Ugh, that requires two extra cards, which would bring us down to five stages.
Perhaps going back to my previous idea will help here, except this time using Iname As One and Apothecary Geist. Use Iname As One to bring Apothecary Geist from the graveyard/library to the battlefield, gaining 3 life; then, only Child of Alara can get the Geist off the battlefield. That can save three cards!
Edit: Hmm, we need to be able to bring Bramblewood Paragon back after the megastage transition, but that requires Verdant Succession triggers. So we need to use up an Engineered Explosives with two counters, which is one less time destroying Jade Bearer. That tilts things one too many in the opposite direction, and we wind up one Engineered Explosives short. I think we can fix that by just going back to the Smite the Monstrous configuration, allowing Goblin Dark-Dwellers to be bounced back to our hand.
Edit: Looking at the Soul Foundry deck, it looks like Wirewood Herald could be made to work without Verdant Succession; we create a token copy of Wirewood Herald, then each sacrifice of Engineered Explosives will destroy both the original Wirewood Herald and the token copy, allowing us to create another token copy and bring both Wirewood Herald and Godtoucher back to our hand. But we can't do this without using a first Engineered Explosives to create the first token, and we can't bring Godtoucher back to our hand then. So that uses up one usage of Engineered Explosives. That should make things even, so long as we can't bounce Goblin Dark-Dwellers back to our hand. That gives us something like:
Man, even with green creatures and creatures with power 4 back in play, I can't seem to improve on what we already have. One more one-creature stage would allow seven stages, but I can't seem to find one.
Hmm yes, we need to add something for the artifacts again. For now I'm using Wormfang Behemoth, unless we can find something that retrieves artifacts from the graveyard and can be protected from Worldfire. So that's an extra card, and we don't save a card from Bone Harvest since I didn't have it in the above deck. It looks like we need a Forked-Branch Garami, and the second can either be another FBG or a Bone Harvest; either way we need to Champion Goblin Dark-Dwellers for the megastage transition, since we can't bounce it.
But yeah, getting the potential for more stages doesn't help if we don't have room. I was hoping that maybe we could get more one-card stages though; I guess we would need at least two more to turn a profit.
I'm sure that Iijil was correct, but I'm not seeing why at the moment. Once you play the Champion, everything after it is a triggered ability. You resolve the first Bloodbond March trigger to bring the Champion back into play, which triggers the Champion abilities; resolving those will exile the Dark-Dwellers and sacrifice the Champion, triggering the Dark-Dwellers to come back. This in turn triggers our spell or spells. Throughout this whole chain of events, we can keep having the Dark-Dwellers cast Battle Cry, which is fine, that's what's supposed to happen; if at any point we cast Rebuild, we are stuck without Vedalken Orrery until the nearest point at which we could have put a Mirrorworks ability, which is below all the Bloodbond March triggers.
Cool. But, how does Natural Order gain us a lot of life? It can bring back Harbinger of Spring, but not destroy it to bring back Basilica Bell-Haunt - except for when you sacrifice a green creature as an additional cost, but that only happens once, so you only get 3 life. Unless, we put Panharmonicon back in? That looks like it is okay, since in the megastage transition we only get the BBH after everything gets destroyed.
Ah, the Sea Snidd doesn't work once we have access to all the colors, a pity. Something I have been thinking about, is to replace Smite the Monstrous with Into Thin Air and Brace for Impact. That would free up all the creatures with power >= 4 for the later stages, although we would lose multicolored creatures. That would also mean we would be unable to bounce our gigastage creatures with power >=4, which look to be Goblin Dark-Dwellers and Horobi, Death's Wail. (Child of Alara and Molderhulk are of course multicolored.) The Dark-Dwellers can be Championed under Boggart Mob, and in fact we have to do so now. For Horobi, I guess we can use Forked-Branch Garami to retrieve Horobi and our lifegain spirit at the same time?
Ooh, I didn't notice the Disciple only gaining 2 life! So many little things can affect whether things work or don't work. But yeah, with TYS we could get a lot of other green creatures before getting the Disciple, which would mess things up. Unless we couldn't counter sorceries, which would mean only the original Natural Order could come after the original Worldfire. But, both TYS and sorcery countering are looking quite necessary for our decks.
As for those extra Engineered Explosives - I was kinda counting on what you said before about the Verdant Succession soaking up two uses, but which I have forgotten the exact details about. Could you go over again how this worked in the Moggcatcher / Azban Falconer deck?
@J_kibbs: Yes, that's what I meant by "this is really easy with your populate ability". Sorry for the confusion!
@Stakfish: I was wondering if there was some other life-gaining creature that we could use, and I think I have a possible solution: use Basilica Bell-Haunt to gain 3 life, and then use Iname, Life Aspect or some other Soulshift 4+ creature with at least 4 power to return it to our hand. This looks like it might be dangerous, since it separates the life gain from the action of Child of Alara destroying everything - but we need to use Child of Alara to destroy Basilica Bell-Haunt. So after destroying and exiling Iname to gain 3 life from BBH, we still need to go through a Child of Alara destruction to get BBH off the battlefield. I don't see a way to abuse this.
Assuming that works, we can get our Worldfire versions working again, and even with one more card slot. So I think we are back up to 7 stages again.
@J_kibbs: Looks good so far! Note that Vitu-Ghazi Guildmage creates a token directly, whereas Stakfish's idea was to use mana to bounce and replay Copy Enchantment, which triggered many copies of Dual Nature to each create a token, with each one getting greatly multiplied by the Doubling Seasons. So the method Stakfish was using gets one more layer than yours does. Who knows though, maybe your further extensions will be compatible with the Guildmage but not with Copy Enchantment. If not, you can always switch over later.
Right now you have:
Layer 1: each token creation can create an exponentially increasing number of Doubling Seasons.
Layer 2: Each Runaway Steam-Kin ability creates a lot of mana, which can be used to activate the Guildmage many times.
Layer 3: Each red spell triggers many Runaway Steam-Kins.
Now, since Layer 3 is based on the number of Steam-Kins, to get to Layer 4 or beyond you need to update the number of Steam-Kins accordingly - but this is really easy with your populate ability!
Stakfish: Hey, if we switch over to Worldpurge, maybe using Dual Nature is safe in some decks? The reason we switched out of using Dual Nature was I believe Child of Alara? But, maybe it could be possible to use Dual Nature with Child of Alara.
Now, when Child of Alara is in our hand, we can get a free destruction of Child of Alara by playing it, getting a token copy, then legend-ruling one or the other. So when Child of Alara goes back to our hand - basically, when we cast Worldpurge or use a higher-stage creature - we can get an extra mana. So the gigastage transition will allow for an extra green mana. Problematic, but perhaps not insurmountable?
However, Dual Nature is still not safe in some decks. In the Soul Foundry deck, Brudiclad tokens give all tokens haste, which is too good with Dual Nature. And your deck has Goryo's Vengeance, which can easily fetch Child of Alara for it to be destroyed again. Does your deck need to have Goryo's Vengeance?
J_kibbs: Glad to hear that it is making some sense! We like to be helpful as much as possible.
Stakfish: Oh, I see: when we tap Godtoucher or Razorfin Abolisher, we get a lot of Psychic Battle triggers, and each of them can bounce Boggart Mob back to our hand, which brings Goblin Dark-Dwellers back to the battlefield, allowing us to cast either Battle Cry or Rebuild. But, there is no point in casting Rebuild before the last targeting of Boggart Mob, since then we lose Vedalken Orrery, and can no longer do anything substantial until we resolve a Vedalken Orrery token. So I guess yeah, we don't really need Panharmonicon. But, since Panharmonicon doesn't lose us a card slot, we might as well keep it unless it causes problems; technically, it allows for a greater final number, even if that improvement is unnoticeable in the final estimate.
Also, I guess not having Panharmonicon prevents that problem I was mentioning with Natural Order. But, Natural Order doesn't help get back Nylea's Disciple either, since we can only cast Natural Order in the gigastage transition, and we can't afford to resolve all the way down to the previous gigastage transition to get Nylea's Disciple back.
Oh yeah, for some reason I thought we wouldn't have to pay the X cost when replicating it - stupid of me. So yeah, the best thing to do is to just max out the WSZ and pay none to the DI, so you wind up with much fewer Cats. I didn't forget the TYS copies, but they didn't make a dent when I thought that we had DI copies. So now each casting of WSZ takes M mana to roughly STM^2 mana, where T is the number of TYS copies and S is the number of previously cast instants/sorceries. So after N castings we get roughly N!*T^N*(M^2^N), and that is completely dominated by M^2^N. This is less than before, but still enough to get to between 2^^13 and 2^^14 mana after all the SPs run out. So the main point still holds; all the advantage we get from the WSZs and other mana producers become unnoticeable once we get to the three arrow level, i.e. after we start casting Cackling Counterparts.
@Stakfish: Just wondering if you saw my post #1894, where I asked how we could retrieve Nylea's Disciple after it gets exiled by Worldfire. If neither Nylea's Disciple nor Tireless Missionaries can be retrieved after Worldfire hits, then I guess both of my latest decks are currently nonworking. The only stage artifact that is currently usable is Metallurgeon, which requires white, and both Izzet Guildmage and Razorfin Abolisher require blue; the alternative to the Abolisher requires black. So we need three colors by the megastage, which rules out Centaur Safeguard, and I don't know what else to use for the life-gaining creature. I guess we could consider using Bramblewood Paragon + Abzan Falconer, maybe there's something we could make out of that.
@Stakfish: We don't need multiple Rebuilds, but we do want the same Goblin Dark-Dwellers to cast both Battle Cry and Rebuild. I suppose that we could rejigger the hyperstage so that we get can have the Dwellers enter the battlefield twice per Engineered Explosives, but if those two ETB effects happen independently, then we can have each one cast a Rebuild and wind up getting two Engineered Explosives out of it, allowing us to add layers to the lower stage. I suppose it should work if so long as the two ETB effects are triggered at the same time, but right now Panharmonicon is the only way I see how to do that.
Yeah, Wormfang Behemoth worried me a little too. But, the situation looks the same as for the megastage transition - we get an Engineered Explosives and Goblin Dark-Dwellers back in our hand, but this is supposed to be nullified by our need to create and use Verdant Succession triggers. Actually, can you go over again how our extra EE and GDD are normally used up in the megastage transition? That's a really important thing that we need to keep track of.
Switching over to Worldpurge is certainly always on the table. I believe the problem we were having is that we were using Elvish Spirit Guide to gain mana for the megastage transition, and using Worldpurge in the gigastage transition also brought Elvish Spirit Guide back to our hand, so that we wound up with an extra green mana afterwards. If we could use something else to gain green mana in the megastage transition, that might be useful.
@J_kibbs: Yes, I kept track of the mana, but it is not enough of an effect to make an appreciable difference. Basically, you get mana on the order of our number of creatures squared, and squaring is not enough to make a noticeable difference in large exponential towers. An important point is that mana is not serving to create more Doubling Seasons, at least not at a low level - it does allow for more Djinn Illuminatus copies for spells like Cackling Counterpart, but since mana is not significantly higher than our number of creatures (relative to Knuth arrow scale), it's not mattering.
@Stakfish: How is Nylea's Disciple supposed to work again? The problem I am seeing is that Worldfire will exile our Nylea's Disciples, and we have to get them back somehow. I was hoping that Verdant Succession could bring them back, but we can only trigger it by destroying a Child of Alara, and then we have to resolve all the Verdant Successions until we get to the creation of another Vedalken Orrery. So we can't store up Verdant Successions, and if we hold a Child of Alara destruction on the stack, the Nylea's Disciples won't be on the battlefield, so they won't trigger Verdant Succession. So Verdant Succession doesn't seem to solve the problem. Natural Order won't work since they can bring the Disciples back to the battlefield below the Worldfire, and we can gain life after dropping down to 1, and put an additional megastage on the stack, I think. So I don't know how we used Nylea's Disciple in previous decks.
@J_kibbs Interesting deck again. Here is my analysis:
On your Phyrexian Metamorph line, near the end you say "all MS but one copy", did you mean DS instead? I will assume that is the case.
So there will be plenty of mana for the initial cards. When you play Doubling Season, you get one copy via a Mirrorworks ability, which becomes two tokens. So you have three total. Then you get 8 Clever Impersonator tokens, which become Mirrorworks copies. Then, when Phyrexian Metamorph comes into play, it triggers all nine copies of Mirrorworks, allowing us to generate D Doubling Seasons, where D is between 2^^10 and 2^^11. Every creature from that point forward will generate 9 * 2^D token copies, which will be between 2^^11 and 2^^12. This will generate about C(9 * 2^D)^2 = 81C * 2^(2D) mana, which will also be between 2^^11 and 2^^12.
Next we come to Steady Progress and White Suns' Zenith. With Djinn Illuminatus maxed out and TYS, we will get between 2^^11 and 2^^12 copies of Steady Progress, each time drawing a White Sun's Zenith. If we have M mana before we cast WSZ, the best bet is to use M/2 mana on WSZ, and M/2 mana on Djinn Illuminatus, creating M/6 copies, and thus generating (M^2 * 2^D)/12 token Cats. This will generate about (M^2 * 2^D)^2/144 mana, or roughly M^4 mana since M is much greater than 2^D, and growing rapidly while 2^D is staying constant. So if we cast WSZ N times, we get about M^4^N mana at the end. So with between 2^^11 and 2^^12 casts, we get between 2^^13 and 2^^14 mana.
