I understand U/W wont be back becuase Wizards and casual players don't like draw go decks. But it seems like the top 8's of everything is aggro. If they turn U/W into a aggro skies guild its just to become terribly unflavorful.
B/U Control...Pretty sucky
G/B AGGRO Control elements.
U/R Control
The only decent control guild we have had was Izzet and to some effect Golgari. Im just sick of seeing top 8's composed of ALL aggro or aggro/control.
Heartbeat seems to be the only deck that isn't aggro that compete these days.
Sure thats great for casual players that don't have to deal with draw go decks. But what about players who LIKE control. Good job casual players I guess and Aggro people becuase Wizards is favoring you in this block I guess. They made aggro players happy with cards like Watchwolf and Char and Burning Tree Shamen. Can us conteol players get at least something better then a 5 cost counter. *Sigh* My opinion.
Warning, the Following posts contains spolier info!
There is a new better wild growth what do you guys think about this. I mean there isnt much ld in the enviormnt but its an enchant. I remember Star Wars Kid playing wild growth in his ext. Heartbeat for awhile. I mane it makes sence it gives you three mana turn two which then u can set up for a quicker win. Im still split about it, it seems kinda shaky. so 4 sakura and 4 reach or 4 sakura and 4 Utopia Growth?
Henrik, how long have you been at these boards? (no offense meant by that AT ALL) but I have posted like 3 in depth matchups blogs in which I use the man plan, with GREAT detail and how it is SO successful against Zoo and Gruul.
Thanks I found the reports. I have been on the boards about a week, but if you scroll back a few pages youll see that Im not a new player at all, just new to these boards
I've found that the giga is real good on ensuring you can go off versus izzetron, and I like it versus HiH sometimes dependin on their build( makes ure they can't mortify.), there is already alot to bring in against zoo but If you can find the room its not the worst idea I guess. I use it as a mana short most of the time, but it can be used as a mini time walk to against aggro expect I rather just have the board wipers and wall of blossoms against them IMO. If your running Trasformer board I dont see why you would board in giga's too unless your just siding out all ur combo for a more control style transform.
Warning: the follow post contains Diss. Information.
I've picked up my friend owl deck a few times, I like the way it runs, but im letting it lie dormant until I feel the meta is about to change, then switch right away to catch off the enviorment, then once they learn to deal with it drop it. Its a really good deck but there is only a small window of time that I feel you can play it :/
I bet all the Owl players are real happy with the new diss. card. That costs 1U each players draws two cards, instant.
I realize the transformational board si good but, I mean sure you side in like 6 big fat guys and u can play one early, but it dosent seeme like that is enough to win against Zoo, or anything. I just have never been able to wrap my head around man plans weather it was in this deck or the other deck.
I mean it jsut seems more supsectable that ull only see one fattie and then die to 4-5 opposing creatures. Ive always use the supporter board with the toolbox things to help you win.
Is the transformational board really that good and if so can someone give me like example play by play games?
Im gonna have to agree, everytime I've played HiH ive crushed them. Okiba Gang hurts but thats usually after sb. which then youve brought in Wall of Blossoms to block it, so youll only get hit once. But yeah HiH can disrupt you a little but with the top and your ability to go off at the drop of a hat you should beat HiH almost always.
Im glad my report accualy got read a few dozen posts ago. And on distress, yeah ive seen HiH running distress and Casitgate be scared fellow haertbeat players.
On the Man plan, I reconize that it is good, its just not my playstyle, when i played tooth and nail i never played the man plan It just wasnt my style :p. I think it depends what you are more ready to play with.
I forget why I only boarded in three Shadows there, tring to rememebr give me a minute ><.
As for the second Weird mainboard, do you often miss having the Recollect main?
I've never considered using Shadow of Doubt before, how is it working out?
First off sorry for the double post, jsut tring to catch up a little bit here.
Secondly, yeah shamen is tech like hes amazing lol. On the Recollect versus Weird Harvest- the Japenese list I saw ran three Harvest and no boomerang. Sure the Recollect is nice but ive found its jsut not as nessecary as I thought it would be, Im tring to deicde with I want a third harvest like the Jap. List did. Cuz not having to muddle for it does wonders.
