Okay so now you're gonna resort to personally attacking me? Kay
Well...
I don't care. I stated my reasons for my opinion about this subject. If you think that's stupid, then that's your problem.
Also, Jund is not a good deck. It has bad matchups against stuff like Tron, Dredge, and Scapeshift, and even at that is only average at best. Bloodbraid Elf is an interesting card that would be fun to play and to play against, and might make the deck pretty good again. Besides, Elf doesn't solve the deck's hard matchups anyway, nor is it as good as when it was legal with Deathrite Shaman. However, just in case it ended up being too good, unban Jace along with it to counteract it. The two cards pair against each other pretty well, and that would be much more interesting to watch than... I dunno, whatever the hell the format is now.
I mentioned that the artifact lands would make decks like Krak-Clan Ironworks and U/B Tezzeret better, and I"m sure that there are more decks that I haven't even thought of. I also mentioned that I do not think Affinity is a T1 deck now, nor do I think artifact lands would make it T1 or better.
Sidebar: I'd be fine with the unbanning of everything but Dread Return, because that card is actually dangerous and would probably make Dredge too good. The others are fine unbans, especially Twin. I was a Twin player for some time before the ban, and I have always believed that the card was fair and balanced. "But it stagnated the metagame and forced you to play answers". Infect forced you to play answers. Tron forced you to play answers. And now, Dredge forces you to play answers. Oh and for the record, where are these decks that Twin was "supposedly" holding back? Nowhere to be seen.
Strongly disagree. I think Hypergenesis is very degenerate, and much more so than it was back in 2009. It's extremely fast (think turn 2-turn 3), and putting Urabrask + Emrakul/Progenitus/Terastodon or something similar into play is game over on the spot. Living End is fine because it's slower, doesn't kill you before T4, doesn't combo, and is weak to graveyard hate/Remand. Hypergenesis does not have that weakness.
But it's not degenerate. Affinity is what, 3% of the MTGO metagame according to ? No Affinity anywhere to be seen in GP Dallas? Hardly seems like a broken deck to me. Decent yeah, but not broken.
That general argument only works if these improvements would make it broken, or if it's broken in the first place. Yeah obviously Lightning Bolt would be broken if it did 4. Yeah it's already good. So? These improvements the artifact lands would make to Affinity would not make it broken, so they're fine. Ancestral Vision was an improvement to the blue control decks. Golgari Grave-Troll was an improvement to Dredge. And guess what? Both were fine. So why can't the artifact lands be fine?
The deck can already do that. True, the artifact lands would make it more consistent, but only by a bit.
Turn Cranial Plating into a degenerate piece of equipment
Plating's already a "degenerate" piece of equipment. Adding the artifact lands does what, make it slightly more effective?
Make Master of Etherium stronger
See above.
Can be fed to Ravager
See above again. Also, what lands are you cutting for the artifact lands? Are you cutting manlands? That makes the deck less consistent and weaker to hate. Are you cutting Glimmervoid? Makes your sideboard worse, and makes it harder to play colored cards maindeck. I could only really see cutting Darksteel Citadel for these artifact lands, honestly.
All of these things mentioned seem like minor things, not incredibly broken things. And just because it was a "mistake" or was broken in the past doesn't mean that it's broken now. Thopter Sword was broken in the past. Valakut was broken in the past. So why were they unbanned? Simple, because they're not broken now.
I think that of the potential unbans, the artifact lands are the most likely. Like, what can you really do with them? Affinity wouldn't be any more broken. Ironworks wouldn't be broken. If anything, it opens up plenty of cards and decks. Krak-Clan Ironworks as mentioned, Thirst for Knowledge and U/B Tezzeret... I think it would be really cool.
Okay, so forgive me if the question is dumb (Currently on a mobile, so access is limited), but is there a reason why you don't use Force of Will in this current list?
Probably a dumb question, but I'm assuming a leyline of sanctity counters this? e.g. you can't target with the lifeloss so it's countered?
