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Magic Market Index for June 8th, 2018
 
Ravnica: The Living Guildpact
 
Magic Market Index for June 1st, 2018
  • posted a message on Most turn 1 damage in a deck with no infinite combos
    A link to the document describing this was posted to /r/math, and a few people noticed that in the writeup, a spellweaver volute is trying to enchant allay very early on, but the allay wasn't in the graveyard. Allay was targeting a copy enchantment that was copying dual nature. Cowardice will bounce the copy enchantment, with allay on the stack. This triggers the dual nature, exiling all the other dual natures. We move on, leaving all these on the stack, but this also leaves the allay on the stack.

    Someone who has spent more time looking at this should see if this is actually a problem or not.

    If it is a problem, I think a simple counterspell will solve it, countering the allay that is under the triggers will put it into the graveyard where it belongs.
    Posted in: Magic General
  • posted a message on 2CH LR Historic; Feyd_Ruin and Mogg win! (440 points)

    4) nerdyjoe
    Karakas / Mangara of Corondor


    1) Convoy_Avenger
    Hangarback Walker / Rhys the Redeemed

    6-0 Hangerback can't self kill, so I eventually exile it safely. Rhys can make a spare token, but I get to pinch mana with karakas if he comes down early. Mangara takes Rhys first, then the hangerback, then the leftover token, and happily swings for 20. (I may be wrong if walker gets too big too fast, but I don't think so.)

    2) Feyd_Ruin :: Absurdity.dec
    Pyrite Spellbomb / Soldevi Digger
    2-2 I can swing with Mangara just fine. You pop spellbomb (at me) in my end step, put it back on top, redraw it, cast it, and we're back to where we were. But this trades 2 life for 1. I can target spellbomb at some point, but you can happily crack it, at which point I bounce mangara, and we make no progress. If you don't crack it, we both lose our win con. If I never tap mangara, if you ever crack spellbomb, I remove your recursion, and eventually win.

    3) Mogg
    Pyrite Spellbomb / Walking Ballista
    0-6 I play mangara on turn 4, you play ballista on turn 4, and pop one off at mangara. I bounce her, replay her. But on your turn, you can pump ballista, then shoot her again.

    5) Superbajt
    Angrath, the Flame-Chained / Sol Ring
    0-6 Turn 3 Angrath is too fast. Legendary, but not a creature...

    6) tomsloger
    History of Benalia / Metallic Mimic
    6-0 I scoop up the saga before you get 5/4s, and deal with the rest in turn. Then beats get there.

    4 | 6 2 0 X 0 6 |

    Pyrite spellbomb did work, discard also wrecks me, but I wasn't expecting discard.
    Posted in: Forum Magic
  • posted a message on 5CH Instill Energy; Convoy_Avenger and Mogg win! (350 points)
    Nerdyjoe:
    Archetype of Endurance / Auriok Salvagers / Black Lotus / Black Lotus / Memnarch

    1: 3-3 Holding up Mana tithe keeps me from playing anything. Or I go first and devour you.

    2: 3-3 Revoker stops me from doing things, or I go first and drop my fatties. Ugin doesn't help.

    3: 0-6 Mangara doesn't matter, but foil stops me cold, and the goblin gets there.

    5: 3-3 Revoker stops me from doing things, or I drop enormous threats that you can't handle.

    4 | 3 3 0 X 3 |
    Posted in: Forum Magic
  • posted a message on 5CH Raging Storm; Mogg wins! (520 points)
    You can just steal my turn 1 elemental in upkeep. I deal with the rest of your board, but then didn't get that swing in. Later, I can gut shot one of your elementals. Then we are even in missed attacks, and whoever went first gets it. Updated to 3-3.
    Posted in: Forum Magic
  • posted a message on 5CH Raging Storm; Mogg wins! (520 points)
    5) nerdyjoe
    Black Lotus / Disenchant / Gut Shot / Path to Exile / Patrician's Scorn


    1) ??? Patrician's scorn makes this possible. You play out some enchantments in some order, and I choose when to blow up all the ones you played out. This fees a lot like a slow fact or fiction. You choose the piles, I choose which one you keep.

    2) 0-6 The dweebs block, I can only remove 2 of the 4.

    3) 3-3 Path Salvagers, Disenchant Memnarch, gut shot one of the 5/1s. I do lose an elemental to memnarch when you go first, so we end up balanced on attacks, with you going first.

    4) 0-6 Foil protects Mirri, who noms on elementals.

