MTG Salvation

Quote from HighHolder »

Five mana for plus one card advantage? No thanks. I'll just keep running the khans red enchantment and Vance's blasting.

i think you’re selling this short by a lot. This can be reused multiple times a turn not just a single upkeep trigger. Red has more synergy with artifacts than enchantments. Discarding can be a plus for delve, faithless looting, past in flames, madness etc. Not to mention theres a second side of this card, so it’s also a flexible card with options.

The world tree spans across all 10 realms. So drawing power from multiple trees makes sense. I could see an argument either way though.

Quote from Courier7 »

How long until we get some enchantment or artifact that give creature cards in your hand foretell, allowing you to spend 2 then later on foretell for the actual mana cost -1 or - 2? The exile zone is now one step closer to being your third pile of cards in hand.

Does Zirda reduce the foretell cost, in this case down to GG?

I definitely understand the third pile concern but I really don’t feel like Foretell is crossing into that. Exile is used as a temporary holding zone for Foretell. This is basically Suspend but you decide when it’s cast. It’s not like you’re manipulating cards hit by Path to Exile or tormod's crypt.

That’s silly. What’s the difference between a dragon, a drake, a serpent, or wurm? It’s physical characteristics that often distinguish them you dont need p/t tiers. On Segovia a leviathan is a 3/3 because everything on that plane is much smaller. Lorthos is a massive, ancient octopus bigger than quite a few leviathans and krakens.

Blue is the color with the greatest affinity for artifacts? This card makes complete sense.

I like it, but I don't love it. I have been looking forward to these last two demons for a loooong time. The ability is definitely cool, yet it still seems uninspired to me. Razaketh feels like a bit of a thrown in with everything else going on in the set. I'm beginning to wish that he wasn't on Amonkhet at all, and that Lili's demons had a more dedicated story/set. The way he was utilized is rather disappointing. Oh well, I will still pick one up at some point to continue my Liliana collection. I reeeeeeeally hope they print a card depicting Lili and Razaketh together to continue the unofficial cycle of Lili and a her demons on spells ie Demonic Tutor and Dark Petition...

Magic: the Gathering

This is a good start, the next utopian step would be to actually delve into these characters when they return the limelight and create meaningful personalities. I think they do well at creating characters, but they don't know how to flesh them out within the story. I like all 5 of the Gatewatch, but WOTC has missed the mark in the stories.

Jace having such a meek demeanor and being permanently nervous is just pandering to the "nerd" paradigm. They just created him into a bloated stereotype. Also, I despise how he is completely useless in battle. It doesn't make sense. He has multiple cards with unsummon and other relevant in battle abilities, but in the story he can only create do-nothing illusions, and yet not a single PW card of his creates an Illusion token! A more mature Jace alone would make the story so much better. But all that being said I think he has a great foundation his loss memories, destroying the mind of his traitorous mentor, falling for a century old walker, being tricked by bolas to release the eldrazi... but now we have a nervous teenager.

Chandra's dialogue is so painful. We get it red is known for emotions, but having emotions doesn't mean you have to be an idiot. When I read the stories I literally skip any part where Chandra speaks or has inner dialogue. Once again the pieces were there for an interesting character the tragedy with her parents, Keral Keep, the allusions to Jaya, the romance with Gideon, I'm sorry "Gids"...

Nissa is so devoid of any meaningful character I dont even know where to begin. Her retcon is the only one that really bothers me, and that's mostly because of how awful their execution has been with creating a quality character. They could have had a more compelling story about the semi-xenophobic, race supremacist who relied on non-Elves to help her save home world. They could have showed her inner struggle to trust the outsiders, her apprehension to join the Gatewatch, and an inner dialogue where she struggles with an antiquated ethos.

Gideon imo has probably had the most going for him despite being the consummate meathead. I like that they show his struggle with the death of his Irregulars, but sometimes it just feels thrown into the story. I really like his struggle with the gods on Amonkhet, and it has been one of the more interesting character developments since the gatewatch was created.

Liliana is my favorite character and it pains me how they created such a great character, but in the stories she is lesser version of Cruella D'evil. A century old walker with her past should not feel like a twenty year old college student... I absolutely love her story. IMO its the most intersting. Liliana brokering her soul to four demons for power but then reneging is a great story (though i think it could be better). Then there is the enigmatic Raven Man story aspect, which i think has caught the imagination of most readers (I'm nervous about their execution to this story in the coming future though). She also has the painful past with the accidental zombifying of her brother... Then there is her struggle with the Chain Veil and the risk of her dying or becoming a demon like Ob Nixilis.. She even has a history with Nicol Bolas... ALL OF THIS and all they can do with her is make her shallow, eye candy for the predominantly male audience...

TLDR: The gatewatch planeswalkers each have a great foundation to be interesting characters, but WOTC has failed time and time again creating truly compelling characters.

