Don't forget Persist, and the Creature - Spike. And to flesh it out further, Modular, Proliferate (with and without Poison),
....
....
....
*cough* Cave of Temptation, Weapon Rack
Al and Humphrey are both right and wrong on Captured by Lagnacs-
Does a better Pacifism need to be multicolored?
Does it fit in the Top 3 GW cards? Top 4?
Is your GW made for Aggro-Midrange?
Does White support Search/Recurring auras?
All these need to qualify the card. It is not any different than other great multi cards that are simply souped-up mono cards but now take up a multi slot.
I would call it Cubeable. But GW is arguably the most bloated guild in pauper. You can make a Top 10 and still have honorable mentions. The issue comes down to how many multi slots, and does it replace a unique card.
*My GW is Pridemage, Cloak and Travel Prep. So this semi competes with Travel Prep and Cloak, I am unwilling to cut either, so I would have to look at going to 4 cards in Multi. Maybe this set FINALLY makes it viable.
I appreciate the sentiment and approach. But after the changes, slips in balancing, and so on, I simply have lost faith that they will be redeemed. The Death Corona thing was already cringeworthy. Now they are erasing without compassion for long time players. Wait a year and see what a complete set with those now "missing" cards will be worth.
To me this is a new Reserved List without unilateral action. I agree on the premise that some subjects are touchy. But it is not up to WotC to mind wipe 25 years of cards as they see fit. They took a knee is a mostly harmless way, but as they have said "ignoring the secondary market". Those cards are now harder to get. And we have seen when they make statements like that the market over speculates and never retreats.
TCGPlayer and SCG, and Card Kingdom have either Out of Stock or removed the cards in question. What we are seeing signals a far worse implimented plan. I know I sound like a lunatic. And will not be offended being called one. But as the saying goes:
"Stand for something, or you'll fall for anything"
Does anyone here have a desire to outright buy a foil cube plus like 200+ extra foil commons that are applicable?
I am leaving MtG and all WotC products permanently, and deleting my account here as I cannot comply with those who would disrespect their customers as they have. PM me if you want to Tender a serious offer for an all foil cube including landeskog and a few proxy foils for non-foilable cards.
It has been fun, and I will miss the interactions.
@Reinventing:
I do not deny the math. In fact I happily run multiple common fetches. But in standard limited, Looking at the ability to turn a 40 card deck into essentially a slow 39 is not the only thing that is needed to make it better. Yes, if supplemented with draw, and other search it can matter more. But a single fetch does not carry over a back braking advantage. It is almost like a nice addition because it is a 5c land, but as mentioned it is a tapped one.
The math is their. Just not as high of a priority as "first pickz"; imo
I REALLY like Fire prophecy. Non-player burn basically cannot make Staple unless it is ridiculous. See Flame Slash. And that is not even ubiquitous. I am glad there is better card filter options in Red. But it is not going to be as big a threat as say Magma Jet.
@Deck Thinning (E. Wilds)
It is advantage, but it takes so long to prove it that it is more of an overhyped math claim than a result.
@Mutate:
I am still trying Tom wrap my head around a proper evaluation. I think once prerelease... oh, wait... once we hear more reports trickle in, we will all be reevaluating what these do. I found spots for all 5 as they are somewhere between Ninja and Sorcery Buffs.
*Reprints are reprints. Seldom does one gain or lose value unless something major happens
If you want to be bold and use the Bad/Borderline/Cubeable system, it helps us revisit our own views and discuss. I too give high praise for Borderline cards, but still need to admit they are not necessary adds.
Update Notes:
One of the easiest ones to date as most of these are lateral "upgrades". Mutate is not a mechanic I want to adopt. However, for the context of this, it is just an 'upgrade' to Aggro/Midrange early bodies. No real ideologies change, and I just have to consider Pyroceratops as a slot that needs forced in.
Rules Note:
Mutate is a nightmare. On the positive side, these things can upgrade Hexproof bodies, have "Haste" if the creature they are going on Top of has been under your control since beginning of turn... But no shenanigans with Faceless Butcher. I mean these will single-handedly cause some of the most headche-inducing explanations since Conspiracy.
Increasing the validity of Tokens and "Army in a Can" bodies is intriguing. I think all are worth testing and may surprise us in how often then are valid.
I would hope alsomthat taking a step back to review your own words you can see that there is a somewhat standoffish opinion when challeneged to do your own complete review.
