MTG Salvation

Quote from Cranial_extraction »

Quote from Sheldon »

Possibility Storm.

I don't agree with the RC much, but this is the best possible answer. Along with Knowledge Pool. Assuming no one is running either in tandem with Teferi.

I'm actually experimenting with both cards at the moment to see how well they are received. Knowledge Pool is a card I'm unsure about for the same reason I've never played with Confusion in the Ranks yet. I believe it likely leads to situations where players cast a few inconsequential spells to get all of the gravy out of the Pool and then leave everyone to durdle around because their hands are full of expensive bombs that can only be exchanged for chaff. I'm not sure discouraging players from casting their sweet cards creates better games of Magic.

As far as Possibility Storm is concerned, I'm much more warm about it. Regardless of what is in someone's hand, they can always hope to cascade into something amazing. A friend of mine is a bit less enthusiastic about the card though, complaining that it removes too much strategy from the game and turning the game into a crap shoot. I suspect that I will keep the card in regardless so long as enough other players enjoy it.

Bazaar Trader + Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker

Create a copy of a creature with Kiki-Jiki. Once you're finished using it, donate the copy away to another player. You are no longer the controller of the copy and therefore cannot sacrifice it. Also works with Feldon of the Third Path.

Quote from cryogen »

Quote from arrogantAxolotl »

I'm designing a deck whose sole purpose is to create the most interesting and entertaining games of Commander possible. While I'm certain that everyone here will have a different definition of fun, I would still like to know which cards led to some of the greatest games of Commander of all time. Please share any stories you have regarding how much fun you've had because of your opponents' cards.

Based on comments made by various users in different threads similar to this one, I think "fun for my opponents" would be effects that affect your opponents but don't actually take the strategy and gameplay from them. Also, game states which are.confusing or hard to resolve are fine in moderation but not as a game plan.

The Maelstrom Wanderer deck in my sig is my attempt at a fun chaos deck, although I haven't played it in over a year.

Would you be able to provide me with any links to previous threads? I did a brief search already, but I wasn't able to turn up anything useful.

I'm designing a deck whose sole purpose is to create the most interesting and entertaining games of Commander possible. While I'm certain that everyone here will have a different definition of fun, I would still like to know which cards led to some of the greatest games of Commander of all time. Please share any stories you have regarding how much fun you've had because of your opponents' cards.

Blessed Reincarnation and Illusory Gains for my Zedruu the Greathearted deck. I haven't had many opportunities to play with the Reincarnation yet, but Illusory Gains has been phenomenal for me, allowing me to redistribute ownership of various creatures that enter the battlefield.

Blessed Reincarnation - I've always wanted to cast Polymorph, but it always had too many strikes against it. It's sorcery speed. It destroys the target rather than exiles it. I also have to make a decision regarding whether or not I want to polymorph my own creature or an opponent's creature, when I really just want to polymorph everything. The reincarnation solves all of these problematic aspects.

Illusory Gains - Often times, when my opponents play creature cards, I want to meddle with them. That usually involves stealing them and then donating them away to somebody less fortunate (or more fortunate depending on your perspective) while doing my best Robin Hood impression. This enchantment facilitates that strategy handily by providing me with a permanent that generates that opportunity perpetually.

I never build decks to guarantee an inevitable victory.

My goal in Commander is to use my cards in conjunction with my opponents' cards in order to create the most interesting and entertaining game of Magic possible. This objective impacts both the cards I choose to put into my decks as well as how I choose to play those cards. Whenever I construct a deck, I never want to deny my opponents the ability to win the game. I value the relationships that I foster with the individuals I play with more than the prospect of winning. I end up with a lot of silver medals.

Thanks for the insight.

I thought I'd chime in again after rereading your post. I'm a bit confused at to exactly how you recycle the Dissipation Field combo once you've killed a player with it. If you donate the Dissipation Field to a player and then kill them for whatever reason, the Field is going to end up in your exile because it was under their control when they lost the game. I suppose this isn't really a concern if you control a Venser, the Sojourner since you can blink Dissipation Field before the last point of damage is dealt. Mirror of Fate could also pull Dissipation Field out of exile to recycle the combo.

EDIT: Regarding mana rocks, if you happen to be interested in including any more of them, I would suggest Fellwar Stone to you. I don't know what the typical size of your multiplayer games are, but I tend to play with four players frequently. With four players, I always have access to at least two colors and frequently have access to all three.