Shadow of doubt really shines, I dont run the man plan so I feel its my safety net versus cranial, that and running more weird harvests to keep open my muddles. I recommend it if your not running the Man Plan, also it throws off the mirror match in your favor
FNM Playing Heartbeat
By Henrick Ostergard
Erie, Pa
Gateway Games
Credentials
Contructed Rating: 1874
1 PTQ TOP 8
2 GP TOP 8
JSS Nationals 27th place
Already Q'd for JSS Nationals this year
Favorite Type of Deck: Combo
x2 Wierd Harvest:
- While most people only run 1, and muddle for it. I ran two so I could be less dependant on the Muddle, letting me hold it in my hand for a coutner war during my combo if nessecary. This Idea came from some Japenesee Heartbeat decks running 3 Werid Harvest. I still may up the count to 3.
x1 Savage Twister MB
- While some people like the pyroclasm more, I feel the savage Twister is just a better overall card in the slot, more resilant, but I do acknowledge the Pyroclasm as shown in my Sideboard.
x1 Shamen SB
- A reaction to Pithing Needle, which will always be on drift. You can muddle for your weird harvest and find the shamen and blow up the needle mid-combo. This card is Hot Tech.
x4 Shadow of Doubt
- While some of you have opted to remove this card, I find is great all around. Not jsut versus the mirror matchup which dosent expect this card as much anymore, but versus cranial, ect.
The Report
Round 1: Frank ??? w/ Izzetron
Game one I start out with a subar hand, He plays some random card drawing, leaving one blue and a tron peice open, I go off and muddle his remand on my maga.
-1 Savage Twister
-1 Boomernag
-1 Sakura Tribe Elder
+3 Gigadrose
Game two goes prettym uch the same way, expect I gigadrose his blue EOT and proceed to go off on turn 6.
Games:
2-0
Matches:
1-0
Round 2: Eric Horton w/ Black and White Aggro.
Game one he opens up with a confidant, and a Palladin. I know he runs Mortify so I know I have to work around it, I could go off turn 4 with 5 lands and the weird in my hand but he held back suspeciosly. I top and transmute some to find my remand, and go off next turn remanding his mortify.
I opted to take out a weird becuase the muddle didn't seem as important in the matchup so I could waste it on a trasmute. Game to goes smootly he Castigate's an early harvest but I have a Wall buying me a few turns, I go off smoothly while hes tapped out for a Ghost Council with one mana open.
Games:
4-0
Matches:
2-0
Round 3: Rob Richardson w/ That Dimir House Guard Control Deck.
Game one I know he ahs mb cranial and game get it turn 4 pretty easily, I have to work fast but keep mana open, He turn three transmutes for the cranial and plays it turn 4, it meets a Remand, I pass, He plays it again it hits for Heartbeat. To make a long stroy short ntihing happens for about ten turns until he plays down a Yosei. By that time I have around 14 lands and I go off without the heartbeat.
-1 Savage Twister
-1 Sakura Tribe Elder
-1 Boomerang
+3 Shadow of Doubt
I knows hes going to be aggresive with crainials and searching for them so I bring in the shadows. He sure enough tries to hit me and I shaodw he calls harvest and I reveal my hand with no Harvests. He persecutes me and it meets a muddle. I go off for the win.
Games:
6-0
Matches:
3-0
Round 4: Jake Fling w/ Mike Flores new Ghazi Chord Deck
Game 1 in eventful he plays some elves an Elephant and a Yosei, he gets me down to the wire and I try to go off, He chords for a Nikko-Onna in responce to smash my heartbeat. Luckily I float the mana harvest and can transmute for another hearbteat and still go off.
-1 Savage Twister
+1 Virdiean Shamen
Game two is alot of fun, same game setup as before. Expect hes got a pithing needle on Drift. I hearbteat then harvest and ther Weird for drifts maga and shamen and his head explodes and blow up the needle and go off.
Games:
8-0
Matches:
4-0
CONCLUSION
Even though the event was small (15 players)Heartbeat is an amazing deck, I credit some of my games to luck, but also to my meta which has more control. which I find is easier for hearbeat.
