@MilkIsMYPotion I think Choke is the better card for that purpose. Thrun is good no doubt, but I feel it is only good vs Uw and UWr control. It doesn't match up well vs BGx or GDS for example, since their creatures grow bigger and leaves Thrun on perpetual chump blocking duties. It is also hard to fit in mana wise, since it requires 18 green sources to cast on turn 4 or 20 green on turn 6 with regen up.
A better card which suits DnT more is actually Choke. Choke requires fewer green sources (12 green sources on turn 3). Choke is also good vs Uw and UWr, but also excellent vs GDS, merfolk (a premium hate card here) and Storm (fetch version). Plus choke really plays well with the mana denial suite of DnT.
I think we can't rely only Stony anymore with the inclusion of Inspector. With the side in Stony plan, you leave yourself with 16 dead cards, 4 x Thalia, Arbiter, Inspector, Vial, not to mention sub par cards like Crusader and Thalia HC.
I think the first step to make the matchup better is to have a better main. I believe the main has 5 flex slots, which are usually two 2 cmc flyers (Avenger, Copter, Spirit) and 3 others (Displacer, Thalia HC, Crusader, Revoker, Mindcensor) all of which are fine depending on the meta. To attack Affinity, the main should keep or add more 2 cmc flyers and limit the other slots to Displacer, Revoker and Mindcensor. This way, you have less dead cards to side out.
Assuming the main is setup as such, you have around 12 slots to side out (4 x Thalia, Arbiter, Inspector) although Inspector is at least fine to keep to crew copters and is a better chump blocker than the taxers.
Currently, Im using this sideboard
2 Burrenton Forge-Tender
2 Dismember
1 Ethersworn Canonist
2 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 Kataki, War's Wage
2 Ratchet Bomb
2 Rest in Peace
2 Settle the Wreckage
Siding in BfT, Dismember, Kataki, Ratchet Bomb and StW, so thats 10 cards in, leaving 2 Inspectors.
A humble request to Deathandcatmix, can you update the primer. I feel the builds in the main page are pretty outdated and might be misleading for beginners. Monowhite for example, the given list has 0 copies of Thraben Inspector, Horizon Canopy or Resto, and the loss of 8 card draw effects will certainly affect the consistency of those lists. For WB Eldrazi Taxes, the given list does not include Bobs, while the current performing lists all have Bob as at least a 2 off.
I've been giving some thought on the Affinity matchup and sideboards in general.
Mono White is generally even-unfavoured g1 against decks that go wider (Affinity, Merfolk, Humans, Elves), graveyard based decks (Dredge, Living End), CoCo (Abzan CoCo, Druid, Humans, Elves) and traditional BGx.
Stony Silence, as good as it is, is only really good for DnT against Affinity and Lantern, full stop. We should not bring it in against Tron or Eldrazi Tron (Aether Vial is paramount while going for heavy land destruction) or Ad Nauseum ( Ad Nauseaum generally trims Pentad Prism against DnT since Wisp 2-1's it, leaving only Lotus Bloom as a target, where Revoker would do better). As such Stony only comes in against 8-10% of matchups, which is a poor use of sideboard slots, especially if you dedicate 4.
The problem with the Affinity matchup in general, even without accounting for Stony, is that you start off with 8 duds in the main (Thalia and Arbiter), meaning optimally you need 8 cards to replace them. This is compounded if you bring in Stony, which leaves a furthur 8 duds in Vial and Thraben Inspector. You could argue that if Stony sticks you win, but Affinity is a resilient beast and can win through Stony regardless, especially if they get their Aether Grids, and sometimes they just get their Thoughtsiezes and Spell Pierces in time.
Instead, I would advocate the use of a more 'general' sideboard strategy, which is some combination of Pithing Needle, Phyrexian Revoker , Dismember/Sunlance and Ratchet Bomb, preferably up to 8 copies so that you can completely replace Thalia/Arbiter.
There are two benefits to this approach. Basically you bring 8 good cards to replace 8 bad cards (thalia/arbiter) while leaving Vial/inspector intact. This results in a strictly better post board 60. Crucially, this avoids the Stony or bust approach, where if you don't get Stony, you are left with an even worse matchup than g1, since you still have some of your duds and the affinity deck would've brought in their Aether Grids and Whipflares.
