Hey, Bear! I do have some updates but I have also been a little out of commission as well. Currently the deck is under some construction but the core is mostly unchanged. I'll give the primer an update to reflect the changes.
I think it's 3 for RUG, 2 for BtL. I've also been considering that 1 in the sideboard (of Bring to Light). I want to try being able to go up to 3 Anger of the Gods, 4 Obstinate Baloth, 3 Jace for a midrange-style plan post sideboard. Whether or not it's a good idea, I want to try it
I have been testing an Engineered Explosives in the main and it has been great. Hopefully you have one somewhere int he 75.
How do we all feel about Izzet Staticaster in the side? In the day of Birthing Pod it was a champion. I have seen a lot of Young Preezys and Lingering Souls tokens in Mardu Pyromancer recently.
What are everyone's opinions on Engineered Explosives right now?
I still run it in the SB. It is a great way to kill a board full of Humans or Affinity critters. But I mainly like that it can hit multiple Blood Moon, Choke (if U becomes extremely dominant), Spreading Seas (if for some reason Valakut was targeted), etc.
I have been keeping my eye out on both RUG and BtL builds. I still think RUG may be our go to...but is there a chance BtL sneaks ahead because it can Wrath a board of Eldrazi?
Praying for Scapeshift Reprint in Masters 25. I want to begin building this deck because if the meta slows down due to Jace, then this might become a big deck like it once was for a very short time. With Scapeshift and Jace, tho, it might have the 2 most expensive cards in the format. My wallet about to hurt
I used to religiously play 25 lands, and I ran a version with prismatic omen & 4x valakut for a fairly long time as well;
I remember your list. I have been religiously looking at this thread from the near beginning. I only registered a user in 2014. Your Prismatic Omen list was inspiring. I even jammed it online.
I think right now we need 25 lands minimum. I am excited to see where you innovate and hopefully my ideas will stick as well.
Nothing brings me more pleasure than explaining Valakut triggers to people. Even if they call a judge, I'll just sit at my table and relax. I could see where it gets annoying in competitive events...but I do not think that is the norm. Even if this deck ends up being a dud in the new meta I am still going to endlessly jam it.
I still think Supreme Will can find a home. Being a late game mana leak in the midst of trying to resolve a Scapeshift or Impulseing for a win condition have been very useful for me.
Also, updating the primer post announcement might be a good idea since Jace is likely to alter the metagame and Scapeshift could be in the list of Jace decks.
I think we should start figuring out what a list looks like before we update the primer (although I am 100% for it).
Here is my initial test list.
I am still unsure of what are removal suite will look like. Right now I am on the 3x Bolt/1x Repeal/1x Izzet Charm plan. I think this is a good start. We don't plan on burning people out with bolt, but being able to hit opposing Jaces sounds great. Perhaps 4 is warranted?
Jace makes us have a hard look at Search for Azcanta. again. Do we run both?
I've found Search for Azcanta pretty poor, I've had a hard time tapping out for it online and/or getting it to flip. Especially with the rise in Field of Ruin.
I like where your list is headed, and keep me up to date on the 1 ofs. I'm at 4 bolts right now, with both spell queller and humans being reasons why. Izzet charm and repeal both feel low power, but izzet charm will probably be important w/ jund back on the map. How do you like farseek? I've not needed the 9th ramp much, and sakura tribe elder already feels meh in a lot of places.
Would you ever consider 1 field of ruin as your 26th land? I've been struggling w/ Tron after the printing of Ulamog, that card is such a beating.
I think I need to go up to 4x Bolts eventually. I am still in my old habits of wanting only cards that draw me cards or prolong the game (with options). Bolt will be essential going forward.
I think Search for Azcanta as a 1 of is perfect. I would never go more, and its great as a faux-ramp spell in the late game. Early game can filter our draws and we can bin unwanted extra ramp spells if we need to.
Farseek is something I have used since my BtL days. I just cut a 26th land and now I am thinking that Farseek needs to stay because I am running fewer lands than normal. I think 25 may be the sweet spot. 25 lands with a 1x Farseek sounds like a great concession to my conclusion. I love having at least 1 ramp spell in my opener. I feel that the 9th greatly improves my chances (if someone could do that math that would be great...if not...give me a sec).
