When you double counters with Corpsejack Menace you are doing so as they are being put onto a creature. So in this case you would sacrifice the Vastwood Hydra to Scourge of Skola Vale and the ability goes on the stack as well as the triggered ability from Vastwood dying. Vastwood's will resolve first and go to put 4 counters on whoever you choose, but will be doubled by the Corpsejack resulting in 8 counters total. Then the Skola Vale ability will resolve and go to place another 4 counters, but be doubled by Corpsejack resulting in a total of 16 counters for Scourge of Skola Vale.
Not really. Under the Infraction Procedure Guide if a player makes an illegal choice or forgets to make a choice for a permanent on the battlefield the judge has that player make the choice then. It is covered under Game Rule Violations.
"If a player made an illegal choice or failed to make a required choice for a permanent onthe battlefield, that player makes a legal choice."
Here's what I have so far in cards from m15 for modern. I left off reprints since we already know how they are.
Definite: These are the cards that will immediately be slotted into t1/t2 decks. I only included the cards where the general consensus I've seen fits this. Hushwing Gryff (White decks that want Torpor Orb with legs, wings, and instant speed) Waste Not (8 Rack) Reclamation Sage (Pod over Harmonic Sliver)
Probable: These are the cards that have either decks archetypes they make possible or existing t1/t2 they will probably go in. Some cards may be definite, but the general consensus hasn't quite reached that far yet. Ajani Steadfast (Hard to say. I imagine token decks will at least consider him for his -2 and his +1 helps with racing or helping Tidehollow Sculler live through combat) Spirit Bonds (I've seen some mention of Norin decks wanting this and it looks possible as a value card) Chief Engineer (Hard to evaluate since it is a new sort of effect. Possible deck ideas generally include Etherium Sculptor,Architect, Heartless Summoning, or all three) Goblin Rabblemaster (Possible addition to goblin decks. The must attack clause may be too limiting, but is very powerful when combined with warchief) Obelisk of Urd (+2/+2 is a very powerful ability. Particularly when combined with Intangible Virtue to allow attacks and casting post combat this card may see play in a Spirit Tribal.) Perilous Vault (The new Oblivion Stone. Which one you prefer is sort of 50/50. Exiling doesn't matter in a lot of matchups and Tron already has a good Pod match. The extra mana and no fate stones make me think O-Stone is better, but others disagree. It does work as an O-stone 5-6 in a pinch)
Possible: Cards that seem to do what certain types of decks want to do, but aren't quite good enough. Certain combos are meta game shifts may make them more viable so they should at least be considered. Triplicate Spirits (Without Convoke it is garbage. With Convoke it might be Spectral Procession 5/6. Maybe) Return to the Ranks (It seems like a worse Immortal Servitude which is already a card that doesn't see play. I have seen people brewing with it and some of them are interesting so it deserves a mention.) Aether Whirlwind (Aetherize sees some play in sideboards though it isn't particularly popular right now. For an extra mana they now have to redraw everything. Possibly too expensive, but possible.) Necromancer's Stockpile (This card makes my jimmy senses tingle. Gravecrawler is legal and Deathrite shaman isn't. Is it time for a dredge deck that can abuse this? Maybe.)
Here's the Torpor Orb ruling:
6/1/2011 If Torpor Orb and a creature enter the battlefield at the same time, that creature entering the battlefield won't cause triggered abilities to trigger.
They share the same effect word for word so you should be good.
Correct. The delayed trigger on Impromptu Raid can only track the original object. When you exile and bring a card back into play the game considers it an entirely new object.
Madness is Hawt. But I doubt it. maddness + lili = gross
I agree, its pretty unlikely, also are you going to be at modern today?
I'm hyped that Chord is confirmed back. Wizards is making some sort of effort to keep things reasonable, it may not be as much as everyone wants, but the effort is obviously there.
Yep. I'll be there. missed 2 weeks ago because my grand da got sick. But I'll be there now. And I have to double up. Nice to see reprints. I'm not sure how many new modern cards we got, but we got some cool reprints (phyrexian revoker to name one) though, the no reprint of lili still stings.
By my count we have about 8 definite or almost definite cards that will be slotted into t1/t2 decks (Waste Not). Another 6 or 7 potentials based on how they actually interact (Spirit Bonds). Most of the rest are either reprints, fine for standard but bad in modern, or just limited chaff. Of course even some of the ones that will definitely see play aren't all that exciting. Reclamation Sage gets put into pod over Harmonic Sliver immediately, but it won't change the deck any.
