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  • posted a message on on MTGO........ The errata update we all been waiting for....Phyrexian Creature type update (added text version of cards)
    So I am betting more than naught that we'll see a return to Mirrodin or a Phyrexian Invasion on another plane w/in the next 2 years


    If this is true it would make the Sphinx errata even more sadder as it already is.
    Posted in: The Rumor Mill
  • posted a message on UB cards from secret lairs will be reprinted in MTG form in “The list” and maybe even certain sets in magic
    Diamonds are valuable only because a) they have subjective aesthetic appeal and b) are artificially scarce.


    They are also the hardest material in the whole world, and thats why the same user that said that they were "intrinsecally worthless" also said that are "used as a hardening agent for many types of tools". As I noticed, that's very far from something being "intrinsecally worthless" So saying diamonds are valuable only because they are pretty or artifically scarce seems fallacious to me.
    Posted in: The Rumor Mill
  • posted a message on UB cards from secret lairs will be reprinted in MTG form in “The list” and maybe even certain sets in magic
    Quote from FlossedBeaver »
    I think he was specifically referring to their monetary value. In this context "intrinsic" would imply that the worth, monetary value, whatever, exists only because of artificial or external factors.


    I mean, unless Diamonds are something that cheap, free and easy to find as leafs, stones, sea water or sand, I don't think "intrinsecally worthless" is a correct terminology to define them. They sure have their own monetary value and use, even if they're not worth 1 billion dollars each. It's just the use of unnecessary and misleading hyperboles that irks me (in pretty much the same way people use to say every new card is a "strictly better" version of a past card even if this isn't true in the 99% of cases). Let's use words in the proper way or language becomes confusing and meaningless.
    Posted in: The Rumor Mill
  • posted a message on UB cards from secret lairs will be reprinted in MTG form in “The list” and maybe even certain sets in magic
    Quote from MrMoustacheMM »
    Quote from Mystic_X »
    would diamonds (or lion's eye diamonds) have any special meaning or a high value if they were found in abundance all over the place? How many practical purposes (or deck archtypes) do they truly usefully serve?

    Diamonds ARE found in abundance. Their "scarcity" is artificial, created by a monopoly by the DeBeers corporation. They aren't special at all, and are intrinsically pretty much worthless.

    Diamond (usually lab-made) is used as a hardening agent for many types of tools (often drill bits). A drill bit with diamond in it can cut through much harder materials than your standard steel drill bit.

    I know, that's not the point you were making, but if you're going to illustrate a point, use an example that doesn't directly contradict your point.



    Can you explain in what sense you mean that Diamonds are "intrinsically pretty much worthless" when you say below that " is used as a hardening agent for many types of tools (often drill bits). A drill bit with diamond in it can cut through much harder materials than your standard steel drill bit."?
    Doesn't seems that intrinsically worthless. Unless you give the word "intrinsic" and "worthless" a very different meaning from what it's wrote on the dictionaries.
    Posted in: The Rumor Mill
  • posted a message on Secret Lair: Stranger Things
    or run a card that drives me crazy and makes me sad. So I don't think it's fair to say that it's only additive.


    As the other user noticed, conservative players always get crazy on changes. Many did get crazy because they made the planeswalker card type, other get crazy when WotC supported femminism and LGBT, and that's why have this represented in Magic cards and lore too, and yes, many people get also very crazy when WotC made up the existence of Standard format. They even made a list of things that were close to kill Magic, because of upset enfranchised playerbase, and, in the end, turns out it was actually good for the game in the long-term run (otherwise Magic today wouldn't be that successful as it currently is):
    https://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/making-magic/twenty-things-were-going-kill-magic-2013-08-01

    So yes, conservative get crazy over changes, in general, and they think something is disruprive to them even when is simply additive to the player experience and doesn't take nothing from them. That's how things works since the dawn of time. WotC, luckily, isn't held hostage from conservative players, or we would will miss many, many cool things they made in those years, not only UB.

    And anyway, even you personal isssue have a solution. If you just don't like the flavor a card you like to play, just change yourself the flavor of that card by proxing with MSE or alter-art directly the card. The first option that is very cheap and easy, is what I do all time with my EDH decks (I currently got a Jace and Nicol Bolas deck with every single card flavored and referring to those 2), and as a Vorthos player myself, I feel pretty satisfied with this solution, and I think is a reasonable one for you too.
    Posted in: The Rumor Mill
  • posted a message on Secret Lair: Stranger Things
    Well we have the D&D set it is not supposed to be part of UB but it is a nondirect lore and is is there insetead of the core set.


    Ironically enough, I never heard (neither on the internet of in real life) anybody complaining D&D crossover set, seems that for every magic player as long as it is a fantasy setting, anything goes I guess.

    And while I agree it is silly to get up and leave midgame i can fully understand them not wanting to play against UB and asking the other person to play a different deck for the next time or using the deck with the UB cards less often.


    All these issues seems more theoretical than practical. I saw very often players having alter-art of their cards of any kind of media they like and I never heard once in my life a complaining from some vorthosian inquisitor about not playing with them because the art and flavor or their magic card is not kosher enough.


    For people who dislike UB in general its similar to people that don't like lets say Planeswalkers you add something but that something detracts their enjoyment, there are people that quit bc of planeswalkers just as there will be people that do because of UB.


    Good riddance in that case. As another user very wisely said, maybe some players won't survive some Magic changes, but Magic will definitely survive some players abandon, for the game's greater good.


    I am ok with Godzilla treatment since atleast I dont have to play with the UB versions


    UB cards will have their non-UB counterpart anyway.
    Posted in: The Rumor Mill
  • posted a message on Secret Lair: Stranger Things
    Quote from FlossedBeaver »
    You didn't jump the shark, you rode the slippery slope all the way to its improbable conclusion.

    Were sales declining so much during the pandemic that they needed cross-cultural crutches to boost popularity or collectability?


    To my understanding, sales - and the popularity of Magic in general - have never been higher. You wouldn't know it by reading this message board, but people seem to actually like what WotC is doing.



    Good point. Sometimes what internet, forum and social media's report about something -players reactions about WotC decision in this case- is just a vocal minority. And we know, a single tree that fall makes much more noise than a quiet forest.

    I would fully undestand all this upset behavior over UB if would actually substract something to the game. Like, for example, less or no more standard or core sets, stopping to develop a lore of the magic story, a real contamination between magic multiverse and other IP worlds.

    But no. It will concern the game only in the terms of supplementals set, they will not even affect standard, and their lore is totally separate and still non-existent within in-game real lore. As a Vorthosian myself I'm perfectly cool with it.

    This is simply an element that is not substractive, but addictive to the game, and therefore, making in more richer and makes happy anybody that loves their favorite IP portrait officially as magic cards.
    Posted in: The Rumor Mill
  • posted a message on on MTGO........ The errata update we all been waiting for....Phyrexian Creature type update (added text version of cards)
    The rules said that. Every version of a black-bordered card with a specific name is treated as identical to each other version (with the official text coming from Gatherer). You can't have two different versions of a card with the exact same name (again, in black border).


    Im afraid you misunderstood the sense of my question. Obviously mechanically every card with the same name must be the same gameplay wise, but that doesn't mean that flavorfully could not be different, and actually, the Paladins cases, show indeed that the logic of "flavorfully phyrexian in one printing, flavorfully phyrexian in all past printings" is indeed wrong, so WotC actually proved that they really arent that strict on that criteria.


    EDIT: Another perfect case to make the Sphinx Phyrexian : Wurmcoil Engine . It was errated as phyrexian and yet, exactly as the Sphinx case, it got a masterpiece reprint in a world that technically shouldn't have phyrexians, like Kaladesh. All this proves that the argument "flavorfully phyrexian in one printing, flavorfully phyrexian in all printings" doesn't hold water and completely fall apart on front of the objective facts that WotC did.
    Posted in: The Rumor Mill
  • posted a message on on MTGO........ The errata update we all been waiting for....Phyrexian Creature type update (added text version of cards)
    you need to accept that some decisions are actually made for your benefit


    Maybe you should realize that WotC is not some infallible institution, but that errors can be made and the Sphinx case is one of them (and Witch Engine is another cases that prove indeed this errata list have fallacies), and errors shouldn't be justified, but reported to be fixed.

    con sphinx is highly played. limiting it to just masters style sets, and phyrexian oriented sets, actually scums you - the player.


