If you are a Soldier Stompy enthusiast you should read this post, especially the bottom part because it's got some honest insight into the viability of this deck.
Why don't any of these deck lists I see have Trinisphere? The point of running a stompy shell is to have Chalice of the Void and Trinisphere to mess with your opponent. The red stompy build which has typically been the most competitive Stompy deck always runs Trinishpere. One of the mains reasons the deck has been better is because it has Blood Moon, Trinishpere and Chalice which can prevent your opponent from doing much of anything if nothing at all in certain matchups. Just like Red Stompy, my deck gives the opponent SERIOUS mana problems, and doesn't just rely on Chalice to prevent them from casting spells. For us, the Thalia's are like the equivalent of Magus of the Moon and Blood Moon, also, when I used to play this deck, I always ran Loxodon Gatekeeper, a card which is very similar to the new Thalia (with a stronger effect), but it costs 1 more. I would still run that card for sure, maybe just less copies because we have Recruiter of the Guard to fetch it if we are playing vs basic lands. Suppression Field feels like it's just a dead card in a lot of matches, or at least not worth a slot, and I think running a singleton Phyrexian Revoker that can be fetched with Recruiter, and possibly more copies in sideboard, is better than running 4 Suppression fields. This also frees up slots for other stuff.
My sideboard needs to be updated, I haven't looked deep into it, this is basically what it was like two years ago when I was playing this deck, and I haven't really played this deck since then. I've just started testing this again, so I'm sure this list will change slightly.
Things to Note:
Winter Orb had been doing work in my testing. It combos with your creature mana tax abilities, and is especially broken with the new Thalia and Loxodon Gatekeeper. Also, to everyone not running Gustcloack Savior, I advise you to test it. I remember when I was playing this deck a lot, that this card performed extremely well, and it is not letting me down in my recent little bit of testing. It makes it so that you can attack into a big creature with Captain and not have to worry, you can always swing with everything and not working about feeding creatures off. And also, something that is very relevant, you can avoid triggering Swords and Jitte effects by making sure your opponents don't deal combat dmg while they block. Sanctum prelate seems like it just has absurd power level, but I'm wondering it's hard to make room for more cards in this deck. Currently I have 1 of, but I'm thinking about possibly removing it and adding another Relic Seeker or Recruiter to make sure I can consistently get Jitte down in the matchups that it shines in. Suppression Field seems like a sideboard card to me if played at all, as it IS very good in some matchups, while useless in others. Captain of the Watch is cool with Captain, but not necessary to win games, I don't need to be swinging with giant soldier to win games, and it's not like I can outrace lots of decks if I'm not disrupting them. I just need to be developing my board while preventing my opponent from doing so. I have it as a 1 of for testing purposes, but I think I will be removing it last some point.
Cards with Potential: Aven Mindcensor is a great card. Most decks run fetch lands so it can be useful vs most decks, and it's even better vs decks with Tutor effects like Maverick or Ad Nauseum.
Stoneforge Mystic is just a better card than Relic Seeker and might be worth inclusion.
Sanctum Prelate is an absurdly good card but it's hard to cast in this deck, especially on turn 3. This card makes me want to ditch a Soldier theme deck and just play I kind of mono-white big hatebear deck.
It might make sense to ditch the Soldier plan. Here's some thoughts on the matter.
Pros: We have other options open to us, Aven Mindcensor, Vryn Wingmare, and of course Sanctum Prelate, which is like almost like a Chalice on legs.
IMPORTANT!! SEE BELOW!!
Here is a Red Stompy list that placed 4th in a recent tournament with 772 players on July 9th. Compare your list with this deck and ask yourself, is your deck as effective as Red Stompy? When I compare my lists, I see a lot of similarities, but I think the Red Stompy is better at doing what this deck wants to do. It has a good finishers, and the Blood Moon effect is better in many matchups than Thalia and Gatekeeper effects. Prove me wrong. Also, this deck runs Simian Spirit Guide, an effect that we don't have access to which is a huge loss. It not only fixes the mana, but gives them a better chance of dropping a turn 1 Chalice and just makes the deck consistently faster. I think this is actually one of the bigger issues of the deck. It's very hard to play a card like Sanctum Prelate because it isn't reliably castable.