    6) 3-3 Not totally sure about this one, but I think that gut shot revoker, disenchant bridge, and path an elemental works out. Exactly how the turns work out is not clear, and maybe chalice of life breaks symmetry more than the path does. I'll call it 3-3 until someone corrects me.
    Posted in: Forum Magic
  • posted a message on 5CH Creature Favoritism; Mogg wins! (567 points)
    4 | 0 0 0 X |

    Revokers end my gameplan before it even gets started. It also requires a few turns with permanents in play, which memnarch takes.
    Posted in: Forum Magic
  • posted a message on 5CH Self-Destruction; Mogg and nerdyjoe win! (467 points)
    Results for:
    5) nerdyjoe
    Fiery Justice / Spell Pierce / Tarnished Citadel / Tarnished Citadel / Tarnished Citadel

    1) 6-0 Black Lotus / Helix Pinnacle / Khalni Garden / Invigorate / Timetwister. You don't interact with citadels. I can kill your garden token, then lose life at my leisure.

    2) 6-0 Black Lotus / Glacial Chasm / Illusions of Grandeur / Leyline of Punishment / [Generic tapped land]. I can spell pierce your illusions, and lose life at my leisure.

    3) 3-3 City of Brass / Gemstone Caverns / Time Vault / Voltaic Key / Xantid Swarm. Both are turn 3 wins, and don't interact (or are protected) from each other.

    4) 3-3 Adanto Vanguard / Black Lotus / Foil / Island / Tarnished Citadel. If I go first, I hold up pierce. You can go for vanguard, I would pierce the Lotus. If you foil back, you can get vanguard down, lose 4 life immediately. On my turn, you lose 4 life, I lose 6. On your turn, you lose 4 life, on my turn, you lose 4 life in upkeep, but then main I win. If you instead don't go for vanguard, my citadels race. If you go first, you get vanguard down, and citadel down, losing 7 life, on my turn you lose another 4, on your turn you lose another 7, and then on my second upkeep you win.

    6) 6-0 Ancient Tomb / Damping Matrix / Mana Crypt / Smokestack / Sphere of Resistance. If I go first, I can hold pierce for smokestack, then my lands go way faster than yours. If I go second, you get a stack down turn 1. I can get two activations out of each land, but that's only 18 total. But maybe I play a land, wait for you to start stacking. You have to sac stacks at some point, then I get down my other two lands and race. I always win this race. (Unless you'd like to propose a line I haven't considered below)


    Life totals will be (you-me)
    Every line is a turn

    Primary line
    You're on the play, slam Tomb Crypt Smokestack (18-20)
    I drop the citadel, hold up mana
    break to secondary line (*) here
    You tick up smokestack, play out one of your rocks, I spell pierce it (16-17)
    I float mana, lose the citadel, and pass (16-14)
    You have to sac Crypt, and lose your life (14-14)
    I pass
    You lose smokestack, and your life (12-14)
    I play out a citadel, lose life (12-11)
    You lose life (10-11)
    I play out the other citadel, lose life (10-5)
    You lose life (8-5)
    I lose life (8- (-1) ) and win.

    (*) Secondary line
    You don't tick up stacks, and instead just play out a rock, which I spell pierce (16-17)
    I tap for mana. (16-14)
    Break for third line (**)
    You tick up stacks, play out your other rock (14-14)
    I tap for mana, lose citadel, and pass (14-11)
    You lose the rock, tap for mana and pass (12-11)
    I do nothing
    You lose crypt, tap for mana and pass (10-11)
    I do nothing
    You lose stacks, tap for mana and pass (8-11)
    I play citadel, tap for mana (8-8)
    You tap for mana and pass (6-8)
    I play citadel, tap for mana (6-2)
    You tap for mana (4-2)
    I tap for mana (4- (-4) ) and win.

    (**) Third line
    You play out your other rock (14-14)
    I tap for mana (14-11)
    Break for fourth line (***)
    You tick up stacks, tap for mana (12-11)
    I tap for mana, lose citadel (12-8)
    You lose the rock (10-8)
    I pass
    You lose crypt (8-8)
    I sense the end is coming, and play a citadel (8-5)
    You lose stacks (6-5) (You could also lose your way to win, and I still have another citadel left in hand, so this is a losing line)
    I play my other citadel, and tap out (6 - (-1) ) to win.

    (***) Fourth line
    You tap for mana. (12-11)
    I sense a win, play out a second citadel, and tap for mana (12-5)
    You tick up stacks, tap for mana. (10-5)
    I tap for mana in upkeep (10- (-1) ) and win.

    7) 6-0 Commandeer / Daze / Foil / Hex Parasite / Island. I just need to play lands, your 4 life each (pair of) turn(s) is not as fast as mine.