Interestingly enough, I'm intending on creating a Dragon deck very similar in nature to your own. I'm not particularly interested in having a Commander at the helm that cares about Dragons, but I still want the deck to be centered around them. It intends to "play big dudes and kill someone" just like your own.

When I began to look at the cards that I wanted to include, I quickly realized that both red and green were essential to the deck and could not be removed. With that aside, I then began looking at each of the other three colors to see how much weight they pulled. While I have not currently decided which combination of colors I'll be using yet, here is what I value in blue:

Call to the Kindred - If I can enchant a dragon with this card, it probably means playing more dragons for free! It is also one of the few auras I had anywhere on my list.

Gravitational Shift - A card you've already mentioned. All of my Dragons happen to fly, so cards that play well with fliers are an important subtheme I looked into. This happened to be the best among cards in that subtheme.

Temur Ascendancy - A goodstuff card of sorts. Dragons happen to almost always be creatures that enable Ferocious. This card helps to ensure that you don't run out of gas while simultaneously ensuring that your dragons have a huge impact the turn you play them. Granting your mana dorks haste is nothing to scoff at either.

Sarkhan Unbroken - While I'm unsure just how good this guy is, he's pretty darn cool. If you ever happen to activate his ultimate ability, it will be pretty hard to not win the game.

Rush of Knowledge - Dragons are expensive permanents.

Stormtide Leviathan - While he isn't a dragon himself, his Moat ability protects you while still allowing your dragons to crash in the air.

Soul of Ravnica - This may seem like a strange card to list here. Although he is also not a dragon and will not benefit from cards that exclusively benefit from dragons, he will benefit from most of the same cards that benefit cards with dragon-like qualities. He's big, flies, and cares about multicolored cards (many dragons happen to be multicolor). Almost certainly much more significant in five color dragons than in three.

Multicolor Blue Dragons - There are more than a few multicolor blue dragons. Although you could more than easily design an entire deck full of nothing but red dragons, adding a third color allows you a greater variety of dragons to choose from.

If none of these listed cards have much appeal to you, perhaps opting out of blue would be a favorable decision.

Yea, I've come to the conclusion that the type of cards I'm interested in donating are so oddly specific that almost no cards meet my criteria. The closest match I've stumbled across thus far is Contagion Engine, but that card has little to no synergy with the rest of my deck so I decided not to include it. Humble Defector is the shining example of nearly everything I want in creature form, but few other creature cards can meet that standard.

Something interesting I've realized during my journey to create the most entertaining games of Commander possible is that I am actually able to craft a better experience for everyone by raising the general power level of my deck. At first I was operating on a much lower level than my opponents. When I made my best effort to exert some kind of influence in the game, I was restricted by my ability to generate enough mana, cards, or other such resources necessary to create the fun gamestates that I desired. After recently including a few goodstuffy cards that I previously shied away from, I noticed how much more effective I had become at my goal.

Perhaps the greatest advantage I gathered from that adventure though was that because I resisted everyone's advances so little, players never perceive me as a threat anymore. As such, I was able to reconstruct my deck, removing all of the defensive cards that many other Zedruu decks pile on like Ghostly Prison. Aside from a few inclusions such as Wall of Denial, your deck seems to be constructed similarly. On another note, I am a bit surprised at how few mana rocks you've opted to include. With all of the cards you're drawing, I'd imagine that you often have a full grip and an empty coffer.

Hey there!

Just wanted to chime in and offer you my thanks for creating such an exquisite deck and an opening post to match it. I'm constantly searching for ways to improve upon my own Zedruu deck and your thread has inspired me to reexamine several cards that I previously glossed over. It is refreshing to find another player who is more interested in telling a story with his or her deck rather than simply taking the quickest route to victory.

Quote from krichaiushii »

What about Well of Ideas? Zedruu and whomever gets it will draw two off of it, all others one.

This card has been suggested to me before by other players. While it does have exactly what I'm looking for in a card, it just doesn't tickle my fancy. I suppose this is because donating the Well away to somebody else still doesn't feel consequential. The only thing that happens differently is that one other person will be drawing an extra card each turn.

Quote from The_Return_of_Skullfer »

My angle on Zedruu is chaos. A lot of people think it's a lot of fun, but just as many hate that they have such little control over the game (usually control and combo players). So it's not for everyone.

I enjoy chaos cards to some extent. I believe games of Magic are most fun when players have the opportunity to interact with one another. Commander is just a medium in which players can interact with one another in novel ways. Some chaos cards facilitate this by creating interesting gamestates that would otherwise never occur in an ordinary game of Magic, but many chaos cards deny players the ability to interact by denying players the ability to make meaningful decisions.

