I wonder since I don't have the Horizon Canopies, if Loaming Shaman wouldn't be better in their place. As well as, one of the 3 Essence Wardens as kind of an oops lifegain in the mainboard instead of Elvish Champion. I am thinking Elvish Champion might screw up the curve a little more, which frees another sideboard option for me.
I am going to go into a little bit more analysis of the games that I have had. I can't go into too much detail as I don't remember all of them. Some references to thing, I could really use some help on what to take out in general or specific match ups. However, when I say I exploded or vomited elfs. It generally went turn 1 - Mana dork, turn 2 with a heritage leading to tapped elves for archdruid or ezuri or lead the stampede.
Game 1: Jund - 0-0 - Game 1 - he won game 1 after mulling down to 5, but he had 3 pieces of hand disruption that got rid of my turn 1 Nettle Sentinel, and a Turn 2 Dwynen's Elite. I also got really really flooded and drew nothing else. I never recovered after having no early game and he powered through with Tarms. I sided in Chameleon Collosus and I think 3 Dismembers. I took a hodge podge of an archdruid, an elite, a visionary, I think 2 mana dorks. I am not certain of what to take out during siding. I settled on if I was racing, I would take visionaries and an elvish champion if no forest. If I was grinding that I still took out a visionary, an elite or 2, and then some manadorks/an archdruid. It really just depends, but I could use some help in learning on what to take out during boarding. I would appreciate it. Game 2: I don't remember as much, as it wasn't great hands by either of us. I think he was stuck on 3 Lands and when he got a 4th land it was a tap land, so he couldn't damnation. I had enough juice to go with it. I think it involved a collected company for a visionary/ezuri where I got a chameleon collossus and played it. He thought he was good, but he forgot that chameleon was an elf. Game 3, I had a good hand just vomited Elves into Archdruid attacks. This will be a repeating refrain. If they couldn't interact with me or a had a slow hand it was just over for them by turn 4.
Match 2: Merfolk - 1-0 Game 1 - he had an aether vial out and some merfolk. I kept an eye on cursecatcher and others, but I had sylvan messengers and leads in hand, so I just got ridiculous number of elves in my hand and then exploded with heritage on the field for a quick victory. Game 2 - I kept a slow hand and he had Rejery combo like turn 4 which exploded with lords that bounced my archdruid into hand and I scooped for game 3. Game 3 was much like game 1. I had the elves and the spells to gas, I pressed it and did a huge amount of overun damage like activiting ezuri multiple times type thing.
Match 3: Jund - 2-0 I don't remember these games much as I think I blocked them out of my mind, but I think I kept really bad hands and he disrupted what I took with early tarmos. I do remember he had a Bonfire redspell that wiped my board once or twice that really really hurt me. I also whiffed pretty hard on messengers/leads/companies when I had them. I think this was an inexperience in keeping bad hands early and then just whiffing didn't help either. I went 0-2 both games.
Match 4: GR Tron - 2-1 - Game 1 I had a great hand and upchucked the Elves. He even had tron on turn 3 or 4, but couldn't deal with all the explody elfyness. Game 2 - He got an early karn that exiled my Ezuri in hand and then followed with wyrm coil. I did get a sided in Fracturing Gust, but to no avail as I didn't draw enough gas and he got the Emekrul mana to kill me. Game 3 was just really explodey again with elves. I think it was another turn 3-4 kill and he was on 2 lands and a bunch of big stuff in hand.
Match 5: Baby Junk or GW Hatebears - 3-1 My match opponent was late buying cards which lead to a game loss on his part. At this point, I was in table 5, so I was quite ecstatic at this point. the only game we played, I had a turn 3 kill on the draw as I emptied my hand completely on turn 2 with like a heritage and 2 nettle sentinels in play and ended that turn with Archdruid as I spent like a total of 8 mana turn 2. I drew the Ezuri and he conceded. It must have really frustrating and pointless for my opponent. I saw a Scooze and a Bladeslicer and later saw him playing Voice of Resurgence.
Match 6: Affinity - 4-1 Game 1 - He outraced me, I don't think I exploded fast or well enough to outrace him. I think I mulliganed, but I didn't have complete gas. Game 2 - Whipflare on turn 2 after I exploded and drew a Fracturing Gust.