We get some more casts via Yawgmoth's Bargain and {c]Domri Rade[/c], but we only get 10 WSZ casts from YB and between 2^^11 and 2^^12 casts from Domri Rade, so we are still between 2^^13 and 2^^14.
Next up is Cackling Counterpart. First we use the TYS and DI copies and have them all target Doubling Season, and each copy takes X Doubling Seasons to about 2^X Doubling Seasons. So after more than 2^^13 copies we wind up with more than 2^^(2^^13) copies of Doubling Season. Then we start resolving the Precursor Golem triggers. Each one creates a copy for each Doubling Season, each of which takes X to 2^X, so we wind up taking X Doubling Seasons to roughly 2^^X Doubling Seasons. So we wind up appending "2^^" more than 2^^11 times to 2^^(2^^13), so we eventually get between 2^^^(2^^11) and 2^^^(2^^12) Doubling Seasons.
It's instructive at this point to look at how much mileage we got out of all the work we did to get more mana; the result is, the effect is unnoticeable. Yes, before the Precursor Golem triggers we wound up with 2^^(2^^13) Doubling Seasons rather than 2^^(2^^11) Doubling Seasons, which is noticeable if not an enormous difference; but, each Precursor Golem trigger appended a "2^^" to the numbers, and we had more than 2^^11 of them, so the difference between 13 and 11 becomes insignificant. Either way we wind up between 2^^^(2^^11) and 2^^^(2^^12) Doubling Seasons. So the mana isn't really making a significant impact here.
Neither is Seize the Day, which increases our mana, but not our Doubling Seasons, so the effect is unnoticable; basically our mana becomes roughly the square of our number of Doubling Seasons, and the squaring operation is completely unnoticeable for numbers at the triple arrow level. Also, we can't go into and out of combat while the stack is not empty, so we can't do this step while there are copies of Runic Repetition, activated abilities, or Mirrorworks or Bloodbond March triggers on the stack. So even if this step did something significant, it couldn't be recursed over with what follows next.
Runic Repetition can fetch Cackling Counterpart and gets lots of copies via DI and TYS, so it takes X to 2^^^^X. So the first time we cast it we produce more than X = 2^^^^(2^^^(2^^11)) copies of Doubling Season.
We then create roughly X Rowan Kenriths and Rowan Kenrith emblems (actually 2^X and 2^2^X respectively, but the difference is unnoticeable), and then create roughly X Chandra Ablazes. So we can cast Runic Repetition X times (technically 2^X * 2^2^X), to generate 2^^^^^(2^^^^(2^^^(2^^11))) Doubling Seasons.
We then create about Y copies of The Chain Veil. When we tap a single TCV, we get E copies where E is the number of Rowan Kenrith emblems, allowing us to activate each of R Rowan Kenriths E times each, generating 2^(RE) more emblems. So after Y such abilities we get roughly 2^^Y RK emblems at the end. This allows us to use Chandra roughly 2^^Y more times, allowing us to generate 2^^^^^(2^^Y) Doubling Seasons, or more than 2^^^^^(2^^^^^(2^^^^(2^^^(2^^11)))) Doubling Seasons.
You may notice that the arrows are not increasing as fast as one might expect. This is because the requirements to stack layers are not being met. Specifically, if, between each activation of Chandra Ablaze, we could update the number of Rowan Kenrith Emblems to roughly the number of Doubling Seasons in play, then each Chandra Ablaze could cast X Doubling Seasons and thus take X to 2^^^^^X, and then having X Chandras would take X to 2^^^^^^X. Then, if between each activation of a The Chain Veil we could increase the number of emblems or Chandras to roughly the number of Doubling Seasons, then X The Chain Veils would take X to 2^^^^^^^X. But, since we can't update any of our numbers, except when casting one of our permanents, we are stuck at the five arrow level.
Another problem is that are Planeswalkers require the stack to be empty to use their loyalty abilities. This means that we can't take advantage of any further recursion that requires abilities on the stack. So, while we might expect that Clever Impersonator would take us to six arrows because of Bloodbond March, and the exile cards would take us to seven because of DI and TYS copies, those extra layers only function properly if we can keep the Bloodbond March, DI, and TYS triggers on the stack, which we can't.
So, it looks like the best we can do is to have each of the CI and PM cards implement another X to 2^^^^^X, taking us to between 2^^^^^^11 and 2^^^^^^12 DSes. Then the exile cards can retrieve all 10 CI/PM/CA/TCV cards, allowing another 10 implementations of X to 2^^^^^X. So that takes us to between 2^^^^^^211 and 2^^^^^^212.
Unfortunately, this is less than your first two decks. I encourage you to look at what is creating layers and what isn't - some things that are interfering with layer creation are:
1) independent layers - in all your decks you have both doubling season creation and mana generation, and they never stack on top of each other. So we just wind up building on whatever is stronger, which is usual the doubling season creation. (Yes, it's true that the mana generated depends on the number of Doubling Seasons. But that mana never gets translated back into Doubling Seasons, which is necessary for stacking layers.)
2) Numbers not getting updated - It would be nice if having many Rowan Kenrith emblems or Mirrorworks tokens translated into layers. Unfortunately, they are not getting updated frequntly enough to count as layers, as I talked about above. I don't know how to fix that in this particular deck, but it is something to keep in mind. Rings of Brighthearth would be nice if you could update artifacts frequently, but of course you can't if you are using The Chain Veil to recurse over Chandra Ablaze.
3) stack needing to be cleared for combat or planeswalker abilities. I also don't know how to fix this in this deck - the obvious solution is Teferi, Temporal Archmage, but his second ability can untap The Chain Veil, so that's no good.
So far all our decks have killed the opponent, but looking at the rules, it looks like that was never specified. So it's okay to just deal a lot of damage to opponent without killing him. (presumably using something like Abyssal Persecutor to keep him alive)
Edit: Looking for creatures that we can't bounce and replay to protect from Worldfire, I suppose that we don't have any way to bounce Celestial Gatekeeper. So, it looks like we need to go back to Nylea's Disciple. Two Nylea's Disciple plus Arixmethes can substitute for two Celestial Gatekeepers plus Tireless Missionaries.
It would be nice if adding Radiant Purge allowed us to get rid of Ray of Revelation. After some thought, it does look like one copy of Psychic Battle is theoretically enough to implement the stage structure, and we won't need a bunch of Psychic Battles for Smite the Monstrous, since we have Thousand-Year Storm copies. But, with just one Psychic Battle we only get to bounce one artifact besides Metallurgeon, so we have only enough to bounce Obelisk of Bant once, paying just for the Metallurgeon. We will have nothing to pay for Karn, Silver Golem or Ray of Revelation, for instance.
