MTG Salvation

Looking at the primer and reading the last couple of pages, I'm wondering something. In the Planeswalker section, it lists walkers that are good and really only has a few. If U/W is one of the more popular color combos for the deck, why is there no mention of Narset Transcendent? Sure her rebound ability is useless for us, but she digs hard for cards and once your opponent can't cast non-creature spells, our enchantments are safe and with Ghostly Prisons and Nevermore effects running, they likely won't have any way to win. Seems like she could help speed up wins for the deck some portion of the time.

Then again, I'm currently running Esper Transcendent and have upped the walker count to 13 main and 2 more in the board, but walkers seem like an excellent win con for the deck.

Quote from treachtv »

I fear there will be no goblins in Ixalan block. Oh well.. at least Dominaria has to have them!

One of the red rares is a Goblin Pirate I believe. Goblins FINALLY freaking return. Pretty underwhelming in BFZ block and none in Shadows, Kaladesh OR Amonkhet. Not sure there has been a year and a half gap for Goblins before has there?

Yes, the fact that none of the mill cards are instant speed is a bit of a bummer, but really that doesn't matter. The Gearhulk interacts w/the card draw and countermagic (and Engulf) that you use to stay alive and choose your spots to do chunks of milling. Plus, you likely end up able to drop a Fraying here and there and have multiples in play before that build even bothers to start doing much milling.

The Fog decks takes a lot from an early Approach deck I was working on. The Full On Combo version uses some of the same artifacts that are used in my Aetherflux Reservoir deck to dig and help get delerium for Manic Scribe. There is so much removal floating around the format right now that MoI feels very underwhelming to be relying on him, for me anyway. I'd rather setup a little bit, then when things are safe and you choose your spot, do big chunks of milling.

Temur Mill



Bant Mill-Fog



Gearhulk Control Mill



Full on Mill



Fun Mill Math:

1)
T4: Fraying Sanity on the board. Compelling Argumentx2. Mills a total of 20 (5+5+10).
T5: Startled Awake. Mills a total of 26 (13+13)

2)
T5: Fraying Sanityx2 on the board. Compelling Argument, Sac Ipnu Rivulet. Mills a total of 36 (5+4+9+18)
T6: Winds of Rebuke, Sac Ipnu Rivulet. Mills a total of 24 (2+4+6+12

3)
T5: Fraying Sanityx2 on the board. Startled Awake. Mills a total of 52 (13+13+26)

4)
T4: Fraying Sanity on the board. Compelling Argument, Sac Ipnu Rivulet. Mills a total of 18 (5+4+9).

5)
T6: Fraying Sanityx3 on the board. Compelling Argumentx2, Winds of Rebuke. Mills a total of 84 (5+5+2+12+24+36).




Friend is supposed to come over this weekend and I will get some opportunities to test the Gearhulk version.

Other than the 1 mana cc increase, Riverwinder is a strict upgrade to River Serpent

1 card for 0 mana (Street Wraith)

2 cards for W (Glassdust Hulk, Winged Shepherd) Hulk is OK, Shepherd is pretty crap. Hulk is the only reasonable option for white.

4 cards for U (Curator of Mysteries, Architects of Will, Glassdust Hulk, Striped Riverwinder) Curator and Architects have the best bonus once in play and Riverwinder is the most likely to stay on the board excepting boardwipes.

3 cards for B (Architects of Will, Monstrous Carabid, Horror of the Broken Lands) All great

3 cards for R (Monstrous Carabid, Deadshot Minotaur, Desert Ceredon) (See Black)

1 Card for G (Deadshot Minotaur) He's fine, more useful vs a deck like Affinity who have lots of fliers so you don't just kill your own Faerie Macabre





Currently my build is running 27 total cyclers and they all cycle for 1 mana. Here is a breakdown by deck color combo for what options of cyclers exist.


W/U/R/G: 1 Instant, 1 Sorcery cascade; 8 cyclers
Ardent Plea
Violent Outburst

Street Wraith
Glassdust Hulk
Curator of Mysteries
Architects of Will
Striped Riverwinder
Monstrous Carabid
Deadshot Minotaur
Desert Cerodon


W/U/B/R: ALL 8 Sorcery speed cascade; 10 cyclers
Ardent Plea
Demonic Dread

Street Wraith
Glassdust Hulk
Curator of Mysteries
Architects of Will
Striped Riverwinder
Faerie Macabre
Monstrous Carabid
Horror of the Broken Lands
Deadshot Minotaur
Desert Cerodon


W/U/B/R/G: 12 Cascade cards (4 instant); 10 cyclers
Ardent Plea
Demonic Dread
Violent Outburst

Street Wraith
Glassdust Hulk
Curator of Mysteries
Architects of Will
Striped Riverwinder
Faerie Macabre
Monstrous Carabid
Horror of the Broken Lands
Desert Cerodon
Deadshot Minotaur


B/R/G: 1 Instant, 1 Sorcery cascade; 7 cyclers
Demonic Dread
Violent Outburst

Street Wraith
Architects of Will
Faerie Macabre
Monstrous Carabid
Horror of the Broken Lands
Desert Cerodon
Deadshot Minotaur

You're putting very few creatures in the GY, I don't think Scarab God works in this build. I'd rather see it in a U/B Zombies deck w/Cryptbreaker. I could get behind it a bit more if Rise From the Tides wasn't so expensive.

The main milling effects are all centered in blue, so you can do U/X/X easily and not lose out on anything very good. Fraying Sanity, Compelling Argument, Startled Awake and Winds of Rebuke are all you need. The rest of the shell is a question.