Why Ire Shaman? It just seems like only a good card if you are megamorhping which we don't want to do in this deck, unless we find ourselves grinding in the lategame. It just has a mediocre early game impact it seems. Also, why Burning-Tree Shaman? I can see it's benefits, especially against planeswalkers and having two out negates Melira Finks combo. I don't understand why Chord of Calling is not in any of the other lists. We can fetch a free creature from our toolkit with it.
This version is a bit masochistic with the paintrip cantrips, but it makes it have a consistent gameplan.
ALSO!!!!!! I just realized Tasigur is a Shaman!!!!!!!!! So here's my list.
Someone played a Shaman deck against me and toasted me, and it looked really awesome. I found one on tcdecks.net, and then I made my own rendition. I wanted to make it faster, but I think my version is actually just less consistent and is worse at grinding back in the game from behind. And the deck that beat mine had an extremely explosive hand which this deck can have. Dumping shamans and then playing a quick Rage Forger can do serious damage in a hurry with a nice board state left over.
Does anyone have any suggestions to make this thing competitive?
If I cast Profane Command to give my opponents sufficient -x-x in order to kill it, and he gives it pro black by casting Apostle's Blessing, does the second chosen ability for Profane Command resolve? In this instance returning a creature from my graveyard to play.
Then how would you explain Vines of Vastwood? When a kill spell targets a creature it has already become the target, before Vines of Vastwood makes it an illegal target. If the order of operation is as you say it is, then I feel like the same rules should apply for Vines of Vastwood, and the kill spell would successfully resolve because Vines of Vastwood was cast after the kill spell targeted a creature. I'm wondering if there is a difference between "declaring a target" and a creature actually being targeted.
I understand that the owner of a spell must declare a target upon casting that spell, but isn't the creature only targeted once the spell resolves? Diffusion Sliver says "whenever a Sliver you control becomes the target..", not, "whenever an opponent casts a spell that targets a Sliver you control."
If my opponent casts a kill spell on my Sliver, in this instance, Terminate, then I vial in a Diffusion Sliver in response, does my opponent still have to pay 2 in order for the spell to resolve. How does targeting work with the stack? My opponent thinks that because he has already declared a target he does not have to pay 2 to prevent it from being countered.
These are the decklists I've been testing and having success with.
I actually think the artifact themed one is better, because Phyrexian Revoker is too good to not play, and the artifact theme gives the deck more incentive to play it. A metalcrafted etched champion is very powerful as well, and there are just more obstacles for the opponents to overcome. Gatekeeper is amazing, especially with Winter Orb.
I'm thinking that the core of the deck could be changed up to support more of an artifact theme, maybe with Aether Vial and more Mox Opals and the other metalcrafted soldiers, but disruption is key in legacy so I just am not sure if fat weenies will do the trick. Is it really bad to play aether Vial in a stompy deck? Could we run a vial list with Chrome Mox? Should it be stompy or non-stompy? I don't think it's such a terrible idea to put aether vial in a stompy deck. the lack of lands allow us to put more creatures in making up for the extra non creature slots for Aether Vial. Could we use Rishadan Port and Wasteland like d&t? They go beautifully with Loxodon Gatekeeper.
I really hope this card can be built around, the Grandeur effect is so powerful. All this needs is a sure way to get one in play, one in hand, and a way to continually recur the discarded mistress from the graveyard probably at instant speed to prevent disruption. If not instant speed, then disruption to make way for initial loop. Once the loop is in motion, there is no way for them to win, except for with Aegis of the Gods or Leyline of Sanctity
- one in hand
- one in play
- continual recurring loop
I will wire you money if you figure out how to brew this. I'm not Nigerian.
Oh, and it's hard to kill and a good blocker, which I'm sure is relevant.
When I try to start a game the game loader crashes. I have a feeling it's because Untap.in has not been optimized with iOS. I'm not sure how to contact the developer, but I would like to let them know, in case they don't already. Can anyone help me with finding contact info for Untap.in, or even better, help me troubleshoot, especially if you were able to get it working on an iPad.
