And this illustrates why they need to include the rules for new card types when previewed. They don't need all the rules, just a quick summary like if its treated like loyalty or if it loses a "HP" for lack of a better term when one creature attacks it.
"Need" presupposes their goal is clarity. It's entirely reasonable that they are comfortable leaving us speculating for ~24 hours to build hype.
That being said, the vast majority of interactions with this card can be inferred from pre-existing rules. Speculation on the other scenarios and possibilities is part of the fun.
I agree with you to a certain extent. When you don't give any other information, it leads to confusion. They already create interest with the new battle card type.
I think if there has been more time between this spoiler and the launch of spoiler season then more reinforcement would make sense. But the timeframe is so short here, it feels fine to be a little uncomfortable for a little bit with clarity coming as a mini-climax in the plot of spoiler season.
I know this is just an uncommon, but this doesn’t feel impactful enough to justify adding a whole new card type. It’s like they decided they wanted to add a new card type before they knew what it would be instead of finding a new design space and realizing it needed to be a new card type rather than a new subclass of enchantment.
This is exactly how Planeswalkers and Tribal entered the game. Tribal being a perfect example of how to fail at this. Not only has it proven unsustainable it was never clear why the rule change that caused it to exist as a type was preferable to the rules change required to make it a supertype.
I would argue that they could be enchantments but I do love that Disenchant cannot kill a battle.
And this illustrates why they need to include the rules for new card types when previewed. They don't need all the rules, just a quick summary like if its treated like loyalty or if it loses a "HP" for lack of a better term when one creature attacks it.
"Need" presupposes their goal is clarity. It's entirely reasonable that they are comfortable leaving us speculating for ~24 hours to build hype.
That being said, the vast majority of interactions with this card can be inferred from pre-existing rules. Speculation on the other scenarios and possibilities is part of the fun.
They were intentionally cage-y about hoe many planeswalkers are in the set. "At least three but [much] less than ten". We've already seen three planeswalker cards: Chandra, Elspeth and Wrenn. (Chandra being the least spoiler-y they could show us)
So, technically this could be it.
Very tricky!
My guess is, if it's in fact more than 3, it'll be 5. At this point, Quint and Teferi seem most likely to fill those slots, but it will be interesting to see how the spoiler plays out. I get the feeling they aren't quite done throwing these light curveballs.
This next idea definitely belongs in wild speculation but what if whatever these battles are, they are capable of creating game objects and some number of them produce Walkers? Like:
Battle for Innistrad if Phyrexia loses create Thalia Awoken a PW with bla bla bla. If Phyrexia wins, produce Nissa, Corrupted, a PW with other bla. It's a whole lot of words but... Meh?
Sun's Heart synergizes really well with stuff like Angelic Chorus or Verdant Sun's Avatar in a toughness-matters deck, especially if you sprinkle in some proliferate to keep using her ability every turn.
Geist Hunter requires a bit more support to use effectively, since you're probably going to have to keep pulling it back out of your graveyard (easy to do in white, with the low mana cost). Her ult is only occasionally useful late-game, but being able to toss deathtouch onto all your creatures is a good effect, which can be exploited by stuff like Hooded Blightfang.
Honestly, most PW's work best as distractions and damage-sponges while you set up something else, and not as the ominous engines of destruction they're most often played as.
Thanks for your observations but I feel like you are just reinforcing my point. With enough hoops you can play a sub par deck that won't T8 with these cards. While casual play is real let's be honest - that's not what "Broken" looks at. As an idea "Broken" wants to T4 consistently.
W8 is, like the vast majority of 3mv walkers, not going to push any cards out of Decks in older formats. But, TBF, I called Uro wrong so I am happy to come back in 6 months and eat my words.
So, there are 58 PWs in Scryfall with MV <= 3. Plus Compleated walkers that can be cast as if they had MV 3. A few are noteworthy, maybe 10. At this point, I'm not convinced that MV 3 or less is a big deal for walkers anymore.
Depends on the format of play for the 3 cmc walkers.
And yes I run Huatli in a big butt deck in Pioneer on occasion and Kaya in a Standard deck on occasion. So yes they have a home depending on format.
Yes you just proved my point. It depends on which format the 3 cmc walker is played in. There are other formats besides Commander btw.
No, respectfully, you have proven my point. "Occasionally" being the key word. There was a lot of energy on this thread around "she's better then Nissa". The Nissa in question shaped formats, hell I played her and I don't love playing walkers. Will W8 show up occasionally in formats? Of course, will she make an impact, as this thread suggests.. only time will tell but statistics say, no.
So, there are 58 PWs in Scryfall with MV <= 3. Plus Compleated walkers that can be cast as if they had MV 3. A few are noteworthy, maybe 10. At this point, I'm not convinced that MV 3 or less is a big deal for walkers anymore.