1) Actually, when you play CI, you get a Dual Nature trigger, but first it is waiting to be put on the stack. It doesn't actually get put on the stack until a player would receive priority. When you do, first the game checks for state-based actions, and the CI is put in the graveyard. This triggers the Dual Nature destruction trigger, but it is also waiting to be put on the stack. Then state-based actions are checked again, and if nothing happens, then you put your triggered abilities on the stack, in any order you choose. So you could put the destruction trigger below the creation trigger, but you probably will want to put the creation trigger below the destruction trigger, and you can do this. (I'm not a rules expert, but I believe this is how it goes.)
2) Yes, this is correct.
3) DN does not care that the DN tokens were created from a CI card, it only checks for those tokens with that name. This is why it was so convenient in our previous decks to have Dual Nature and Copy Enchantment, we could freely bounce and replay the Copy Enchantment that would copy nothing, and not have to worry about Dual Nature getting rid of our tokens.
Edit: Looking to vet the latest decks - both the Soul Foundry and Bramblewood Paragon decks need the Goblin Dark-Dwellers to cast both Battle Cry and Rebuild, and we can't really be allowed to separate them, since no matter what ratio we are supposed to use, we can always tip the scales more towards Rebuild to create more stages in the lower hyperstage. So I think we need Panharmonicon in both decks. It can slide in easily enough by replacing the third Spider Spawning.
I don't think Panharmonicon causes any problems, since we don't have a Changeling Champion. Tireless Missionaries should still work, since it comes back when there are no other nonland permanents on the battlefield.
Edit: Since the decks do not have Muzzio, we need a way to bring back artifacts. Goblin Welder doesn't seem to work anymore, since we don't have an easy way to bring it back from the graveyard. We could add Goblin Welder and Dralnu's Crusade, but there are so many possible one card options that I figure at least one must work. Wormfang Behemoth should do the trick, we can bounce all the artifacts back to our hand, and then exile them with Wormfang Behemoth before Worldfire resolves. We still need to bring back Wormfang Behemoth with Bloodbond March triggers, so that safety net is still there.
To make room, we have to remove a stage from the stage sequence, but we can add Consecrated Sphinx back in.
Yeah, that's a good idea. I was banking on Tidal Courier to bring back Jade Bearer, so we need something else. Verdant Succession is the obvious choice, and fortunately Stakfish's ending stage sequence doesn't interfere with it. Verdant Succession is a triggered ability, and we need to respond to playing Razorfin Abolisher with an activated ability. So, Verdant Succession brings back Jade Bearer, and we use it to bounce Razorfin Abolisher. Then we use Engineered Explosives to destroy the Jade Bearer, and imprint it on a Mimic Vat. We play and counter Razorfin Abolisher, and while there are still Bloodbond March triggers on the stack we tap the Mimic Vat to create a token copy of Jade Bearer. We destroy the Razorfin Abolisher and create a token copy, and use a Bloodbond March trigger to bring the original back to the battlefield. We can use the token Razorfin Abolisher to bounce Boggart Mob, bringing back Goblin Dark-Dwellers and going through the hyperstage transition, allowing us to get back Engineered Explosives. We let the Bloodbond March triggers run out, put the Jade Bearer in the library, and use the Verdant Succession trigger to bring it back to the battlefield, and the loop repeats. Crucially, we have to run out the Bloodbond March triggers for Razorfin Abolisher before we get to resolve the Verdant Succession triggers for Jade Bearer, so we can't utilize multiple Bloodbond March triggers with a single Razorfin Abolisher bounce. So it looks like it works.
I really hope that you can get the Changeling deck fixed, I like it a lot. I will think about it as well. What is allowing us to use Anaba Ancestor, is it having to bounce and replay Chalice of the Void?
Perhaps going back to my previous idea will help here, except this time using Iname As One and Apothecary Geist. Use Iname As One to bring Apothecary Geist from the graveyard/library to the battlefield, gaining 3 life; then, only Child of Alara can get the Geist off the battlefield. That can save three cards!
2 Psychic Battle
3 Cowardice
4 Horobi, Death’s Wail
5 Bloodbond March
6 Chalice of the Void
7 Mimic Vat
8 Omniscience
9 Vedalken Orrery
10 Mirror of Fate
11 Karn, Silver Golem
12 Perpetual Timepiece
13 Allay
14 Skull of Orm
15 Mirrorworks
16 Mana Vault
17 Obelisk of Bant
18 Metallurgeon
19 Battle Cry
20 Rebuild
21 Goblin Dark-Dwellers
22 Boggart Mob
23 Razorfin Abolisher
24 Bramblewood Paragon
25 Jade Bearer
26 Verdant Succession
27 Engineered Explosives
28 Salvaging Station
30 Acorn Harvest
31 Into Thin Air
32 Brace for Impact
33 Child of Alara
34 Apothecary Geist
35 Iname As One
36 Spellweaver Helix
37 Worldfire
38 Spider Spawning
39 Spider Spawning
40 Spider Spawning
41 Molderhulk
42 Divine Congregation
43 Wormfang Behemoth
44 Bayou
45 Eureka
46 Mox Emerald
47 Polluted Dead
48 Frightshroud Courier
50 Ghosthelm Courier
51 Devout Chaplain
52 Royal Assassin
53 Simian Spirit Guide
54 Goblin Kites
55 Old Man of the Sea
56 Xathrid Gorgon
57 Tribal Unity
58 Thousand-Year Storm
59 Consecrated Sphinx
60 Reforge the Soul
Edit: Hmm, we need to be able to bring Bramblewood Paragon back after the megastage transition, but that requires Verdant Succession triggers. So we need to use up an Engineered Explosives with two counters, which is one less time destroying Jade Bearer. That tilts things one too many in the opposite direction, and we wind up one Engineered Explosives short. I think we can fix that by just going back to the Smite the Monstrous configuration, allowing Goblin Dark-Dwellers to be bounced back to our hand.