Leyline doesn't counter it at all; it actually makes Atheros way better, since you automatically get your creature back without giving your opponent the chance to choose wether he/she wants you to or not.
To explain why this works, Atheros's oracle text on the ability reads "Whenever a creature you control dies, return it to your hand unless target opponent pays 3 life." And since Leyline of Sanctity makes your opponent untargeteable by spells or abilities, you cannot target the opponent with the ability, as it automatically recurs your creature unless your opponent pays the life. Opponent can't be targeted, so he can't pay the 3 life.
I like it but do you think that the opponent will care, that the creature he/she just killed will return to the hand of his/her opponent? I mean 3 life is a lot so why not just let them?
Okay, think about it this way.... In Constructed, it's not uncommon for a Black Devotion deck to have 10-15 kill spells in the mainboard, as it is their strategy to control the board so threats like Desecration Demon and Pack Rat can win the game.
With Atheros put into consideration, if you were playing a B/W aggro build of some kind with Atheros against a Mono-Black player, and if they didn't pay life for Atheros, then up to a fourth of their deck is almost useless against you. A fourth. And since board wipes in Mono-Black don't really exist (Bile Blight and Drown in Sorrow are very limited in reach), it's very hard for that Mono-Black player to control you unless they pay a lot of life to make your dudes stay dead. Factor in potential life loss from things like Thoughtseize and Underworld Connections, and it becomes a hard thing for Mono-Black to play around easily (Unless they are forced to Thoughtseize your Atheros, God of Passage from your hand.)
As long as your devotion to white and black is less than seven, Atheros isn't a creature.
Whenever another creature you own dies, return it to your hand unless target opponent pays 3 life.
Hmm... For just three, seems to be quite playable in Constructed; might also be a decent EDH general. He is:
-An Indestructible 5/4 Enchantment Creature for 3.
-Forces your opponents to pay life if they want your creatures to stay dead, especially after a board wipe (ex. Damnation)
-Reads "Creatures you own", which means that the effect triggers if something your opponent Bribery'd out of your deck dies.
Well...
I don't care. I stated my reasons for my opinion about this subject. If you think that's stupid, then that's your problem.
Also, Jund is not a good deck. It has bad matchups against stuff like Tron, Dredge, and Scapeshift, and even at that is only average at best. Bloodbraid Elf is an interesting card that would be fun to play and to play against, and might make the deck pretty good again. Besides, Elf doesn't solve the deck's hard matchups anyway, nor is it as good as when it was legal with Deathrite Shaman. However, just in case it ended up being too good, unban Jace along with it to counteract it. The two cards pair against each other pretty well, and that would be much more interesting to watch than... I dunno, whatever the hell the format is now.
Sidebar: I'd be fine with the unbanning of everything but Dread Return, because that card is actually dangerous and would probably make Dredge too good. The others are fine unbans, especially Twin. I was a Twin player for some time before the ban, and I have always believed that the card was fair and balanced. "But it stagnated the metagame and forced you to play answers". Infect forced you to play answers. Tron forced you to play answers. And now, Dredge forces you to play answers. Oh and for the record, where are these decks that Twin was "supposedly" holding back? Nowhere to be seen.
Stay banned.
The deck can already do that. True, the artifact lands would make it more consistent, but only by a bit.
Plating's already a "degenerate" piece of equipment. Adding the artifact lands does what, make it slightly more effective?
See above.
See above again. Also, what lands are you cutting for the artifact lands? Are you cutting manlands? That makes the deck less consistent and weaker to hate. Are you cutting Glimmervoid? Makes your sideboard worse, and makes it harder to play colored cards maindeck. I could only really see cutting Darksteel Citadel for these artifact lands, honestly.
All of these things mentioned seem like minor things, not incredibly broken things. And just because it was a "mistake" or was broken in the past doesn't mean that it's broken now. Thopter Sword was broken in the past. Valakut was broken in the past. So why were they unbanned? Simple, because they're not broken now.
Just wondering, that's all.
