As someone who's really a Legacy player at heart and only play Modern fishies because "might as well", I run 3x maindeck disrupting shoal and 3-4x maindeck chalices to stay as close to Legacy as I can manage. Right now that style is just completely wrong because eldrazi, so I've been ducking out of Modern more than usual.
I'm with you on that. Before the spaghetti overlords came out of hiding, I was running 3 maindeck Chalice and 2 Ghost Quarter, which is equivalent to what I run in Legacy (except Wasteland) and the deck felt amazing. I haven't tried Disrupting Shoal, but it's become more appealing. Given that we don't often have many cards in hand, do you find yourself hardcasting it? I worry about the limited range of converted mana costs in Merfolk.
Moving to modern, you primarily lose Fiery Confluence (which is truly amazing) and the Sol lands. This both slows us down initially and prevents us from being able to sweep more easily and flexibly. Plus, I've lived the dream and ultimated Chandra into Fiery Confluence more times than I can count and it's beyond ruthless.
As I've been thinking about how to bring this into modern, it feels like the bridge/chalice/moon strategy is really effective for locking people out, but it will struggle in closing out the game fast enough. I've been testing Fanatic of Mogis with the Splinter Twin/Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker engine, which often wins in two turns. Fanatic is large enough it cannot be abrupt decayed, and ideally chalice blocks it from a bolt or path, though burn decks can shoot it with a helix or Searing Blaze. However, there are times when Fantatic doesn't hit for much, which makes me feel like I'd rather lean more on Jaya Ballard and the redundancy of this deck. If we increase most things to 3-ofs and integrate burn spells (even exquisite firecraft perhaps), we can leverage our planeswalkers and allow for the people on the ground to shoot things over the bridge.
I would highly recommend running 3+ Chalices in the sideboard at the least. While people are all fixated on Eldrazi, you have to remember all the other decks that are out there. Chalice hoses Infect. I also run 3 Hurkyl's Recall, both for Affinity as well as Lantern (which is large in my area). YMMV but that could merit inclusion as well.
I've been testing versions of this on MTGO and hopefully will get a chance to on paper soon. I really like the inclusion of Mizzium Mortars. How do you feel with 6 sweepers in the deck? Do you tend to aim slagstorm at the opponent?
Raystack thanks for all the feedback. You're right about the lack of mana with Flamespeaker, but usually Chalice and Blood Moon is such a lock that not being able to cast things off Flamespeaker is not a huge issue.
I do like your point about Bridge and I think that's something I haven't had to face much yet. I think if I were to go to the bridge route, I'd probably focus more on the Hangarback/Pia and Kiran plan, since 1/1 thopters will make their way over the bridge. I could also see Rabblemaster being helpful in that spot, since he can sneak under.
With regards to sweepers, are you running those main or in the side?
So, changes may include
- 4 Kargan Dragonlord
- 4 Prophetic Flamespeaker
- 2 Swords
I'm not sure about Magma Jet versus Arc Trail. I've often been using Magma Jet during combat in concern with first strike damage to kill bigger creatures, then letting flamespeaker swing through with trample, but I could see arc trail being more helpful. I may just switch that to Dismember though.
I'm also thinking that using Pia and Kiran + Thopters may mean you could run maindeck Ensaring Bridge with Phyrexian Revoker (for more fuel) if our spaghetti overlords become a problem. I may run Roast/Dismember over Magma Jet or try to include them in the SB, but that's still up for testing. The upside of Hangarback has been that I'm able to block a lot more things and focus on being proactive with Flamespeaker.
I'm running 20 lands at the moment. I run 2 Ghost Quarter mainboard, so I don't want to let my U sources dip too low.
Are you running those in place of Cavern? I'm also running 2 GQ with 20 lands, but brought them in for Wanderwine Hub since I play 3 MD Chalice. Wondering if Mutavault + 2 Cavern + 2 GQ is too much brown mana. -_-
8Rack
Storm
Boomerain (I guess this is an LD deck?)
KikkiChord
Esper Bounce
Boggles
Grixis Delver
Goblin Burn X 2
Anafenza Rally
HeartlessSummoning/Eldrazi
Burn
Ant (tendrils-less)
That is.... a random mish-mash of nonsense. My first thought, is that I would expect next week's (assuming I fill out the deck) non-sense to be essentially unrelated.
What would you do for optional/slots sideboard against this:
Spell Pierce looks > Vapor Snag (random combo decks). Would you put 2 Vapor Snag in the board?
Phantasmal Image better or worse than Tidebinder in the main?
I don't have a Kira, should I buy one?