After seeing Circular Logic card spoiled in Vintage Masters, it seems strange to me that it doesn't see play. It can potentially be one of the best counter spells out there, and it easy to activate. Any ideas?
Well he got a default loss for showing up late to the tourney. The deck looks awesome to me. Two Aether vials is questionable, and in the featured match it didn't do much. To me, it's just a way to cast Court Hussar.
I could see this deck changing. I just realized how broken Court Hussar is.
I think Aegis of the Gods will be a must-have for the sideboard as it has a similar functionality to a few of the cards currently occupying slots, and it's fetchabilty with Enlistment Officer pushes it in front of the rest as an actual trump card.
Also, what about Loxodon Gatekeeper or Mentor of the Meek or Intrepid Hero? These seem like they have potential at least for recognition and theory testing. They supply great disruption. They are not so one dimensional, and not even too situational besides Intrepid Hero.
Aegis of the Gods from Journey into Nyx diminishes the impact of Liliana and Jace, plus it hoses single target combo and burn. It's a sideboard hoser on legs. Not bad.
I'm not sure where to put this thread, nor am I sure what forum to put it in, but I've used MTG Salvation all my life so I've decided to keep my business here.
I downloaded the Cockatice client for Mac from Woogerworks and when I try to open it I get a message saying that it "cannot be opened" because it is from and "unidentified developer."
Why don't any of these deck lists I see have Trinisphere? The point of running a stompy shell is to have Chalice of the Void and Trinisphere to mess with your opponent. The red stompy build which has typically been the most competitive Stompy deck always runs Trinishpere. One of the mains reasons the deck has been better is because it has Blood Moon, Trinishpere and Chalice which can prevent your opponent from doing much of anything if nothing at all in certain matchups. Just like Red Stompy, my deck gives the opponent SERIOUS mana problems, and doesn't just rely on Chalice to prevent them from casting spells. For us, the Thalia's are like the equivalent of Magus of the Moon and Blood Moon, also, when I used to play this deck, I always ran Loxodon Gatekeeper, a card which is very similar to the new Thalia (with a stronger effect), but it costs 1 more. I would still run that card for sure, maybe just less copies because we have Recruiter of the Guard to fetch it if we are playing vs basic lands. Suppression Field feels like it's just a dead card in a lot of matches, or at least not worth a slot, and I think running a singleton Phyrexian Revoker that can be fetched with Recruiter, and possibly more copies in sideboard, is better than running 4 Suppression fields. This also frees up slots for other stuff.
My sideboard needs to be updated, I haven't looked deep into it, this is basically what it was like two years ago when I was playing this deck, and I haven't really played this deck since then. I've just started testing this again, so I'm sure this list will change slightly.
My current list:
4 Cavern of Souls
2 Flagstones of Trokair
2 Karakas
2 Plains
1 Tundra
4 Ancient Tomb
4 City of Traitors
Creatures: 30
4 Preeminent Captain
4 Enlistment Officer
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
1 Loxodon Gatekeeper
1 Captain of the Watch
4 Thalia, Heretic Cathar
4 Recruiter of the Guard
1 Sanctum Prelate
1 Palace Jailer
3 Gustcloak Savior
1 Phyrexian Revoker
4 Chalice of the Void
3 Winter Orb
3 Chrome Mox
3 Trinisphere
4 Leyline of Sanctity
2 Ratchet Bomb
1 Phyrexian Revoker
1 Crib Swap
1 Intrepid Hero
1 Oblivion Ring
2 Disenchant
2 Rest in Peace
1 Batterskull
Things to Note:
Winter Orb had been doing work in my testing. It combos with your creature mana tax abilities, and is especially broken with the new Thalia and Loxodon Gatekeeper. Also, to everyone not running Gustcloack Savior, I advise you to test it. I remember when I was playing this deck a lot, that this card performed extremely well, and it is not letting me down in my recent little bit of testing. It makes it so that you can attack into a big creature with Captain and not have to worry, you can always swing with everything and not working about feeding creatures off. And also, something that is very relevant, you can avoid triggering Swords and Jitte effects by making sure your opponents don't deal combat dmg while they block. Sanctum prelate seems like it just has absurd power level, but I'm wondering it's hard to make room for more cards in this deck. Currently I have 1 of, but I'm thinking about possibly removing it and adding another Relic Seeker or Recruiter to make sure I can consistently get Jitte down in the matchups that it shines in. Suppression Field seems like a sideboard card to me if played at all, as it IS very good in some matchups, while useless in others. Captain of the Watch is cool with Captain, but not necessary to win games, I don't need to be swinging with giant soldier to win games, and it's not like I can outrace lots of decks if I'm not disrupting them. I just need to be developing my board while preventing my opponent from doing so. I have it as a 1 of for testing purposes, but I think I will be removing it last some point.