Waste of energy? We are one of the smallest factions of MtG besides dead formats. There is one major player in Pauper Cube, we are not it. All of our energy is wasted energy. But, as a select set of passionate, and often in disagreement group, extra investments of energy when applicable help the group as a whole. So, if you do not feel my sense makes much sense, or simply disagree, then you are welcomed by everyone here to also invest the hours it takes to maintain, update, format, and debate thr Evaluate Everything situation we have. It has to be a group effort or it is null.
As a comment on your numerous involvements across the numerous topics here, you often have the last say many times. If that energy can be channeled into the banal task of ALL cards in the given set every few months, then this would likely be others criticizing your opinions. I welcome a challenge. I am always over valuing specific things. So I do need to be challeneged. But I take the time to form and explain my side, reconsider, and find a settling point.
Like a good family, we should not argue in front of the newer members. But healthy discourse can build us back up.
TL;DR
Optics do not look great if you want to throw stones and not do the work as well.
Please helps us do more, by investing the keystrokes instead of dismissing the efforts.
As aggressive as your cube. I did not say it was gospel.
The Cat is in the Doomed Traveller / Hunted Witness camp. The details are marginally different and while it is the worst overall of the 3, I do not see it really needing spelled out. I can accept if others do. Edit: Also, Tukatongue Thallid
And a rebuttal evaluation is always welcomed. I look forward to your write up.
Wingfold Pteron - [-]Bad[/-] Borderline. Flexibility at 6cmc is acceptable. But often you already know what you want it for and there are better dedicated in each keyword.
Ferocious Tigorilla - Borderline - Flexible, but not really better than the competition
Fire Prophecy - Borderline - Card filtering in Red is welcomed. Not hitting players keeps this from a better rating. At least it is Instant speed.
Forbidden Friendship - Borderline - Giving one of the tokens haste is more unique. The different creature types is interesting.
Go for Blood - Bad - In any other color this would be more valuable. But the Sorcery speed coupled with the Fight mechanic make it worse than most of the competitors.
Heightened Reflexes - Borderline - Keeping the First Strike and the low cost make this viable, but not always worth the slot.
Lava Serpent - Cubeable - Better than all the other 6cmc Haste bodies!
Prickly Marmoset - Borderline - Even though the ability is not likely to be used, most of the others are 2/2, so this is +0/+1 better.
Pyroceratops - Cubeable - Better than Pyre Hounds, since now can be used with Auras and Artifacts.
Migratory Greathorn - Cubeable - All things considered, Green is not known for Humans, so it will often have a target. This is just an efficient body and ability coupled for outclassed targets.
Mosscoat Goriak - Borderline - Not typically what green wants. But it is a powercreep card.
Ram Through - Cubeable - Depends on Trample count, but this has the ability to deal damage to players and finish close races.
Sudden Spinnerets - Borderline - Very likeable. Leaving behind Reach is a drastic change, and adding the cheap cost and Untap makes it playable.
Survivors' Bond - Borderline - Not usual for Green. Likely to be usuable though.
Thwart the Enemy - Borderline - 3cmc Fogs aren't where most want to be. But it can set up blowouts; however unlikely.
Wilt - Borderline - Sideboard normally, adding Cycling makes it possible for maindeck.
Notables
Mutates - U/W/G (B/R are up for debate)
Unexpected Fangs - 2cmc instant that acts like an aura.
Ram Through - most are replacing Ambuscade
Pyroceratops - Now Pyre Hounds can fit any deck
Lava Serpent - Final word in 6cmc Hasters
SCG has foils up. Wilt is sold out as of now, not that that was a dealbreaker. I got about 14 cards and Evolving Wild because I have an art collection for those.
Boggart Brute imo is better than the Wolverine. Dohblestrike is ok if you can really weaponize it with evasion, but a 2 rear still dies to much of the early bodies and 1-2cmc removal. However, notmusing just that crutch, until it has Double Strike it is a low priority target so it may survive attrition.
Does fall to Evincar's Justice. (As does the Boggart)
Just because of how starved this format gets, the main lasting pieces from the set will be the Mutates. I like some of the Keyword Counter stuff, but not enough to see much surviving for more than a year. (I am adding the Lifelink instsnt)
....
....
....
*cough* Cave of Temptation, Weapon Rack
Does a better Pacifism need to be multicolored?
Does it fit in the Top 3 GW cards? Top 4?