Quote from dreamsequencer »

I have won games off donating artifacts - Gilded Lotus or Trailblazer's Boots come to mind. Isperia, Supreme Judge is a good one as well, especially if you have Consecrated Sphinx out. Some helpful things that stay on your side of the table are Boldwyr Heavyweights (everyone loves free creatures!) or Nin, the Pain Artist (ping their creatures without killing 'em), and Swans of Bryn Argoll.

Gilded Lotus - I actually already play with this card. The amount of mana it provides for the cost is fantastic, especially since my deck lacks green. I would almost never donate this card to someone else though. Although I am interested in assisting other players, I still need enough mana to reliably engage with my opponents throughout the game. If I was interested in donating a mana source to my opponent, it would be a land instead.

Trailblazer's Boots - This is an interesting card to consider to me. I suppose I could use it for its own merits if I wanted to instead of donating it? I don't feel particularly attracted to it. If I wanted to use a piece of equip, I would probably opt for Sword of Feast and Famine, which would assist in my mana production as well as grant protection from colors irrelevant to me provided that I donate it to someone at a later point. The only piece of equipment I currently use is Assault Suit.

Isperia, Supreme Judge - This effect would do almost nothing for me. Most players rarely perceive me as a threat (and they're probably right) so they focus their attentions towards one another. As a result, I almost always get second place. I recently removed Illusionist's Gambit from my deck for the same reason. Isperia is also fragile, considering that she is a creature with low toughness for a card that costs six.

Consecrated Sphinx - Not a card I would ever play. Too degenerate

Boldwyr Heavyweights - I've been too scurred to play with this card because I've always believed it would come back to bite me in the ass. I'll give him a try and see if I like him for a while. I don't expect the Heavyweights to be a permanent addition, although I would like to be pleasantly surprised.

Nin, the Pain Artist - Not a fan. If I wanted to find a way to give extra cards to my opponent, it wouldn't be on a squishy 1/1 creature that requires me to invest gobs of mana into using it.

Swans of Bryn Argoll - I'm not sure what to think of this card. I will consider it.

Quote from GodoftheGrove »

Donating Azor's Elocutors can be fun, and probably will be even more fun with an Assault Suit. Much like Contested Warzone. Then there is Humble Defector. Then there are some cantripping aura's like Flight of Fancy. If that does anything to help your opponents depends on what you target, but at least it'll draw you some cards right away!

Azor's Elocutors - I don't think this works the way you think it does. Assault Suit is also an upkeep trigger, so if I attached the Elocutors with the Suit and passed it around, by the time an opponent received it during his or her turn it would be too late to gain a filibuster counter.

Contested War Zone, Humble Defector - I already play with both of these cards and they are among my favorites in my deck.

Flight of Fancy - This is the type of card I'm not interested in donating to an opponent because it doesn't actively do anything for them! It is irrelevant who controls the enchantment. I'm interested in donating cards that actually provide some kind of tangible use.

Quote from Forgotten One »

Any card that says "draw a card" on it, but your non-creature options are limited. Tsabo's Web or Eternity Snare might be what you are looking for.

You can also donate some of the Theros gods like Keranos, God of Storms or Heliod, God of the Sun. Since they are Indestructible they are much less likely to get killed, but there is a good chance that your opponents won't have Devotion to the proper colors to ever turn them into creatures.

Tsabo's Web, Eternity Snare - Although each of these cards do something for me when they enter the battlefield (which is great!), neither card does anything of consequence when I donate them away to somebody else. I'm afraid that the latter is usually more important to me than the former.

Theros Gods - Although it may be a bit hypocritical of me to say this, I've never been particularly fond of the Theros Gods due to their resiliency. I believe Magic games are at their best when players have the opportunity to interact with one another's cards. Mechanics like Indestructible tend to take away opportunities for players to interact with one another rather than provide them. That aside, this seems like a fair suggestion. I'm going to test the waters with Thassa, God of the Sea.

Quote from Hermes_ »

Akroan Horse gives everyone a token but the person who controls it, I made a zed deck..part group hug/part pillow fort thing

Akroan Horse - I used to play with this card. I liked that it self-donated, but I found out over a series of games that the card just caused attacking to be a chore for any player. The player with the Horse doesn't want it and is prone to sacrifice it, but nobody else wants to remove it because it is providing them with free Soldiers. Therefore, the players with Soldiers feel encouraged to attack the other non-Horse players, but that becomes difficult due to the fact that the Horse is providing a free chump blocker for them every turn. Also, my Ruhan has destroyed my own Horse on more than one occasion.

