Well, it's all about where people draw the line, what parts they liked about Innistrad, etc. Currently for me Eldritch Moon just is far too over the top, and feels closer to New Phyrexia than anything else. Which is all well and good if you like the villain, but if you don't then it's an issue. And, at least for me, it still feels very clearly alien. It doesn't feel like something native to Innistrad, and I'm not a fan of it. I prefer planar threats that are internal.
I feel like the creative team gives too much deference to characters (i.e. the Gatewatch), and very little to the actual worlds. They don't seem to matter at all.
Further, I was really excited when they announced the changes to how the story would be delivered, but the story they have chosen to deliver is lazy, boring, predictable, and a slew of other unflattering adjectives. Some of the stories appear to be written by high school students who mistake an abundance of adjectives for good writing. I also didn't need what amounted to a sequel to BFZ's story. I was bored of the eldrazi before Oath, and now they're back, keeping me from enjoying my favorite plane.
Maybe my newfound disdain for the eldrazi is a byproduct of BFZ block being lackluster. Either way, I don't find them to be compelling villains, which is something Magic has in painfully short supply.
Well said. Influence of Emrakul perfectly embodies my problems with this set - you couldn't tell if the art for the card is happening on Innistrad or on Zendikar. Even the flavor text - hordes of Eldrazi drones attack a city, defenders are overrun - could fit both stories; just swap out "Thraben" for "Sea Gate". The card completely takes you out of Innistrad (which just happens to be one of the most beloved MTG worlds) and right back into the hot mess that was BFZ. Even if the Eldrazi in BFZ block hadn't been poorly handled and badly executed, using the same villain for two blocks in a row is bound to get a little boring.
Just imagine this: Instead of Emrakul, WotC chooses a brand new Sea God, Chtulhu-style, that erupts and transforms the creatures on Innistrad. No Eldrazi brand, no repeating the Eldrazi visual clues (which can be summarized as "grey + violet, lots of tentacles"). Instead, Emrakul stays out there, a constant menace, to be reused in a block a few years down the road. (I mean, they abandoned the Eldrazi after first introducing them for 5 and a half years, it's not like they HAD to return Emrakul to the story right away.) I would have preferred that by miles, simply because reusing a threat that a) just had a whole block dedicated to them and b) sucked terribly the last time it was around is lazy and completely unnecessary. I feel like the decision has minimal upsides with large potential problems.
Sea God would have been much more preferred yeah. Preferably with different aesthetics and a bit less corruption, so far it's looking a bit too heavy for me. Feels like so much is Emrakul now, which is an issue. At best she should be a newish sixth focus, instead feels like there is just a ton of Eldrazi/Horrors now.
That's kind of the impression I got. Being the biggest threat doesn't mean he has to overpower them, or even engage them directly, that isn't his style.
I'd personally rather have the more interesting things up front, if just because I'd rather know whether or not the things I'm hoping to see (in this case a new Tamiyo, likely other stuff though) are there. But different pros and cons for people, for me at least it's just harder for me to want to tune in every day right now.
I wish Lorwyn had a Planeswalker, would be really nice to see that, and it kind of bugs me seeing every Plane we've visited just about have a Planeswalker card. Not sure what race I'd want to see from Lorwyn, but Fairy/Flamekin seems best, feel pretty Lorwyn without being unpopular I think. Could do an Elf too I suppose, since they're pretty distinctive on Lorwyn.
The problem with a fairy walker from Lorwyn is that they are all somekind of clone of Oona, or something along those lines, they are supposed to have very short lifespans. An Elf from Lorwyn would face a very different problem, they would be lore-bound to hate almost everyone everywhere, they remind me of the people of Krikkit from The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy that upon finding out they weren't the only things in existence they promptly made plans to eradicate all life in the universe. While a Kithkin would be radically changed by no longer being part of the thoughtweft. Treefolk would be interesting, though because they start life as completely normal trees having a spark would be weird. Changelings as non intelligent creatures would be interesting but awkward in the story. Which only really leaves Boggarts(their versions of Goblins) and Flamekin, either of which would be interesting but I don't think Wizards decided how they left Lorwyn and the whole aurora so that would have to be hammered out before hand.
I could see them hand waving it as the planar shift altered Fairies enough for them to live on their own. As for Elves could be the same deal, the new plane could have toned them down a bit. Or of course could be a Shadowmoor Elf, somehow exempt from change due to their spark igniting.
Lots of things, I just want to see one at least. Preferably in one of my favorite colors of course, but I love the flavor enough even if it wasn't I would be happy.
what do you guys think about this new mechanic? i find it too much a-la yu gi oh lol, unplayable in eternal and this is so sad..
If everything was jusdged based on being playable in eternal. We basically shouldn't by any cards from any set.
It can join morph as a Yugi mechanic I guess. But it seems playable. That's all that really matters in the end.
The concept of facedown cards in Magic predates Yugi. Morph might be after but it only exists because of the cards that made cards go facedown before then.
Unglued was after Yugioh but almost assuredly not inspired by it, was only out for a couple years. BFM was undoubtedly not inspired by it. It's also not the same kind of thing as how YGO's fusions.
