Any recent news on Saskia? I just finished building Bruse//Reyhan as my first DC deck right before the ban announcement, interested in switching to Saskia. Are the lists substantially different? What are the major play differences?
I'm really wishing I would've taken this deck to the GP in Vegas right now. Against the field I'm seeing of all grixis shadow and eldrazi Tron it seems real strong.
I don't know if both are needed, but I like having at least one. The deck has a lot of threats, but only [[Reality Smasher]] has any kind of evasion on its own. I like the swords as as easy way to give some of the creatures that could otherwise be a worse late game draw an upgrade. [[Sword of Feast and Famine]] in particular can be a win untapping the lands we have.
It may be enough there, but it's not enough here. This deck lacks anything like [[Condescend]], [[Thirst for Knowledge]], or [[Fabricate]] to help us find the land we need. Four maps is a must here.
The CotV isn't strong enough here against enough decks to go all in mainboard. You could go to three, but I don't think I'd run four. CotV is more of a tool than a prison piece here.
I think 3 karn and 2 ugin is to much, sure they are useful but I'd never want to see more than one of either; I see them as mostly expensive forms of removal or control.
I disagree. They're the finishers in this deck, the thing your opponent has to deal with once they've dealt with all your other threats. I love drawing multiples, because it pretty much guarantees the win. It lets you throw a Karn away just for the exile and a fog, because you know they can't deal with the second one in your hand. It's been the right number and split for me so far.
Any thoughts on defense grid? 7 possible cards you'd want to use on your turn but with the mana advantage the deck offers it can really slow the opponent down and almost blank their removal.
It seems relevant with Smasher, Swords, and against control. I don't know if that's worth a slot in the 75 though. It wouldn't really help with particularly weak matchups more than anything we already have. You could test it out though and let me know.
Just curious how this matches up against the other eldrazi decks.
No idea. I'd imagine it'd stomp against Eldrazi and Taxes, but Bant Eldrazi might be able to go bigger faster depending on hands. Haven't tested it against any Eldrazi decks though. Against Tron decks it plays out like a midrange deck that can go as big as them if the game draws out. We rely a lot on our early pressure and the inability of their sweepers or Ugin to save them from our threats (vs Green variants). Against Blue variants you're going to map for Cavern and smash them, their removal usually doesn't match up well here.
I'm still tweaking and playing the deck, though I have yet to put together a non-proxy version in paper. I've cut one [[Cavern of Souls]] for a second [[Wastes]], but otherwise my list remains the same. I tested [[All is Dust]] instead of [[Skysovereign, Consul Flagship]] , but I don't think it was actually better. I also might want to switch the number of [[Spatial Contortion]] and [[Warping Wail]] around, because Wail frequently feels like our best card against Infect and Combo decks. I feel like it's ~3-5 card changes away from being something I want in paper and would take to a major tournament. Current list for myself more than anyone else:
We can play around Path by never activating Inkmoth into white mana. When they are at 0 lands and plays a white source, we Ghost Quater it away, they float the white mana, we go to Beginning of Combat and their mana disappears, then we animate the Inkmoth.
Bloodmoon. Ugh.
Looks like a fun deck with potential. I'm gonna start testing it on Cockatrice.
Initial thoughts are, like other's mentioned, that the deck needs Inventor's Fair.
I also wonder if 23 lands are too much. I think around 19-20 should be fine.
Make sure you're being hyper specific if you do this in a tournament. You saying "go to combat" means that you're passing priority in your Beginning of Combat step and it's too late to activate nexus and also have it attack this turn.
Beginning of Attack*. Online you can go to combat, and you still have time to activate. In real life, it's impossible to actually go to combat unless you have a triggered ability at the start of combat. When you say "Go to combat" you're actually going to declare attacks unless your opponent stops you, which you correctly said means you can't activate before attacking after saying that.
Man... I don't think I can have fun with this deck online haha. In paper I could handwave my whole turn away, but online it just takes forever to play through the loops. It is a sweet deck though, I like it with just the one Inkmoth. Played two matches, didn't drop games in either first time on the deck. Good stuff man. I'll try to proxy it up and play paper with it so I can get more reps in and come up with some real feedback on the list.
Excluding everything else, your Arbor Elf should be Birds of Paradise if you don't have Utopia Sprawl. I had the same issue with Sprawl/Elf, I felt like I got blown out really hard by a Ghost Quarter on any of the first few turns. I wasn't really able to capitalize on the fast mana early enough to have snagged value before the LD.
I don't really like how dependent your list is on Iona/Elesh Norn. You have the same/more chance of drawing your huge dudes than you do of drawing Finks/EWit/Thragtusk. You definitely said up front that it's pretty all in on reanimation to win, but that's not a place I want to be in a format trying desperately to combat Dredge. I liked previous versions because they continue to get value with their midrange-y game and Angel of Serenity even through grave hate. With the density of midrange-y cards in this list you're only going to be on that gameplan if you happen to draw correctly, you can't really count on it.
That said, if it's working for you keep at it. I'd love to know you get through sideboard cards or people that combo faster than you/with interaction (like Scapeshift, Ad Naus, Storm, etc).