Ghost Quarter and Tech Edge don't seem that good... I did pick up a Sea Gate Wreckage last night.
Hurkyll's Recall seems unnecessary (but I will probably pick them up just in case). It turns out I have Pithing Needles and Ratchet Bombs, but wasn't planning on putting them in 75.
We play at the same LGS! Would I know you from Tuesday Legacy events? Let me know if you ever want to borrow the deck. My list is in my sig.
I'd say that I would favor Phantasmal Image over Tidebinder Mage in the mainboard, but both of them should probably be in your deck. I strongly favor 4 Tidebinder Mage in the sideboard, but that's a personal preference.
Kira, Great Glass-Spinner is a helpful card, and most decks carry 1 or 2. I'm not running any, though, and I think the consensus is that it might not be super well-positioned in the coming metagame. I'd get them if you can find them cheaply, but don't stress about it too much.
Ghost Quarter and Tectonic Edge don't look like much at first glance, but they severely inconvenience the likes of Eldrazi and Tron, as well as anyone running manlands (and there are a lot of them - Raging Ravine, Celestial Colonnade, Blinkmoth Nexus, Inkmoth Nexus, the list goes on and on). Ghost Quarter is typically easier to sneak into your mainboard, whereas Tectonic Edge usually comes in as a haymaker out of your sideboard.
+1 to all of this, especially about lands. I run 2 ghost quarter main with 20 land.
I am thinking of trading in most of my Tron staples for the Merfolk deck. Never really played aggro before (Jund, Twin, etc. is what I have played mainly).
The deck seems fairly well positioned now, and honestly it looks like a fun deck that is safe to buy into.
What are the main strengths and weaknesses of this deck? Is Affinity the only real bad match up?
I would definitely encourage you to read the primer page, which I think has been updated since the bannings, as well as head back to about page 58 (or wherever the day is of the bannings) and read our thoughts about this deck in the new modern meta.
IMO - The deck is very well positioned against many of the current T1 decks (Burn, Affinity, Infect, Tron, Eldrazi), with Affinity depending on how may Hurkyl's Recalls you run and who draws what cards.
The biggest strengths of Merfolk are that it is a deck that grows exponentially (each Lord gives you another body and +1/+1 across the board) and that the creatures are often evasive (thanks Spreading Seas!). The deck has a lot of flexibility in that it can play a controlling role (I run 3 main deck Chalice of the Void) and shut down opponents' plans, or play a more aggressive role or even play tempo. With Aether Vial, we're not as mana hungry as some of the other creature decks, so we're able to play more than 1 creature/spell per turn, often for tremendous value (Harbinger, Tidebinder, Master of Waves). The deck is also quite consistent.
Our biggest weakness (from my perspective) is wrath effects and a plated Etched Champion. Because we are able to create critical mass, a mid-game Supreme Verdict is pretty detrimental and we just don't have a lot of tools to deal with an Etched Champion, aside from Mutavault - though we can do a lot about Cranial Plating.
I'll defer to Fanattic, Rothgar13, CoBTyrannon, Nikachu_, and Bearscape for a more informed take.
I see a lot of people maindecking one or two Phantasmal Images. Why not use 4 Phantasmal Images now? Especially when we have such creature heavy builds.
2 seems to be en vogue right now because it offers a good mix of flexibility without flooding them in your hand. It's also hard to have too many of them because you don't get the benefit of Path when they're targeted, etc. You also need enough creatures to actually target, so if your hand is Cursecatcher, Image, Image or even Silvergil, Image, Image, you're in trouble.
That said, they have a lot of utility (if you go a few pages back you can see all the fun creatures we've copied), so perhaps running an extra in the board is worth exploring. For those of us that also play Merfolk in Legacy, 3 is often the right number, but I find them to more often copy other creatures in Legacy, whereas in modern I tend to want another Lord, Master of Waves, and occasionally Cursecatcher (saved me against UW Control yesterday).
I think the Ghost Quarters main is too ambitious with all that brown mana, otherwise it seems fine
My manabase is similar, except -2 Wanderwine Hub, + 1 Island, + 1 Minamo and I haven't been having issues casting blue spells. That said, I'm not playing with spell pierce main, so I'm okay with T1 not being an island. YMMV.
I could definitely see moving a Dismember to the side for an Echoing Truth in the main. Master of Waves has, so far, been the most awkward card in my sideboard. Considering changing it to a Warping Wail to have another card to bring in for Scapeshift, Elves, and Infect or Hibernation.
I ended up maindecking Echoing Truth after the amount of times I wanted to dismember two things (double goyf, rhino, etc) and realizing that the time I buy from bouncing those creatures would be more than worth it. Excited to see how this goes for you.