Cards with Potential:
Aven Mindcensor is a great card. Most decks run fetch lands so it can be useful vs most decks, and it's even better vs decks with Tutor effects like Maverick or Ad Nauseum.
Stoneforge Mystic is just a better card than Relic Seeker and might be worth inclusion.
Sanctum Prelate is an absurdly good card but it's hard to cast in this deck, especially on turn 3. This card makes me want to ditch a Soldier theme deck and just play I kind of mono-white big hatebear deck.
It might make sense to ditch the Soldier plan. Here's some thoughts on the matter.
Pros: We have other options open to us, Aven Mindcensor, Vryn Wingmare, and of course Sanctum Prelate, which is like almost like a Chalice on legs.
IMPORTANT!! SEE BELOW!!
Here is a Red Stompy list that placed 4th in a recent tournament with 772 players on July 9th. Compare your list with this deck and ask yourself, is your deck as effective as Red Stompy? When I compare my lists, I see a lot of similarities, but I think the Red Stompy is better at doing what this deck wants to do. It has a good finishers, and the Blood Moon effect is better in many matchups than Thalia and Gatekeeper effects. Prove me wrong. Also, this deck runs Simian Spirit Guide, an effect that we don't have access to which is a huge loss. It not only fixes the mana, but gives them a better chance of dropping a turn 1 Chalice and just makes the deck consistently faster. I think this is actually one of the bigger issues of the deck. It's very hard to play a card like Sanctum Prelate because it isn't reliably castable.
1 Goblin Settler
1 Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker
1 Murderous Redcap
1 Pia and Kiran Nalaar
1 Siege-Gang Commander
1 Stingscourger
2 Imperial Recruiter
4 Goblin Rabblemaster
4 Magus of the Moon
4 Moggcatcher
4 Simian Spirit Guide
4 Blood Moon
Artifacts: 12
2 Umezawa's Jitte
3 Chrome Mox
3 Trinisphere
4 Chalice of the Void
Lands: 20
2 Cavern of Souls
4 Ancient Tomb
4 City of Traitors
10 Mountain
This version is a bit masochistic with the paintrip cantrips, but it makes it have a consistent gameplan.
ALSO!!!!!! I just realized Tasigur is a Shaman!!!!!!!!! So here's my list.
4 Chord of Calling
4 Rage Forger
4 Flamekin Harbinger
4 Elvish Visionary
4 Burning-Tree Emissary
4 Bosk Banneret
2 Tasigur, the Golden Fang
1 Scavenging Ooze
4 Simian Spirit Guide
4 Street Wraith
4 Manamorphose
Sorceries
4 Gitaxian Probe
Artifacts
1 Shared Animosity
Lands
2 Forest
1 Dryad Arbor
4 Cavern of Souls
1 Overgrown Tomb
1 Blood Crypt
2 Stomping Ground
4 Wooded Foothills
Does anyone have any suggestions to make this thing competitive?