The second benefit is that now you have more 3-4 more sideboard cards to bring in against other decks. Needles, Revoker and Ratchet line up nicely against the CoCo decks in particular, and you can cleanly sideboard out Thalias for them.
I believe that the EV of this approach is better overall, especially post-Thraben Inspector.
When ~ enters the the battlefield, you may exile a permanent you control. If you do, you may exile up to one target permanent of the same type.
2/2
"An eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth."
Vilas, Consul of Legislation
1{W}{W}
Legendary Creature- Human Advisor
Each player can't draw more than one card each turn.
Whenever a land enters the battlefield under a player's control, if that player had another land enter the battlefield under his or her control this turn, exile that land instead.
2/2
Dawnwisp
{W}
Creature- Elemental
Flying
When ~ enters the battlefield, each opponent gains 2 life.
Sacrifice ~: You or target permanent you control gains protection from the color of your choice until end of turn.
First post. Have followed this thread for quite a bit, found it to be extremely helpful. I've scoured the other related control (UW,UB,Sultai,Jeskai) threads and found that UR to be well positioned and in fact ahead in some aspects comparatively.
Aside from main deck Angers mentioned by megaman125, the deck benefits from having early draw selection that other control decks simply lack. Magma Jet and Tormenting Voice, other control decks would kill for these early filters.
Also, lands. Being dual colored allows us to use Radiant Fountain,valuable life gain that this color combination has traditionally lacked. Having access to Shivan Reefs as opposed to Polluted Deltas or Flooded Strands helps us fix our land better, since once cracked, fetchlands only provide one color source as opposed to painlands. Also, since fetches reduce the number of lands in our deck, they contribute, albeit marginally,to missing land drops. However, lack of fetches mean less fuel for Dig Through Time, though the deck plays enough spells to fill the yard comfortably enough.
Deck explanation
Like Kiln Fiend above, I want to win primarily by using Mindswipe and having them recycled by Cranial Archive should the need arise. This combined with Stoke the flames and goblin tokens (recyclable as well) should provide the deck with enough inevitability to win any game. Also, blanking removal is always nice. The deck takes the control role against all aggro and midrange decks. However, against other control, we should take up the role of aggressor, since they can control the game better. This is by no means a bad thing if we prepare for it (game 1), since we have the advantage of evergreen burn while their precious spot removal lies dead in their hands.
I decided against Pearl Lake Ancient because he often becomes the target of otherwise dead removal and is bad against other control. Against UW and UB, bringing PLA in simply results in a losing position, since they are able to remove our PLA while we cannot remove theirs. I also decided against Keranos because he gets exiled by the vault and due to the fact that there is just too much enchantment hate atm. Mindswipe felt very powerful as it is both a control and finisher element. I could sit back and accumulate lands while putting the opponent in a lose-lose position.
To tackle the big creature problem I decided to rely more on Vaults, with a combination of Hordeling Outburst and Stoke the Flames to stall the board as necessary for Vaults to come online. Also, 2 Burn Away come off the board vs Abzan, Monsters and Temur.
Fated Conflagration is not the solution, even though I really wanted it to be red's answer to Hero's Downfall. This is because we actually need 22 red sources for Fated Conflag to be reliably casted on turn 4 or 21 sources on turn 5. I was not willing to give up the smooth current mana base for an ultimately weak card. For a while, I considered Spite of Mogis and found it be a decent answer, but sorcery speed, requiring to be played around and awkward interaction with DTT led me to Stoke and Outburst instead. Stoke hits the relevant creatures well enough, goblins enable the occasional convoke, and stoke combines with a blocking goblin token to take out the rhino (trample still hurts though).I am still unsure of the correct split but strongly feel this is the way forward for the deck.
A better card which suits DnT more is actually Choke. Choke requires fewer green sources (12 green sources on turn 3). Choke is also good vs Uw and UWr, but also excellent vs GDS, merfolk (a premium hate card here) and Storm (fetch version). Plus choke really plays well with the mana denial suite of DnT.