Decided not to go with Warping Wail for regionals. Hurkyl's Recall works really well with Chalice of the Void and also hits Lantern Control besides just hitting Affinity. Chalice and Phantasmal Image have been game 1 all-stars so far in about 100 or so games.
I really like the look of this. Excited to hear how it shakes out for you. I'm not a huge fan of Dismember right now MD (I play Echoing Truth) but I think it's meta dependent.
I'm with you on that. Before the spaghetti overlords came out of hiding, I was running 3 maindeck Chalice and 2 Ghost Quarter, which is equivalent to what I run in Legacy (except Wasteland) and the deck felt amazing. I haven't tried Disrupting Shoal, but it's become more appealing. Given that we don't often have many cards in hand, do you find yourself hardcasting it? I worry about the limited range of converted mana costs in Merfolk.
I play something very similar in Legacy and have been trying to figure out how to port over the deck with a stronger finish. Here's the legacy list:
4x Ancient Tomb
4x City of Traitors
10x Mountain
4x Chalice of the Void
4x Blood Moon
4x Chrome Mox
4x Ensnaring Bridge
4x Magus of the Moon
4x Simian Spirit Guide
4x Magma Jet
2x Sudden Shock
4x Fiery Confluence
2x Chandra, Pyromaster
4x Koth of the Hammer
2x Boil
2x Dismember
3x Faerie Macabre
2x Null Rod
3x Tormod's Crypt
3x Trinisphere
Moving to modern, you primarily lose Fiery Confluence (which is truly amazing) and the Sol lands. This both slows us down initially and prevents us from being able to sweep more easily and flexibly. Plus, I've lived the dream and ultimated Chandra into Fiery Confluence more times than I can count and it's beyond ruthless.
As I've been thinking about how to bring this into modern, it feels like the bridge/chalice/moon strategy is really effective for locking people out, but it will struggle in closing out the game fast enough. I've been testing Fanatic of Mogis with the Splinter Twin/Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker engine, which often wins in two turns. Fanatic is large enough it cannot be abrupt decayed, and ideally chalice blocks it from a bolt or path, though burn decks can shoot it with a helix or Searing Blaze. However, there are times when Fantatic doesn't hit for much, which makes me feel like I'd rather lean more on Jaya Ballard and the redundancy of this deck. If we increase most things to 3-ofs and integrate burn spells (even exquisite firecraft perhaps), we can leverage our planeswalkers and allow for the people on the ground to shoot things over the bridge.
My thought of what that could look like:
4 Ghost Quarter
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Blood Moon
4 Ensnaring Bridge
4 Magma Jet
4 Exquisite Firecraft
3 Koth of the Hammer
3 Chandra, Pyromaster
3 Jaya Ballard, Task Mage
2 Magus of the Moon
or even:
4 Ghost Quarter
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Blood Moon
4 Ensnaring Bridge
3 Magma Jet
2 Exquisite Firecraft
3 Splinter Twin
2 Chandra, Pyromaster
4 Simian Spirit Guide
4 Fanatic of Mogis
2 Magus of the Moon
This could be a terrible line of reasoning, but I'd love your feedback on this.
Very delayed, but I use the 1/0 Elementals that came in theros. However, RK Post makes custom tokens, at least one of which is a 1/0 Elemental - http://www.rkpost.net/#!product/prd1/4043829341/t213-classic-elemental-4-token
How did rabblemaster perform for you? Would you rather have had a different creature?
I do like your point about Bridge and I think that's something I haven't had to face much yet. I think if I were to go to the bridge route, I'd probably focus more on the Hangarback/Pia and Kiran plan, since 1/1 thopters will make their way over the bridge. I could also see Rabblemaster being helpful in that spot, since he can sneak under.
With regards to sweepers, are you running those main or in the side?
So, changes may include
- 4 Kargan Dragonlord
- 4 Prophetic Flamespeaker
- 2 Swords
+ 3 (4?) Ensnaring Bridge
+ 3 Phyrexian Revoker
+ 4 Goblin Rabblemaster
I'm not sure about Magma Jet versus Arc Trail. I've often been using Magma Jet during combat in concern with first strike damage to kill bigger creatures, then letting flamespeaker swing through with trample, but I could see arc trail being more helpful. I may just switch that to Dismember though.
