I have switched from Tokens to BW Control about half a year ago so I can give some insight on both archetypes.
First of all, both have a terrible combo matchup, as neither Tokens nor Planeswalkers make for a fast clock. Gideon of the Trials can steal some games against something like Ad Nauseum or Lantern with his Emblem (and he is great against Burn), but if Tokens gets the right mix between tokens and anthem effects, their clock is slightly faster I have to say.
Against creature decks, in my experience the BW Control list is a little more favoured than Tokens. Even with anthems the tokens get outclassed really fast by delve threats or humans or Hollow Ones, etc. A curve like Wall of Omens into a Gideon into a wrath deals conveniently with most aggro and midrange strategies and allows for faster pressure afterwards with a 4/4 or 5/5 Gideon.
Both archetypes grind well and have decent control matchups. In the end, I feel like both decks are somewhere in low Tier 2 with Tokens having a little more linear playstyle. The biggest upside and also the reason I switched to BW control is that it minimizes draws that do nothing on their own. Intangible Virtue or a Sorin on a board with no tokens feels really bad. Finally, in my list I play some number of Wall of Omens and Night's Whisper to smooth out draws and have a better chance to draw sideboard cards.
Which decks does SFM benefit most? Two-colored (or mono-colored in the case of D&T), non-red, fair decks. It lines up well against the hyperaggro decks that rule the roost without coming anywhere near to invalidating them. Again, I freely admit to bias here. I play UW control and also have been working on brewing and testing the best shell for Orzhov Stoneblade in Modern, in order to be ready when her (hopefully inevitable) unban takes place.
Anyway, apologies for preaching to the choir; I haven’t seen anyone here suggest that SFM should remain on the ban list. It’s just that the case for her release seems to grow stronger and stronger with each passing day.
I don't think there is any real argument left for SFM to stay on the ban list from a gameplay perspective. IMO the reason Wizards won't release her in the next couple ban/unban dates is that they want to grab some money off of it by printing it in a future set like they did with Jace. So no SFM for 2018 I think, although I would love to brew some Orzhov or Esper list, too!
Sooo I'm not sure where I'd post this, but this Thread seems pretty on-topic for this idea.
I'd like to see if there's a viable Build that would use the synergy between Karn, Scion of Urza and Tidehollow Sculler. Between Sculler, some vehicles like Looter Scooter or Heart, 3-drop Planeswalkers like Lili or Gid of the Trials, and also running the usual Lingering Souls and discard/removal package, that you'd have a fantastic disruption package with a really powerful grinding engine in Karn. Making a 4/4 or drawing you cards every few turns sounds incredibly powerful, and I feel like if I could figure out a truly nasty creature package to pair this idea with, it could have a lot of potential.
Any ideas?
Some food for thought: Tidehollow Sculler, Smuggler's Copter, Blade Splicer, Thraben Inspector. These are all reasonable midrange cards that are or produce artifacts. I think the problem is that Karn would be your only payoff card for the artifact theme and that alone doesn't make it worth it.
This is an interesting list for sure. I cannot argue with the result, but there are some things I don't like about it. Lingering Souls and Path to Exile are THE reason to even play white in Modern and there is neither in the mainboard. Especially in conjunction with Lili, Souls is too much value to pass up in my opinion. Oath of Liliana can be a lot of value too with such high amounts of planeswalkers, but against the go-wide-aggro meta we have at the moment I would much rather stabilize with Souls into Wrath than Oath into planeswalker. No Path probably makes sense with the design of the deck; everything Push cannot hit can be hit by the sacrifice effects. But then again, with Gideon of the Trials we are well equipped to fight sole targets anyway. The only meta I would be happy to play this version would be against a field full of Boggles
He's my most current version of the list. I've ditched BB, it was strong, and could end games by itself, but the speed of this build feels much stronger and gives us more game against rougher match ups, I've even beaten Tron a couple times with this build! I think I want to find a way to get Auriok champion back in there but I love raise the alarm and gather the townsfolk too much. Opinions,-/+ more than welcome c:
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First of all, both have a terrible combo matchup, as neither Tokens nor Planeswalkers make for a fast clock. Gideon of the Trials can steal some games against something like Ad Nauseum or Lantern with his Emblem (and he is great against Burn), but if Tokens gets the right mix between tokens and anthem effects, their clock is slightly faster I have to say.
Against creature decks, in my experience the BW Control list is a little more favoured than Tokens. Even with anthems the tokens get outclassed really fast by delve threats or humans or Hollow Ones, etc. A curve like Wall of Omens into a Gideon into a wrath deals conveniently with most aggro and midrange strategies and allows for faster pressure afterwards with a 4/4 or 5/5 Gideon.
Both archetypes grind well and have decent control matchups. In the end, I feel like both decks are somewhere in low Tier 2 with Tokens having a little more linear playstyle. The biggest upside and also the reason I switched to BW control is that it minimizes draws that do nothing on their own. Intangible Virtue or a Sorin on a board with no tokens feels really bad. Finally, in my list I play some number of Wall of Omens and Night's Whisper to smooth out draws and have a better chance to draw sideboard cards.
Hope I could help a little @tarotplz
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I don't think there is any real argument left for SFM to stay on the ban list from a gameplay perspective. IMO the reason Wizards won't release her in the next couple ban/unban dates is that they want to grab some money off of it by printing it in a future set like they did with Jace. So no SFM for 2018 I think, although I would love to brew some Orzhov or Esper list, too!
1
Some food for thought: Tidehollow Sculler, Smuggler's Copter, Blade Splicer, Thraben Inspector. These are all reasonable midrange cards that are or produce artifacts. I think the problem is that Karn would be your only payoff card for the artifact theme and that alone doesn't make it worth it.
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