Is your GW made for Aggro-Midrange?
Does White support Search/Recurring auras?
All these need to qualify the card. It is not any different than other great multi cards that are simply souped-up mono cards but now take up a multi slot.
I would call it Cubeable. But GW is arguably the most bloated guild in pauper. You can make a Top 10 and still have honorable mentions. The issue comes down to how many multi slots, and does it replace a unique card.
*My GW is Pridemage, Cloak and Travel Prep. So this semi competes with Travel Prep and Cloak, I am unwilling to cut either, so I would have to look at going to 4 cards in Multi. Maybe this set FINALLY makes it viable.
To me this is a new Reserved List without unilateral action. I agree on the premise that some subjects are touchy. But it is not up to WotC to mind wipe 25 years of cards as they see fit. They took a knee is a mostly harmless way, but as they have said "ignoring the secondary market". Those cards are now harder to get. And we have seen when they make statements like that the market over speculates and never retreats.
TCGPlayer and SCG, and Card Kingdom have either Out of Stock or removed the cards in question. What we are seeing signals a far worse implimented plan. I know I sound like a lunatic. And will not be offended being called one. But as the saying goes:
"Stand for something, or you'll fall for anything"
I am leaving MtG and all WotC products permanently, and deleting my account here as I cannot comply with those who would disrespect their customers as they have. PM me if you want to Tender a serious offer for an all foil cube including landeskog and a few proxy foils for non-foilable cards.
It has been fun, and I will miss the interactions.
I do not deny the math. In fact I happily run multiple common fetches. But in standard limited, Looking at the ability to turn a 40 card deck into essentially a slow 39 is not the only thing that is needed to make it better. Yes, if supplemented with draw, and other search it can matter more. But a single fetch does not carry over a back braking advantage. It is almost like a nice addition because it is a 5c land, but as mentioned it is a tapped one.
The math is their. Just not as high of a priority as "first pickz"; imo
I REALLY like Fire prophecy. Non-player burn basically cannot make Staple unless it is ridiculous. See Flame Slash. And that is not even ubiquitous. I am glad there is better card filter options in Red. But it is not going to be as big a threat as say Magma Jet.
@Deck Thinning (E. Wilds)
It is advantage, but it takes so long to prove it that it is more of an overhyped math claim than a result.
@Mutate:
I am still trying Tom wrap my head around a proper evaluation. I think once prerelease... oh, wait... once we hear more reports trickle in, we will all be reevaluating what these do. I found spots for all 5 as they are somewhere between Ninja and Sorcery Buffs.
*Reprints are reprints. Seldom does one gain or lose value unless something major happens
If you want to be bold and use the Bad/Borderline/Cubeable system, it helps us revisit our own views and discuss. I too give high praise for Borderline cards, but still need to admit they are not necessary adds.
Aim High -> Sudden Spinnerets
Thriving Rhino -> Migratory Greathorn
Savage Swipe/Utopia Vow -> Ram Through(Maybe)[No Ambuscade to cut]
Phantom Monster -> Dreamtail Heron
Giant's Skewer -> Unexpected Fangs (somehow I left it in?)
Faceless Butcher -> Cavern Whisperer (Experimental)
Granitic Titan -> Lava Serpent (may find room for both)
Keldon Raider -> Cloudpiercer
Master of Diversions -> Vulpikeet (still have Hammerskull)
Update Notes:
One of the easiest ones to date as most of these are lateral "upgrades". Mutate is not a mechanic I want to adopt. However, for the context of this, it is just an 'upgrade' to Aggro/Midrange early bodies. No real ideologies change, and I just have to consider Pyroceratops as a slot that needs forced in.
Rules Note:
Mutate is a nightmare. On the positive side, these things can upgrade Hexproof bodies, have "Haste" if the creature they are going on Top of has been under your control since beginning of turn... But no shenanigans with Faceless Butcher. I mean these will single-handedly cause some of the most headche-inducing explanations since Conspiracy.
Increasing the validity of Tokens and "Army in a Can" bodies is intriguing. I think all are worth testing and may surprise us in how often then are valid.
Waste of energy? We are one of the smallest factions of MtG besides dead formats. There is one major player in Pauper Cube, we are not it. All of our energy is wasted energy. But, as a select set of passionate, and often in disagreement group, extra investments of energy when applicable help the group as a whole. So, if you do not feel my sense makes much sense, or simply disagree, then you are welcomed by everyone here to also invest the hours it takes to maintain, update, format, and debate thr Evaluate Everything situation we have. It has to be a group effort or it is null.