I usually don't even bring in Leyline against Storm. Any good player would bring in Echoing truth and it's easy enough for the to draw through their entire deck to find it while going off.
But I can also see:
Attempt to draw a card. Notion thief replacement effect happens, and opponent never has an option to dredge as they are not drawing a card.
Does it depend on who active player is? Does it depend on who's card's effect is drawing the card?
It doesn't depend on active player and it doesn't depend on who's effect is causing the card draw. When two replacement effects try to replace the same event the affected object (or player in this case) decides which one to apply first. Then the other replacement effects check if they can still apply and if they don't are ignored.
Even though he is rather expensive, there's enough decent ramp from the Theros block that I would say makes him able to be cast sooner anyways, turn 5 probably most commonplace, and with the four abilities that interact with the board or let him protect himself, I'd say he's probably playable in a GB ramp deck.
The ramp in Theros block is pretty bad really. What I wouldn't give to have Farseek back. Or this as the curve topper in Jund from last season. mmm so good.
Well, T1 Elvish Mystic, T2 Sylvan Carytid, T3 play a Nyxthos and Courser, turn four Garruk is still possible while keeping you defended. It's not the best, but certainly good enough where you can put him out earlier.
It's possible, but other formats (Previous standards) have things like Rampant Growth or Farseek or Ranger's Path to ramp in a way that tends not to lose to Supreme Verdict.
Even though he is rather expensive, there's enough decent ramp from the Theros block that I would say makes him able to be cast sooner anyways, turn 5 probably most commonplace, and with the four abilities that interact with the board or let him protect himself, I'd say he's probably playable in a GB ramp deck.
The ramp in Theros block is pretty bad really. What I wouldn't give to have Farseek back. Or this as the curve topper in Jund from last season. mmm so good.
I've also cracked oblivion stone on the back of my own Wurmcoil before which would be a lot worse with O-Stone. Right off the bat I think O-Stone is still better, but I could be wrong. Relic of Progenitus is usually enough to exile the things I want exiled.
Hey guys I have some questions in particular one is about Persist. Today I was playing a game and managed to get the combo off with Archangel of Thune and Spike Feeder. In addition, I had a Murderous Redcap on the field, along with a Kitchen Finks. Since these get as many +1/+1 counters as I want (lets say 500), they were very large. My opponent managed to kill these with an Oblivion Stone though (the very next turn, he got it off the top), and of course, they persisted. Since these had tons of +1/+1 counters on them, how does that work? Do they just re-enter the battlefield with a -1/-1 counter on them and ignore the previous +1/+1 counters placed on them, or does it use the "last known information"? (since it looks at the card when it was previously on the battlefield)? I'm assuming it works by them just become a 1/1 and 2/1 again respectively, but correct me if I'm wrong. I had remembered reading somewhere it might be the opposite but could not remember.
Secondly, I played against Tron today and it was probably the toughest match I've had so far playing this deck. A turn 3 or 4 Wormcoil engine or Karn really blows. What do you guys sideboard against those particular decks?
They just return as the card itself with a -1/-1 counter on it. Last known information is for when an ability originates from something on the battlefield and is needed to be checked on resolution. For example if you have a Murderous Redcap come into play from persist and target a player with its ETB ability and in response the Redcap is killed. When the ETB ability goes to resolve it needs to know what the Redcap's power was (and the Redcap card in the graveyard has no relation in the game rules) so it looks at what its power was immediately prior to death.
As for sideboarding against Tron you are in a rough spot. Tron is probably the hardest match up and there isn't a lot Melira Pod can do against them. Depending on what you have take out things like Orzhov Pontiff and Thrun. Side in Thoughtseize, try to combo off quickly, and hope they don't natural Tron.
Vastwood Hydra
Corpsejack Menace
When you double counters with Corpsejack Menace you are doing so as they are being put onto a creature. So in this case you would sacrifice the Vastwood Hydra to Scourge of Skola Vale and the ability goes on the stack as well as the triggered ability from Vastwood dying. Vastwood's will resolve first and go to put 4 counters on whoever you choose, but will be doubled by the Corpsejack resulting in 8 counters total. Then the Skola Vale ability will resolve and go to place another 4 counters, but be doubled by Corpsejack resulting in a total of 16 counters for Scourge of Skola Vale.