I am still fiddling with my list. I almost can't think of anything else than how fun it is going to compress this charcoal of a list into a diamond.
Not saying I'm an Oracle on any of this by any means. Just sharing my thoughts. One of the reasons this deck has struggled in recent times may have stemmed from an over-reliance on remand in the face of an aggressive format which packs single mana burn or discard spells by the bucket.
Keep up the comments. Scapeshift was the deck I started with and this deck is going to need people like you and I (not saying that I am an Oracle either) to propel it going forward.
A lot of people have been sleeping on us. I am not seeing any SCG, CFB, TCG articles floating around. With the proper amount of playing/theory crafting I think we can attack this metagame quite well.
I do have one quesiton...are you really playing only 23 lands? We want at least 25.
I'm looking forward to crafting this deck into a masterpiece.
Also, updating the primer post announcement might be a good idea since Jace is likely to alter the metagame and Scapeshift could be in the list of Jace decks.
I think we should start figuring out what a list looks like before we update the primer (although I am 100% for it).
I am still unsure of what are removal suite will look like. Right now I am on the 3x Bolt/1x Repeal/1x Izzet Charm plan. I think this is a good start. We don't plan on burning people out with bolt, but being able to hit opposing Jaces sounds great. Perhaps 4 is warranted?
Jace makes us have a hard look at Search for Azcanta. again. Do we run both?
I think this means we are back on straight RUGshift. I know I will be testing Jace as a 3-of. Being able to slam him turn three to either Brainstorm or bounce a creature sounds tasty.
@MuzzleMuffin,
Thanks , yes I’ve tried repeal at first , but since the change of rules for the double face cards , it’s less good I think ! EE was the replacement, because of the heavy meta with humans, DS , etc... I’m trying it now to help us in this matchup wich are difficult! It can also destroy bloodmoon even if there are 2 of them ! But I aggree with you that in somme matchups it’s a deadcard !
For supreme will , same thing I love the card ! But in the current meta here in france , it’s a bit slow ! And I’m trying to take the deck to GP Lyon in 2 weeks , so I am trying the 1/1 split with izzet charm for card like thalia, meddling , liliana etc... and for the last part I’m recently trying 1 abrade in place of the 4 bolt main , I don’t know if it will stay , but I wanted to give it a try ^^
Trying to make this deck great again !!
Quick question : have you the need for crumble to dust lately in the board ? I’m thinking of cutting it ! What do you think ? Thanks
Thoughts on a primer change/update?
I have really liked Crumble to Dust. I am able to hit Celestial Collonades in the UW/UWR matchups, Tron lands in Gx/Eldrazi Tron matchups, Inkmoth Nexus in the near non-existent infect matchup, etc. I have even used it on lands that require an activation cost to blow up other lands (think Field of Ruin). If you are not facing these types of matchups I would recommend cutting it. But if I were going to a GP I would definitely keep it in. Being a 1 of in the SB doesn't require a lot of attention and we are able to get to it easily with BtL.
My list is in my sig if you ever need inspiration.
I know I have expressed this notion before. Is anyone considering taking over the primer? It would be nice to see it titled "RUGx Scapeshift" that way we wouldn't alienate someone looking for advice on a U Scapeshift core (that both BtL and RUGshift use). Plus, our traffic is low and want as much love as possible for this thread.
I am not throwing myself in the hat yet but I wouldn't mind doing it if it meant we had an updated primer.
@Kozent
I like the list. But I would definitely find room for 1 more Supreme Will. I think 2 is perfect, any more or any less seems criminal. How have you liked Engineered Explosives in the main? I used to run it at times but right now I have been playing a little more interesting piece of tech.
I have been having a lot of success with Repeal lately. I have used it to bounce a Death's Shadow for 2 which allowed me to prolong the game for a turn in order to combo off. In match ups where its dead (control mirrors) I am able to cycle it on any permanent on the board (SfA, PWalkers, etc.). I know in the old days of straight RUG shift 1 was commonly seen. I like having a 1x of bounce spell in either Repeal (my choice) or a kicked Into the Roil to round of my removal suite for a total of 1x Bounce Spell (your choice), 1x Izzet Charm, 3x Lightning Bolt One of the cons is that we are not able to Bring to Light for it successfully. This is not a problem for BtL because if we need a bounce effect we would search out Cryptic Command.