    Dude, in over a decade of Sphinx reprints, only 1 of those times (Amonkhet promo) was reprinted in a standard legal set, and still wasn't standard legal and extremely rare to find. So, facts over 10 years of reprinting proved that Phyrexian or not, that would change absolutely almost nothing on the life of standard players. As phyrexian it can still be reprinted in practically every supplemental sets you can think of - a Commander precon, Conspiracy, Jumpstart, Historic Anthology or anything you can think of, not only "masters" sets, and being very avaialble to players, both papers and online.

    See Mirari's Wake, another mythic with relevant power level in EDH card that for flavor reason will never appear in a standard set ever again, and still was reprinted many times to be easily available for casual players too. Saying that Sphinx shouldn't be phyrexian to be more easily printed for standard is just a silly excuse and fact proves otherwise.


    there has been zero link between phyrexia and amonkhet. that is a big stretch right now, on top of that a big part of amonkhet's lore would indeed link directly to making a sphinx sacred - ie consecrated. they do not have to be mutually exclusive with phyrexian. i'm not sure you're seeing how easily not linking that creature type to it lends it to being reprinted anywhere it fits without having to make leaps in story. if you make it phyrexian, any plane it appears on now has direct ties to phyrexia that you have to explain.


    Repetita Juvant:

    2) Who ever said Amonkeht Sphinx necessairly must have story implications? Who ever said the creature type errata of one card must have a retro-active retcon of every single past print of that card? Paladins example shows exactly why forcing a retroactive flavor to every single printing just doesn't make sense (and I'm sure it's not the only case, but that's the most blatant and fitting with the Sphinx case I can think of).
    MaRo just admit lately in his blog that WotC planned to make the phyrexia errata only after they created the new Vorinclex. Which means that when they made the Amonkhet Sphinx in their mind that card was simply a Sphinx with a generic name that could fit in every single plane of the multiverse, generic exactly like something thing called Eastern or Western Paladin.

    So, that Amonkhet Sphinx is just still a sphinx. there is no issue at all. The special promo printed card will always have simply the word "sphinx" for those maniacal vorthosian purists.

    But the same maniacal vorthosian purists should explain me how it is acceptable to not have the Sphinx errata as Phyrexian just because of some very special reprints of that card, and at the same time they don't mind to have the original "Blessed by the hands of Jin-Gitaxias" that got a phyrexian watermark with very compleated appereance, not being phyrexian at all.

    Posted in: The Rumor Mill
  • posted a message on on MTGO........ The errata update we all been waiting for....Phyrexian Creature type update (added text version of cards)
    it's a sphinx, that's been made sacred, and specific to the plane of mirrodin also been compleated. it shouldn't get the phyrxian update because it would then mean every consecrated sphinx everywhere is a phyrexian one.


    Well, with the same argument we could say that "Nested Ghoul" it's a perfectly generic name that could fit in many places of the multiverse, but, guess what? It is phyrexian, so yeah, you must either sacrifice flavor (no Nested Ghouls in Innistrad or whatever place you like) or gameplay possibilities (adding simply the word "phyrexian" to the line doesn't substract absolutely nothing in terms of gameplay, au contraire, it opens new rooms for new potential synergies between cards). That's why I said that WotC from two fails should had choosen the lesser evil, which is in this case, making the Sphinx phyrexian for gameplay reasons and would be still be a good compromise for the maniacal vorthosian purists since the Amonkhet Sphinx will always have forever only the word "Sphinx" in her printed creature line.

    it's a sphinx, that's been made sacred, and specific to the plane of mirrodin also been compleated.


    And that is not and will never be phyrexian. What a flavor win, right? It's incredible how some vorthosian purists have this cognitive dissonance of not accepting that Amonkhet Sphinx could maybe be phyrexian, but have absolutely no problem to have the Jin-Gitaxias masterpiece as not phyrexian at all. From a flavor viewpoint it's a total failure in exactly both cases (I would argue that flavorwise the current solution it's even worse, because if it's still possible that maybe there's a chance for the Amonkhet Sphinx to be phyrexian, but in the other hand it's for sure 100% wrong with no flavor excuses whatsoever that the mirrodian sphinx shouldn't be phyrexianized).

    pretty simple. get over it.