    5 | 6 6 3 3 X 6 6 |

    For the challenge, replacing Firey Justice (never mattered) with pithing needle, I'm pretty sure I get 600. Unfortunately it 3-3's the list I did submit, so it doesn't 6-0 the whole field.
    Posted in: Forum Magic
  • posted a message on 5CH Self-Destruction; Mogg and nerdyjoe win! (467 points)
    Can't Convoy_Avenger win on turn 2?
    Pregame play out the leyline. T1 Black lotus, crack for blue, River of Tears, play Illusion of Grandeur.
    T2 don't pay upkeep on Illusion, lose 20 life, SBA say lose, round rules say win.
    Posted in: Forum Magic
  • posted a message on 2CH DLR Retrace; Reyemile wins! (433 points)
    Results for

    4) nerdyjoe
    Council of the Absolute / Esper Charm
    Of note, when I am on the draw, I keep you to 2 mana, unless you hold both cards and discard them to the in-your-draw-step discard 2 every turn.


    1) CalvinSchwa Orim's Chant / Sanctum Prelate
    3-3. Each of us gets to get down our 3-drop first when we're on the draw, which swings the game in that player's favor.

    2) ManyCookies :: No Fun Allowed Ebony Charm / Unsubstantiate
    ???

    Eveenntually, I burn through your drawn cards, since each cast of Unsubstantiate is -1 card for you, but not for me. Casting ebony charm speed this up (so you don't burn through 20 points of life before I get through your drawn cards). Once council is down, it names unsubstantiate, and we race. I haven't computed this race, so I'm just guessing I win. 2 points a turn vs 1 point a turn (one draw a turn) seems to be in my favor.
    I missed the gain life part of the charm. If I instead play council on charm, you have to bounce it to play charm. Every turn you don't bounce it (to build up drawn lands or played lands), you lose 2. If I get ahead on lands-in-hand, and at least enough lands to cast my charm lots, I can safely cast it. I think this one is close, and I don't know how to play both ends optimally. I'd want to proxy it up and run through several iterations before coming to a conclusion.

    3) Mogg :: t5 Burn Ancestral Recall / Spiraling Embers
    6-0 Council always arrives just in time. Also discard slows you down slightly, making sure council always arives.

    5) Reyemile Leyline of the Void / Mardu Charm
    4-1 When you're on the play, you get to take my charm (for good), then make some tokens on your next turn. But after that council blocks if you swing, and keeps you from making more. On the draw, I force you to discard your charm (and more) before you can cast it, then my council prevents you from making blockers.

    6) Superbajt :: Black-Red Charming Command Kolaghan's Command / Rakdos Charm
    3-3 On the draw, we cut each other off mana and cards to get our threats through.

    7) tomsloger Curse of the Pierced Heart / Needle Drop
    6-0 Remove curse, win. Name needle drop, win.

    4 | 3 ? 6 X 4 3 6 |
    Posted in: Forum Magic
  • posted a message on 3CH LR Only Colored Permanents; Magus of the Aesthetic wins! (400 points)

    1) CalvinSchwa ??? Eeeeh? Lots of finkyness with making tokens, blocking with myth realized, getting cut off white mana, lilly edicts.

    2) 3-3 Braids always arrives. I can play vessel to force braids to arrive. When you're on the play, you can keep me to two mana. I think that's good enough. I get a 1/1, but braids is a 2/2, and so races. On the draw, I get to three mana, so lili edicts braids away.

    3) 2-2. We both get to remove the other's win con. Obby never gets down, myth always gets blown up or exiled from hand.

    4) 1-4 When i'm on the play, you only get one of these. Runed halo forces the tie. When I'm on the draw, you get to combo off.
    Posted in: Forum Magic
  • posted a message on 3CH LR Slow Roll; ManyCookies wins! (486 points)
    5) nerdyjoe
    Kozilek, Butcher of Truth / Lion's Eye Diamond / Shelldock Isle

    1) 0-6 CalvinSchwa On the play, Kozilek threatens, either the unkicked capsise puts it back in hand, and then it comes back many turns later, or you just lose (EDIT: or you venser it, and win). On the draw, the isle gets bounced before Kozilek can appear, or I get landlocked.

    2) 6-0 Magus of the Aesthetic :: This Hand Brought to You by Mogg Waiting until turn 3, I get do anihilate your lands.


    3) 0-6 ManyCookies :: Slow Rolling is BM On the play, you get to kill me, ignoring kozilek. On the draw, you have to shoot down kozilek, but he comes back. You then gain 6 life a turn, starting on turn 3, with an extra 5 thrown in some time. You get to 48+5 life on turn 10, just in time to kill me with kozilek back on the board.