As a comment on your numerous involvements across the numerous topics here, you often have the last say many times. If that energy can be channeled into the banal task of ALL cards in the given set every few months, then this would likely be others criticizing your opinions. I welcome a challenge. I am always over valuing specific things. So I do need to be challeneged. But I take the time to form and explain my side, reconsider, and find a settling point.
Like a good family, we should not argue in front of the newer members. But healthy discourse can build us back up.
TL;DR
Optics do not look great if you want to throw stones and not do the work as well.
Please helps us do more, by investing the keystrokes instead of dismissing the efforts.
The Cat is in the Doomed Traveller / Hunted Witness camp. The details are marginally different and while it is the worst overall of the 3, I do not see it really needing spelled out. I can accept if others do. Edit: Also, Tukatongue Thallid
And a rebuttal evaluation is always welcomed. I look forward to your write up.
Colorless
Adaptive Shimmerer - Bad - Cool idea. Not enough.
Farfinder - Borderline - We have flying versions, but better than non-flying. NOT AN ARTIFACT.
Mysterious Egg - Bad - We only have 5 Mutate bodies
Sleeper Dart - Borderline - Variant on an unused design.
Springjaw Trap - Borderline - While the activation is steep and single use, adding FLash and the ability to hit players means it can be useful.
White
Blade Banish - Bad. 4cmc is too much. Nice to Exile.
Checkpoint Officer - Bad (terrible).
Coordinated Charge - Bad. Marshalling Cry exists.
Daysquad Marshal - Bad. We have versions that make better tokens.
Drannith Healer - Bad.
Garrison Cat - Functional Reprint
Helica Glider - Borderline. NIGHTMARE SQUIRREL! But either ability is just par at this cost
Imposing Vantasaur - Borederline - Noble Templar is better more often.
Light of Hope - Borderline. Maindeck-able flex card
Maned Serval - Borderline. 2 mana Yotian Soldier, so it is defensive.
Pacifism - reprint.
Patagia Tiger - Borderline. It is better bodied than the other 5cmc EtB boosters, but limited targets.
Perimeter Sergeant - Bad. Very limited boost. Body is vanilla.
Savai Sabertooth - Functional Reprint
Snare Tactician - Bad.
Solid Footing - Bad. Triclopean Sight is better.
Spontaneous Flight - Borderline. Flying sticks and is an instant. 3 cmc is not where you want most tricks.
Vulpikeet - Cubeable. Non-Human makes this a Mutate formthe splash color. However, 3cmc for 3/4 Flying is VERY acceptable!
Blue
Aegis Turtle - Borderline. Power creep, but unimpressive
Capture Sphere - Functional
Crystacean - Bad. Flash costs too much here.
Dreamtail Heron - Cubeable. Non-human is not a big deal. Discounted, and better, Phantom Monster. Worth the gamble.
Essence Scatter - Reprint
Facet Reader - Bad.
Frost Lynx - Reprint
Frostveil Ambush - Bad. Too costly.
Glimmerbell - Borderline. Powercreep of a small flying body, pseudo-vigilance.
Gust of Wind - Borderline. In the right color for the discount. But Sorcey hurts.
Hampering Snare - Bad. *Caveat, better in Sealed.
Keep Safe - Borderline. Compares to Confound.
Of One Mind - Borderline. Most Cubes will be able to fit this. But compared to Winged Words, it is less reliable a discount.
Phase Dolphin - Borderline. Powercreep does not make up for an unflattering body.
Startling Development - Borderline. Pseudo-Giant Growth with cycling.
Thieving Otter - Functional reprint of Stealer of Secrets.
Wingfold Pteron - [-]Bad[/-] Borderline. Flexibility at 6cmc is acceptable. But often you already know what you want it for and there are better dedicated in each keyword.
Black
Blitz Leech - Bad. Too much.
Blood Curdle - Borderline. Effectively a 1.5-for-1. Upgrading a body and instant speed ar comparable at 4cmc. But more efficient options exist.
Boot Nipper - Borderline. Flexibility kills its agression.
Bushmeat Poacher - Borderline. Cost is lower than other options, even if it needs to tap now.
Cavern Whisperer - Borderline. Black has many co peting slots like Okiba-Gang. Still a fine choice.