2 Psychic Battle
3 Cowardice
4 Horobi, Death’s Wail
5 Bloodbond March
6 Chalice of the Void
7 Mimic Vat
8 Omniscience
9 Vedalken Orrery
10 Mirror of Fate
11 Karn, Silver Golem
12 Perpetual Timepiece
13 Allay
14 Skull of Orm
15 Mirrorworks
16 Mana Vault
17 Obelisk of Bant
18 Metallurgeon
19 Battle Cry
20 Rebuild
21 Goblin Dark-Dwellers
22 Boggart Mob
23 Razorfin Abolisher
24 Bramblewood Paragon
25 Jade Bearer
26 Verdant Succession
27 Engineered Explosives
28 Salvaging Station
30 Acorn Harvest
31 Smite the Monstrous
32 Child of Alara
33 Basilica Bell-Haunt
34 Iname As One
35 Spellweaver Helix
36 Worldfire
37 Spider Spawning
38 Spider Spawning
39 Panharmonicon
40 Molderhulk
41 Divine Congregation
42 Wormfang Behemoth
43 Bayou
44 Eureka
45 Mox Emerald
46 Polluted Dead
47 Frightshroud Courier
48 Havengul Runebinder
49 Ghosthelm Courier
51 Royal Assassin
52 Simian Spirit Guide
53 Goblin Kites
54 Old Man of the Sea
55 Xathrid Gorgon
56 Tribal Unity
57 Thousand-Year Storm
58 Military Intelligence
59 World at War
60 Reforge the Soul
Edit: Looking at the Soul Foundry deck, it looks like Wirewood Herald could be made to work without Verdant Succession; we create a token copy of Wirewood Herald, then each sacrifice of Engineered Explosives will destroy both the original Wirewood Herald and the token copy, allowing us to create another token copy and bring both Wirewood Herald and Godtoucher back to our hand. But we can't do this without using a first Engineered Explosives to create the first token, and we can't bring Godtoucher back to our hand then. So that uses up one usage of Engineered Explosives. That should make things even, so long as we can't bounce Goblin Dark-Dwellers back to our hand. That gives us something like:
2 Psychic Battle
3 Cowardice
4 Brudiclad, Telchor Engineer
5 Bloodbond March
6 Broken Ambitions
7 Soul Foundry
8 Omniscience
9 Vedalken Orrery
10 Pull from Eternity
11 Izzet Guildmage
12 Karn, Silver Golem
13 Canal Dredger
14 Mimic Vat
15 Ray of Revelation
16 Skull of Orm
17 Mana Vault
18 Obelisk of Bant
19 Metallurgeon
20 Battle Cry
21 Rebuild
22 Goblin Dark-Dwellers
23 Boggart Mob
24 Godtoucher
25 Wirewood Herald
26 Engineered Explosives
27 Salvaging Station
29 Acorn Harvest
30 Into Thin Air
31 Brace for Impact
32 Thousand-Year Storm
33 Child of Alara
34 Iname As One
35 Apothecary Geist
36 Goryo's Vengeance
37 Spellweaver Helix
38 Worldfire
39 Spider Spawning
40 Spider Spawning
41 Spider Spawning
42 Molderhulk
43 Divine Congregation
44 Wormfang Behemoth
45 Bayou
46 Eureka
47 Mox Emerald
49 Frightshroud Courier
50 Havengul Runebinder
51 Ghosthelm Courier
52 Devout Chaplain
53 Royal Assassin
54 Simian Spirit Guide
55 Goblin Kites
56 Old Man of the Sea
57 Xathrid Gorgon
58 Tribal Unity
59 Consecrated Sphinx
60 Reforge the Soul
Man, even with green creatures and creatures with power 4 back in play, I can't seem to improve on what we already have. One more one-creature stage would allow seven stages, but I can't seem to find one.
But yeah, getting the potential for more stages doesn't help if we don't have room. I was hoping that maybe we could get more one-card stages though; I guess we would need at least two more to turn a profit.
I'm sure that Iijil was correct, but I'm not seeing why at the moment. Once you play the Champion, everything after it is a triggered ability. You resolve the first Bloodbond March trigger to bring the Champion back into play, which triggers the Champion abilities; resolving those will exile the Dark-Dwellers and sacrifice the Champion, triggering the Dark-Dwellers to come back. This in turn triggers our spell or spells. Throughout this whole chain of events, we can keep having the Dark-Dwellers cast Battle Cry, which is fine, that's what's supposed to happen; if at any point we cast Rebuild, we are stuck without Vedalken Orrery until the nearest point at which we could have put a Mirrorworks ability, which is below all the Bloodbond March triggers.
If the above is wrong and Panharmonicon is indeed unsafe, then how is Natural Order gaining us a bunch of life? I only see how to gain 3, by sacrificing Harbinger of Spring or Forked-Branch Garami to fetch the lifegain Spirit once.
Ah, the Sea Snidd doesn't work once we have access to all the colors, a pity. Something I have been thinking about, is to replace Smite the Monstrous with Into Thin Air and Brace for Impact. That would free up all the creatures with power >= 4 for the later stages, although we would lose multicolored creatures. That would also mean we would be unable to bounce our gigastage creatures with power >=4, which look to be Goblin Dark-Dwellers and Horobi, Death's Wail. (Child of Alara and Molderhulk are of course multicolored.) The Dark-Dwellers can be Championed under Boggart Mob, and in fact we have to do so now. For Horobi, I guess we can use Forked-Branch Garami to retrieve Horobi and our lifegain spirit at the same time?
If that works, I guess we can add another stage using Dralnu's Crusade into Mad Auntie. So maybe:
2 Psychic Battle
3 Cowardice
4 Horobi, Death’s Wail
5 Bloodbond March
6 Chalice of the Void
7 Mimic Vat
8 Omniscience
9 Vedalken Orrery
10 Mirror of Fate
11 Karn, Silver Golem
12 Perpetual Timepiece
13 Allay
14 Skull of Orm
15 Mirrorworks
16 Mana Vault
17 Obelisk of Bant
18 Metallurgeon
19 Battle Cry
20 Rebuild
21 Goblin Dark-Dwellers
22 Boggart Mob
23 Razorfin Abolisher
24 Bramblewood Paragon
25 Jade Bearer
26 Verdant Succession
27 Engineered Explosives
28 Salvaging Station
30 Acorn Harvest
31 Into Thin Air
32 Brace for Impact
33 Child of Alara
34 Apothecary Geist
35 Forked-Branch Garami
36 Forked-Branch Garami
37 Spellweaver Helix
38 Worldfire
39 Spider Spawning
40 Spider Spawning
41 Panharmonicon
42 Molderhulk
43 Natural Order
44 Bayou
45 Eureka
46 Mox Emerald
47 Goblin Gardener
48 Mad Auntie
50 Frightshroud Courier
51 Havengul Runebinder
52 Ghosthelm Courier
53 Devout Chaplain
54 Royal Assassin
55 Simian Spirit Guide
56 Goblin Kites
57 Old Man of the Sea
58 Xathrid Gorgon
59 Tribal Unity
60 Thousand-Year Storm
61 Reforge the Soul
Hmm, one card over. But, perhaps with our extra creature space we can find another one-card stage?
As for those extra Engineered Explosives - I was kinda counting on what you said before about the Verdant Succession soaking up two uses, but which I have forgotten the exact details about. Could you go over again how this worked in the Moggcatcher / Azban Falconer deck?