    No, sorry but I won't accept it and neither get over it. Thank god in EDH rule zero is a thing and most people have more sense into them than whoever incompetent at wotc made this phyrexian update. All shall be one!
    Posted in: The Rumor Mill
  • posted a message on Secret Lair: Stranger Things
    Quote from boombox_smk »
    I'm 100% excited for this crossover. Stranger Things might not be your cup of tea, but it's a nostalgic throwback to the 80's. Believe it or not, older millennials like myself also are a demographic with spendable money. It's also got some light horror elements. It's an ongoing mystery and it was designed from the beginning to have a finite run. The creators have a full vision for the show. Also, not to spoil the show, but Will also has some funky stuff going on in terms of supernatural things, and another character later on is a host to evil. It's not that much different than Innistrad, to be honest. Sounds weird mad scientists, horror elements, and monsters. If random humans on Ravnica can be magical, then this is no different. If there are infinite universes in Magic, there is bound to be one more modern that castle, castle, dragon. It's fine and it's supplemental. If you don't like it, don't buy it. The local card shop I play in, a lot of EDH players use proxies and alters with impossibly-endowed anime women on them. I'd much rather play with professionally-made cards depicting Stranger Things characters than sitting across from people with their poorly-stickered or painted waifus. There's no reason to get in a huff about it. You aren't forced to buy it.



    And even in the case they are "forced" to play, say because they become playable staples of any format, they can still alter-art to anything they wish to their beloved pure fantasy IP. Tournaments allow that.
    Posted in: The Rumor Mill
  • posted a message on Secret Lair: Stranger Things
    Quote from Morphling »
    Magic will surely survive this. Maybe some of you won't, but, to be clear, Magic will probably survive that too. (Believe it or not, so will you.)

    Anyone complaining these don't belong in Magic is hanging on way too tightly. Anyone complaining these drive Magic to an unaffordable place probably hasn't been playing Magic very long, tbh.

    While I respect other folks' viewpoints and personal taste, I am unconvinced these are some horrible thing that simply should not exist. arms crossed


    Wisest words of the entire thread.
    Posted in: The Rumor Mill
  • posted a message on Secret Lair: Stranger Things
    This is an interesting argument, if we go by the "near 30 years ago they did this a couple of times" you could use that same argument for giving blue burn again, land destruction or damage prevention.


    Weird thing I know, but, things changes, and not only changes, sometimes reverts too ( * pikachu surprised face meme * )
    Alpha Lighting Bolt printed text : "Lightning Bolt deals 3 damage to one target."
    Almost every other printing in Magic History till Dominaria : "Lighting Bolt deals 3 damage to target creature or player."
    Current Bolt oracle text: "Lightning Bolt deals 3 damage to any target."
    Very similar, right? But wait, there's more

    Storm, dredge, affinity. For years WotC tought were mechanics so broken that should never appear again, because they are too harmful for the game, conceptually an error to not repeat again. And yet now appears recently in supplemental sets like Commander or Modern Horizon. Or crazy broken stuff like Channel or Tainted Pact being legal in formats like historic!

    Time Vault. A card that since the beginning of the game was planned to be broken and that could work with alpha printing Twiddle. For over a decade WotC tought that card should have an errata that couldn't work with any card that could untaps artifacts. Then, they changed their idea again, and decided to give the original intended function, despite being completely broken and making the card spike in price again of thousands of dollars.

    Books! Magic lore started with books. Then, for a long while, WotC tought "screw books, our uncharted realms and planeswalker guides articles will be more than enough", and now magic books are returning again.

    Core Sets! Core Sets were a part of Magic since the first alpha printing. Then WotC tought "Wait, Core Sets are not a good thing anymore, we don't need them", and didnt use them for years. Turn out they changed their idea again and now Core Sets are again a staple in magic products.