I'm starting to think you are right about Leonin Arbiter. His biggest strength to me was not that he shut down searching, but that he made our opponents tutors more expensive. Stopping them from combo'ing on that same turn. Come to think of it, he seems to be pulling mix results. I remember him being quite terrible one game and good the other. I'm taking a hard look at him and he might be on the chopping block very soon.
Phyrexian Arena is something I have had a lot of success with. In the face of cEDH storm lists, etc., this looks lackluster. But I would argue that because I mostly play multiplayer formats the card advantage this guys generates is insane. Other playgroups may see Arena as a real threat, hence why it could be called a lightning rod, but in the face of cutthroat lists it doesn't even bother them. When we have a lot of hateful critters in the list drawing as much as possible has been a great strategy (even if its only on my upkeep).
Having said all that, I am going to start monitoring cards that I thought were "shoe-ins" and keep a tallied list of what they did, when I saw them, did I play it right away, etc. Thanks for all the insight everyone.
1G Sorcery
Destroy target artifact or enchantment. You may put a land card from your hand onto the battlefield.
This looks great. Only bummer is that its at sorcery speed. I assume this sees play. What do we think?
I have been testing an Engineered Explosives in the main and it has been great. Hopefully you have one somewhere int he 75.
How do we all feel about Izzet Staticaster in the side? In the day of Birthing Pod it was a champion. I have seen a lot of Young Preezys and Lingering Souls tokens in Mardu Pyromancer recently.
I still run it in the SB. It is a great way to kill a board full of Humans or Affinity critters. But I mainly like that it can hit multiple Blood Moon, Choke (if U becomes extremely dominant), Spreading Seas (if for some reason Valakut was targeted), etc.
I have been keeping my eye out on both RUG and BtL builds. I still think RUG may be our go to...but is there a chance BtL sneaks ahead because it can Wrath a board of Eldrazi?
https://mobile.twitter.com/SaffronOlive/status/962500402838233088
Hopefully this gives you some hope. I feel like it is indeed very likely. Gotta get that original Morningtide art though.
I remember your list. I have been religiously looking at this thread from the near beginning. I only registered a user in 2014. Your Prismatic Omen list was inspiring. I even jammed it online.
I think right now we need 25 lands minimum. I am excited to see where you innovate and hopefully my ideas will stick as well.
Nothing brings me more pleasure than explaining Valakut triggers to people. Even if they call a judge, I'll just sit at my table and relax. I could see where it gets annoying in competitive events...but I do not think that is the norm. Even if this deck ends up being a dud in the new meta I am still going to endlessly jam it.
On that note, I have gone down to 25 lands, 1x Supreme Will, 1x Repeal, 1x Izzet Charm, 1x Electrolyze, 1x Search for Azcanta, and 1x Farseek; being my 1 ofs.
I still think Supreme Will can find a home. Being a late game mana leak in the midst of trying to resolve a Scapeshift or Impulseing for a win condition have been very useful for me.
Thoughts?
I think I need to go up to 4x Bolts eventually. I am still in my old habits of wanting only cards that draw me cards or prolong the game (with options). Bolt will be essential going forward.
I think Search for Azcanta as a 1 of is perfect. I would never go more, and its great as a faux-ramp spell in the late game. Early game can filter our draws and we can bin unwanted extra ramp spells if we need to.
Farseek is something I have used since my BtL days. I just cut a 26th land and now I am thinking that Farseek needs to stay because I am running fewer lands than normal. I think 25 may be the sweet spot. 25 lands with a 1x Farseek sounds like a great concession to my conclusion. I love having at least 1 ramp spell in my opener. I feel that the 9th greatly improves my chances (if someone could do that math that would be great...if not...give me a sec).
I am still fiddling with my list. I almost can't think of anything else than how fun it is going to compress this charcoal of a list into a diamond.
Keep up the comments. Scapeshift was the deck I started with and this deck is going to need people like you and I (not saying that I am an Oracle either) to propel it going forward.
A lot of people have been sleeping on us. I am not seeing any SCG, CFB, TCG articles floating around. With the proper amount of playing/theory crafting I think we can attack this metagame quite well.
I do have one quesiton...are you really playing only 23 lands? We want at least 25.