Depends on the format of play for the 3 cmc walkers.
So, there are 58 PWs in Scryfall with MV <= 3. Plus Compleated walkers that can be cast as if they had MV 3. A few are noteworthy, maybe 10. At this point, I'm not convinced that MV 3 or less is a big deal for walkers anymore.
dfc tokens would require rules change, no? under current rules tokens are not cards and comprules transform definition requires "cards" to work. but based on past weasel-wording by maro this could as well not be even remotely connected to actual transform mechanic but something completely different.
What worries me is the card that produces such a token. It would have to spell out what the token is, its characteristics, what triggers the transform and what are the characteristics of the other face. I'm guessing they will have to use the extremely-tiny-font tech on that one.
Unless this ties into a new keyworded mechanic that sits only in comp rules from day 1. I get that they haven't really done this but it could happen.
Phyrexia is much more than just Norn, I feel like that's just cutting one head off the hydra.
The artwork could be for something else but Elesh isn't dead in the story. Just wounded. Elspeth striked the shoulder of Elesh to escape the battle against her and get to Nissa to distract her so Chandra and Wrenn can get to the tree. We have the next dead Preator but it isn't Elesh.
Well then, this feels like perfectly reasonable plot craft.
#1: Creatureless control (or 2-3 creature) has been an archetype since year 1 so I'm not sure how true that is.
Even if that is true control decks runs mass removals since dawn of times, so I still don't think how's that an issue. Aggro decks gonna pay the ward cost, creatureless decks got many other ways to remove a threat, not a big deal.
I'd hate to throw away a 4c or 5c sweeper to deal with just this but you are probably right that it being an option is enough to make it fair.
A couple of things confuse me. 1) don't they avoid ward costs that may be impossible to satisfy? And 2) does the timing on the green one work? It feels like she gets vigilance after she taos to attack
1) actually every normal deck play creatures, it's harsh, but not impossible to satisfy normally.
2) she got vigilance on both sides, so she never tap.
#1: Creatureless control (or 2-3 creature) has been an archetype since year 1 so I'm not sure how true that is.
A couple of things confuse me. 1) don't they avoid ward costs that may be impossible to satisfy? And 2) does the timing on the green one work? It feels like she gets vigilance after she taos to attack
I think if there has been more time between this spoiler and the launch of spoiler season then more reinforcement would make sense. But the timeframe is so short here, it feels fine to be a little uncomfortable for a little bit with clarity coming as a mini-climax in the plot of spoiler season.
This is exactly how Planeswalkers and Tribal entered the game. Tribal being a perfect example of how to fail at this. Not only has it proven unsustainable it was never clear why the rule change that caused it to exist as a type was preferable to the rules change required to make it a supertype.
I would argue that they could be enchantments but I do love that Disenchant cannot kill a battle.
"Need" presupposes their goal is clarity. It's entirely reasonable that they are comfortable leaving us speculating for ~24 hours to build hype.
That being said, the vast majority of interactions with this card can be inferred from pre-existing rules. Speculation on the other scenarios and possibilities is part of the fun.
This next idea definitely belongs in wild speculation but what if whatever these battles are, they are capable of creating game objects and some number of them produce Walkers? Like:
Battle for Innistrad if Phyrexia loses create Thalia Awoken a PW with bla bla bla. If Phyrexia wins, produce Nissa, Corrupted, a PW with other bla. It's a whole lot of words but... Meh?
Thanks for your observations but I feel like you are just reinforcing my point. With enough hoops you can play a sub par deck that won't T8 with these cards. While casual play is real let's be honest - that's not what "Broken" looks at. As an idea "Broken" wants to T4 consistently.
W8 is, like the vast majority of 3mv walkers, not going to push any cards out of Decks in older formats. But, TBF, I called Uro wrong so I am happy to come back in 6 months and eat my words.
No, respectfully, you have proven my point. "Occasionally" being the key word. There was a lot of energy on this thread around "she's better then Nissa". The Nissa in question shaped formats, hell I played her and I don't love playing walkers. Will W8 show up occasionally in formats? Of course, will she make an impact, as this thread suggests.. only time will tell but statistics say, no.
Really? Huatli, the Sun's Heart or Kaya, Geist Hunter has a home?
Unless this ties into a new keyworded mechanic that sits only in comp rules from day 1. I get that they haven't really done this but it could happen.
Well then, this feels like perfectly reasonable plot craft.
I'd hate to throw away a 4c or 5c sweeper to deal with just this but you are probably right that it being an option is enough to make it fair.
Phyrexia is much more than just Norn, I feel like that's just cutting one head off the hydra.
#1: Creatureless control (or 2-3 creature) has been an archetype since year 1 so I'm not sure how true that is.
#2: It sure does does help when I RTFC