Quote from schweinefett »

i'd steer away from creatures as much as possible unless they are genuinely useful, since most people would have sac outlets to get rid of them just before your extra draws.

in terms of genuinely useful things, im struggling to think of things that cant end up biting you back. The Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale ?

I'm actually ok with giving away cards that can bite me back. More often than not, players do not perceive me as a threat and choose not to attack me for strategic reasons or are thankful for their gifts and choose not to attack me for political reasons. Provided that the donated card is actually a creature, I can always activate a Homeward Path to return the creature back under my control if things happen to go sour.

Quote from Zygous »

Spine of Ish Shah seems perfect.

There are a few enchantments with WTB effects. Oblivion Ring, Detention Sphere, Act of Authority.

You could try curses. Curse of Echoes Auras in general seem good, especially stuff like Faith's Fetters and Arrest the only problem being they do die if someone wipes the board.

Spine of Ish Sah, Oblivion Ring, Detention Sphere, Curse of Echoes, Faith's Fetters, Arrest - I am not interested in donating any of these cards. Although each card does provide me with some kind of effect I can benefit from before giving away, the recipient of any of these types of cards doesn't matter. When I donate a card to somebody, I want that player to be able to do something substantial with my donation and not just let it linger around for me to draw extra cards from. While I generally want to donate resilient cards that provide me with some kind of benefit before being given away, it is more important for me to give away a card that my opponent can actually use.

Act of Authority - Unlike the cards mentioned above, my opponents can in fact use this. I already play with this card and it is phenomenal. I love the value it provides as well as the fact that it self-donates.

Quote from Dunharrow »

I just built my Zedruu. I found a fun interaction with Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker. Make a copy of a good creature, give it away, then you can't sac it. I last started giving away Rhox Faithmender, and had a good time.

Palisade Giant might be good.

Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker - Giving away the tokens sounds like a splendid idea! I get to utilize the card in both ability and in combat. I also don't lose anything by giving the token away, since it would typically be sacrificed anyways. My biggest concern is that my opponents may perceive me as too great a threat if I am allowed to untap with this fellow in play due to how powerful he is. That aside, I love this idea. Are there any other cards that provide similar circumstances to the one just described? Obviously Splinter Twin, but is there perhaps something else? It would probably have to create some kind of token that would typically be sacrificed at the end of turn. Minion Reflector maybe? I'll look into this.

EDIT: It looks like neither Splinter Twin nor Minion Reflector will work due to the way that they are worded. I'll have to cook up something else.

Palisade Giant - I like that this protects me in some fashion and that I could donate it away as an irritating combat trick, but I'm afraid this card wouldn't do much for me on its own, as players tend to never aim for me. Still, I may give this a look.

Hey folks! I'm looking for some suggestions.

I currently use Zedruu the Greathearted as my Commander. Most of the Zedruu decks I've found over the Internet tend to either donate cards that are toxic to their controller like Pyromancer's Swath or tend to donate cards that don't care who controls them like Howling Mine. I am not interested in donating those types of cards to my opponents. When I play Commander, my goal is to create the most interesting game of Magic possible and to maximize the amount of fun for each player at the table. As such, I enjoy donating cards to my opponents that assist them, rather than harm them. Unfortunately, these cards are often disposed of easily, especially if they are creatures, causing me to be unable to draw many cards off of Zedruu. Because of this, I tend to donate lands often, but that isn't particularly interesting. Would anyone be able to recommend interesting cards to donate that don't hinder my opponent? The ideal candidate is a card that is resilient, but also provides me with some sort of tangible benefit like an enters the battlefield trigger that I can utilize before giving the card away to somebody else.

Thanks for the quick response!

Comet Storm is indeed the type of card I'm looking for, but dang is that sucker expensive! 3RR for Searing Spear? Ugh. I would have to have an absolute absurd amount of mana to make that card reasonable. I may give it a try though.

Cylconic Rift is definitely the type of card I'm trying to avoid. Disperse is an innocent enough card, but overloading it just causes it to return fifty mana worth of opposing permanents back to their owner's hands without discrimination. Wash Out may work, but I'm still concerned about how well it would interact given a number of multicolored permanents in play.