@Stakfish: I was wondering if there was some other life-gaining creature that we could use, and I think I have a possible solution: use Basilica Bell-Haunt to gain 3 life, and then use Iname, Life Aspect or some other Soulshift 4+ creature with at least 4 power to return it to our hand. This looks like it might be dangerous, since it separates the life gain from the action of Child of Alara destroying everything - but we need to use Child of Alara to destroy Basilica Bell-Haunt. So after destroying and exiling Iname to gain 3 life from BBH, we still need to go through a Child of Alara destruction to get BBH off the battlefield. I don't see a way to abuse this.
Assuming that works, we can get our Worldfire versions working again, and even with one more card slot. So I think we are back up to 7 stages again.
Right now you have:
Layer 1: each token creation can create an exponentially increasing number of Doubling Seasons.
Layer 2: Each Runaway Steam-Kin ability creates a lot of mana, which can be used to activate the Guildmage many times.
Layer 3: Each red spell triggers many Runaway Steam-Kins.
Now, since Layer 3 is based on the number of Steam-Kins, to get to Layer 4 or beyond you need to update the number of Steam-Kins accordingly - but this is really easy with your populate ability!
Stakfish: Hey, if we switch over to Worldpurge, maybe using Dual Nature is safe in some decks? The reason we switched out of using Dual Nature was I believe Child of Alara? But, maybe it could be possible to use Dual Nature with Child of Alara.
Now, when Child of Alara is in our hand, we can get a free destruction of Child of Alara by playing it, getting a token copy, then legend-ruling one or the other. So when Child of Alara goes back to our hand - basically, when we cast Worldpurge or use a higher-stage creature - we can get an extra mana. So the gigastage transition will allow for an extra green mana. Problematic, but perhaps not insurmountable?
However, Dual Nature is still not safe in some decks. In the Soul Foundry deck, Brudiclad tokens give all tokens haste, which is too good with Dual Nature. And your deck has Goryo's Vengeance, which can easily fetch Child of Alara for it to be destroyed again. Does your deck need to have Goryo's Vengeance?
Edit: Okay, I made a Worldpurge version of the Soul Foundry deck:
2 Psychic Battle
3 Cowardice
4 Brudiclad, Telchor Engineer
5 Bloodbond March
6 Broken Ambitions
7 Soul Foundry
8 Omniscience
9 Vedalken Orrery
10 Pull from Eternity
11 Izzet Guildmage
12 Karn, Silver Golem
13 Canal Dredger
14 Mimic Vat
15 Phantatog
16 Skull of Orm
17 Mana Vault
18 Obelisk of Esper
19 Metallurgeon
20 Battle Cry
21 Rebuild
22 Goblin Dark-Dwellers
23 Boggart Mob
24 Godtoucher
25 Wirewood Herald
26 Verdant Succession
27 Engineered Explosives
28 Salvaging Station
30 Roar of the Wurm
31 Smite the Monstrous
32 Thousand-Year Storm
33 Child of Alara
34 Harbinger of Spring
35 Harbinger of Spring
36 Elvish Spirit Guide
37 Spellweaver Helix
38 Worldpurge
39 Acorn Harvest
40 Acorn Harvest
41 Panharmonicon
42 Molderhulk
43 Rude Awakening
44 Radiant Fountain
45 Glimmerpost
46 Wormfang Behemoth
47 Breeding Pool
48 Eureka
49 Mana Crypt
51 Frightshroud Courier
52 Havengul Runebinder
53 Ghosthelm Courier
54 Devout Chaplain
55 Royal Assassin
56 Old Man of the Sea
57 Xathrid Gorgon
58 Tribal Unity
59 Consecrated Sphinx
60 Words of Wisdom
Only five stages - it does look like Worldfire is a little more compact, if you don't need too many cards to bring things back.
Edit: The Bramblewood Paragon deck works out the same:
2 Psychic Battle
3 Cowardice
4 Horobi, Death's Wail
5 Bloodbond March
6 Cephalid Shrine
7 Mimic Vat
8 Omniscience
9 Vedalken Orrery
10 Mirror of Fate
11 Karn, Silver Golem
12 Perpetual Timepiece
13 Phantatog
14 Skull of Orm
15 Mirrorworks
16 Mana Vault
17 Obelisk of Esper
18 Metallurgeon
19 Battle Cry
20 Rebuild
21 Goblin Dark-Dwellers
22 Boggart Mob
23 Razorfin Abolisher
24 Jade Bearer
25 Verdant Succession
26 Bramblewood Paragon
27 Engineered Explosives
28 Salvaging Station
30 Roar of the Wurm
31 Smite the Monstrous
32 Thousand-Year Storm
33 Child of Alara
34 Harbinger of Spring
35 Harbinger of Spring
36 Elvish Spirit Guide
37 Spellweaver Helix
38 Worldpurge
39 Acorn Harvest
40 Acorn Harvest
41 Panharmonicon
42 Molderhulk
43 Rude Awakening
44 Radiant Fountain
45 Glimmerpost
46 Wormfang Behemoth
47 Breeding Pool
48 Eureka
49 Mana Crypt
51 Frightshroud Courier
52 Havengul Runebinder
53 Ghosthelm Courier
54 Devout Chaplain
55 Royal Assassin
56 Old Man of the Sea
57 Xathrid Gorgon
58 Tribal Unity
59 Consecrated Sphinx
60 Words of Wisdom
Stakfish: Oh, I see: when we tap Godtoucher or Razorfin Abolisher, we get a lot of Psychic Battle triggers, and each of them can bounce Boggart Mob back to our hand, which brings Goblin Dark-Dwellers back to the battlefield, allowing us to cast either Battle Cry or Rebuild. But, there is no point in casting Rebuild before the last targeting of Boggart Mob, since then we lose Vedalken Orrery, and can no longer do anything substantial until we resolve a Vedalken Orrery token. So I guess yeah, we don't really need Panharmonicon. But, since Panharmonicon doesn't lose us a card slot, we might as well keep it unless it causes problems; technically, it allows for a greater final number, even if that improvement is unnoticeable in the final estimate.
Also, I guess not having Panharmonicon prevents that problem I was mentioning with Natural Order. But, Natural Order doesn't help get back Nylea's Disciple either, since we can only cast Natural Order in the gigastage transition, and we can't afford to resolve all the way down to the previous gigastage transition to get Nylea's Disciple back.
