I don't get the hate for affinity. Sure it gets great draws sometimes but so can any good deck. Thats just the way the game is.
I think the hate is against a deck that can just kill you, no matter what you do. That is the perception, since the deck is so fast and has so many threats. In reality, I'm surprised that the mono-red deck wasn't running shattering spree in the SB, but I didn't see the whole list.
After looking through the old grow decks there is a consistent theme, spell that much more powerful than Quirion Dryad. Gush, Force of Will, Daze, and Land grant. Spells that are free to cast and have been banned or are used in very powerful legacy decks. I don't foresee Quirion Dryad becoming a large threat that it once was. This doesn't mean I won't try to play it at FNM for shiggles.
Maro has stated about this problem with mythics. It's a "Damned if they do, Damned if they don't." Mythic's all constructed playable? they cost $40-80. Cards never going to see a deck list except for Limited? $2-3. Either way people complain about them. I personally don't mind if a Mythic is good or not as long as it is impressive. Doesn't mean mana cost, or ability, I prefer a card that makes sense being Mythic. Army of the Damned does this for me, another trash dragon doesn't.
For those hoping for a Bob reprint, I'm one of you. I love the card and think it could fit very well, but there is a problem. There is already a confirmed Phyrexian Arena on a stick. It's a 4/4 flying demon for 3bb. He fits the same idea as bob, but not nearly the same role. A creature that you lose life to gain cards too, but at such a high cost will be put into radically different decks than Bob ever was.
However, with this demon and other tech in black that has been reprinted recently, I'm looking at you smallpox, MBC could be a force in Modern as well as standard.
The exile-ing of your cards is part of the activation cost, therefore the cards will be gone before your opponent can respond to the ability. He can however decide to remove your graveyard before you use the ability during other legal times, but then you would be able to respond to his spell, by activating Grim lavamancer.
I'm confused by people bemoaning the death of blue without Jace 2.0, and stating that they don't see a reason for Jace 2.0 to get banned. The card is being used in EVERY constructed format. Standard is the weakest of all constructed formats, usually the slowest, and has the smallest card pool. Wotc's targeted 'walker hate was powerless against him. For those stating that Jace wasn't a problem before Caw-Blade, I disagree. Jace was warping the format long before some birds picked up swords along side him. Before NPH Top 8's were consistently variations on Jace, wasn't there a GP with 32/32 Jaces?
As to the new meta. I'm not sure. Are flaming spires + Land fetching 6/6's good. Yes. But I hear Tectonic edge is around, and have people forgotten about Spreading Seas? That was how blue fought against Val in the first place, it will be back. I fully expect new strategies to come to light. NPH is out, we've got fun Johnny cards and a new type of mana that needs to be broken so WotC will learn they can't change mana. This is a time for deck designers ala Patrick Chapin. Someone will step up to the plate and wreck a PTQ, SC5K, or even the Pro Tour with something off the wall.
So Innistrad is a Graveyard/death mechanic block, set in a Gothic/Baroque era. Come on Holy Roman empire world full of political back stabbing, cults, and darkness! I'm really enjoying the way ghosts and spirits are being used in multiple cards, spreading the use of the afterlife to more colors than just black and white.
I can't wait to play this guy. EDH (Commander, whatever) is about fun for me, and nothing screams FUN like randomly hitting someone for 7 every turn! "Yo, You got a chump blocker? No? Take 7 or lose something important" Yes, there are answers to this guy. Yes, he won't kill anyone in a group game, most likely. Yes, he turns you into a target. BUT, he does something! and he does it FAST. He gets in there, he turns what is normally a stagnated drawn out format into a 'OH CRAP!? I have to cast non-mana accel before turn 8 to answer this guy or I'm dead?"
A+ in my book and I can't wait to get my Japanese version.
I am creating a Wort, the Raidmother EDH deck. In looking through cards for this new deck I have come across a number of cards that would be interesting pairs with Wort if the rules work in my favor.
Specifically if you play Nostalgic Dreams and conspired it with Word, the Raidmother would you have to discard x cards twice? Then get 2x cards from your graveyard, thus making the conspire pointless in most situations, or would the copy effect from conspire copy the x you discarded to the original spell, thus giving you double the cards you discarded, including the cards you discarded if you desired?
The general question is when you copy a spell with an effect do you still have to pay additional costs of the spell? After looking up the Comp rules I believe this to be yes, but I just want a clarification.
Fair enough. I do know that the Pre-release I attended was about 75 people in a place that I normally see no more than 35-40. Also, the other places I talked to the owners with are reliable people who don't bull. I'm 36 years old and it's well known that I have an invested interest in gaming and how well certain games do. These guys won't say "awesome" if it wasn't. They've told me other times when it's been bad, so I have no reason to feel that they are trying to pork up my opinion of them.
I pre-release I went to had a drastic drop in attendance for this set. It usually pulls over 150 I would guess, I have no numbers this was just an observation. But in past events the hall was packed with gamers from wall to wall with people drafting on the outside, worldwake was insane. Rise? Half the hall was empty chairs, and only 3/4's of the tables being used had people sitting in them. We even had Patrick Chapin as gunslinger. People didn't show up for Rise.