Its so resilant to every form of hate thrown against it Pithing Needle, Cranial ect.
Props:
Rob Richardson, for his Final FNM before he moves to Pittsburg.
Jake Fling, for playing the Chord Deck and being a good sport in the Finals.
Mike Flores, Shamen Tech in the board that let me win the finals.
Heartbeat, for being awesome
Before I start my Rant, Im not tring to bad mouth any other posts here but I think you guys are being a little narrow minded, so sit back relax and listen with an OPEN mind, this card is OBVIOUSLY amazing.
I made this screen name just to explain to whats going on in the COMPETITIVE world of magic.
Aggro rules the world.
Decks can devote countless slots to creature hate and aggro still can punch through for the win.
The only decks that are surviving are decks that can win very quickly or burst our of nowhere for the win. ( Aggro Decks, Heartbeat, Owling Mine ect.)
Osyp himself said
" Control decks have fallen off the map. Aggro decks can just cheat their way in games most of the time." quoted from Star City Games.
In a way hes right. You'd think in an enviorment with the best removal weve seen in ages. Moritfy, Puetrfy, Faith fetters ect. And an enviorment where you can splash for removal like it's nobodys business, that control decks would be amazing. Well go look at the Pro Tour, or the Team PTQ top 4's.
Now why condemn is great, is that A is a quick soultion to the threats of the enviorment.
All your anologies have been with dragons and control creatures ect. But in the real world, youll have to face kird ape beating you into a pulp followed by watcholf ect.
Condemn lets you gain control of the game early on which control has a problem with before. Before control had to ramp into an early wrath of god to get cotnrol otherwise they were toast. If they do nothing until wrath against zoo turn 4 they have already taken around 10 damage and are within burn range of zoo burn after they drop another creature the following turn.
Condemn lets you kill that first turn 2/x guy, thus resulting around 6-8 less damage before you can play other spells to gain mroe control, before you had to be completely reactive with your control decks, this lets you react to an early threat giving you a higher postion.
It dosen't matter that they have to be attacking, im sorry if the aggro decks arent attacking your already winning.
The bottem of the library clause is better then going to the graveyeard in some situations and sometimes its not, no one complains about hinder.
Now im not saying that anyone else has bad idea's I respect everyone opinion, but just wait Condemn will be all over standard soon enough, its amazing and adds right up there to Moritfy, Faith fetters, and Puetry.
Would all the creatures go away at the same time, making teysa trigger be to late?
R/W Aggro
G/W Aggro
B/W Aggro
R/G Aggro
B/R Aggro
U/W Aggro...?
and then if you look at the other guilds
B/U Control...Pretty sucky
G/B AGGRO Control elements.
U/R Control
The only decent control guild we have had was Izzet and to some effect Golgari. Im just sick of seeing top 8's composed of ALL aggro or aggro/control.
Heartbeat seems to be the only deck that isn't aggro that compete these days.
Sure thats great for casual players that don't have to deal with draw go decks. But what about players who LIKE control. Good job casual players I guess and Aggro people becuase Wizards is favoring you in this block I guess. They made aggro players happy with cards like Watchwolf and Char and Burning Tree Shamen. Can us conteol players get at least something better then a 5 cost counter. *Sigh* My opinion.
There is a new better wild growth what do you guys think about this. I mean there isnt much ld in the enviormnt but its an enchant. I remember Star Wars Kid playing wild growth in his ext. Heartbeat for awhile. I mane it makes sence it gives you three mana turn two which then u can set up for a quicker win. Im still split about it, it seems kinda shaky. so 4 sakura and 4 reach or 4 sakura and 4 Utopia Growth?
Thanks I found the reports. I have been on the boards about a week, but if you scroll back a few pages youll see that Im not a new player at all, just new to these boards
I've found that the giga is real good on ensuring you can go off versus izzetron, and I like it versus HiH sometimes dependin on their build( makes ure they can't mortify.), there is already alot to bring in against zoo but If you can find the room its not the worst idea I guess. I use it as a mana short most of the time, but it can be used as a mini time walk to against aggro expect I rather just have the board wipers and wall of blossoms against them IMO. If your running Trasformer board I dont see why you would board in giga's too unless your just siding out all ur combo for a more control style transform.