@Stakfish: Just wondering if you saw my post #1894, where I asked how we could retrieve Nylea's Disciple after it gets exiled by Worldfire. If neither Nylea's Disciple nor Tireless Missionaries can be retrieved after Worldfire hits, then I guess both of my latest decks are currently nonworking. The only stage artifact that is currently usable is Metallurgeon, which requires white, and both Izzet Guildmage and Razorfin Abolisher require blue; the alternative to the Abolisher requires black. So we need three colors by the megastage, which rules out Centaur Safeguard, and I don't know what else to use for the life-gaining creature. I guess we could consider using Bramblewood Paragon + Abzan Falconer, maybe there's something we could make out of that.
Yeah, Wormfang Behemoth worried me a little too. But, the situation looks the same as for the megastage transition - we get an Engineered Explosives and Goblin Dark-Dwellers back in our hand, but this is supposed to be nullified by our need to create and use Verdant Succession triggers. Actually, can you go over again how our extra EE and GDD are normally used up in the megastage transition? That's a really important thing that we need to keep track of.
Switching over to Worldpurge is certainly always on the table. I believe the problem we were having is that we were using Elvish Spirit Guide to gain mana for the megastage transition, and using Worldpurge in the gigastage transition also brought Elvish Spirit Guide back to our hand, so that we wound up with an extra green mana afterwards. If we could use something else to gain green mana in the megastage transition, that might be useful.
@Stakfish: How is Nylea's Disciple supposed to work again? The problem I am seeing is that Worldfire will exile our Nylea's Disciples, and we have to get them back somehow. I was hoping that Verdant Succession could bring them back, but we can only trigger it by destroying a Child of Alara, and then we have to resolve all the Verdant Successions until we get to the creation of another Vedalken Orrery. So we can't store up Verdant Successions, and if we hold a Child of Alara destruction on the stack, the Nylea's Disciples won't be on the battlefield, so they won't trigger Verdant Succession. So Verdant Succession doesn't seem to solve the problem. Natural Order won't work since they can bring the Disciples back to the battlefield below the Worldfire, and we can gain life after dropping down to 1, and put an additional megastage on the stack, I think. So I don't know how we used Nylea's Disciple in previous decks.
On your Phyrexian Metamorph line, near the end you say "all MS but one copy", did you mean DS instead? I will assume that is the case.
So there will be plenty of mana for the initial cards. When you play Doubling Season, you get one copy via a Mirrorworks ability, which becomes two tokens. So you have three total. Then you get 8 Clever Impersonator tokens, which become Mirrorworks copies. Then, when Phyrexian Metamorph comes into play, it triggers all nine copies of Mirrorworks, allowing us to generate D Doubling Seasons, where D is between 2^^10 and 2^^11. Every creature from that point forward will generate 9 * 2^D token copies, which will be between 2^^11 and 2^^12. This will generate about C(9 * 2^D)^2 = 81C * 2^(2D) mana, which will also be between 2^^11 and 2^^12.
Next we come to Steady Progress and White Suns' Zenith. With Djinn Illuminatus maxed out and TYS, we will get between 2^^11 and 2^^12 copies of Steady Progress, each time drawing a White Sun's Zenith. If we have M mana before we cast WSZ, the best bet is to use M/2 mana on WSZ, and M/2 mana on Djinn Illuminatus, creating M/6 copies, and thus generating (M^2 * 2^D)/12 token Cats. This will generate about (M^2 * 2^D)^2/144 mana, or roughly M^4 mana since M is much greater than 2^D, and growing rapidly while 2^D is staying constant. So if we cast WSZ N times, we get about M^4^N mana at the end. So with between 2^^11 and 2^^12 casts, we get between 2^^13 and 2^^14 mana.
We get some more casts via Yawgmoth's Bargain and {c]Domri Rade[/c], but we only get 10 WSZ casts from YB and between 2^^11 and 2^^12 casts from Domri Rade, so we are still between 2^^13 and 2^^14.
Next up is Cackling Counterpart. First we use the TYS and DI copies and have them all target Doubling Season, and each copy takes X Doubling Seasons to about 2^X Doubling Seasons. So after more than 2^^13 copies we wind up with more than 2^^(2^^13) copies of Doubling Season. Then we start resolving the Precursor Golem triggers. Each one creates a copy for each Doubling Season, each of which takes X to 2^X, so we wind up taking X Doubling Seasons to roughly 2^^X Doubling Seasons. So we wind up appending "2^^" more than 2^^11 times to 2^^(2^^13), so we eventually get between 2^^^(2^^11) and 2^^^(2^^12) Doubling Seasons.
It's instructive at this point to look at how much mileage we got out of all the work we did to get more mana; the result is, the effect is unnoticeable. Yes, before the Precursor Golem triggers we wound up with 2^^(2^^13) Doubling Seasons rather than 2^^(2^^11) Doubling Seasons, which is noticeable if not an enormous difference; but, each Precursor Golem trigger appended a "2^^" to the numbers, and we had more than 2^^11 of them, so the difference between 13 and 11 becomes insignificant. Either way we wind up between 2^^^(2^^11) and 2^^^(2^^12) Doubling Seasons. So the mana isn't really making a significant impact here.
Neither is Seize the Day, which increases our mana, but not our Doubling Seasons, so the effect is unnoticable; basically our mana becomes roughly the square of our number of Doubling Seasons, and the squaring operation is completely unnoticeable for numbers at the triple arrow level. Also, we can't go into and out of combat while the stack is not empty, so we can't do this step while there are copies of Runic Repetition, activated abilities, or Mirrorworks or Bloodbond March triggers on the stack. So even if this step did something significant, it couldn't be recursed over with what follows next.
Runic Repetition can fetch Cackling Counterpart and gets lots of copies via DI and TYS, so it takes X to 2^^^^X. So the first time we cast it we produce more than X = 2^^^^(2^^^(2^^11)) copies of Doubling Season.
We then create roughly X Rowan Kenriths and Rowan Kenrith emblems (actually 2^X and 2^2^X respectively, but the difference is unnoticeable), and then create roughly X Chandra Ablazes. So we can cast Runic Repetition X times (technically 2^X * 2^2^X), to generate 2^^^^^(2^^^^(2^^^(2^^11))) Doubling Seasons.
We then create about Y copies of The Chain Veil. When we tap a single TCV, we get E copies where E is the number of Rowan Kenrith emblems, allowing us to activate each of R Rowan Kenriths E times each, generating 2^(RE) more emblems. So after Y such abilities we get roughly 2^^Y RK emblems at the end. This allows us to use Chandra roughly 2^^Y more times, allowing us to generate 2^^^^^(2^^Y) Doubling Seasons, or more than 2^^^^^(2^^^^^(2^^^^(2^^^(2^^11)))) Doubling Seasons.
