I have been playing legacy eldrazi for about three months and have not been disappointed. I play a splash white version with displacers. i like the displacers a lot but i dont play wastlands main because i need the caves of koilos for the white. I have been thinking of running straight colorless and ditching the white (making it possible to put the wastelands in). I have also been considering tomb of the spirit dragon as a one-of. what are your thoughts?
I think if you're playing this deck you need Wasteland access even if you're running white. There's a list on the primer for D&T Eldrazi which is decent to reference. The format is so reliant on mana, especially a deck like this, and full of problematic lands that it's warranted. I'm of the idea that even if your opponent wastelands you it benefits you to have the ability to wasteland them back just to retain some hold on the game without falling too far behind. Since playing Eldrazi in modern I can attest that the painlands are very valuable but I would try and work them in together. Tomb seems kinda slow but after losing hard to a burn deck the other night I'd say if you can fit it it could be fringe-good.
Thanks @Wildfire393 for the primer update btw, it looks great and looking forward to seeing it evolve. Praise the spaghetti!
Hangarback seems meh to me, it's a good mana sink but why play a creature that isn't an eldrazi/revoker? I feel the list is a bit tight to warrant his inclusion but if you find he works please post on it.
After some playtesting around my main things to figure out with this deck are:
- The number of Jittes to spread between the main and sideboard
- The number of Endbringers to split between the main and sideboard (I find the card is a great catch-all answer to random problem creatures in the format and wouldn't leave home without at least one)
- If Urborg is at all worthwhile in reality. I went down to one from two and haven't missed it. It's a nice bonus when I happen to draw it and gives me options but I rarely ever "need" it.
Also new to the legacy scene and trying out this deck. About 8/9 cards away from completion but I'm finding it a lot of fun. I wish it was a bit more interactive at times and a little less reliant on hoser-artifacts. I'm used to modern where I can keep a hand with an eldrazi-curve but am quickly realizing that's almost never a keep-able hand.
I've tested a bit against D&T, Miracles, Grixis Delver, and UB Reanimator. D&T feels 40/60%, their ability to tax seems a bit stronger than ours and we're a bit more reliant on our lands. It is hilarious that Mom is pretty much useless. Miracles felt more 60/40, I think it depends on the playing level of your opponent. Just try to disrupt the lock and you should be ok. Delver felt fine, it's pretty much what this deck is supposed to beat. Land the tax-artifacts and you should be in the clear if they hit. Reanimator is 50/50 depending on if you're going first. Landing a chalice on one is great but it's incredibly difficult to deal with a Griselbrand or Tidespout Tyrant. Of note: Endbringer pulled serious work in one game for me as I ensured Griselbrand could never attack or block and was able to slowly win that way.
@Kaiyla_Han Good luck with the event! Please post how it goes and how the deck runs.
How's the Mox Diamonds treating you? From what I've heard, they were a no go in Legacy Eldrazi. My list looks fairly similar on the other hand.
They're hit or miss right now to be honest. There are some hands where they give you the necessary acceleration to drop what you need, they also make better hands of those with multiple Eye of Ugins. However, they are terrible to draw later and aren't always getting you any further than your current sol lands. They are however the only way to get a turn 2 smasher which is pretty nice when the stars align.
Also new to the legacy scene and trying out this deck. About 8/9 cards away from completion but I'm finding it a lot of fun. I wish it was a bit more interactive at times and a little less reliant on hoser-artifacts. I'm used to modern where I can keep a hand with an eldrazi-curve but am quickly realizing that's almost never a keep-able hand.
I've tested a bit against D&T, Miracles, Grixis Delver, and UB Reanimator. D&T feels 40/60%, their ability to tax seems a bit stronger than ours and we're a bit more reliant on our lands. It is hilarious that Mom is pretty much useless. Miracles felt more 60/40, I think it depends on the playing level of your opponent. Just try to disrupt the lock and you should be ok. Delver felt fine, it's pretty much what this deck is supposed to beat. Land the tax-artifacts and you should be in the clear if they hit. Reanimator is 50/50 depending on if you're going first. Landing a chalice on one is great but it's incredibly difficult to deal with a Griselbrand or Tidespout Tyrant. Of note: Endbringer pulled serious work in one game for me as I ensured Griselbrand could never attack or block and was able to slowly win that way.
Pretty sure you want Goyf in this deck. The BG Eldrazi decks popping up with Lili and Stirrings all play him.
i tested a version which ran 4x ancient stirrings and 4x goyf as well as the more aggro eldrazi creatures.
it was great fun. needs a tweak but definitely competitive. can keep a wide range of opening hands as well which is a weakness of the other eldrazi decks.
realistically, the deck could stretch to Liliana of the Veil as well, and matter reshaper into her is unreal.
I actually did run it before the current list but honestly goyf just didn't synergize well unless you were matter-reshapering into it (which you have nom control over). I found I'd far rather play any eldrazi than play a goyf so he ended up coming out for the mimics. But we'll see, he may end up back in in place of some non-eldrazi spells. I did in fact once reshaper a Lilly and it was the closest I'll ever get to playing Bloodbraid elf in modern haha.
I have a lot of fun playing eldrazi, and I do think something needs to be done about it though I hope it doesn't just straight up die. It's toeing a fine line between Eye and Temple. If you ban Eye the deck probably immediately drops to tier 2 but is still viable. However, you end up slightly negatively impacting the trons (sure they don't NEED it but it's always been a good card to have to ensure an end game). If you ban temple you straight up slaughter the deck, whether or not that should be done I'm not able to say.
As far as the sideboard hate against eldrazi I see many people just all over the map on what to suggest. Is it possible to beat eldrazi? YES. But the silver bullets are not all that great. Ensnaring Bridge gets thrown all over, but is that really going to stop eldrazi? The deck can splash literally any color and Nature's Claim seems pretty good then. I've been arguing that modern needs to be playing more sweepers for years, that is extraordinarily powerful against the deck and sets them back a ton. But again, it's not going to do much if TKS has ripped your hand right apart.
TL;DR I have no idea what is going to happen with this deck, but it's not going to be around in its current state for long. That much is for sure.
Went undefeated at FNM.
Beat (in order):
Jund 2-0:
good opener in game 1 (start the night well). Games were grindy and my threats died. Had no real chance of winning except for topdecking my 1x Sea Gate Wreckage and proceeded to draw two cards a turn, quickly grinding my way to a threat-dense win both times. Why is nobody running this card?
CoCo allies, 2-1:
Got smashed game 1. Very synergistic. He was running the blue mill ally and it took me apart with multiple triggers. He also pathed my threats.
Games 2 and 3 were grindy midrange fests but i had brought in my "top end" package and eventually cast All is Dust for the win.
Round 3. Burn, 2-0
The deck felt really powerful here. I don't think there's a consistent way for the burn deck to win. This is why the Eldrazi deck was built this way, it's an aggro killer.
Round 4: affinity 2-1:
All three games were intense and full of crazy resource management and trades. Really tough but i eventually won through with a well-timed Dismember in response to an arcbound ravager activation. My big break was topdecking pithing needle and naming cranial plating. Chalice was great.
And that was that. The deck felt like a run of the mill stompy deck apart from when I played burn. At that moment, it all made sense and chalice basically won the game. That's the reason you play this deck: to crush the 1-mana-heavy aggro decks.
Cards of note:
1x Seagate Wreckage maindeck. (won two games off the back of this. Absolutely unreal. EoT draw, untap draw, play two threats. One eats removal who cares; EoT draw, untap draw etc.). Singlehandedly turned around a losing prospect against jund.
Seriously everyone needs one.
2x damping matrix. Sideboard
Seemed like a shot in the dark but came up trumps from the side. Really good against a wide variety of things.
1x Ulamog, 1x sower, 1x conduit, 1x All is Dust in the side. This was my "going big" package and I'd advocate going this way (remember I've got a single sower in the main). Ulamog needs to be in the side for sure. You gain too much value it's a mistake to not have the option to go big in grindy games. You only need to look at protour footage to see a singleton ulamog would have been insane a lot of the time.
Also I dropped down to 1 spellskite main and stuck in a single maindeck oblivion sower. Made the difference a few times as the deck often runs out of steam and needs a big fatty to drop sometimes. Having the one maindeck is a nice safety valve but the curve needs to be quite low so I'd advocate sticking with one. Spellskite seems kinda weak maindeck if you've got more than one.
Ratchet bomb stayed in my hand almost every time I drew it, but in a couple of games it made the difference between a win and a loss. I'm 50/50 on the card but for the moment it can stay as a 2-of.
Pithing needle sideboard is essential. Go up to three if you have to. Needle and chalice against affinity gives you a solid matchup. Name cranial plating followed by arcbound ravager.
It's going to suffer against decks packing stuff like remand and strong removal. It seemed on the face of it like we are really soft to the uninteractive combo (ad nauseam) side of things, and the late-game side of things. Wrath spells are a kicking for us, because we are mostly forced to go wide a bit like a big affinity deck.
Nice write up man and congrats on the record. It really saddens me that my time with this deck is probably limited but it is damn fun to play. I also went 4-0 undefeated yesterday but against a much different field as you'll see. All decks were pretty competitively built despite not being tier 1.
I fully concede that my list is not 100% optimized but it still runs quite well and is stupidly explosive at times while being able to go the late game better than most midrange decks.
My matches were:
UB Mill: 2-1
In the game I lost the library burn was just really fast. Made me wish I packed one of the eldrazi titans of old. Also helped that the guy didn't draw a piece of removal in any game. Brought in Nihil Spellbombs to turn off his snapcasters from recurring glimpse the unthinkables and chalice on one to turn off a lot of other things. All in all ripping apart his hand with huge bodies paved the way to victory (when wouldn't it?).
Mono-R Goblins: 2-1
I feel like burn is better in general, but also better against this deck where I can also pump out creatures pretty fast but mine will often trade and live. This deck can be surprisingly explosive at times, it's nothing to scoff at to see Foundry Street Denizen swing in for a crazy amount of damage. Feed the clans did work since ferocious can almost always be turned on.
Mono-R Goblins: 2-1
Yup, again. Though this time I was able to play an Overgrown Tomb, laugh as my opponent played Blood Moon, float a green and Nature's Claim it. Claim is one of the main reasons for me going into Green apart from Stirrings and Feed the clan. Say what you want but a blood moon in the past has made the games borderline unplayable for me unless you happened to get a Wastes.
Taking Turns: 2-0
I've never beaten this deck in the past, and when i was playing BW<> I handily lost everytime. The longer the game goes the closer they probably get to "going off" and never giving you another turn. Again, Nature's Claiming proved huge on a Dictate of Kruphix which is the key card to make sure their deck never runs out of gas. Backed up by timely discard and Liliana I was finally able to take down this menace which seriously packs more punch than you would think. Gigadrowse is bonkers in the right deck like this one.
Has Ruin Processor really been that great for you guys? I see it in a number of sideboards, mainly the mono-b ones, but it seems so slow to me and of little help once you get to cast it. I've never played with it so I can't attest to it's efficiency, I just know in BW there's of course life gain options and still there are artifact ones available to all other builds (Dragon's Claw, Sun Droplet). Depending on your build, burn may or may not bring in Destructive Revelry but anyways, what are the thoughts?
Other note, are that many builds trying out Matter Reshaper? I haven't tested enough to figure out the optimal list for it. It might be BG, but I like the idea of a body with built in value and death-deterrent.
Side note: I'm loving Warping Wail in this deck. Even without the presence of Twin for mode 1, the other modes are still crazy valuable. Whether it's ensuring you land a Thought-Knot the next turn, countering plenty of relevant targets, or exile I haven't yet been disappointed with running it as a 2-of, maybe even going up to 3.
The card I'm not a big fan of at the moment is Wasteland Strangler. Got done playing a few games and that card is nice as a 3/2 beater, but rarely does it's processor ability really help a lot. It's like either there isn't anything in exile when I have to make the play, or there are things out, but using it's ability just gets in the way of blight herder or doesn't do enough.
Sometimes its just a 3/2, but sometimes it helps me kill: Bob, Etched Champion, Signal Pest, Goblin Guide, Swiftspear, Eidolon of the Great Revel, etc. I won't say it's always incredible, but it has some amazing application and I can't see going below 3 in a list.
My build at least, is incredibly competitive. It's a well oiled machine for sure. Just make sure you have multiple outs for winning. As much as I hate Exsanguinate with Cabal Coffers+Thespian's Stage+Urborg, I may end up adding that combo in as a backup plan.
Been wanting to build a Meren deck, this thread is a great read! I have a fair few of the cards in your lists actually, would just need to supplement/build on it a bit. How are you finding the playability of the list you're running?
It's a bit slow at the moment, so it can fall behind pretty easily if I don't get a good start. I'm looking in to upping my ramp a bit, likely with Golgari Signet and possibly Mana Crypt (I'll have to decide if I want to move it from the deck it's currently in), and maybe even a card or two more after that, depending on whether or not the new mulligan rules slowed the rest of my group down. If I can fix that problem, it's a super solid list, however.