I did not like the BFZ Eldrazi. I thought Colorless Mana was cool but the OGW Eldrazi were also lame. However I really really like these Eldrazi <something> creatures. The only pure Eldrazi creature is Emrakul and everything else is a weird mix, and I enjoy this set quite a bit.
My guess would be that they seal Emrakul into the moon and the extreme transformations will stop. Leaving Innistrad permanently a bit warped but overall okay.
That is my guess as well. You won't get the extreme aberrations we've had in this set, though they'll still likely exist, while Emrakul becomes the focus of a cult-like following. Though I know others along with myself aren't really happy with that solution it's really the only "good" way to have things turn out.
Funny you guys feeling that way when that's exactly the way Nahiri feels about Sorin keeping her imprisoned, unable to be there when 3 titans ravaged her homeworld. I really hope they get their best writer to write their eventual confrontation/duel. Their parallel paths are fast approaching an intersection.
I feel bad for her too. I don't think either Nahiri or Sorin is really blameless, but I don't think either is fully to blame either. I probably place more blame on Nahiri given she escalated things but it's bad all around.
I wish Lorwyn had a Planeswalker, would be really nice to see that, and it kind of bugs me seeing every Plane we've visited just about have a Planeswalker card. Not sure what race I'd want to see from Lorwyn, but Fairy/Flamekin seems best, feel pretty Lorwyn without being unpopular I think. Could do an Elf too I suppose, since they're pretty distinctive on Lorwyn.
Also, I don't see why everyone's complaining about Sorin's portrayal so much. I don't think it's out of character for him to give up on Innistrad, simply because he knows just how much of a threat the Eldrazi are. As far as he knows, there's no way to stop an Eldrazi Titan other than sealing it away, and that was a process that required decades of preparation. It makes perfect sense that he'd think the situation is hopeless and focus all of his efforts on going after Nahiri. To him, Innistrad is already dead, and the only thing left to do is get revenge on the person who killed it.
It's also worth keeping in mind that this story was written from Liliana's perspective. If he seems like a cold uncaring bastard in this story, it's because that's how Liliana sees him. If we saw more of his internal monologue, he'd probably come across as more sympathetic.
Yep. I really like that aspect, seeing characters from multiple points of view, including their own, is very interesting, and helps to get a better grasp of their motivations, as well as how they impact others. Someone else brought that up earlier, and it really is interesting. For us, even distantly removed, what's happening to Innistrad is bad. For someone who spent their entire life trying to protect it just about I can only imagine how much worse it must be. I do feel somewhat bad, even if he brought it upon himself to some extent.
I'm not saying that the storytelling or flavor is bad -- I've lately enjoyed both and the twists on repeat settings -- but, card-wise, I feel as though the last few years have been all, like:
Wizards: "Check out all these Eldrazi on Zendikar! Bet y'all don't miss allies and Adventureland!"
Players: "We kinda do, actually. Can we have both?"
Wizards: "Check out all these Phyrexians on New Phyrexia! Bet y'all don't miss Mirrans!"
Players: "We kinda missed the Phyrexians, but Mirrodin was pretty okay, too."
Wizards: "Check out all these sweet angels on Innistrad! Bet y'all don't miss werewolves!"
Players: "You kinda...undid Innistrad, but the angels are okay. Can we keep those, but get the other stuff back, too?"
Wizards: "Check out all these dragons on Tarkir! Bet y'all don't miss wedge clans!"
Players: "Dragons are kinda cool, but every set has those, and we'd been asking for wedge stuff for how long?"
Wizards: "Check out all these allies and planeswalkers on Zendikar! Bet y'all still don't miss Adventureland!"
Players: "No, we still...we still miss Adventureland, and those Eldrazi things are even more plentiful, now, and --"
Wizards: "Check out all these normal werewolves and messed up and/or dead angels on Innistrad! Bet y'all don't miss the lawful good guys!"
Players: "Can you please stop over-correcting?!"
Wizards: "...Check out all these Eldrazi on Innistrad! Bet y'all don't miss Halloweentown!"
Players: "..."
Kind of sums up my thoughts on a lot of Planes. I don't necessarily mind how these last two blocks have played out, they make sense from a story standpoint, but I still think they could have been done in a different way. At least the Eldrazi had to be dealt with since they were made, would have been weird to bring them up and never resolve them. Though I didn't miss the Phyrexians, kind of miffed about Mirrodin to an extent.
Tbh I like the whole The Thing vibe, that said this is a lot more Eldrazi influence than I had thought we'd get.
As a query for people, is it the Eldrazi sub-type or warping werewolves/vampires in general? So for example with the werewolf/vampire eldrazi we've had spoiled, if instead they went from warped humans/vampires (mad but no tentacles), to Werewolf/Vampire horrors, but no Eldrazi type, would that have been better?
I'm not a huge fan of the body horror kind of transformation thing in general, though if it was done from a more internal source then I wouldn't mind as bad. Still wouldn't be good, but it's degrees of bad.
Lol I ALMOST feel sorry for liking this plot of eldrazi takeover.