You may notice that the arrows are not increasing as fast as one might expect. This is because the requirements to stack layers are not being met. Specifically, if, between each activation of Chandra Ablaze, we could update the number of Rowan Kenrith Emblems to roughly the number of Doubling Seasons in play, then each Chandra Ablaze could cast X Doubling Seasons and thus take X to 2^^^^^X, and then having X Chandras would take X to 2^^^^^^X. Then, if between each activation of a The Chain Veil we could increase the number of emblems or Chandras to roughly the number of Doubling Seasons, then X The Chain Veils would take X to 2^^^^^^^X. But, since we can't update any of our numbers, except when casting one of our permanents, we are stuck at the five arrow level.
Another problem is that are Planeswalkers require the stack to be empty to use their loyalty abilities. This means that we can't take advantage of any further recursion that requires abilities on the stack. So, while we might expect that Clever Impersonator would take us to six arrows because of Bloodbond March, and the exile cards would take us to seven because of DI and TYS copies, those extra layers only function properly if we can keep the Bloodbond March, DI, and TYS triggers on the stack, which we can't.
So, it looks like the best we can do is to have each of the CI and PM cards implement another X to 2^^^^^X, taking us to between 2^^^^^^11 and 2^^^^^^12 DSes. Then the exile cards can retrieve all 10 CI/PM/CA/TCV cards, allowing another 10 implementations of X to 2^^^^^X. So that takes us to between 2^^^^^^211 and 2^^^^^^212.
Unfortunately, this is less than your first two decks. I encourage you to look at what is creating layers and what isn't - some things that are interfering with layer creation are:
1) independent layers - in all your decks you have both doubling season creation and mana generation, and they never stack on top of each other. So we just wind up building on whatever is stronger, which is usual the doubling season creation. (Yes, it's true that the mana generated depends on the number of Doubling Seasons. But that mana never gets translated back into Doubling Seasons, which is necessary for stacking layers.)
2) Numbers not getting updated - It would be nice if having many Rowan Kenrith emblems or Mirrorworks tokens translated into layers. Unfortunately, they are not getting updated frequntly enough to count as layers, as I talked about above. I don't know how to fix that in this particular deck, but it is something to keep in mind. Rings of Brighthearth would be nice if you could update artifacts frequently, but of course you can't if you are using The Chain Veil to recurse over Chandra Ablaze.
3) stack needing to be cleared for combat or planeswalker abilities. I also don't know how to fix this in this deck - the obvious solution is Teferi, Temporal Archmage, but his second ability can untap The Chain Veil, so that's no good.
Anyway, best of luck!
Edit: Looking for creatures that we can't bounce and replay to protect from Worldfire, I suppose that we don't have any way to bounce Celestial Gatekeeper. So, it looks like we need to go back to Nylea's Disciple. Two Nylea's Disciple plus Arixmethes can substitute for two Celestial Gatekeepers plus Tireless Missionaries.
Also, the Soul Foundry deck doesn't have any easy way to bounce Izzet Guilmage it looks like. We can add Radiant Purge, but that takes another card slot, removing Consecrated Sphinx.
It would be nice if adding Radiant Purge allowed us to get rid of Ray of Revelation. After some thought, it does look like one copy of Psychic Battle is theoretically enough to implement the stage structure, and we won't need a bunch of Psychic Battles for Smite the Monstrous, since we have Thousand-Year Storm copies. But, with just one Psychic Battle we only get to bounce one artifact besides Metallurgeon, so we have only enough to bounce Obelisk of Bant once, paying just for the Metallurgeon. We will have nothing to pay for Karn, Silver Golem or Ray of Revelation, for instance.
2) Yes, this is correct.
3) DN does not care that the DN tokens were created from a CI card, it only checks for those tokens with that name. This is why it was so convenient in our previous decks to have Dual Nature and Copy Enchantment, we could freely bounce and replay the Copy Enchantment that would copy nothing, and not have to worry about Dual Nature getting rid of our tokens.
Edit: Looking to vet the latest decks - both the Soul Foundry and Bramblewood Paragon decks need the Goblin Dark-Dwellers to cast both Battle Cry and Rebuild, and we can't really be allowed to separate them, since no matter what ratio we are supposed to use, we can always tip the scales more towards Rebuild to create more stages in the lower hyperstage. So I think we need Panharmonicon in both decks. It can slide in easily enough by replacing the third Spider Spawning.
I don't think Panharmonicon causes any problems, since we don't have a Changeling Champion. Tireless Missionaries should still work, since it comes back when there are no other nonland permanents on the battlefield.
Edit: Since the decks do not have Muzzio, we need a way to bring back artifacts. Goblin Welder doesn't seem to work anymore, since we don't have an easy way to bring it back from the graveyard. We could add Goblin Welder and Dralnu's Crusade, but there are so many possible one card options that I figure at least one must work. Wormfang Behemoth should do the trick, we can bounce all the artifacts back to our hand, and then exile them with Wormfang Behemoth before Worldfire resolves. We still need to bring back Wormfang Behemoth with Bloodbond March triggers, so that safety net is still there.
To make room, we have to remove a stage from the stage sequence, but we can add Consecrated Sphinx back in.
I really hope that you can get the Changeling deck fixed, I like it a lot. I will think about it as well. What is allowing us to use Anaba Ancestor, is it having to bounce and replay Chalice of the Void?
2 Psychic Battle
3 Cowardice
4 Horobi, Death's Wail
5 Bloodbond March
6 Cephalid Shrine
7 Mimic Vat
8 Omniscience
9 Vedalken Orrery
10 Mirror of Fate
11 Karn, Silver Golem
12 Perpetual Timepiece
13 Ray of Revelation
14 Skull of Orm
15 Mirrorworks
16 Mana Vault
17 Obelisk of Bant
18 Metallurgeon
19 Battle Cry
20 Rebuild
21 Goblin Dark-Dwellers
22 Boggart Mob
23 Razorfin Abolisher
24 Tidal Courier
25 Jade Bearer
26 Bramblewood Paragon
27 Engineered Explosives
28 Salvaging Station
30 Acorn Harvest
31 Smite the Monstrous
32 Thousand-Year Storm
33 Child of Alara
34 Tireless Missionaries
35 Celestial Gatekeeper
36 Celestial Gatekeeper
37 Spellweaver Helix
38 Worldfire
39 Spider Spawning
40 Spider Spawning
41 Spider Spawning
42 Molderhulk
43 Divine Congregation
44 Bayou
45 Eureka
46 Mox Emerald
47 Polluted Dead
48 Frightshroud Courier
50 Ghosthelm Courier
51 Devout Chaplain
52 Royal Assassin
53 Simian Spirit Guide
54 Goblin Kites
55 Old Man of the Sea
56 Sea Snidd
57 Reign of Chaos
58 Xathrid Gorgon
59 Tribal Unity
60 Words of Wisdom
Same number of cards required as the Soul Foundry deck, but perhaps one or the other could be improved.