You can stay mono blue and go all in on the combo, Manic Scribe, Implements and Puzzleknots to help get delerium, but not much of an alternate win plan. Crush of Tentacles and maybe a copy of Approach of teh Second Sun splashed in off Prophetic Prisms and Aether Hubs are a possibility.

You can go Bant and merge the mill cards with a TurboFog deck.

You can go Temur and have Fevered Visions as a secondary gameplan, but also keeping your hand filled to keep milling them faster. Hour of Devastation helps keep the board clear as well.

Sultai gets the Fogs from Green and kill spells from Black.

Esper has board wipes in Hour of Revelation and Fumigate, as well as a bonus fog in Dazzling Reflection.

You can also stay mono blue and merge the mill plan with a Gearhulk control deck.

I like the mono blue ideas and leaning hard on Engulf the Shore for protection. The Puzzleknot version just runs Woodweavers to help stay alive. I like that you can run 2 Dunes of the Dead in addition to the 4 Ipnu Rivulets in the mono blue build and not lose anything, plus it gives you a couple extra deserts to sac so you don't just get rid of the land that provides that ability.

The Riverwinder trades w/Angler, dies to Wurmcoil Engine, larger Goyfs and Death's Shadow and not a whole lot else that actually sees play. I don't want to deal w/the mana of a 4C or 5C version of the deck, but a hexproof 5/5 is pretty sexy.

New incentive to have blue in the deck in Striped Riverwinder. Cycling was heavier in the first set clearly, but here are all the creatures w/cycling in the set (minus the 0/5 defender)

Angel of the God-Pharoah 4WW 4/4 Flying; Cycling: 2

Striped Riverwinder 6U 5/5 Hexproof Cycling: U
Nimble Obstructionist 2U 3/1 Flash Flying; Cycling: 2U When cycled, Stifle

Lurching Rotbeast 3B 4/2 Cycling: B
Vile Manifestation 1B 0/4 gets +1/+0 for eac cycling card in GY; Cycling: 2

Granitic Titan 4RR 5/4 Menace; Cycling: 2

Rampaging Hippo 4GG 5/6 Trample; Cycling: 2

Hollow One 5 4/4 Costs 2 less for each card cycled/discarded this turn; Cycling: 2

The Dragons I used when I tried this deck recently in Modern were 1 each of:
Thundermaw Hellkite
Stormbreath Dragon
Dragonlord Kolaghan
Atarka, World Render
Scourge of Valkas
Bogardan Hellkite

Of the cards you listed, it appears that IoK and Abrupt Decay are the low hanging fruit. There isn't really a good way to bring the cost of LotV and Thoughtseize down short of more reprints. Completely understand the father thing as I have 3 kids myself. Pulse is a 1-2 of generally and Decay is anywhere from 2-4 in the 75.

Inquisition of Kozilek: $5
Abrupt Decay: $4.50
Liliana of the Veil: $90
Maelstrom Pulse: $25
Thoughtseize: $30



This is the last build I was running, apparently my SB is missing tho. If you can't swing an Overgrown Tomb or 2 and don't have any green fetches, your current manabase is fine. I don't actually run any discard in my version and I was using Coursers in the deck as well. Some number of Ooze in the board is good. Phyrexian Arena I like as a 1 of. Too many just kills your life way too fast and this deck can be very rough on your life total. Languish would be Damnation if I had one.




Smallpox is a great 2nd or 3rd turn play. If you Search T1, Elder T2, then T3 cast Smallpox, you are looking at being on 3 mana afterwards and they will be behind. Really great to be on the play and watch them do something like T1 Delver or the Bauble builds of Death Shadow that get a T1 Shadow on the board. Then you take your turn and Smallpox it away You have ways to get things back from the GY and to search out of your deck, so losing a land early isn't that big a deal. In the turn sequence I showed above, you can easily drop Garruk in the wake of that play on the next turn or Courser and maybe get a land off the top of your deck.

Some builds of the deck go the Utopia Sprawl route to ramp, but I haven't messed w/that yet. I'll admit my deck has been put up for awhile as it hasn't felt great in the meta for quite awhile, but if we can protect ourselves from their discard somehow, having more resources than your opponent gets you way ahead. An Abzan list w/Leyline of sanctity in the board might be a thing.

Quote from Quartz »

A couple of pages ago is a decklist from a user (can't remember the name, sorry) that has gotten some results.

anorgasmicdeath is the user in question. I like the consistency of a 2C manabase over a 3C, but his Esper list looks good. I will check yours out too.

This seems potentially bad for us.



http://mythicspoiler.com/hou/cards/solemnity.html

Is there currently a consensus build for UB Mill? Fraying Sanity looks very interesting for the deck. Sadly the Primer OP is 4 years old.

I'm really shocked that no one noticed a full set of Lava Axe in the 9th place Baltimore Burn deck. I'm assuming it's a typo as there is no Lava Spike in that decklist, but that is one helluva way to fight flooding out and throwing off DS life math. Not to mention that it can't get grabbed by IoK

Sadly it's probably just a typo, not secret tech.



EDIT: Tweeted SCG and they fixed it. Sad it's a typo heh.

Knew there had been another card from AER I was forgetting. The list had originally been a mostly Kaladesh list and I remembered Rebuke and slid it in.

Quote from fromagedechevre »

With the printing of Desert Cerodon and Horror of the Broken Lands, most people will probably choose to play a Jund variant of Living End. So it seems unlikely that they'll want it, but a blue variant isn't totally impossible to build.

I think Blue is interesting for the SB possibility of removing the combo and turning into a cycling value deck w/Drake Haven and Faith of the Devoted.