I'm looking forward to crafting this deck into a masterpiece.
I think we should start figuring out what a list looks like before we update the primer (although I am 100% for it).
Here is my initial test list.
2x Breeding Pool
1x Cinder Glade
1x Flooded Grove
2x Forest
3x Island
4x Misty Rainforest
1x Mountain
1x Sheltered Thicket
4x Steam Vents
4x Stomping Ground
2x Valakut, the Molten Pinnacle
1x Wooded Foothills
Instant (14)
4x Cryptic Command
1x Izzet Charm
3x Lightning Bolt
4x Remand
1x Repeal
1x Supreme Will
1x Farseek
4x Scapeshift
4x Search for Tomorrow
1x Sweltering Suns
Enchantment (1)
1x Search for Azcanta Flip
Creature (6)
4x Sakura-Tribe Elder
2x Snapcaster Mage
Planeswalker (3)
3x Jace, the Mind Sculptor
2x Anger of the Gods
3x Chalice of the Void
2x Dispel
1x Engineered Explosives
2x Nature's Claim
1x Negate
3x Obstinate Baloth
1x Shatterstorm
I am still unsure of what are removal suite will look like. Right now I am on the 3x Bolt/1x Repeal/1x Izzet Charm plan. I think this is a good start. We don't plan on burning people out with bolt, but being able to hit opposing Jaces sounds great. Perhaps 4 is warranted?
Jace makes us have a hard look at Search for Azcanta. again. Do we run both?
edit: SB is definitely in the works.
I think this means we are back on straight RUGshift. I know I will be testing Jace as a 3-of. Being able to slam him turn three to either Brainstorm or bounce a creature sounds tasty.
Anybody with a potential list?
Thoughts on a primer change/update?
I have really liked Crumble to Dust. I am able to hit Celestial Collonades in the UW/UWR matchups, Tron lands in Gx/Eldrazi Tron matchups, Inkmoth Nexus in the near non-existent infect matchup, etc. I have even used it on lands that require an activation cost to blow up other lands (think Field of Ruin). If you are not facing these types of matchups I would recommend cutting it. But if I were going to a GP I would definitely keep it in. Being a 1 of in the SB doesn't require a lot of attention and we are able to get to it easily with BtL.
My list is in my sig if you ever need inspiration.
I am not throwing myself in the hat yet but I wouldn't mind doing it if it meant we had an updated primer.
Thoughts?
I like the list. But I would definitely find room for 1 more Supreme Will. I think 2 is perfect, any more or any less seems criminal. How have you liked Engineered Explosives in the main? I used to run it at times but right now I have been playing a little more interesting piece of tech.
I have been having a lot of success with Repeal lately. I have used it to bounce a Death's Shadow for 2 which allowed me to prolong the game for a turn in order to combo off. In match ups where its dead (control mirrors) I am able to cycle it on any permanent on the board (SfA, PWalkers, etc.). I know in the old days of straight RUG shift 1 was commonly seen. I like having a 1x of bounce spell in either Repeal (my choice) or a kicked Into the Roil to round of my removal suite for a total of 1x Bounce Spell (your choice), 1x Izzet Charm, 3x Lightning Bolt One of the cons is that we are not able to Bring to Light for it successfully. This is not a problem for BtL because if we need a bounce effect we would search out Cryptic Command.
I'm starting to think you are right about Leonin Arbiter. His biggest strength to me was not that he shut down searching, but that he made our opponents tutors more expensive. Stopping them from combo'ing on that same turn. Come to think of it, he seems to be pulling mix results. I remember him being quite terrible one game and good the other. I'm taking a hard look at him and he might be on the chopping block very soon.
Phyrexian Arena is something I have had a lot of success with. In the face of cEDH storm lists, etc., this looks lackluster. But I would argue that because I mostly play multiplayer formats the card advantage this guys generates is insane. Other playgroups may see Arena as a real threat, hence why it could be called a lightning rod, but in the face of cutthroat lists it doesn't even bother them. When we have a lot of hateful critters in the list drawing as much as possible has been a great strategy (even if its only on my upkeep).
Having said all that, I am going to start monitoring cards that I thought were "shoe-ins" and keep a tallied list of what they did, when I saw them, did I play it right away, etc. Thanks for all the insight everyone.