I think the first step to make the matchup better is to have a better main. I believe the main has 5 flex slots, which are usually two 2 cmc flyers (Avenger, Copter, Spirit) and 3 others (Displacer, Thalia HC, Crusader, Revoker, Mindcensor) all of which are fine depending on the meta. To attack Affinity, the main should keep or add more 2 cmc flyers and limit the other slots to Displacer, Revoker and Mindcensor. This way, you have less dead cards to side out.
Assuming the main is setup as such, you have around 12 slots to side out (4 x Thalia, Arbiter, Inspector) although Inspector is at least fine to keep to crew copters and is a better chump blocker than the taxers.
Currently, Im using this sideboard
2 Burrenton Forge-Tender
2 Dismember
1 Ethersworn Canonist
2 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 Kataki, War's Wage
2 Ratchet Bomb
2 Rest in Peace
2 Settle the Wreckage
Siding in BfT, Dismember, Kataki, Ratchet Bomb and StW, so thats 10 cards in, leaving 2 Inspectors.
2 Burrenton Forge-Tender
2 Dismember
1 Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 Grafdigger's Cage
2 Phyrexian Revoker
1 Pithing Needle
2 Ratchet Bomb
2 Relic of Progenitus
1 Surgical Extraction
Against CoCo decks I have 9-10 sideboard cards as well, depending on whether Surgical is relevent, so I'm well equipped on that front.
Mono White is generally even-unfavoured g1 against decks that go wider (Affinity, Merfolk, Humans, Elves), graveyard based decks (Dredge, Living End), CoCo (Abzan CoCo, Druid, Humans, Elves) and traditional BGx.
Stony Silence, as good as it is, is only really good for DnT against Affinity and Lantern, full stop. We should not bring it in against Tron or Eldrazi Tron (Aether Vial is paramount while going for heavy land destruction) or Ad Nauseum ( Ad Nauseaum generally trims Pentad Prism against DnT since Wisp 2-1's it, leaving only Lotus Bloom as a target, where Revoker would do better). As such Stony only comes in against 8-10% of matchups, which is a poor use of sideboard slots, especially if you dedicate 4.
The problem with the Affinity matchup in general, even without accounting for Stony, is that you start off with 8 duds in the main (Thalia and Arbiter), meaning optimally you need 8 cards to replace them. This is compounded if you bring in Stony, which leaves a furthur 8 duds in Vial and Thraben Inspector. You could argue that if Stony sticks you win, but Affinity is a resilient beast and can win through Stony regardless, especially if they get their Aether Grids, and sometimes they just get their Thoughtsiezes and Spell Pierces in time.
Instead, I would advocate the use of a more 'general' sideboard strategy, which is some combination of Pithing Needle, Phyrexian Revoker , Dismember/Sunlance and Ratchet Bomb, preferably up to 8 copies so that you can completely replace Thalia/Arbiter.
There are two benefits to this approach. Basically you bring 8 good cards to replace 8 bad cards (thalia/arbiter) while leaving Vial/inspector intact. This results in a strictly better post board 60. Crucially, this avoids the Stony or bust approach, where if you don't get Stony, you are left with an even worse matchup than g1, since you still have some of your duds and the affinity deck would've brought in their Aether Grids and Whipflares.
The second benefit is that now you have more 3-4 more sideboard cards to bring in against other decks. Needles, Revoker and Ratchet line up nicely against the CoCo decks in particular, and you can cleanly sideboard out Thalias for them.
I believe that the EV of this approach is better overall, especially post-Thraben Inspector.
1{W}{W}
Human Advisor
When ~ enters the the battlefield, you may exile a permanent you control. If you do, you may exile up to one target permanent of the same type.
2/2
"An eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth."
Vilas, Consul of Legislation
1{W}{W}
Legendary Creature- Human Advisor
Each player can't draw more than one card each turn.
Whenever a land enters the battlefield under a player's control, if that player had another land enter the battlefield under his or her control this turn, exile that land instead.
2/2
Dawnwisp
{W}
Creature- Elemental
Flying
When ~ enters the battlefield, each opponent gains 2 life.
