Quote from davidb32 »Hushbringer
Syr Konrad, the Grim10/4/2019 An ability that triggers on a card leaving a zone (such as that of Syr Konrad, the Grim) won’t trigger if that card is leaving its previous zone because it’s entering the battlefield as a creature.
Can anyone tell me what C.R. rules cover this ruling? I'm having a hard time understanding it.
Regardless of whether Bloodghast is entering the battlefield or an embalm creature is exiling itself, Syr Konrad is looking for the creature card leaving the graveyard, so why does Hushbringer interfere with the Konrad/Bloodgast trigger?
So, if Hushbringer is in effect, and Syr Konrad is hanging around, "Creatures entering the battlefield don't cause abilities to trigger." Therefore, suppose some creature card in your graveyard moves onto the battlefield. That creature entering the battlefield doesn't cause Syr Konrad to trigger (if it IS a creature that enters the battlefield).
Even though triggered abilities define what counts as an event, this new breed of rule-modifying abilities have closed the book on what counts as one or two things that happen, and how they cause triggered abilities to trigger from them. Syr Konrad would trigger on "a creature card leaving your graveyard", you say, and you say that happened. I ask, "When did that happen?" and you now can only indicate how that card moved from the graveyard into the battlefield as a creature permanent. Every way you point to it, a concrete thing that happened, you're talking about a creature entering the battlefield. Hushbringer says that cannot be a thing that triggers abilities.
In regards to 603.10, that says to look back in time to make the determination, "using the existence of [the triggered abilities in question] and the appearance of objects immediately prior to the event." No part of this countermands that Hushbringer gets to see the reality of what has happened in full, or even that the triggered ability without a Hushbringer nosing around would not get to see the attributes of involved objects after the event as well as before. For example, a trigger that cares about a creature dying has to -actually know- that the object entered the graveyard afterward. It's just that, unlike with other triggers, we need to use more information than just spotting the assertion of a new game state as goggle-minded amnesiac - just as the full text of 603.10 says, which extends 603.2.
603.10. Normally, objects that exist immediately after an event are checked to see if the event matched any trigger conditions, and continuous effects that exist at that time are used to determine what the trigger conditions are and what the objects involved in the event look like. However, some triggered abilities are exceptions to this rule; the game “looks back in time” to determine if those abilities trigger, using the existence of those abilities and the appearance of objects immediately prior to the event. The list of exceptions is as follows: