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    posted a message on UBx Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas Control
    So Molz7 at this point your deck is just Lantern with Thopters no? Not dissing, looks super fun.

    I'm running a hybrid list with 4 Lily, 3 Tezz, and 2 JtMS. Due to KCommand resurgence and desire to turn on Opal faster I'm 4/3/2 Bauble/Opal/Jar. Jace is a great wincon in the deck that offers different flexibility from Tezz but most of the time Jace is just fatesealing in my testing so far. He's great at guaranteeing a win behind Bridge, but this is far from the best deck for truly making use of him. Jace was borderline useless in the matchups I ran into last night but that's going to happen.

    I think it may be worth considering a shift to a Grixis Prison shell now. Part of the issue before was durdling into nothing with a chalice, blood moon or Bridge on the BF. Using an explosive artifact Mana package with some SSG and a stronger sweet of 4 cmc walkers could be great. T2 blood moon, T3 Jace bounce for example makes more use of Jace's abilities and could lock some opps out of the game. This is definitely an approach I'd like to try.
    Posted in: Control
  • 1

    posted a message on UBx Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas Control
    I have actually cut my Thopter Combo (3/2) at the moment to make room for 2 JtMS. I've used the other 3 spots to drive up the low curve artifact count to get a better feeling of how reliably I can jam T2/T3 walkers. My list is 4 LotV, 3 Tezz, 2 JtMS with 4 Whir and I am really counting on the Walkers plus Bridge to win the game for me. My hope is with Jace as another win condition I can further weaken Stonys impact on the deck by cutting Thopter Foundry. Post board where I can bring in more direct interaction to fight my opponent I will be less reliant on ramping into walkers which naturally will make me stronger against Stony as Mana rocks and Baubles are now my only activated artifacts.

    I will plan to record some with the new list later this week.

    PS traded into 3 Opals over the weekend at GP Toronto and then played the list to a 3-3 in PTQ on Sunday. First real event with the deck in paper. It had mostly been online for me before. Beat Humans, lost to burn (really lazy keep in G3 on the draw), lost to Traverse Shadow with all of the hand disruption and Stubs, beat Amulet in 3 (that took some serious doing), lost to Abzan, beat Affinity.
    Posted in: Control
  • 1

    posted a message on Sultai Midrange
    Double black is also a cost of Victim of Night. The cost is very relevant in a tri color deck only running 22 land. It's not just in casting the first Go for the Throat, but Snapping it back. It is relevant against all the decks running Ghost Quarters, Fulminator Mage, and Merfolk. It also isn't dead against Dredge, which while weakened still exists. I just find the first Go for the Throat to be far superior to the first Victim of Night. Right now I'm running Victim of Night in the side over a second Go for the Throat since Affinity and Storm are so popular. Madcap Experiment into Platinum Emperion post board versus Storm is a legit thing right now. As for Tron, if that deck resolves a Wurmcoil and you're playing BGx it is almost impossible to win anyway. That said I do think the BGx versions have a lot more game against Tron due to the countermagic package to fight the walkers, so you are more likely to run into a few scenarios where you're able to win through a Wurmcoil.

    I really like Collective Brutality, but the tricky part is realizing when it's worth it to pitch an otherwise good card to use a second ability. It's easy to pitch a Thoughtseize against Burn to escalate it. It's less easy to escalate on top of giving a creature -2/-2 by pitching a Snapcaster to it to get rid of the opponent's Fatal Push to clear the way for Tarmogoyf the next turn. Snapcaster is so strong it feels like it's better in your hand, but effectively there are matchups where the tempo of essentially trading the Snappy for their Fatal Push without spending the 2 mana on Tarmogoyf for the Fatal Push to just eat it anyway is totally worth it. It's not always clear when that is appropriate obviously. The other thing I like about it is just the flexibility in modal cards. It is not the strongest kill spell, discard effect, or lifegain spell for 2 mana, but it plays as extra removal and lifegain against almost any go wide deck. It's extra discard against almost every combo deck that can hit the combo pieces costing over 3 cmc. It just is flexible.

    As for the countermagic I love Countersquall, but again it's not without its costs. In the end I may go back to a Countersquall/Negate split, but I want to see how well the Spell Pierce work on protecting us in those T1 on the draw against a T2 Stony Silence type draws. It may not be good enough without more early threats like Delver of Secrets, but one doesn't know without trying.
    Posted in: Midrange
  • 1

    posted a message on Sultai Midrange
    Quote from Velthov »
    I've seen several list going without Serum Visions. Is it worth dropping for other spells?
    @h3xw0l7 I like the list, you are however light on removal spells, as mentioned before. If you where to have the full play set of Fatal Push, how'd the list look like?