I've found ramp to be crucial in a competitive meta. You get way too far behind, Meren is super powerful but super grindy. Your value comes from turn-to-turn plays and not as usually the explosive ones EDH is known for. Meren builds seem to more closely resemble well-oiled machines but if a cog gets thrown in them they fall behind. I've added mana dorks to the mix to pump out an early Meren, plus they're fine to sac since they can come right back. I cannot stress enough how good Devoted Druid is for this deck.
First report with BW Eldrazi, wasn't playing with any OGW cards yet and now that I'm getting some I will definitely be tweaking the deck. But here goes:
Pretty wacky games, a lot of back and forth interaction. But the MB grave hate was a huge boon and kept his deck in check. Both games I was able to land sowers and eventually search up and cast Ulamog to get in there for the win. Game 2 he sided in Lingering Souls and brought me down to TWO LIFE and I was able to claw my back out. He also used Secure the Wastes and this game alone made me a believer in Blight Herder where before I was on the fence about his worth.
Game 2: Jund
Win: 2-1
Played against this guy a lot, good friend. I love games where you can play fast because you just know what you're doing. I play jund a lot myself so we were both eager to see if this was as one-sided as everyone on these forums says. I will say this: It's certainly in our favor but you definitely still need to work for it. Junds ability to go T1 discard into T3 Fulminator Mage (a lot of people are running Fulmy mb now) can definitely keep this deck in check. We tended to have very back and forth games but this decks top decks tend to be more powerful than Junds. Blight Herder is also very strong here where Lilly becomes worse and you can gain time.
Game 3: Aggro Slivers
Win: 2-1
I know, slivers. You may not think its competitive but you would be surprised, this deck takes down a lot of games at our shop because for whatever reason modern players tend to not see the value in running board wipes. That being said, the game came down to whether or not I drew an All is Dust and cast it. In Game 3 it came down to a lethal turn with the wipe in my hand and I drew the Urborg I needed to cast it. I don't feel this deck has a particularly horrid aggro matchup since it can sort of meet the opposition midway if you have timely discard and spot removal into a wipe.
Game 4: 4 Days Undoing Affinity
Loss: 0-2
Games were fun, but affinity went a little to fast in each of them. I've played against it a number of times and my win percentage is about half and half. Things that are great include: Strangling an Etched Champion, blocking an Etched Champion, Sowering Blinkmoths/Inkmoths to your side for flying blockers. Things that aren't so great include: Mainboard All is Dust and Go for the Throats (lols).
In general really enjoying the deck, I don't think its bonkers but I could see an argument for Eye of Ugin being banned one day. I have Thought-Knot Seers and Matter Reshapers in bound and I'm strongly considering the mono-black build. I think the mana in this deck is ok but it could be a lot smoother and the OGW cards are very interesting and powerful for this. I also like the idea of running a playset of Ghost Quarters and some amount of Tectonic Edges mb so I don't even have to slot land-hate in the side. Whether or not Heartless Summoning makes it in remains to be seen for me, the card seems good but my issue is it's ALWAYS been good, but never quite been "there." Perhaps this is the deck for it but it just seems like a fragile enabler to me right now.
Looking forward to seeing this deck's future, it's definitely got the ability to rumble with the best of them!
I'm sure it's been discussed enough but a Leyline of Sanctity is a huge detriment to this deck. I couldn't use discard (which the deck heavily relies on in the early game) nor could I use my spellbombs or half of my relics. It also shuts down the cast effect of sower and all processing. Very powerful, the deck ends up just playing big vanilla creatures.
However, what do you guys think of the new "green ponder" aka Oath of Nissa? In Bob-less Junk this may be a good option for filtering for the Lilly/Rhino/Tasigur/Finks you need or the land drop you missed. Worth exploring potentially.
I don't think we want this. We need to trust our top decks and we do play a lot of instants and sorceries (discard, souls, removal), and we really can't afford this to whiff. I think it's more for decks that struggle with consistency. I can definately see this being played in those green devotion decks.
Nissa doesn't seem like a card Junk would want to play. Not just that it would have problems with consistency but it's also (imo even bigger) a problem that it plays a lot of instants and sorceries which Oath of Nissa can't find and this makes it worse. It also can't find some of the best sb cards (read Stony Silence). Junk simply relies too much on cards that Oath of Nissa can't find, especially from sb.