I wonder if it could replace Triskelion in vintage workshops.

I like that Ajani joins, and honestly I cant think of current walker on the roster that makes more sense. I'm interested to see if Saheeli wants to join, but I feel like she will want to stay and help rebuild Kaladesh after the impending war. I think Dack would be better anyways. He's another good foil to Gideon's righteousness. I could see Gideon having issues with Dack's thievery of planes they visit. But most importantly Dack already has history with a known villain, Ashiok. So if there is a return to Theros in the works the Greatest Thief in the Multiverse seems like an interesting addition.

Piggybacking on Theros, I think Elsepth should remain dead because she is so beloved by so many. It would be a beautiful story if the Gatewatch failed in their attempt to rescue her. This story will only be truly compelling if they allow our main (planeswalker) characters to actually lose and in some cases lose everything. Otherwise this story will slowly become more and more static because the viewers will be able to predict every outcome. I know I'm probably in the minority when it comes to Elspeth, but my interest in the story would grow exponentially if I knew one of my characters could be snuffed out at any point.

I would honestly enjoy a Legion of Doom as well: Bolas, Ashiok, Tezz, Ramaz, Ob, Tibalt, Vraska. I don't know about Nahiri though. It was pretty damn evil for her to not only seek revenge on Sorin but to be willing to sacrifice an entire plane of people to get back at him. That's far worse than anything most of the other candidates for the Legion of Doom have done. I could see the GW defeating Bolas in some scheme next block, or at least challenging him enough that he starts to recruit other walkers to aid his pursuit to regaining his power. I'm sure they would still be nothing more to him than pawns. I could see him using his team to distract the GW while he continues his pursuit of pre-mending power, and of course I'm sure he'd more than willing to sacrifice them along the way.

I find it weird that people think this is ruining Kaldheim.

You are now invested in the fate of Kaldheim. You don't want the plane to fall to the phyrexians. There are now real stakes. You are emotionally involved.

This is a good thing, story telling wise. Was Lord of the Rings ruined for you when Frodo left the shire and came in contact with the Nazgul for the first time and there was now the real possibility that he could die or be injured?

I don't get this. The magic multiverse is way too much a museum of planes rather than an ecosystem of planes as it is. More interconnectivity and agents for change are a good thing in my book. (And we all know that if enough people like Kaldheim, it will not fall to the phyrexians because brand beats storytelling.)

The answer to what plane a Phyrexian should invade is: Yes.

This is because Phyrexians are meant to be multi-planar level threats that are a fusion of various sci-fi horror stuff like Alien and the Borg. It doesn't matter what that world is as that plane will be assimilated and compleated.

Remember the stuff with Emrakul on Innistrad? That is of a similar level threat, but instead of being an eldritch monstrosity with unknowable motives aside from hunger, the Phyrexian's strive for perfection in compleation and will force this perfection on others.

Or that stuff with Nicol Bolas decimating an entire plane then taking its survivors and turning them into what he believed as the perfect army through mummification and lazotep plating? That is like a cute science fair project in comparison to what Phyrexians are.

The biggest difference between Phyrexians, Nicol Bolas, and Emrakul though is fairly simple in terms of multi-planar level threats: Nicol Bolas and Emrakul's vision lives and dies with them, not literal death mind you but in their abscene. The Phyrexian's vision however is an instinctual dogma and to battle an ideology is harder than to battle simply a big bad threat.

Yawgmoth died, we thought his vision died with him. But when the oil in Karn's heart leaked onto what we knew as Mirrodin at the time, that created a new breed of Phyrexians with the same core beliefs of 'all will be compleated' as though nothing had changed even though they are divorced from Yawgmoth himself. The vision lives on. The only infighting came from the fact that there was no Father of Machines to guide them, so we had five praetors who took different roads for the same destination.

Thank you for coming to my ted talk about Phyrexians.

Quote from i_am_outerspace »

Quote from Tiro of Meletis »

Quote from i_am_outerspace »

DAMN. :'( This was one of the ones I was most looking forward to getting something new.... Ikoria was okay but a lot of the best "sea monsters" were whales and sharks and M21 just gave us more whales... Wish all sea monster matter cards could be errated to include whales lol. C'MON, ZENDIKAR!

I have high hopes for Zendikar as well. Especially with Kiora there currently. Seriously WOTC, don't you even dare.

I can see it now fish and sharks as far as the I can see with a lone U/B Lorthos Reanimated as the sole creature with a Octopus, Serpent, Leviathan, or Kraken subtype. Arixmethes just wants some new friends (or spells).

I'd like to see marine environments and underwater locations as well. More takes on cards like Quest For Ula's Temple, but easier conditions to meet. Support comprable to Gishath. If they insist on making sea monsters 6+ mana, the very least they could do is provide more chances to put them into play. Even in Commander it's a challenge, yet a welcome one since the deck is immensely popular despite its lacking support. It's time to get creative. Show us oceanic expeditions and discovery in Zendikar. Diving, exploring, seeing more of the seas there. I'm over all these terrestrial biomes.