"If a player made an illegal choice or failed to make a required choice for a permanent onthe battlefield, that player makes a legal choice."
Definite: These are the cards that will immediately be slotted into t1/t2 decks. I only included the cards where the general consensus I've seen fits this.
Hushwing Gryff (White decks that want Torpor Orb with legs, wings, and instant speed)
Waste Not (8 Rack)
Reclamation Sage (Pod over Harmonic Sliver)
Probable: These are the cards that have either decks archetypes they make possible or existing t1/t2 they will probably go in. Some cards may be definite, but the general consensus hasn't quite reached that far yet.
Ajani Steadfast (Hard to say. I imagine token decks will at least consider him for his -2 and his +1 helps with racing or helping Tidehollow Sculler live through combat)
Spirit Bonds (I've seen some mention of Norin decks wanting this and it looks possible as a value card)
Chief Engineer (Hard to evaluate since it is a new sort of effect. Possible deck ideas generally include Etherium Sculptor,Architect, Heartless Summoning, or all three)
Goblin Rabblemaster (Possible addition to goblin decks. The must attack clause may be too limiting, but is very powerful when combined with warchief)
Obelisk of Urd (+2/+2 is a very powerful ability. Particularly when combined with Intangible Virtue to allow attacks and casting post combat this card may see play in a Spirit Tribal.)
Perilous Vault (The new Oblivion Stone. Which one you prefer is sort of 50/50. Exiling doesn't matter in a lot of matchups and Tron already has a good Pod match. The extra mana and no fate stones make me think O-Stone is better, but others disagree. It does work as an O-stone 5-6 in a pinch)
Possible: Cards that seem to do what certain types of decks want to do, but aren't quite good enough. Certain combos are meta game shifts may make them more viable so they should at least be considered.
Triplicate Spirits (Without Convoke it is garbage. With Convoke it might be Spectral Procession 5/6. Maybe)
Return to the Ranks (It seems like a worse Immortal Servitude which is already a card that doesn't see play. I have seen people brewing with it and some of them are interesting so it deserves a mention.)
Aether Whirlwind (Aetherize sees some play in sideboards though it isn't particularly popular right now. For an extra mana they now have to redraw everything. Possibly too expensive, but possible.)
Necromancer's Stockpile (This card makes my jimmy senses tingle. Gravecrawler is legal and Deathrite shaman isn't. Is it time for a dredge deck that can abuse this? Maybe.)
6/1/2011 If Torpor Orb and a creature enter the battlefield at the same time, that creature entering the battlefield won't cause triggered abilities to trigger.
They share the same effect word for word so you should be good.
By my count we have about 8 definite or almost definite cards that will be slotted into t1/t2 decks (Waste Not). Another 6 or 7 potentials based on how they actually interact (Spirit Bonds). Most of the rest are either reprints, fine for standard but bad in modern, or just limited chaff. Of course even some of the ones that will definitely see play aren't all that exciting. Reclamation Sage gets put into pod over Harmonic Sliver immediately, but it won't change the deck any.
It doesn't depend on active player and it doesn't depend on who's effect is causing the card draw. When two replacement effects try to replace the same event the affected object (or player in this case) decides which one to apply first. Then the other replacement effects check if they can still apply and if they don't are ignored.
It's possible, but other formats (Previous standards) have things like Rampant Growth or Farseek or Ranger's Path to ramp in a way that tends not to lose to Supreme Verdict.
The ramp in Theros block is pretty bad really. What I wouldn't give to have Farseek back. Or this as the curve topper in Jund from last season. mmm so good.
I wish they had made it instant speed somehow. That could have been playable. Maybe like
-3: You get an emblem with "Sacrifice this emblem: Return target non-land permanent to its owner's hand."
They just return as the card itself with a -1/-1 counter on it. Last known information is for when an ability originates from something on the battlefield and is needed to be checked on resolution. For example if you have a Murderous Redcap come into play from persist and target a player with its ETB ability and in response the Redcap is killed. When the ETB ability goes to resolve it needs to know what the Redcap's power was (and the Redcap card in the graveyard has no relation in the game rules) so it looks at what its power was immediately prior to death.
As for sideboarding against Tron you are in a rough spot. Tron is probably the hardest match up and there isn't a lot Melira Pod can do against them. Depending on what you have take out things like Orzhov Pontiff and Thrun. Side in Thoughtseize, try to combo off quickly, and hope they don't natural Tron.