    Many modern events this weekend, I'm hoping for some sort of BUG list to take top 8 or 16 :)..


    In the BGx versions of Sultai Serum Visions is not a necessary card. You are trying to disrupt and close. Thought Scour helps feed your Goyfs, Flayers and Snapcaster Mages far more effectively than Serum Visions does while simultaneously acting as a sort of combo trick pumping your creatures after blocks.

    In the UBx version of Sultai that are playing more controlling you almost certainly want Serum Visions.
    Posted in: Midrange
  • 2

    posted a message on Sultai Midrange
    The godfather of BGx Willy Edel tweeted his first take on Sultai BGx yesterday. Said he went 4-1 w/it in a league. He goes with Rain of Tears over Fulminator Mage in the sideboard in the hopes of getting extra uses out of Snappy. He goes DEEP on Damnation, and has the full playset of Collective Brutality in the 75. I like Ashiok, Nightmare Weaver as a way to both fight midrange decks that are trying to go bigger as well as being a pretty great threat against control decks in my experience.

    I like the manabase. The 4 Darkslick Shores incentivizes you to fetch Forest or Swamp early which is better for Blood Moon. I love Treetop Village in general, and since you're more aggressive in this build the cheaper activation is probably worth it. There is definitely some room to tune here, but generally speaking it looks good.

    https://twitter.com/bazardebagda/status/831161925979471873/photo/1
    Posted in: Midrange
  • 1

    posted a message on Sultai Midrange
    For the record, this is my latest midrange build. I haven't been playing with it very much though since I've been playing the Control version and have found that a bit more consistent. I also do maindeck the Mana Leak because in G1 you just don't know what you're playing and it's the best catch all you can get despite its flaws, and just hope you close fast. It's also important to note that Mana Leak grows your Goyfs where Remand does not. Anyway I know you don't have several of these cards, but this is more of the approach I took with building midrange.

    Posted in: Midrange
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    posted a message on Sultai Midrange
    Quote from Argomok »
    Is there any merit to a hybrid between "Cryptic BUG" and Midrange BUG or is there simply not enough deck space to accommodate both?


    There is some merit, but I think the BUG Midrange builds, more so than any other BGx build, suffers the most from a contradiction in desire to be proactive versus reactive. Jund's red reactive spells can help proactively close the game. White is using powerful hate cards to proactively shut down opponents. The hand disruption is generally proactively trying to clear the way for your creatures or delay your opponent until you can. Countermagic by nature has to be reactive and so it creates this tension in BUG more so than in other decks. It might be different if there was a "true" counterspell at two cmc that could be held up as a catch all counter (in conjunction with something like Abrupt Decay), but Mana Leak is the best you have, and unfortunately the card is terrible late game and BUG is the most likely to run into the long game. This leads to running more conditional counters like Spell Snare, Countersquall, Stubborn Denial etc since they are at least "hard" counters.

    This again just leads to an issue where instead of having either Abrupt Decay or Counterspell you have Abrupt Decay or conditional countermagic. This leads to a lot more instances where your hand will just NOT line up with what your opponent is doing. This is why I think the midrange builds of BUG need to just naturally be more reactive. That said I still think there is some merit because countermagic allows BUG to do one thing the other BGx matchups can't do and that is have game in nearly EVERY matchup. So while with that style of build you may lose a lot more due to awkward draws you're also going to have days where everything lines up, Inquisition away their removal, slam a Tarmogoyf, hold up countermagic/removal that is appropriate in the matchup and you just can't lose.

    Posted in: Midrange
  • 1

    posted a message on Sultai Midrange
    I cut a Grim Flayer today going down to only two to add Liliana, the Last Hope today. I ran it through another Friendly League and went 4-1 (9-2) in games. Liliana was excellent. I also cut one Fulminator Mage from the sideboard to bring in a Jace, Architect of Thought. I thought it would just be good in grindier midrange matchups as well as being a good way to buy time against go wide decks/tokens. I never actually saw the card though and am not certain I'm sold on it anyway.