Sacrifice ~: You or target permanent you control gains protection from the color of your choice until end of turn.
1/1
First post. Have followed this thread for quite a bit, found it to be extremely helpful. I've scoured the other related control (UW,UB,Sultai,Jeskai) threads and found that UR to be well positioned and in fact ahead in some aspects comparatively.
Aside from main deck Angers mentioned by megaman125, the deck benefits from having early draw selection that other control decks simply lack. Magma Jet and Tormenting Voice, other control decks would kill for these early filters.
Also, lands. Being dual colored allows us to use Radiant Fountain,valuable life gain that this color combination has traditionally lacked. Having access to Shivan Reefs as opposed to Polluted Deltas or Flooded Strands helps us fix our land better, since once cracked, fetchlands only provide one color source as opposed to painlands. Also, since fetches reduce the number of lands in our deck, they contribute, albeit marginally,to missing land drops. However, lack of fetches mean less fuel for Dig Through Time, though the deck plays enough spells to fill the yard comfortably enough.
However, the glaring weakness of the deck is definitely removing higher toughness creatures. Here we are ashamed by the wealth of options given to our UB and, to a lesser extent, our UW cousins. This weakness is mitigated by the excellent Disdainful Stroke, however problem cards remain. By name:
Savage Knuckleblade
Brimaz, King of Oreskos
Anafenza, the Foremost
Courser of Kruphix
Ashiok,Nightmare Weaver
Special mention to Siege Rhino
5 Island
6 Mountain
3 Radiant Fountain
4 Shivan Reef
4 Swiftwater Cliffs
4 Temple of Epiphany
//Spells
3 Anger of the Gods
1 Cranial Archive
3 Dig Through Time
3 Disdainful Stroke
3 Dissolve
2 Hordeling Outburst
3 Jace's Ingenuity
2 Lightning Strike
2 Magma Jet
3 Mindswipe
4 Perilous Vault
3 Stoke the Flames
2 Tormenting Voice
1 Disdainful Stroke
2 Lightning Strike
3 Negate
3 Stormbreath Dragon
2 Ashcloud Phoenix
2 Burn Away
1 Anger of the Gods
1 Hordeling Outburst
Deck explanation
Like Kiln Fiend above, I want to win primarily by using Mindswipe and having them recycled by Cranial Archive should the need arise. This combined with Stoke the flames and goblin tokens (recyclable as well) should provide the deck with enough inevitability to win any game. Also, blanking removal is always nice. The deck takes the control role against all aggro and midrange decks. However, against other control, we should take up the role of aggressor, since they can control the game better. This is by no means a bad thing if we prepare for it (game 1), since we have the advantage of evergreen burn while their precious spot removal lies dead in their hands.
I decided against Pearl Lake Ancient because he often becomes the target of otherwise dead removal and is bad against other control. Against UW and UB, bringing PLA in simply results in a losing position, since they are able to remove our PLA while we cannot remove theirs. I also decided against Keranos because he gets exiled by the vault and due to the fact that there is just too much enchantment hate atm. Mindswipe felt very powerful as it is both a control and finisher element. I could sit back and accumulate lands while putting the opponent in a lose-lose position.
To tackle the big creature problem I decided to rely more on Vaults, with a combination of Hordeling Outburst and Stoke the Flames to stall the board as necessary for Vaults to come online. Also, 2 Burn Away come off the board vs Abzan, Monsters and Temur.
Fated Conflagration is not the solution, even though I really wanted it to be red's answer to Hero's Downfall. This is because we actually need 22 red sources for Fated Conflag to be reliably casted on turn 4 or 21 sources on turn 5. I was not willing to give up the smooth current mana base for an ultimately weak card. For a while, I considered Spite of Mogis and found it be a decent answer, but sorcery speed, requiring to be played around and awkward interaction with DTT led me to Stoke and Outburst instead. Stoke hits the relevant creatures well enough, goblins enable the occasional convoke, and stoke combines with a blocking goblin token to take out the rhino (trample still hurts though).I am still unsure of the correct split but strongly feel this is the way forward for the deck.