Henrik:D
I've picked up my friend owl deck a few times, I like the way it runs, but im letting it lie dormant until I feel the meta is about to change, then switch right away to catch off the enviorment, then once they learn to deal with it drop it. Its a really good deck but there is only a small window of time that I feel you can play it :/
I bet all the Owl players are real happy with the new diss. card. That costs 1U each players draws two cards, instant.
I mean it jsut seems more supsectable that ull only see one fattie and then die to 4-5 opposing creatures. Ive always use the supporter board with the toolbox things to help you win.
Is the transformational board really that good and if so can someone give me like example play by play games?
Henrik
henrik
On the Man plan, I reconize that it is good, its just not my playstyle, when i played tooth and nail i never played the man plan It just wasnt my style :p. I think it depends what you are more ready to play with.
I forget why I only boarded in three Shadows there, tring to rememebr give me a minute ><.
Henrik
First off sorry for the double post, jsut tring to catch up a little bit here.
Secondly, yeah shamen is tech like hes amazing lol. On the Recollect versus Weird Harvest- the Japenese list I saw ran three Harvest and no boomerang. Sure the Recollect is nice but ive found its jsut not as nessecary as I thought it would be, Im tring to deicde with I want a third harvest like the Jap. List did. Cuz not having to muddle for it does wonders.
Shadow of doubt really shines, I dont run the man plan so I feel its my safety net versus cranial, that and running more weird harvests to keep open my muddles. I recommend it if your not running the Man Plan, also it throws off the mirror match in your favor
henrik
By Henrick Ostergard
Erie, Pa
Gateway Games
Credentials
Contructed Rating: 1874
1 PTQ TOP 8
2 GP TOP 8
JSS Nationals 27th place
Already Q'd for JSS Nationals this year
Favorite Type of Deck: Combo
Notes on Choices:
x2 Wierd Harvest:
- While most people only run 1, and muddle for it. I ran two so I could be less dependant on the Muddle, letting me hold it in my hand for a coutner war during my combo if nessecary. This Idea came from some Japenesee Heartbeat decks running 3 Werid Harvest. I still may up the count to 3.
x1 Savage Twister MB
- While some people like the pyroclasm more, I feel the savage Twister is just a better overall card in the slot, more resilant, but I do acknowledge the Pyroclasm as shown in my Sideboard.
x1 Shamen SB
- A reaction to Pithing Needle, which will always be on drift. You can muddle for your weird harvest and find the shamen and blow up the needle mid-combo. This card is Hot Tech.
x4 Shadow of Doubt
- While some of you have opted to remove this card, I find is great all around. Not jsut versus the mirror matchup which dosent expect this card as much anymore, but versus cranial, ect.
The Report
Round 1: Frank ??? w/ Izzetron
Game one I start out with a subar hand, He plays some random card drawing, leaving one blue and a tron peice open, I go off and muddle his remand on my maga.
-1 Savage Twister
-1 Boomernag
-1 Sakura Tribe Elder
+3 Gigadrose
Game two goes prettym uch the same way, expect I gigadrose his blue EOT and proceed to go off on turn 6.
Games:
2-0
Matches:
1-0
Round 2: Eric Horton w/ Black and White Aggro.
Game one he opens up with a confidant, and a Palladin. I know he runs Mortify so I know I have to work around it, I could go off turn 4 with 5 lands and the weird in my hand but he held back suspeciosly. I top and transmute some to find my remand, and go off next turn remanding his mortify.
-1 Boomerang
-1 Kodama's Reach
-1 Weird Harvest
-1 Savage Twister
+1 Pyroclasm
+3 Carvern Caryatid
I opted to take out a weird becuase the muddle didn't seem as important in the matchup so I could waste it on a trasmute. Game to goes smootly he Castigate's an early harvest but I have a Wall buying me a few turns, I go off smoothly while hes tapped out for a Ghost Council with one mana open.