Match 7: Merfolk - 4-2 Game 1 - Explodey McExploderson. Game 2 - I let up on competitiveness and played a slow had with lots of gas, but no early explosiveness. He got a really great hand with Regery again to cast a lot on his side. I underestimated my opponent and the deck after easy wins previously. This was a rookie mistake Game 3 - I didn't let up this time, I exploded again for victory.
I am sorry that I am not as detailed as some others. I am still new to this and I don't remember much. 5-2 and I am going to keep playing this rather than the chord version. I like it alot and it caters to my preferred simplistic tribal style .
I played essentially a version of the Andrew Sollano Lead/Messenger deck today (10/25/15) at a Star City 5k Premier IQ. I got 11th. The only changes I think from your list was 18 lands with no horizon canopies and I used Elvish Champion as a replacement for the 19th Land, and using Essence Wardens instead of Kitchen Finks. However, I never faced an opponent that I sided in the Essence Wardens for save as a weird Affinity tempo play.
I beat Jund 2-1, UW Merfolk 2-1, and then lost to Jund 0-2, beat GR Tron 2-1, mini-Junk 2-0, lost to Affinity 0-2, then beat Merfolk 2-1. This was my first major tournament and I took your version instead of the chord version for several reasons. I thought being a relatively new player and not having the deck for long, a more straight forward deck with less lines of play compared to the chord version would lead to a better outcome. I also liked the simplicity of the deck with less sideboarding options in the toolkit. The affinity match up just was bad. The first game, I just wasn't fast enough and thats ok. The second game he wildslashed me after I exploded. I did side the 2 Fracturing Gusts and had one in my hand, but after wildslash, I had no more mana to cast it. Should I have not exploded and kept more in hand? I think I would play that match up differently now that I know what it contains. I was just surprised by it, being new, I guess I should have expected it. Affinity was extremely prominent as was Merfolk. I was wondering if you have a 3rd Fracturing Gust or go with a Kataki's War Mage if affinity becomes more popular or go with a mainboard rec sage if you don't like Elvish Champion. I just wwonder what I could cut though in the sideboard for a 3rd piece of Affinity hate that doesn't really screw me in my other match ups.
What do you think that 19th land should be? I think the only real choices are Rec Sage, Elvish Champion, Sylvan Messenger, and Lead the Stampede. I am leaning towards Lead the Stampede after today.
This deck was explosively fast. There were times in which I just exploded my hand. What are your mulligan rules in general?
I will be placing Emeria Shepherd in the deck absolutely. What about the new X costing Oblivion Ring or the Flash creature oblivion ring? Do they have a place here? I just bought the entire deck and have it, but I haven't played it yet. I used the list on the first page.
That is cool, I currently play the white splash as it is easier on the wallet (I don't have canopies), but I am interested in seeing a variety of lists and what cards they use or not. Can you post some of many lists and the variety of cards? I would be interested in seeing it.
I would like to play Shamans competitivly, but I switched to Elves until Shamans gets a boost. I love my shamans and I am not going to dismantle the deck at all save for what I use for Elves, but I feel we need another win con other then Rage Forger. I feel the deck is way way too fragile otherwise. If we had a lord like Elvish Archdruid wich provided some other benefit while giving a +1/+1 and a 1 CMC mana dork, I think we would be better.
Thrun is in a lot of lists and probably Chameleon Colossus might be able to replace him for Tasigur/Angler decks, atlhough against Azban, it still might be useful to have the hexproof of Thrun.
There is a Red shaman for 2R in the spoilers that when he enters the battlefield he grants menace to ALL creatures. This might be an additional turn 3 or 4 or beyond play for additional/final damage to push through tokens/blockers. I like this as a sort of turn 4 play with banneret on the field. cast this then Rage Forger for lots of damage or even turn 3 this and let your BTE and other card deal if not spectacular damage, decent damage and the finish with Rage Forger next turn.