My version:
4 Rage Forger
4 Flamekin Harbinger
4 Elvish Visionary
4 Burning-Tree Emissary
4 Bosk Banneret
2 Eternal Witness
1 Wild Beastmaster
1 Scavenging Ooze
4 Simian Spirit Guide
4 Manamorphose
4 Gitaxian Probe
4 Street Wraith
2 Forest
1 Dryad Arbor
4 Cavern of Souls
4 Stomping Ground
4 Wooded Foothills
1 Misty Rainforest
Version on tcdecks.net
1 Eternal Witness
1 Fulminator Mage
1 Prophetic Flamespeaker
1 Thrun, the Last Troll
2 Burning-Tree Shaman
2 Ire Shaman
2 Scavenging Ooze
3 Bosk Banneret
3 Flamekin Harbinger
3 Wolf-Skull Shaman
4 Burning-Tree Emissary
4 Elvish Visionary
4 Rage Forger
4 Simian Spirit Guide
2 Manamorphose
4 Lightning Bolt
1 Shared Animosity
1 Fire-Lit Thicket
1 Verdant Catacombs
2 Cavern of Souls
2 Forest
2 Mountain
2 Mutavault
4 Stomping Ground
4 Wooded Foothills
2 Essence Warden
1 Reclamation Sage
2 Blood Moon
2 Choke
1 Leyline of Punishment
1 Ancient Grudge
2 Combust
1 Destructive Revelry
1 Guttural Response
1 Lead the Stampede
Please explain.
Thanks
I understand that the owner of a spell must declare a target upon casting that spell, but isn't the creature only targeted once the spell resolves? Diffusion Sliver says "whenever a Sliver you control becomes the target..", not, "whenever an opponent casts a spell that targets a Sliver you control."
I actually think the artifact themed one is better, because Phyrexian Revoker is too good to not play, and the artifact theme gives the deck more incentive to play it. A metalcrafted etched champion is very powerful as well, and there are just more obstacles for the opponents to overcome. Gatekeeper is amazing, especially with Winter Orb.
I'm thinking that the core of the deck could be changed up to support more of an artifact theme, maybe with Aether Vial and more Mox Opals and the other metalcrafted soldiers, but disruption is key in legacy so I just am not sure if fat weenies will do the trick. Is it really bad to play aether Vial in a stompy deck? Could we run a vial list with Chrome Mox? Should it be stompy or non-stompy? I don't think it's such a terrible idea to put aether vial in a stompy deck. the lack of lands allow us to put more creatures in making up for the extra non creature slots for Aether Vial. Could we use Rishadan Port and Wasteland like d&t? They go beautifully with Loxodon Gatekeeper.
2 Flagstones of Trokair
2 Karakas
3 Plains
1 Tundra
4 Ancient Tomb
2 City of Traitors
4 Preeminent Captain
4 Porcelain Legionnaire
4 Enlistment Officer
4 Etched Champion
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
3 Phyrexian Revoker
4 Loxodon Gatekeeper
4 Daru Warchief
4 Chalice of the Void
3 Winter Orb
1 Mox Opal
3 Chrome Mox
2 Ratchet Bomb
1 Phyrexian Revoker
1 Crib Swap
1 Intrepid Hero
1 Oblivion Ring
2 Disenchant
2 Rest in Peace
1 Lavinia of the Tenth
1 Flagstones of Trokair
2 Karakas
1 Horizon Canopy
3 Plains
1 Tundra
4 Ancient Tomb
2 City of Traitors
4 Ballyrush Banneret
4 Preeminent Captain
4 Enlistment Officer
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Daru Warchief
2 Field Marshal
4 Loxodon Gatekeeper
3 Gustcloak Savior
1 Lavinia of the Tenth
4 Chalice of the Void
4 Suppression Field
4 Chrome Mox
I really hope this card can be built around, the Grandeur effect is so powerful. All this needs is a sure way to get one in play, one in hand, and a way to continually recur the discarded mistress from the graveyard probably at instant speed to prevent disruption. If not instant speed, then disruption to make way for initial loop. Once the loop is in motion, there is no way for them to win, except for with Aegis of the Gods or Leyline of Sanctity
- one in hand
- one in play
- continual recurring loop
I will wire you money if you figure out how to brew this. I'm not Nigerian.
Oh, and it's hard to kill and a good blocker, which I'm sure is relevant.
my device
iPad Air, iOS 7.1.1
Thanks in advance
- Rendroc
I could see this deck changing. I just realized how broken Court Hussar is.
Also, what about Loxodon Gatekeeper or Mentor of the Meek or Intrepid Hero? These seem like they have potential at least for recognition and theory testing. They supply great disruption. They are not so one dimensional, and not even too situational besides Intrepid Hero.
I downloaded the Cockatice client for Mac from Woogerworks and when I try to open it I get a message saying that it "cannot be opened" because it is from and "unidentified developer."
Please help me.