Quote from Impossible »

Quote from SyntheticDreamer »

Quote from Impossible »

I like the card, but "Massacre Girl" is a pretty terrible name for a legendary creature.

But that's her name.

Doesn't make it less terrible. It's like calling Nissa just "Vital Force" or Chandra "Torch of Defiance". The only character that should be referred to by title only is The Ineffable, and he's been dead for centuries that this point.

Disagree. It's a well-used and rock-solid trope to have a character who no longer goes by their name, but is instead known only by a nickname, title, or another moniker. This is a very well-established and VERY old literary technique. Not simply literary, either, but in real life for people whose names are not known, although their actions are. See Jack the Ripper. They become or start off as urban legends.

Moreover, it makes perfect sense for a thrill-kill assassin in the guild of over-the-top-performers to have just such a memorable stage name, who is not known by anything else. Her name and history are intentionally a mystery. There's a bounty on her head. She keeps getting away with murder, mass murder, literally. No one knows her by anything but Massacre Girl, just like Jack the Ripper, etc. Why would anyone know her name, including we the audience? That would break the mystique.

Massacre Girl is essentially a Ravnican urban legend that we the audience get to see is real, but still don't get to know her name and history. Only her deeds. Which includes massacres with no witnesses left alive, it seems.

Well at least it ain't papyrus

Quote from entombedhydra »

I hate Dutiful Servants so much it's not even funny. You know Wizards did this on purpose. And poorly designed zombie camel aside, this may be the insult that breaks my back. It's a poorly designed vanilla, with art and flavor purposely designed to trick you to confuse it for another card in the same block. This is the sort of thing that leads to entirely preventable gameplay mistakes in limited. And somehow MaRo said "Print it."

Well, I'm sorry MaRo, but peddle your joke cards elsewhere. And I'm sorry piss-poor designers, but PAY ATTENTION to what you do.

Of course they did it on purpose, the flavor is the point. The Annointed mummies seen in Those Who Serveare completely hardwired to serve their duties, even when the world is literally falling to pieces around them. So yes, even as the river turns to blood and the sky is full of plagues and the pyramids are falling down, the mummies just continue to do what they were programmed to do, in this case carrying parcels around. In fact, the most recent story made a point of talking about mummies who had were tasked to cook meals, automatically preparing so much food that it was piling up around them as they blindly did their jobs ad infintum. They show that by having the art in the new card mimic the old. It's not a joke card, it's actually flavorful.

So what if it's a vanilla? It's a white common vanilla creature, we get at least one in just about every set. We'll get another one in Ixalan, i'd put money on it. Finally, is this REALLY going to cause gameplay mistakes? Different name, different p/t, different card, it's not esepcially difficult to get confused. Furthermore, how often are vanilla commons like this actually drafted, much less see play? I think you're overreacting here.

Quote from UnsafeNormal »

It is very important that everybody knows what the Jacetice League is up to.

God forbid we might know something about this Demon and his motivations, he exists solely for Liliana.

Exactly. Everything about the Planes and their characters these days take a back seat to Planeswalkers. It was bad enough the Egypt World we all requested ended up being Bolas World with an Egyptian veneer. Makes for an interesting story so far I suppose, but notice how Eldrazi titans are a pushover but not Ob Nixlis or Bolas, because they're planes walkers. Pretty obnoxious when entire worlds don't matter. Really cheapens the existence of the characters IMO, including Lilliana's journey to kill her demons if those characters don't even matter relative to her.

Quote from PyrogoatX »

Right, so green deals the most with lands. It would be fine for a green planeswalker to make land tokens that say "Tap: Counter target spell" right? Makes sense to me.

Black made gold tokens in one block... and they were a color pie bend, not a regular mechanic. By this logic blue should get graveyard reanimation because of Innistrad's skaab's and green to get flying whenever it wants because destructor dragon.

Blue has been able to make mana for and from artifacts for a long time, and black was one of the original mana ramp colors, and still messes plenty with ramp.
There is excessive precedence here.

Found this interesting thread and hope to bump it.
Recently got back into MTG purely for collecting - planning to sort by artist, and currently starting with Terese Nielsen.

Love to hear what you guys are collecting.

The trait I like the most about Liliana is that she "needs someone to need her," implies deep down she's a very lonely person, and Jace being a telepath who could see her Raven Man allow her to share a secret she couldn't with others, enough that she would fabricate excuses to meet him (or lure him).

While I frown at Liliana/Jace romance, it has its redeeming quality, one being this is a potential fem-dom relationship, which is rare in most games I've played. If done well, I can see it blossom in the future.