Don't. It's not your fault, and I'm not even mad at Wizards. There are clearly fans for this kind of thing. I'm just not one of them, and it sucks that it happened to a plane with a lot of fans who aren't necessarily fans of this concept. I feel sorry somewhat for being glad that some of my favorite planes aren't popular enough to show up again, so they won't have this issue.
BFZ has 51/251 Eldrazi (20%) and OGW has 41/183 (22%).
12 of the 40 cards spoiled so far are (or specifically refer to) Eldrazi. And there are at least 10 colorless cards (non-artifact, so presumably all Eldrazi) yet to come, and you know they're not done with colored spells that transform into Eldrazi. I'm guessing at least 40, which would put it on par with both BFZ and OGW.
Just sayin'....
With the spoiled Eldrazi Vampire and Eldrazi Werewolves today, we're now looking at a minimum of 36 Eldrazi cards in this set. That's 18% already, folks, and I'm sure we're not done yet! My projection of 40 might have been a bit low, actually.
Again, just sayin'....
Yeah. They may not be the same as the Eldrazi drones from BFZ, but they aren't really any better for me at least. Actually kind of prefer the more abstract Eldrazi than these.
I'm not sure if Liliana was pushing Sorin'a buttons because she thought he needed her or if she was acting scared of Sorin to keep Jace from him, could see either as a reasonable explanation of her action change regarding Sorin.
Wow, lots of negativity about a plot development and a theme I'm excited about. I like the way this set is playing out very well, personally.
It's completely ridiculous to claim they're "killing the golden goose" or whatever. Innistrad will still be there after they resolve Emrakul's plot, however they do it.
I can safely say this block took part of why I liked Innistrad and effectively removed it. It may still remain but it's absolutely warped now. For some that's good or neutral, but that's not universal. It still being around doesn't mean it'll contain why I liked the plane. If Ravnica came back but they removed half the guilds I think it would be easy to see why someone wouldn't be happy, even if Ravnica still exists.
Sea God would have been much more preferred yeah. Preferably with different aesthetics and a bit less corruption, so far it's looking a bit too heavy for me. Feels like so much is Emrakul now, which is an issue. At best she should be a newish sixth focus, instead feels like there is just a ton of Eldrazi/Horrors now.
I could see them hand waving it as the planar shift altered Fairies enough for them to live on their own. As for Elves could be the same deal, the new plane could have toned them down a bit. Or of course could be a Shadowmoor Elf, somehow exempt from change due to their spark igniting.
Lots of things, I just want to see one at least. Preferably in one of my favorite colors of course, but I love the flavor enough even if it wasn't I would be happy.
The concept of facedown cards in Magic predates Yugi. Morph might be after but it only exists because of the cards that made cards go facedown before then.
Unglued was after Yugioh but almost assuredly not inspired by it, was only out for a couple years. BFM was undoubtedly not inspired by it. It's also not the same kind of thing as how YGO's fusions.
That is my guess as well. You won't get the extreme aberrations we've had in this set, though they'll still likely exist, while Emrakul becomes the focus of a cult-like following. Though I know others along with myself aren't really happy with that solution it's really the only "good" way to have things turn out.
I feel bad for her too. I don't think either Nahiri or Sorin is really blameless, but I don't think either is fully to blame either. I probably place more blame on Nahiri given she escalated things but it's bad all around.
Yep. I really like that aspect, seeing characters from multiple points of view, including their own, is very interesting, and helps to get a better grasp of their motivations, as well as how they impact others. Someone else brought that up earlier, and it really is interesting. For us, even distantly removed, what's happening to Innistrad is bad. For someone who spent their entire life trying to protect it just about I can only imagine how much worse it must be. I do feel somewhat bad, even if he brought it upon himself to some extent.
Kind of sums up my thoughts on a lot of Planes. I don't necessarily mind how these last two blocks have played out, they make sense from a story standpoint, but I still think they could have been done in a different way. At least the Eldrazi had to be dealt with since they were made, would have been weird to bring them up and never resolve them. Though I didn't miss the Phyrexians, kind of miffed about Mirrodin to an extent.
I'm not a huge fan of the body horror kind of transformation thing in general, though if it was done from a more internal source then I wouldn't mind as bad. Still wouldn't be good, but it's degrees of bad.
Don't. It's not your fault, and I'm not even mad at Wizards. There are clearly fans for this kind of thing. I'm just not one of them, and it sucks that it happened to a plane with a lot of fans who aren't necessarily fans of this concept. I feel sorry somewhat for being glad that some of my favorite planes aren't popular enough to show up again, so they won't have this issue.
Yeah. They may not be the same as the Eldrazi drones from BFZ, but they aren't really any better for me at least. Actually kind of prefer the more abstract Eldrazi than these.
I can safely say this block took part of why I liked Innistrad and effectively removed it. It may still remain but it's absolutely warped now. For some that's good or neutral, but that's not universal. It still being around doesn't mean it'll contain why I liked the plane. If Ravnica came back but they removed half the guilds I think it would be easy to see why someone wouldn't be happy, even if Ravnica still exists.