Non-Basic Land hate (Fulminator mage, Ruin Blaster Goblin, Blood Moon), Artifact/Enchantment Hate (Reclamation Sage, Destructive Revelry, Shatterstorm), Big Creature hate (Roast, Dismember), Graveyard hate (Relic of Progenitus, Scavenging Ooze), Burn hate (Essence Wardens), Lifegain hate (can't remember the card at the moment, but an Elemental Shaman, instant that does damage and prevents lifegain, Atarka's Command), Thrun/other hexproof troll
I like Minotaurs, but I think even in that build while they may win some games, they are going to come out worse for ear more often then not. For a fun, but not too great modern deck it should be a blast, but to trick it out will be insanely costly, for not a lot of benefit.
If you like cheap modern decks that still can work. You could try Shamans on the Budget Modern forum that may work better. I have tried it and I love it and I upgraded the basic package a bit.
How much money are you willing to spend in this endeavor? You are primarily an aggro deck. A mostly slow midrangy one. You need to think about a Turn 4 or 5 win most of the times. You will need graveyard hate such as Relic in the sideboard. You will need non-basic hate or artifact hate for Tron and Affinity. You will need mass destruction for weenies such as Elves and possibly burn (which lifegain somewhere could help). Boggles/Merfolk I htink will give you some trouble as well especiall yif Merfolk plays with spreading seas. I can't really talk about other matchups as I don't know them.
I think you would want Aether Vials at 4. 4 Cavern of Souls obviously, 2 mutivaults, 4 Rakdos fetches, at least 4 possibly more Rakdos Shocklands, 4 Rakdos checklands, Urborg, 3 Mountains, 1 Swamp (maybe more swamps if has prevelance of bloodmoon). Bloodmoon also wouldn't be a bad card to run if yo uwant to run more swamps.
Good Spells that you don't have listed
Thoughtseize - early handdisruption
Inquisition - early hand disruption
Go for the Throat/Heroes Downfall - 1v1 Kill cards
Read the Bones/Sign in Blood/Outpost Siege - need Gas
Pyroclasm for weenie and token decks.
I think you need more Twin, Tron, and graveyard hate
since Rakdos, try Rakdos Charm or Kologhan's Command or look at other rakdos deck for what they choose
Try some sort of lifegain against burn type decks or fast aggro before you can stabilize. Whip of Erebos might be a decent way to go about it, but i am not sure
Spells you need to lose
Lightning STrike
I think you also need some cheap recursion in some form, creature tutors, or something to maintain your engine/ability to do damage
Minotaurs you are missing
Gnarled Scarhide - fast aggro - need 4
Boros Reckoner - one of the best minotaurs ever printed
Gorehorn Minotaur or somehting like that
Lord of Shatterskull pass
Deathbellow raider
Fanatic of Mogis
Felhide Petrifier should be a 2 or 1 of.
Go to four for Rageblood/Ragemonter. You can go more Kragma Warcallers
Minotaurs you should remove
Felhide Spiritbinder (way to slow and dies to bolt)
Kragma Butcher
Minotaur skullcleaver
I can't really comment on non-minotaurs but Mogis might be useful as a sideboard card with long game matches
How much money are you willing to spend in this endeavor? You are primarily an aggro deck. A mostly slow midrangy one. You need to think about a Turn 4 or 5 win most of the times. You will need graveyard hate such as Relic in the sideboard. You will need non-basic hate or artifact hate for Tron and Affinity. You will need mass destruction for weenies such as Elves and possibly burn (which lifegain somewhere could help). Boggles/Merfolk I htink will give you some trouble as well especiall yif Merfolk plays with spreading seas. I can't really talk about other matchups as I don't know them.
I think you would want Aether Vials at 4. 4 Cavern of Souls obviously, 2 mutivaults, 4 Rakdos fetches, at least 4 possibly more Rakdos Shocklands, 4 Rakdos checklands, Urborg, 3 Mountains, 1 Swamp (maybe more swamps if has prevelance of bloodmoon). Bloodmoon also wouldn't be a bad card to run if yo uwant to run more swamps.
Good Spells that you don't have listed
Thoughtseize - early handdisruption
Inquisition - early hand disruption
Go for the Throat/Heroes Downfall - 1v1 Kill cards
Read the Bones/Sign in Blood/Outpost Siege - need Gas
Pyroclasm for weenie and token decks.
I think you need more Twin, Tron, and graveyard hate
since Rakdos, try Rakdos Charm or Kologhan's Command or look at other rakdos deck for what they choose
Try some sort of lifegain against burn type decks or fast aggro before you can stabilize. Whip of Erebos might be a decent way to go about it, but i am not sure
Spells you need to lose
Lightning STrike
I think you also need some cheap recursion in some form, creature tutors, or something to maintain your engine/ability to do damage
Minotaurs you are missing
Gnarled Scarhide - fast aggro - need 4
Boros Reckoner - one of the best minotaurs ever printed
Gorehorn Minotaur or somehting like that
Lord of Shatterskull pass
Deathbellow raider
Fanatic of Mogis
Felhide Petrifier should be a 2 or 1 of.
Go to four for Rageblood/Ragemonter. You can go more Kragma Warcallers
Minotaurs you should remove
Felhide Spiritbinder (way to slow and dies to bolt)
Kragma Butcher
Minotaur skullcleaver
I can't really comment on non-minotaurs but Mogis might be useful as a sideboard card with long game matches
I have found that bosk banneret allows me to get by when I get mana screwed and has helped me win many times not just with his main ability, but being a 1/3 has helped stopped people attacking when i have rage forged a few times or 2/2s
I have found the mana dorks whether birds or mystics helpful to get online faster. Rage Forger is our win condition and getting him or more shamans out on turn 2/3 to swing on turn 4 or get a blood moon on turn 2 or use it when that 3rd land doesn't come on time. They provide stability even if they aren't the best. You could try Treefolk Harbingers if you want a shaman. 0/3 creature could be useful especially if buffed by rage forger as a 1/4. that is a lot of blocking power and can still turn once rage forger is one the field. If you have the mana, it can also tutor a bosk banneret late game if needed or a leaf-crown elder if you have one.
However, try it and see if it works. If it does, let me know.
Game 1: Jund - 0-0 - Game 1 - he won game 1 after mulling down to 5, but he had 3 pieces of hand disruption that got rid of my turn 1 Nettle Sentinel, and a Turn 2 Dwynen's Elite. I also got really really flooded and drew nothing else. I never recovered after having no early game and he powered through with Tarms. I sided in Chameleon Collosus and I think 3 Dismembers. I took a hodge podge of an archdruid, an elite, a visionary, I think 2 mana dorks. I am not certain of what to take out during siding. I settled on if I was racing, I would take visionaries and an elvish champion if no forest. If I was grinding that I still took out a visionary, an elite or 2, and then some manadorks/an archdruid. It really just depends, but I could use some help in learning on what to take out during boarding. I would appreciate it. Game 2: I don't remember as much, as it wasn't great hands by either of us. I think he was stuck on 3 Lands and when he got a 4th land it was a tap land, so he couldn't damnation. I had enough juice to go with it. I think it involved a collected company for a visionary/ezuri where I got a chameleon collossus and played it. He thought he was good, but he forgot that chameleon was an elf. Game 3, I had a good hand just vomited Elves into Archdruid attacks. This will be a repeating refrain. If they couldn't interact with me or a had a slow hand it was just over for them by turn 4.
Match 2: Merfolk - 1-0 Game 1 - he had an aether vial out and some merfolk. I kept an eye on cursecatcher and others, but I had sylvan messengers and leads in hand, so I just got ridiculous number of elves in my hand and then exploded with heritage on the field for a quick victory. Game 2 - I kept a slow hand and he had Rejery combo like turn 4 which exploded with lords that bounced my archdruid into hand and I scooped for game 3. Game 3 was much like game 1. I had the elves and the spells to gas, I pressed it and did a huge amount of overun damage like activiting ezuri multiple times type thing.
Match 3: Jund - 2-0 I don't remember these games much as I think I blocked them out of my mind, but I think I kept really bad hands and he disrupted what I took with early tarmos. I do remember he had a Bonfire redspell that wiped my board once or twice that really really hurt me. I also whiffed pretty hard on messengers/leads/companies when I had them. I think this was an inexperience in keeping bad hands early and then just whiffing didn't help either. I went 0-2 both games.