I like how quickly it can switch between playing control or beatdown. I've only tested ~8 matches so far online, with ~5 of them being against T1 decks. I lost one match to Through the Breach Titan, won the rest. I just swapped a Waste and 3 Ghost Quarter for the Cavern of Souls, but that could be wrong.
In general it assembles Tron much less consistently than really any of the other Tron variants, but it also cares about that much less. It can easily just play a ramp/Eldrazi game until it naturally gets to the late game. The most crucial thing so far has been holding on to Warping Wail/Spatial Contortion for the right moment (never snap it off on things that your creatures can already handle eventually), and making the right Chalice of the Void call. Figuring out when to go hard for Tron and when to be on the Eldrazi beatdown is also a thing.
Also still on the fence about Skysovereign, it should probably be an All is Dust or Sundering Titan, but it's been good often enough that I haven't cut it yet.
Does it feel like this deck has become more competitive with recent relevant cards added to it, or does it still feel pretty bad to take to a tournament? I haven't tried taking it anywhere since Twin was around, wasn't sure if it was worth updating.
MB:
-4 Isolated Chapel
-1 Thalia
-1 Wasteland Strangler
+4 Caves of Koilos
+1 Eldrazi Displacer
+1 Mangara of Corondor
SB:
-1 Relic of Progenitus
+1 Disenchant
The eldrazi switch followed after putting in corondor. Corondor was because I was expecting a lot of Nahiri and Lantern.
Losses were to Lantern (punted), and twice to Jund (I honestly don't know how to win this match-up).
Apologies in advance for any spelling/formatting, I'm on my phone.
I have the same problem, is almost impossible beat JUND
I used to face the same problem with Jund - couldn't seem to win at all. 1 thing I've learnt from this forum though is that Jund's manabase is really weak. ALWAYS attack their red source with GQ. They never have any basic mountains (at least so far for me). If you have an arbiter out when you GQ them on turn 3 or so, it really sets them back quite abit. They're stretched also trying to find the BB for Lili.
If you have Reality Smashers - bring them in they outclass all of Jund's creatures besides a fat Scooze, Finks are good vs Lili edict, and Burrenton Forge-Tender / Kor Firewalker will help protect your important creatures. Flickerwisp also helps to reset an Ooze.
I know all those things, but usually they're just able to kill my Leonin then all the rest of the things, as well as disrupt my hand and use Kommand to auto 2-1 (Vial + any creature but TK, Tidehollow + something else). I'm not playing Reality Smashers because I don't like having a 5 drop in the deck, but I could definitely see how they'd be good in the matchup (especially given TK feels like the best card there right now).
There's already a thread for a Gifts version here, not sure if they should be separate or not, but I'm posting here because I actually like the Gifts-less one most. Made some tweaks to the list on top8, this deck seemed well suited to combating an Eldrazi meta (and it has been so far in testing).
Currently testing this list, focuses more on counterspells/protecting the combo:
I don't know if both are needed, but I like having at least one. The deck has a lot of threats, but only [[Reality Smasher]] has any kind of evasion on its own. I like the swords as as easy way to give some of the creatures that could otherwise be a worse late game draw an upgrade. [[Sword of Feast and Famine]] in particular can be a win untapping the lands we have.
It may be enough there, but it's not enough here. This deck lacks anything like [[Condescend]], [[Thirst for Knowledge]], or [[Fabricate]] to help us find the land we need. Four maps is a must here.
They've been great. The ramp, the colorless mana through Blood Moon, and the cycle have all been worth it.
The CotV isn't strong enough here against enough decks to go all in mainboard. You could go to three, but I don't think I'd run four. CotV is more of a tool than a prison piece here.
I disagree. They're the finishers in this deck, the thing your opponent has to deal with once they've dealt with all your other threats. I love drawing multiples, because it pretty much guarantees the win. It lets you throw a Karn away just for the exile and a fog, because you know they can't deal with the second one in your hand. It's been the right number and split for me so far.
It seems relevant with Smasher, Swords, and against control. I don't know if that's worth a slot in the 75 though. It wouldn't really help with particularly weak matchups more than anything we already have. You could test it out though and let me know.
No idea. I'd imagine it'd stomp against Eldrazi and Taxes, but Bant Eldrazi might be able to go bigger faster depending on hands. Haven't tested it against any Eldrazi decks though. Against Tron decks it plays out like a midrange deck that can go as big as them if the game draws out. We rely a lot on our early pressure and the inability of their sweepers or Ugin to save them from our threats (vs Green variants). Against Blue variants you're going to map for Cavern and smash them, their removal usually doesn't match up well here.