After playing with the Dragon lord at the pre-release I think many of you are misrepresenting how he plays out. It isn't a mana sink you use over a couple of turns to just get blown out by a removal spell. If you play him that way your playing wrong. He is a 2/2, who gladly takes the extra 1 or 2 mana you have each turn or so, if you smart about what spells you will be playing during your opponents turn, and grows from there. Once you get him to lvl 4 and he starts flying, turn 4 or 5 possibly 6 if you played him on 2 or 3, the next turn your opponent is looking down an 8/8 flying trampler. You don't force the 4/4 part of the guy, you force the 8/8 once you got casually to the 4/4. I like hitting my opponent for 8+ on turn 6 when they are starting to stabalize
I'm a fan of this deck idea running around. It looks like it could be a blast to play. I agree with the borderland ranger idea from Amneziak to get your mana right. Has anyone considered running Oracle of Mul-Daya? I'm not sure how much mana acceleration this deck needs past 4, but getting rid of lands from the top of the library seem good, and throwing out multiple dudes to get your beats in also work. If your build has Pelakka Wurm I woiuld suggest it.
For people making a big deal about the price of cards in any format, that isn't the issue for legacy. For legacy it is holding a whole PTQ season and PT where everyone NEEDS dual lands. Wizards doesn't know if there are enough dual lands for that. That's the problem, it isn't just dual lands, but that is the main part. IMO
Is anyone testing this against any decks and not just gold fishing? Play some matches against Jund, Boss Naya, Mono red, Mythic, Spread 'em, and what have you so we can understand what this deck will have trouble with and tinker w/ it after.
-Junds love of killing creatures seems to beat this deck, you've got a single creature it can kill, and only a few counter spells in most builds, while Jund packs a crap ton of removal these days, some as creatures and planeswalkers that negate can't touch.
-Mythic is crazy fast and if you don't counter the right thing your dead to lands which you can't counter
-Counter all of mono-red, I dare you.
-Boss isn't the fastest, so I could see you taking it out fairly easily, but it still packs removal, but not as much as Jund.
-Spread 'em....eh.....it makes your islands...islands....eh?
This is just how I see it at first glance. Does this mean you can't beat each of these decks? no. I just see these as the problems you will encounter and need to watch out for. Good luck testing and making a combo deck work in standard!
I think the hate is against a deck that can just kill you, no matter what you do. That is the perception, since the deck is so fast and has so many threats. In reality, I'm surprised that the mono-red deck wasn't running shattering spree in the SB, but I didn't see the whole list.
For those hoping for a Bob reprint, I'm one of you. I love the card and think it could fit very well, but there is a problem. There is already a confirmed Phyrexian Arena on a stick. It's a 4/4 flying demon for 3bb. He fits the same idea as bob, but not nearly the same role. A creature that you lose life to gain cards too, but at such a high cost will be put into radically different decks than Bob ever was.
However, with this demon and other tech in black that has been reprinted recently, I'm looking at you smallpox, MBC could be a force in Modern as well as standard.
As to the new meta. I'm not sure. Are flaming spires + Land fetching 6/6's good. Yes. But I hear Tectonic edge is around, and have people forgotten about Spreading Seas? That was how blue fought against Val in the first place, it will be back. I fully expect new strategies to come to light. NPH is out, we've got fun Johnny cards and a new type of mana that needs to be broken so WotC will learn they can't change mana. This is a time for deck designers ala Patrick Chapin. Someone will step up to the plate and wreck a PTQ, SC5K, or even the Pro Tour with something off the wall.
A+ in my book and I can't wait to get my Japanese version.
Specifically if you play Nostalgic Dreams and conspired it with Word, the Raidmother would you have to discard x cards twice? Then get 2x cards from your graveyard, thus making the conspire pointless in most situations, or would the copy effect from conspire copy the x you discarded to the original spell, thus giving you double the cards you discarded, including the cards you discarded if you desired?
The general question is when you copy a spell with an effect do you still have to pay additional costs of the spell? After looking up the Comp rules I believe this to be yes, but I just want a clarification.
I pre-release I went to had a drastic drop in attendance for this set. It usually pulls over 150 I would guess, I have no numbers this was just an observation. But in past events the hall was packed with gamers from wall to wall with people drafting on the outside, worldwake was insane. Rise? Half the hall was empty chairs, and only 3/4's of the tables being used had people sitting in them. We even had Patrick Chapin as gunslinger. People didn't show up for Rise.
-Junds love of killing creatures seems to beat this deck, you've got a single creature it can kill, and only a few counter spells in most builds, while Jund packs a crap ton of removal these days, some as creatures and planeswalkers that negate can't touch.
-Mythic is crazy fast and if you don't counter the right thing your dead to lands which you can't counter
-Counter all of mono-red, I dare you.
-Boss isn't the fastest, so I could see you taking it out fairly easily, but it still packs removal, but not as much as Jund.
-Spread 'em....eh.....it makes your islands...islands....eh?
This is just how I see it at first glance. Does this mean you can't beat each of these decks? no. I just see these as the problems you will encounter and need to watch out for. Good luck testing and making a combo deck work in standard!