Match 4: GR Tron - 2-1 - Game 1 I had a great hand and upchucked the Elves. He even had tron on turn 3 or 4, but couldn't deal with all the explody elfyness. Game 2 - He got an early karn that exiled my Ezuri in hand and then followed with wyrm coil. I did get a sided in Fracturing Gust, but to no avail as I didn't draw enough gas and he got the Emekrul mana to kill me. Game 3 was just really explodey again with elves. I think it was another turn 3-4 kill and he was on 2 lands and a bunch of big stuff in hand.
Match 5: Baby Junk or GW Hatebears - 3-1 My match opponent was late buying cards which lead to a game loss on his part. At this point, I was in table 5, so I was quite ecstatic at this point. the only game we played, I had a turn 3 kill on the draw as I emptied my hand completely on turn 2 with like a heritage and 2 nettle sentinels in play and ended that turn with Archdruid as I spent like a total of 8 mana turn 2. I drew the Ezuri and he conceded. It must have really frustrating and pointless for my opponent. I saw a Scooze and a Bladeslicer and later saw him playing Voice of Resurgence.
Match 6: Affinity - 4-1 Game 1 - He outraced me, I don't think I exploded fast or well enough to outrace him. I think I mulliganed, but I didn't have complete gas. Game 2 - Whipflare on turn 2 after I exploded and drew a Fracturing Gust.
Match 7: Merfolk - 4-2 Game 1 - Explodey McExploderson. Game 2 - I let up on competitiveness and played a slow had with lots of gas, but no early explosiveness. He got a really great hand with Regery again to cast a lot on his side. I underestimated my opponent and the deck after easy wins previously. This was a rookie mistake Game 3 - I didn't let up this time, I exploded again for victory.
I am sorry that I am not as detailed as some others. I am still new to this and I don't remember much. 5-2 and I am going to keep playing this rather than the chord version. I like it alot and it caters to my preferred simplistic tribal style .
I beat Jund 2-1, UW Merfolk 2-1, and then lost to Jund 0-2, beat GR Tron 2-1, mini-Junk 2-0, lost to Affinity 0-2, then beat Merfolk 2-1. This was my first major tournament and I took your version instead of the chord version for several reasons. I thought being a relatively new player and not having the deck for long, a more straight forward deck with less lines of play compared to the chord version would lead to a better outcome. I also liked the simplicity of the deck with less sideboarding options in the toolkit. The affinity match up just was bad. The first game, I just wasn't fast enough and thats ok. The second game he wildslashed me after I exploded. I did side the 2 Fracturing Gusts and had one in my hand, but after wildslash, I had no more mana to cast it. Should I have not exploded and kept more in hand? I think I would play that match up differently now that I know what it contains. I was just surprised by it, being new, I guess I should have expected it. Affinity was extremely prominent as was Merfolk. I was wondering if you have a 3rd Fracturing Gust or go with a Kataki's War Mage if affinity becomes more popular or go with a mainboard rec sage if you don't like Elvish Champion. I just wwonder what I could cut though in the sideboard for a 3rd piece of Affinity hate that doesn't really screw me in my other match ups.
What do you think that 19th land should be? I think the only real choices are Rec Sage, Elvish Champion, Sylvan Messenger, and Lead the Stampede. I am leaning towards Lead the Stampede after today.
This deck was explosively fast. There were times in which I just exploded my hand. What are your mulligan rules in general?
With Ivorytusk Fortress, do you try to go in on counters with cathar's crusade? Maybe add in some of the Guildgates?
Doran the Seige Tower for Treefolk Tribal
Zuberi is the only Griffen Tribal Commander
Marrow-Gnawer for Rat Tribal
Seshiro, the Annointed for Snake Tribal
Karona, Progenitus, Child of Alara or if you group will accept it Chromanticore for General of a God Tribal Enchantress.
There is a Red shaman for 2R in the spoilers that when he enters the battlefield he grants menace to ALL creatures. This might be an additional turn 3 or 4 or beyond play for additional/final damage to push through tokens/blockers. I like this as a sort of turn 4 play with banneret on the field. cast this then Rage Forger for lots of damage or even turn 3 this and let your BTE and other card deal if not spectacular damage, decent damage and the finish with Rage Forger next turn.