Here's a potential update:
4x Goblin Rabblemaster
4x Hangarback Walker
2x Magus of the Moon
3x Pia and Kiran Nalaar
4x Simian Spirit Guide
2x Spellskite
Land (20)
16x Mountain
4x Mutavault
4x Desperate Ritual
2x Dismember
Sorcery (3)
1x Earthquake
2x Slagstorm
Artifact (8)
4x Chalice of the Void
4x Ensnaring Bridge
Enchantment (4)
4x Blood Moon
1x Dismember
3x Painter's Servant
2x Phyrexian Revoker
2x Roast
3x Shattering Spree
2x Tormod's Crypt
2x Trinisphere
EDIT: Now that I'm thinking about it and going down this road, it may make sense to run 3-4 Shrapnel Blast to make use of all these robots.
4x Hangarback Walker
4x Kargan Dragonlord
3x Magus of the Moon
3x Pia and Kiran Nalaar
4x Prophetic Flamespeaker
4x Simian Spirit Guide
4x Blood Moon
Instant (8)
4x Desperate Ritual
4x Magma Jet
Artifact (6)
4x Chalice of the Void
2x Sword of War and Peace
Land (20)
4x Cavern of Souls
16x Mountain
3x Damping Matrix
3x Pyroclasm
2x Roast
3x Shattering Spree
2x Tormod's Crypt
2x Trinisphere
I'm also thinking that using Pia and Kiran + Thopters may mean you could run maindeck Ensaring Bridge with Phyrexian Revoker (for more fuel) if our spaghetti overlords become a problem. I may run Roast/Dismember over Magma Jet or try to include them in the SB, but that's still up for testing. The upside of Hangarback has been that I'm able to block a lot more things and focus on being proactive with Flamespeaker.
Are you running those in place of Cavern? I'm also running 2 GQ with 20 lands, but brought them in for Wanderwine Hub since I play 3 MD Chalice. Wondering if Mutavault + 2 Cavern + 2 GQ is too much brown mana. -_-
We play at the same LGS! Would I know you from Tuesday Legacy events? Let me know if you ever want to borrow the deck. My list is in my sig.
+1 to all of this, especially about lands. I run 2 ghost quarter main with 20 land.
I would definitely encourage you to read the primer page, which I think has been updated since the bannings, as well as head back to about page 58 (or wherever the day is of the bannings) and read our thoughts about this deck in the new modern meta.
IMO - The deck is very well positioned against many of the current T1 decks (Burn, Affinity, Infect, Tron, Eldrazi), with Affinity depending on how may Hurkyl's Recalls you run and who draws what cards.
The biggest strengths of Merfolk are that it is a deck that grows exponentially (each Lord gives you another body and +1/+1 across the board) and that the creatures are often evasive (thanks Spreading Seas!). The deck has a lot of flexibility in that it can play a controlling role (I run 3 main deck Chalice of the Void) and shut down opponents' plans, or play a more aggressive role or even play tempo. With Aether Vial, we're not as mana hungry as some of the other creature decks, so we're able to play more than 1 creature/spell per turn, often for tremendous value (Harbinger, Tidebinder, Master of Waves). The deck is also quite consistent.
Our biggest weakness (from my perspective) is wrath effects and a plated Etched Champion. Because we are able to create critical mass, a mid-game Supreme Verdict is pretty detrimental and we just don't have a lot of tools to deal with an Etched Champion, aside from Mutavault - though we can do a lot about Cranial Plating.
I'll defer to Fanattic, Rothgar13, CoBTyrannon, Nikachu_, and Bearscape for a more informed take.
2 seems to be en vogue right now because it offers a good mix of flexibility without flooding them in your hand. It's also hard to have too many of them because you don't get the benefit of Path when they're targeted, etc. You also need enough creatures to actually target, so if your hand is Cursecatcher, Image, Image or even Silvergil, Image, Image, you're in trouble.
That said, they have a lot of utility (if you go a few pages back you can see all the fun creatures we've copied), so perhaps running an extra in the board is worth exploring. For those of us that also play Merfolk in Legacy, 3 is often the right number, but I find them to more often copy other creatures in Legacy, whereas in modern I tend to want another Lord, Master of Waves, and occasionally Cursecatcher (saved me against UW Control yesterday).
My manabase is similar, except -2 Wanderwine Hub, + 1 Island, + 1 Minamo and I haven't been having issues casting blue spells. That said, I'm not playing with spell pierce main, so I'm okay with T1 not being an island. YMMV.
I ended up maindecking Echoing Truth after the amount of times I wanted to dismember two things (double goyf, rhino, etc) and realizing that the time I buy from bouncing those creatures would be more than worth it. Excited to see how this goes for you.
I really like the look of this. Excited to hear how it shakes out for you. I'm not a huge fan of Dismember right now MD (I play Echoing Truth) but I think it's meta dependent.