    4) 0-6 Mogg You are best served not playing anvil. You can hold up chain to prevent me from isling. You play out 26 power on turn 8, and another 26 power on turn 10. This beats down sooner than Kozilek can eat up the delicious zombies.

    5) nerdyjoe
    Kozilek, Butcher of Truth / Lion's Eye Diamond / Shelldock Isle

    6) 0-6 Superbajt :: Let's Do It Again! Path eats Kozilek whenever.

    7) 3-3 Tatterhood On the play, I get Kozilek down before you have drain up, on the draw you get to hold me back until you can combo on turn 7 or so.

    8) 3-3 tomsloger On the play, I get Kozilek down before you have drain up. On the draw, you get to edict lands before I can recast Kozilek.

    0 6 0 0 X 0 2 2
    Posted in: Forum Magic
  • posted a message on 5CH Only Mana Sources; ManyCookies wins! (457 points)
    6) nerdyjoe
    Hadana's Climb / Karakas / Lumbering Falls / Mutavault / Simic Growth Chamber
    Goldfish turn: 7
    vault
    karakas swing 2
    swing 2 growth chamber
    karakas climb, fire up vault to catch counter
    falls swing 4
    swing 10
    swing 10

    1) 0-6 They goldfish turn 5.

    2) 6-0 vorinclex gets bounced, guides get stonewalled until I fly over with a fat mutavault

    3) 0-6 They goldfish turn 5.

    4) 0-6 Lumbering falls stonewalls procession, but City-Tree spits out dudes early, and replaces the ones that die to blocks. I think I lose.

    5) 0-6 They goldfish turn 4

    6) XXX Should have played inkmoth or blinkmoth or mishra's factory over mutavault. There was also only one matchup where hexproof may have been relevant, so some more efficient other manland could have helped.

    7) ?? I think I win. They can chip in the air, but I can block the ground, my things start bigger (for Climb mirrors). They do get landing tokens that are jumped as a hard to block threat, but does a 6/6 hexproof beater take care of that? I think so.

    8) 6-0 vorinclex gets bounced, mycon is way too slow.

    6 | 0 6 0 0 0 X ? 6 | 257
    Posted in: Forum Magic
  • posted a message on 7CBB - Research/Game: To Infinity and Beyond (@ Turn 2^1024 + 9234)
    A 9 card list:

    Sheltered Valley
    Saprazzan Cove
    Forbidden Orchard
    Sandstone Needle
    Doubling Season
    Argent Mutation
    Ensoul Artifact
    Progenitor Mimic
    Sparkcaster

    Endgame, we cast sparkcaster 20 turns in a row. Since Sandstone Needle and Forbidden Orchard are the only lands that let us cast it, we need to get at least 20 counters on Cove. So we need at least 4 doubling seasons (2^4=16) before we play it. The first time mimic (as doubling season) triggers, it generates 4 new doubling seasons, so we're good to go at that point (playing Cove, and casting sparkcaster the first time). Each cast of sparkcaster gives the opponent several spirits. I'll just run through the number of doubling seasons, for the damage dealt. We have 6 (1), then 2^6+6 (2), then 2^{2^6+6} (3), then 2 ^2^...(19 of these)...^2^6. But we don't worry about the ones we give out when dealing leathal damage, so we get attacked by 2^^18 spirits the turn before we win. We gain enough life to ride this out over the first several turns, so this takes 2^^18 turns. (Here, if it isn't clear, ^^ is two up arrows from Knuth's up-arrow notation)

    Fractured identity is has possible use in being a smaller-number-of-cards way to produce lots of doubling seasons.

    Quote from plopfill ยป


    and one more card.
    This one runs into trouble with the mana requirement of Tamiyo, the Moon Sage; Soulfire Grand Master and Tasigur, the Golden Fang can also serve the same purpose, but unfortunately they can win on their own.



    We can add Faerie Conclave to this. It casts us tamiyo, and is a win condition through the army of spirits, that requires tapping the orchard to get through. We don't have enough mana to activate (that generic (1) in the cost is the only barrier).
    Posted in: Forum Magic
  • posted a message on Perfect Hand Magic League 48:01 - 3CB LR Dream Halls - Submit your hands and format suggestions now
    The best I can do for abusing counterbalance is:

    Counterbalance / Counterspell / Black Sun's Zenith / Scalding Tongs
    Posted in: Forum Magic
  • posted a message on Perfect Hand Magic League 47:01 - 2+1 Infinite Shadows over Innistrad - Hands posted, score your row now
    The wording wasn't clear, looking back on it, but I interpreted it as players submit hands as normal, but the third also gets infinite copies in the deck. So you could play a cutthroat on turn 1.
    Posted in: Forum Magic
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