Games:
4-0
Matches:
2-0
Round 3: Rob Richardson w/ That Dimir House Guard Control Deck.
Game one I know he ahs mb cranial and game get it turn 4 pretty easily, I have to work fast but keep mana open, He turn three transmutes for the cranial and plays it turn 4, it meets a Remand, I pass, He plays it again it hits for Heartbeat. To make a long stroy short ntihing happens for about ten turns until he plays down a Yosei. By that time I have around 14 lands and I go off without the heartbeat.
-1 Savage Twister
-1 Sakura Tribe Elder
-1 Boomerang
+3 Shadow of Doubt
I knows hes going to be aggresive with crainials and searching for them so I bring in the shadows. He sure enough tries to hit me and I shaodw he calls harvest and I reveal my hand with no Harvests. He persecutes me and it meets a muddle. I go off for the win.
Games:
6-0
Matches:
3-0
Round 4: Jake Fling w/ Mike Flores new Ghazi Chord Deck
Game 1 in eventful he plays some elves an Elephant and a Yosei, he gets me down to the wire and I try to go off, He chords for a Nikko-Onna in responce to smash my heartbeat. Luckily I float the mana harvest and can transmute for another hearbteat and still go off.
-1 Savage Twister
+1 Virdiean Shamen
Game two is alot of fun, same game setup as before. Expect hes got a pithing needle on Drift. I hearbteat then harvest and ther Weird for drifts maga and shamen and his head explodes and blow up the needle and go off.
Games:
8-0
Matches:
4-0
CONCLUSION
Even though the event was small (15 players)Heartbeat is an amazing deck, I credit some of my games to luck, but also to my meta which has more control. which I find is easier for hearbeat.
Its so resilant to every form of hate thrown against it Pithing Needle, Cranial ect.
Props:
Rob Richardson, for his Final FNM before he moves to Pittsburg.
Jake Fling, for playing the Chord Deck and being a good sport in the Finals.
Mike Flores, Shamen Tech in the board that let me win the finals.
Heartbeat, for being awesome
Before I start my Rant, Im not tring to bad mouth any other posts here but I think you guys are being a little narrow minded, so sit back relax and listen with an OPEN mind, this card is OBVIOUSLY amazing.
I made this screen name just to explain to whats going on in the COMPETITIVE world of magic.
Aggro rules the world.
Decks can devote countless slots to creature hate and aggro still can punch through for the win.
The only decks that are surviving are decks that can win very quickly or burst our of nowhere for the win. ( Aggro Decks, Heartbeat, Owling Mine ect.)
Osyp himself said
" Control decks have fallen off the map. Aggro decks can just cheat their way in games most of the time." quoted from Star City Games.
In a way hes right. You'd think in an enviorment with the best removal weve seen in ages. Moritfy, Puetrfy, Faith fetters ect. And an enviorment where you can splash for removal like it's nobodys business, that control decks would be amazing. Well go look at the Pro Tour, or the Team PTQ top 4's.
Now why condemn is great, is that A is a quick soultion to the threats of the enviorment.
All your anologies have been with dragons and control creatures ect. But in the real world, youll have to face kird ape beating you into a pulp followed by watcholf ect.
Condemn lets you gain control of the game early on which control has a problem with before. Before control had to ramp into an early wrath of god to get cotnrol otherwise they were toast. If they do nothing until wrath against zoo turn 4 they have already taken around 10 damage and are within burn range of zoo burn after they drop another creature the following turn.
Condemn lets you kill that first turn 2/x guy, thus resulting around 6-8 less damage before you can play other spells to gain mroe control, before you had to be completely reactive with your control decks, this lets you react to an early threat giving you a higher postion.
It dosen't matter that they have to be attacking, im sorry if the aggro decks arent attacking your already winning.
The bottem of the library clause is better then going to the graveyeard in some situations and sometimes its not, no one complains about hinder.
Now im not saying that anyone else has bad idea's I respect everyone opinion, but just wait Condemn will be all over standard soon enough, its amazing and adds right up there to Moritfy, Faith fetters, and Puetry.
U/W control may accualy have a chance now:D