I like Minotaurs, but I think even in that build while they may win some games, they are going to come out worse for ear more often then not. For a fun, but not too great modern deck it should be a blast, but to trick it out will be insanely costly, for not a lot of benefit.
If you like cheap modern decks that still can work. You could try Shamans on the Budget Modern forum that may work better. I have tried it and I love it and I upgraded the basic package a bit.
I think you would want Aether Vials at 4. 4 Cavern of Souls obviously, 2 mutivaults, 4 Rakdos fetches, at least 4 possibly more Rakdos Shocklands, 4 Rakdos checklands, Urborg, 3 Mountains, 1 Swamp (maybe more swamps if has prevelance of bloodmoon). Bloodmoon also wouldn't be a bad card to run if yo uwant to run more swamps.
Good Spells that you don't have listed
Thoughtseize - early handdisruption
Inquisition - early hand disruption
Go for the Throat/Heroes Downfall - 1v1 Kill cards
Read the Bones/Sign in Blood/Outpost Siege - need Gas
Pyroclasm for weenie and token decks.
I think you need more Twin, Tron, and graveyard hate
since Rakdos, try Rakdos Charm or Kologhan's Command or look at other rakdos deck for what they choose
Try some sort of lifegain against burn type decks or fast aggro before you can stabilize. Whip of Erebos might be a decent way to go about it, but i am not sure
Spells you need to lose
Lightning STrike
I think you also need some cheap recursion in some form, creature tutors, or something to maintain your engine/ability to do damage
Minotaurs you are missing
Gnarled Scarhide - fast aggro - need 4
Boros Reckoner - one of the best minotaurs ever printed
Gorehorn Minotaur or somehting like that
Lord of Shatterskull pass
Deathbellow raider
Fanatic of Mogis
Felhide Petrifier should be a 2 or 1 of.
Go to four for Rageblood/Ragemonter. You can go more Kragma Warcallers
Minotaurs you should remove
Felhide Spiritbinder (way to slow and dies to bolt)
Kragma Butcher
Minotaur skullcleaver
I can't really comment on non-minotaurs but Mogis might be useful as a sideboard card with long game matches
I think you would want Aether Vials at 4. 4 Cavern of Souls obviously, 2 mutivaults, 4 Rakdos fetches, at least 4 possibly more Rakdos Shocklands, 4 Rakdos checklands, Urborg, 3 Mountains, 1 Swamp (maybe more swamps if has prevelance of bloodmoon). Bloodmoon also wouldn't be a bad card to run if yo uwant to run more swamps.
Good Spells that you don't have listed
Thoughtseize - early handdisruption
Inquisition - early hand disruption
Go for the Throat/Heroes Downfall - 1v1 Kill cards
Read the Bones/Sign in Blood/Outpost Siege - need Gas
Pyroclasm for weenie and token decks.
I think you need more Twin, Tron, and graveyard hate
since Rakdos, try Rakdos Charm or Kologhan's Command or look at other rakdos deck for what they choose
Try some sort of lifegain against burn type decks or fast aggro before you can stabilize. Whip of Erebos might be a decent way to go about it, but i am not sure
Spells you need to lose
Lightning STrike
I think you also need some cheap recursion in some form, creature tutors, or something to maintain your engine/ability to do damage
Minotaurs you are missing
Gnarled Scarhide - fast aggro - need 4
Boros Reckoner - one of the best minotaurs ever printed
Gorehorn Minotaur or somehting like that
Lord of Shatterskull pass
Deathbellow raider
Fanatic of Mogis
Felhide Petrifier should be a 2 or 1 of.
Go to four for Rageblood/Ragemonter. You can go more Kragma Warcallers
Minotaurs you should remove
Felhide Spiritbinder (way to slow and dies to bolt)
Kragma Butcher
Minotaur skullcleaver
I can't really comment on non-minotaurs but Mogis might be useful as a sideboard card with long game matches
However, try it and see if it works. If it does, let me know.