Corpse Churn - Reprint.
Dark Bargain - Reprint.
Dead Weight - Reprint.
Durable Coilbug - Bad. Ability costs too much.
Gloom Pangolin - Bad. Wrong color.
Lurking Deadeye - Borderline. Flash and aggressive body. Another 1.5-for-1. Body won't survive combat.
Memory Leak - Borderline. Coercion-esque with cheap cycling.
Mutual Destruction - Bad.
Nightsquad Commando - Borderline. For Sacrifice decks only.
Serrated Scorpion - Borderline. Aggressive, but unimpressive.
Suffocating Fumes - Borderline. Instant and cycling keep this Nausea variant acceptable.
Unexpected Fangs - Cubeable. Being an Instant versus the Aura versions makes it sneakier. Avoids Disenchants.
Unlikely Aid - Functional
Whisper Squad - Bad.
Red
Blazing Volley - BAD - Not enough
Blisterspit Gremlin - Borderline - Compared to the others that do not have the untap clause, the decision to keep spending mana seems questionable.
Cloudpiercer - Borderline - Everything together is fine. But a rummage 5/4 with Reach is not very Red.
Drannith Stinger - BAD
Ferocious Tigorilla - Borderline - Flexible, but not really better than the competition
Fire Prophecy - Borderline - Card filtering in Red is welcomed. Not hitting players keeps this from a better rating. At least it is Instant speed.
Forbidden Friendship - Borderline - Giving one of the tokens haste is more unique. The different creature types is interesting.
Go for Blood - Bad - In any other color this would be more valuable. But the Sorcery speed coupled with the Fight mechanic make it worse than most of the competitors.
Heightened Reflexes - Borderline - Keeping the First Strike and the low cost make this viable, but not always worth the slot.
Lava Serpent - Cubeable - Better than all the other 6cmc Haste bodies!
Prickly Marmoset - Borderline - Even though the ability is not likely to be used, most of the others are 2/2, so this is +0/+1 better.
Pyroceratops - Cubeable - Better than Pyre Hounds, since now can be used with Auras and Artifacts.
Raking Claws - BAD
Rumbling Rockslide - BAD
Shredded Sails - Borderline - Flexible and cycling are acceptable. Limited to killing Flying is a cube-based decision.
Spelleater Wolverine - Borderline - Double Strike is not better than Evasion in a damage race.
Tentative Connection - Bad - Sorcery and unlikely discount
Green
Almighty Brushwagg - Bad - Unimpressive, or overcosted ability. Combined is not good.
Essence Symbiote - Bad
Excavation Mole - Borderline - Above curve body + ability, adding self-mill support is dependent.
Flycatcher Giraffid - Bad - We have better cards with 2 abilities, not a choice
Fully Grown - Borderline - Green has so many Trample bodies, and splashing it is ok; not overblown.
Honey Mammoth - Borderline - Solid stats and ability. But Green usually gives evasive or bigger at this cmc.
Humble Naturalist - Bad - Worse than the Sliver
Migratory Greathorn - Cubeable - All things considered, Green is not known for Humans, so it will often have a target. This is just an efficient body and ability coupled for outclassed targets.
Mosscoat Goriak - Borderline - Not typically what green wants. But it is a powercreep card.
Ram Through - Cubeable - Depends on Trample count, but this has the ability to deal damage to players and finish close races.
Sudden Spinnerets - Borderline - Very likeable. Leaving behind Reach is a drastic change, and adding the cheap cost and Untap makes it playable.
Survivors' Bond - Borderline - Not usual for Green. Likely to be usuable though.
Thwart the Enemy - Borderline - 3cmc Fogs aren't where most want to be. But it can set up blowouts; however unlikely.
Wilt - Borderline - Sideboard normally, adding Cycling makes it possible for maindeck.
Notables
Mutates - U/W/G (B/R are up for debate)
Unexpected Fangs - 2cmc instant that acts like an aura.
Ram Through - most are replacing Ambuscade
Pyroceratops - Now Pyre Hounds can fit any deck
Lava Serpent - Final word in 6cmc Hasters
Does fall to Evincar's Justice. (As does the Boggart)
Just because of how starved this format gets, the main lasting pieces from the set will be the Mutates. I like some of the Keyword Counter stuff, but not enough to see much surviving for more than a year. (I am adding the Lifelink instsnt)