    • GW Tron 2-0 (1-0)
    • Game one I was able to use countermagic recurred with Snapcaster beats and eventually an ultimated Liliana to win. Game two I was able to get a T3 Fulminator Mage into Surgical Extraction on a Tron piece which allowed me to beat down with a Goyf protected with countermagic before he could get out anything threatening. Technically he did get a Wurmcoil Engine and Worldbreaker out, but Cryptic taps are great.
    • Goblins 2-0 (2-0)
    • The first game was pretty tight and I was able to fade him drawing a Lightning Bolt on a couple draw steps to close him out. I was able to keep his board clear of creatures those turns though to make sure he didn't have any Goblin Grenade fodder. Game two I really ran over him. Just a good draw and he couldn't get any pressure on me.
    • Merfolk 2-0 (3-0)
    • The first game here I had quick early removal into Liliana who was able to help maintain his board while I added more pressure. His last turn he played Master of Waves which would have stalemated us if Liliana weren't there to remove it and end the game. Game two was a long grindy affair in which I was able to ultimate Liliana and use the tokens to aggressively trade off for key creatures. There was definitely a window where had he drawn and stuck an Islandwalk lord he would have taken the game, but thankfully he didn't.
    • Death Shadow Jund 1-2 (3-1)
    • This match was great. I played a lot of Death Shadow Zoo over the last few months and so playing my first match against the new version was eye opening. As I expected it a played a lot more like Jund. I had a phenomenal hand to fight the deck, but my opponent seeing this with his opening Inquisition just bided his time sculpting his hand while picking me apart as much as he could allowing me to get him down to 1. When he went for the Temur Battle Rage win and I Spell Snared it I was excited knowing they only run two now, but he had both of them in hand and so the second one gave him game 1. Game two was much of the same back and forth, but I had just enough removal to hold him off killing me before I could get lethal through his Goyf with a Creeping Tar Pit. Game three I had to mull to 5, with two lands, a Go for the Throat, a Spell Snare and a Surgical Extraction. He picked away the Snare and GftT on his first two turns before playing his Goyf. However I was able to use that time to get the lands and a Snapcaster which allowed me to kill and Extract the Goyf. I thought that was going to put me way ahead but the next turn he casted his own Liliana, the Last Hope and rode her to victory. It made me very sad as I had sided out all of my Cryptic Commands thinking they would be to slow which gave me no way to race the zombie tokens, and reduced the number of answers I had in the deck to handle a resolved planeswalker in the first place.
    • Bogles 2-0 (4-1)
    • Game one the opponent mulled to 6 and kept a creatureless hand. By the time he drew one on T4 I was able to Cryptic it while I beat down to a quick victory. Game two he had a much faster start, but I had nice fatties to buy me a little time by stifling his ability to attack while he developed his board. By the time he was ready to attack however I was able to use Cryptic, and Snap Cryptic to tap his team and race him.
    Posted in: Midrange
  • 1

    posted a message on Sultai Midrange
    Quote from Godrik1374 »
    I really like your list guys, played jund for 3 years. Just bought tonight a cryptic sultai deck.
    No place for lili last hope in main deck? I can understand than lotv and counterspell are bad together.
    But I'm currently trying your list Requiem with -1 CB and +1 lili last hope.


    I absolutely think Liliana, the Last Hope is playable in a version of this deck. I could even see one in the main, one in the side. This is actually part of what I've been considering as one of the extra two delirium enablers, just trying to figure out what I'd want to trade online to pick a copy up. I do think that the meta is not the greatest for Lily right now as a removal spell (thought as Genini said there are definitely matchups she shines), but she should be decently easy to protect in this build as an alternate win condition. Also her down tick not only can recur a Snapcaster but help feed the graveyard for Snap/Goyf/Flayer. As it is I was strongly considering cutting the 3rd Grim Flayer for something and I think this will be it. It's possible with the addition of a Lily, and eventually an Engineered Explosives it might be possible to fit a 3rd Flayer back in at least Delirium wise, but we'll have to see.

    @Retswerd
    I haven't tested Bitterblossom yet, but I will say with the builds I'm playing the only deck that has been a consistent struggle for me was Grixis Delver. Bitterblossom can be excellent against them out of the side assuming you are able to focus on protecting your life total. I also think it can be good as a two of in a more tempo/delirium focused build that maxes on Grim Flayer/Tamrogoyf with Thought Scours and Collective Brutality as ways to get it in the GY.
    Posted in: Midrange
  • 1

    posted a message on [Primer] Infect
    Regarding Pulse of Murasa
    I'm a newbie with relatively few matches under my belt, so take my comment with a grain of salt. It seems very very serviceable, most of this is theoretical. Not only is it lifegain that seems to line up well for around turn 3-4, where versus a deck like burn you either are going for it or trying to setup a second run, but in the longer grindy matchups like BGx it seems like it would really be a good card to have extending the game by a turn and getting you another threat. It seems extra good there w/BG Infect as you may be able to get Phyrexian Crusader that could live through a Night of Souls' Betrayal. I've been packing two, and while it's seemed decent against Burn, it wasn't good enough versus Zoo when I played it.
    Posted in: Aggro & Tempo
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