I'm still tweaking and playing the deck, though I have yet to put together a non-proxy version in paper. I've cut one [[Cavern of Souls]] for a second [[Wastes]], but otherwise my list remains the same. I tested [[All is Dust]] instead of [[Skysovereign, Consul Flagship]] , but I don't think it was actually better. I also might want to switch the number of [[Spatial Contortion]] and [[Warping Wail]] around, because Wail frequently feels like our best card against Infect and Combo decks. I feel like it's ~3-5 card changes away from being something I want in paper and would take to a major tournament. Current list for myself more than anyone else:
2 Chalice of the Void
4 Expedition Map
3 Mind Stone
1 Skysovereign, Consul Flagship
1 Sword of Feast and Famine
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
3 Cavern of Souls
4 Eldrazi Temple
1 Ghost Quarter
4 Urza's Mine
4 Urza's Power Plant
4 Urza's Tower
2 Wastes
4 Reality Smasher
4 Thought-Knot Seer
2 Spellskite
3 Karn Liberated
2 Ugin, the Spirit Dragon
3 Spatial Contortion
2 Warping Wail
2 Chalice of the Void
4 Grafdigger's Cage
3 Phyrexian Revoker
2 Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger
2 Warping Wail
Beginning of Attack*. Online you can go to combat, and you still have time to activate. In real life, it's impossible to actually go to combat unless you have a triggered ability at the start of combat. When you say "Go to combat" you're actually going to declare attacks unless your opponent stops you, which you correctly said means you can't activate before attacking after saying that.
I don't really like how dependent your list is on Iona/Elesh Norn. You have the same/more chance of drawing your huge dudes than you do of drawing Finks/EWit/Thragtusk. You definitely said up front that it's pretty all in on reanimation to win, but that's not a place I want to be in a format trying desperately to combat Dredge. I liked previous versions because they continue to get value with their midrange-y game and Angel of Serenity even through grave hate. With the density of midrange-y cards in this list you're only going to be on that gameplan if you happen to draw correctly, you can't really count on it.
That said, if it's working for you keep at it. I'd love to know you get through sideboard cards or people that combo faster than you/with interaction (like Scapeshift, Ad Naus, Storm, etc).
2 Chalice of the Void
4 Expedition Map
3 Mind Stone
1 Skysovereign, Consul Flagship
1 Sword of Feast and Famine
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
4 Cavern of Souls
4 Eldrazi Temple
1 Ghost Quarter
4 Urza's Mine
4 Urza's Power Plant
4 Urza's Tower
1 Wastes
4 Reality Smasher
4 Thought-Knot Seer
2 Spellskite
3 Karn Liberated
2 Ugin, the Spirit Dragon
3 Spatial Contortion
2 Warping Wail
2 Chalice of the Void
4 Grafdigger's Cage
3 Phyrexian Revoker
2 Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger
2 Warping Wail
https://manastack.com/deck/modern-mud
I like how quickly it can switch between playing control or beatdown. I've only tested ~8 matches so far online, with ~5 of them being against T1 decks. I lost one match to Through the Breach Titan, won the rest. I just swapped a Waste and 3 Ghost Quarter for the Cavern of Souls, but that could be wrong.
In general it assembles Tron much less consistently than really any of the other Tron variants, but it also cares about that much less. It can easily just play a ramp/Eldrazi game until it naturally gets to the late game. The most crucial thing so far has been holding on to Warping Wail/Spatial Contortion for the right moment (never snap it off on things that your creatures can already handle eventually), and making the right Chalice of the Void call. Figuring out when to go hard for Tron and when to be on the Eldrazi beatdown is also a thing.
Also still on the fence about Skysovereign, it should probably be an All is Dust or Sundering Titan, but it's been good often enough that I haven't cut it yet.
I tested it out last night, feels really strong.
I know all those things, but usually they're just able to kill my Leonin then all the rest of the things, as well as disrupt my hand and use Kommand to auto 2-1 (Vial + any creature but TK, Tidehollow + something else). I'm not playing Reality Smashers because I don't like having a 5 drop in the deck, but I could definitely see how they'd be good in the matchup (especially given TK feels like the best card there right now).
I always valued Deathandcatmix's opinion when working on it before, so I just grabbed his list from here: http://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=12115&d=269483&f=MO
I swapped:
MB:
-4 Isolated Chapel
-1 Thalia
-1 Wasteland Strangler
+4 Caves of Koilos
+1 Eldrazi Displacer
+1 Mangara of Corondor
SB:
-1 Relic of Progenitus
+1 Disenchant
The eldrazi switch followed after putting in corondor. Corondor was because I was expecting a lot of Nahiri and Lantern.
Losses were to Lantern (punted), and twice to Jund (I honestly don't know how to win this match-up).
Apologies in advance for any spelling/formatting, I'm on my phone.
Currently testing this list, focuses more on counterspells/protecting the combo:
1 Blood Crypt
1 Mountain
1 Steam Vents
1 Swamp
1 Watery Grave
2 Darkslick Shores
2 Island
4 Blackcleave Cliffs
4 Polluted Delta
4 Scalding Tarn
Creatures:
3 Snapcaster Mage
2 Jace, Vryn's Prodigy
4 Obzedat, Ghost Council
2 Mana Leak
4 Thought Scour
2 Izzet Charm
4 Terminate
4 Goryo's Vengeance
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Rune Snag
2 Logic Knot
Sorceries:
4 Faithless Looting
3 Bitterblossom
1 Countersquall
1 Crumble to Dust
1 Dispel
3 Fulminator Mage
1 Izzet Staticaster
1 Rise/Fall
1 Slaughter Pact
1 Tribute to Hunger
2 Vandalblast