    Chaos Warp! Since the beginning, Mark Rosewater said it was a color pie error that should never be supported again, in no way red should be able to get rid of enchantments no matter the drawback. Well guess what, since those words Chaos Warp was printed 14 times, and now thanks to the mystical strixhaven reprint is even legal to the historic format too!
    https://scryfall.com/search?as=grid&order=released&q=!"Chaos Warp" include:extras&unique=prints

    I could continue forever, but those are all examples that proves the logical fallacy of who think that once Wizard from A turns to B, should never go back A again, because A was an ontological failure while B the illuminated progression. Sometimes this is true, other times it isn't. So it perfectly legit to claim P3K and Arabian Nights as precedents of UB, because now WotC realize that Magic Sets with no Magic IP could, in fact, be good for the game, and not only because in any case gameplay in the end trumps flavor, but that many maigc players enjoy crossovers and flavor familiar with the others IP they love and that most players, except the famous "maniacal vorthosian purists" don't mind to play their Magic IP cards along with Non-Magic IP cards together or against (and I speak as vorthos myself!)
    Posted in: The Rumor Mill
  • posted a message on on MTGO........ The errata update we all been waiting for....Phyrexian Creature type update (added text version of cards)
    those 2 paladins even in their “odd” printing can and fit the phyrexian creature type, not only in lore (Sleeper Agent)


    The Paladins of 7th edition are not Sleeper Agents. They have their own specific lore and history that has literally nothing to do with their omonimous phyrexian printing and simply because phyrexian creature type wasn't a thing yet and so WotC didn't care at all to make originally phyrexian cards with non-phyrexian flavor, which, guess what it is? Yes, same exact case of the Consecrated Sphinx, but reversed!

    Within its art and flavor text, the set narrates events of a war between two bands led by the Northern Paladin and Southern Paladin versus the Eastern Paladin and the Western Paladin. All four of the paladins have a missing eye. When someone is 'confirmed' as a paladin he trades one of his eyes for a magical gemstone which increases his spell casting ability (see Infernal Contract, Grapeshot Catapult, and Oppression for examples of the replaced eye).
    https://mtg.fandom.com/wiki/Seventh_Edition#cite_note-Different-2

    Mark, why the Seventh Edition is so different from the others? It has a lore of paladins war and a totally distinct art style

    We decided to give Seventh Edition all new art and a light story. It didn’t work out too well. People like recognizing cards by art and the story was not enough for people to get.

    https://markrosewater.tumblr.com/post/167236708478/mark-why-the-seventh-edition-is-so-different-from

    From Brandon Bozzi, creative administrator:
    "Actually, all four of the paladins have a missing eye. In the Seventh Edition backstory, when someone is 'confirmed' as a paladin he trades one of his eyes for a magical gemstone which increases his spell casting ability. Take a look at Infernal Contract, Grapeshot Catapult, and Oppression for other examples of the replaced eye."

    https://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/ask-wizards-july-2002-2002-07-01


    Now, the Paladins are currently "Phyrexian" and "Zombies" exactly and exclusively because of their Alpha printing, in which their are effectively phyrexian skeletons. That's why they should had to do the same treatment to the Sphinx, because her alpha printing is extremely relevant case, either in lore ("blessed from the hands of Gitaxias", so a masterpiece of compleated creatures among phyrexians) and gameplay (it is the only creature card in history at that mana cost that could draw you +6 cards per turn in multiplayer EDH by doing absolutely nothing after casting it)
    Posted in: The Rumor Mill
  • posted a message on on MTGO........ The errata update we all been waiting for....Phyrexian Creature type update (added text version of cards)
    Dear leslak, you can going around in circle as you wish, but no flavor explanation can justify why the original Consecrated Sphinx from Mirrodin Beseiged shouldn't be a Phyrexian. Either if you make the Sphinx phyrexian or not, it's still troublesome flavorwise (because it is both unacceptable that Amonkhet Sphinx is phyrexian exactly as it is unacceptable that the "blessed from the hand of Gitaxias" is not phyrexian), but from a gameplay persepctive only missing the Sphinx from being phyrexian is a worse choice in terms of future deckbuildings. So, since both the vorthosian solutions are still a fail flavorwise, if you see it from the maniacal purism viewpoint, from 2 fails WotC should had choosed the one less harmful for the Magic gameplay, which is making the Sphinx phyrexian. Now it's gonna be a pain to explain to players why their phyrexianized watermarked Sphinx is the only one not phyrexian in whole Mirrodin block just because of some rare and random printings completely irrelevant plotwise, in the hand of very few people.

    I don’t care about the Sphynx


    You don't make statistics. The fact that you personally don't care about the Sphinx doesn't mean other people in the world don't care (and as you can see, I'm the living example this is true). The world doesn't revolve around you my dear.
    Posted in: The Rumor Mill
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