Red 2-0
vs Grixis Ctrl 2-0
Made a good 45€ + on that one
One will be on Sunday with around 80-100 Modern players and I will go with the following list:
4 Condescend
1 Cyclonic Rift
2 Remand
2 Repeal
4 Thirst for Knowledge
2 Dismember
2 Supreme Will
Walker:
2 Ugin, the Spirit Dragon
Creatures:
1 Snapcaster Mage
1 Treasure Mage
1 Trinket Mage
1 Solemn Simulacrum
1 Platinum Angel
1 Sundering Titan
2 Wurmcoil Engine
1 Walking Ballista
1 Chalice of the Void
1 Engineered Explosives
4 Expedition Map
1 Mindslaver
1 Oblivion Stone
Lands:
1 Academy Ruins
1 Field of Ruin
1 Gemstone Caverns
1 Tolaria West
1 River of Tears
7 Island
4 Urza's Mine
4 Urza's Power Plant
4 Urza's Tower
1 Chalice of the Void
1 Mindslaver
1 Pithing Needle
2 Surgical Extraction
2 Squelch
1 Relic of Progenitus
1 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Dismember
1 Spatial Contortion
2 Summary Dismissal
1 Jester's Cap
1 Gemstone Caverns
Any comments are highly appreciated.
BR
Max
I`m sorry. I did a mistake with the "," - I wanted to say that you could add another(!) chalice instead of Snare. Chalice is currently one of the best cards against certain matchups.
We usually run 7-9 counters Mainboard. Currently, I would add a Dismember as I said.
I´ve just started trying Epiphany online and starting to like it - but I´ve tested too less with it to make recommendations.
Greets
Max
your list looks solid at first sight. Oboro, Palace in the Clouds is kinda "pricy" and is just adding the last percentage of flexibility, so it´s fine for the start I think.
What I would go next is def. Engineered Explosives, you can replace it with Ratchet Bomb on a budget.
For my personal feeling your counter count is a bit too high and you can probably cut the Spell Snare for another Dismember or Chalice of the void, just move it to SB.
Besides that, all the cards you have mentioned are suitable for a SB if it is right for your meta. My all time fav. for the SB is the good old Squelch.
BR
Max
I can share your experience here regarding the online meta, I am currently playing a 1-main 1-sb splitof Mindslaver and I am currently testing a lot of things online for the next bigger tournament (>500ppl) in January like a second Ugin, Gearhulk and even Karn.
My FNM meta is perfect for slaver, a lot of mid-lategame Decks. I finished 3-1 last Friday and won 3 games with slaver..
@GrimDucky I am currently running 2 Dismember MB (mainly against E-Tron) and 2 Contortion SB.
Greets
Max
When talking about Mindslaver.. I´d just wanted to show you what arrived today from Volkan Baga himself:
Exactly.
Quick example: Chalice, any Land, Gemstone Cavern against Burn on the draw. T1 Chalice instead of T2 can make a big difference here, kills at least 16 Cards out of a regular RW version and you avoid a potential 9dmg turn2. That is just one of many examples that can be made.
Max