Leyline doesn't counter it at all; it actually makes Atheros way better, since you automatically get your creature back without giving your opponent the chance to choose wether he/she wants you to or not.
To explain why this works, Atheros's oracle text on the ability reads "Whenever a creature you control dies, return it to your hand unless target opponent pays 3 life." And since Leyline of Sanctity makes your opponent untargeteable by spells or abilities, you cannot target the opponent with the ability, as it automatically recurs your creature unless your opponent pays the life. Opponent can't be targeted, so he can't pay the 3 life.
Okay, think about it this way.... In Constructed, it's not uncommon for a Black Devotion deck to have 10-15 kill spells in the mainboard, as it is their strategy to control the board so threats like Desecration Demon and Pack Rat can win the game.
With Atheros put into consideration, if you were playing a B/W aggro build of some kind with Atheros against a Mono-Black player, and if they didn't pay life for Atheros, then up to a fourth of their deck is almost useless against you. A fourth. And since board wipes in Mono-Black don't really exist (Bile Blight and Drown in Sorrow are very limited in reach), it's very hard for that Mono-Black player to control you unless they pay a lot of life to make your dudes stay dead. Factor in potential life loss from things like Thoughtseize and Underworld Connections, and it becomes a hard thing for Mono-Black to play around easily (Unless they are forced to Thoughtseize your Atheros, God of Passage from your hand.)
5/4 Indestructible Enchantment Creature- God
As long as your devotion to white and black is less than seven, Atheros isn't a creature.
Whenever another creature you own dies, return it to your hand unless target opponent pays 3 life.
Hmm... For just three, seems to be quite playable in Constructed; might also be a decent EDH general. He is:
-An Indestructible 5/4 Enchantment Creature for 3.
-Forces your opponents to pay life if they want your creatures to stay dead, especially after a board wipe (ex. Damnation)
-Reads "Creatures you own", which means that the effect triggers if something your opponent Bribery'd out of your deck dies.
What do you guys think?
Commander:
1x Omnath, Locus of Mana
Creatures (31):
1x Scute Mob
1x Gaea's Herald
1x Rofellos, Llanowar Emissary
1x Sakura-Tribe Elder
1x Azusa, Lost but Seeking
1x Eternal Witness
1x Somberwald Sage
1x Elvish Piper
1x Oracle of Mul Daya
1x Acidic Slime
1x Seedborn Muse
1x Silklash Spider
1x Thragtusk
1x Hydra Omnivore
1x Rampaging Baloths
1x Silvos, Rogue Elemental
1x Soul of the Harvest
1x Verdeloth the Ancient
1x Wurmcoil Engine
1x Avenger of Zendikar
1x Hornet Queen
1x Myr Battlesphere
1x Pelakka Wurm
1x Regal Force
1x Platinum Emperion
1x Terastodon
1x Vorinclex, Voice of Hunger
1x Woodfall Primus
1x Artisan of Kozilek
1x Kozilek, Butcher of Truth
1x Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre
Artifacts (7):
1x Lightning Greaves
1x Swiftfoot Boots
1x Mimic Vat
1x Sword of Feast and Famine
1x Soul Foundry
1x Caged Sun
1x Akroma's Memorial
Instants (7):
1x Noxious Revival
1x Worldly Tutor
1x Back to Nature
1x Unravel the Æther
1x Beast Within
1x Harrow
1x Krosan Grip
Sorceries (9):
1x Green Sun's Zenith
1x Explore
1x Cultivate
1x Creeping Corrosion
1x Harmonize
1x Primal Command
1x Overwhelming Stampede
1x Tooth and Nail
1x Genesis Wave
Enchantments (3):
1x Rancor
1x Awakening Zone
1x Defense of the Heart
Planeswalkers (2):
1x Garruk, Primal Hunter
1x Garruk Wildspeaker
Lands (39):
36x Forests
1x Oran-Rief, the Vastwood
1x Reliquary Tower
1x Temple of the False God
Any and all input on it is welcome; that's why I came here in the first place.