I can see that, but you could also argue that now you have an easy card to side out when you want to bring those in without diluting the deck. I may be on the hype train, but I think this card has potential even if its not an all star. Fixing for Lilly is strong, making a sorin or Elspeth, Knight-Errant more playable MB is strong as well.
However, what do you guys think of the new "green ponder" aka Oath of Nissa? In Bob-less Junk this may be a good option for filtering for the Lilly/Rhino/Tasigur/Finks you need or the land drop you missed. Worth exploring potentially.
I don't think we want this. We need to trust our top decks and we do play a lot of instants and sorceries (discard, souls, removal), and we really can't afford this to whiff. I think it's more for decks that struggle with consistency. I can definately see this being played in those green devotion decks.
I'm confused, this helps your top decks by allowing you to look at three cards instead of one (four if you include the draw you have into Oath). And at the late point in the game it shouldn't matter to pay one green to find a 2-4 mana spell and still be able to cast it. I'm still not sold on it entirely, but I do think that it can be the flex spot that still hangs in the air for those not running Bob, for a while I tried Courser of Kruphix and it was subpar. Thanks for the response though.
Favorite Magic card ever? Hands down it was Spiritmonger. I started playing during Apocalypse and god this card was awesome. It was a huge beater, encompassed my two favorite colors, and had three abilities to boot. Of course the game has sped up since, but even knowing that the card still is pretty good for casual and EDH games. I have a general rule for great creatures and it's that they meet the 3+ "line" criteria. Examples? Deathrite Shaman (RIP in modern), the Lieges, Olivia Voldaren, Ethersworn Adjudicator to name a few. All great cards that pack ridiculous amounts of value when they hit the field. Spiritmonger was the granddaddy of all that.
I think if you're playing this deck you need Wasteland access even if you're running white. There's a list on the primer for D&T Eldrazi which is decent to reference. The format is so reliant on mana, especially a deck like this, and full of problematic lands that it's warranted. I'm of the idea that even if your opponent wastelands you it benefits you to have the ability to wasteland them back just to retain some hold on the game without falling too far behind. Since playing Eldrazi in modern I can attest that the painlands are very valuable but I would try and work them in together. Tomb seems kinda slow but after losing hard to a burn deck the other night I'd say if you can fit it it could be fringe-good.
Thanks @Wildfire393 for the primer update btw, it looks great and looking forward to seeing it evolve. Praise the spaghetti!
After some playtesting around my main things to figure out with this deck are:
- The number of Jittes to spread between the main and sideboard
- The number of Endbringers to split between the main and sideboard (I find the card is a great catch-all answer to random problem creatures in the format and wouldn't leave home without at least one)
- If Urborg is at all worthwhile in reality. I went down to one from two and haven't missed it. It's a nice bonus when I happen to draw it and gives me options but I rarely ever "need" it.
How has everyone else been faring?
They're hit or miss right now to be honest. There are some hands where they give you the necessary acceleration to drop what you need, they also make better hands of those with multiple Eye of Ugins. However, they are terrible to draw later and aren't always getting you any further than your current sol lands. They are however the only way to get a turn 2 smasher which is pretty nice when the stars align.
I've tested a bit against D&T, Miracles, Grixis Delver, and UB Reanimator. D&T feels 40/60%, their ability to tax seems a bit stronger than ours and we're a bit more reliant on our lands. It is hilarious that Mom is pretty much useless. Miracles felt more 60/40, I think it depends on the playing level of your opponent. Just try to disrupt the lock and you should be ok. Delver felt fine, it's pretty much what this deck is supposed to beat. Land the tax-artifacts and you should be in the clear if they hit. Reanimator is 50/50 depending on if you're going first. Landing a chalice on one is great but it's incredibly difficult to deal with a Griselbrand or Tidespout Tyrant. Of note: Endbringer pulled serious work in one game for me as I ensured Griselbrand could never attack or block and was able to slowly win that way.
Here is my list for reference:
4x Ancient Tomb
3x Cavern of Souls
3x City of Traitors
4x Eldrazi Temple
3x Eye of Ugin
2x Mishra's Factory
2x Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
3x Wasteland
Instant (4)
2x Dismember
2x Warping Wail
1x Endbringer
4x Endless One
4x Matter Reshaper
4x Reality Smasher
4x Thought-Knot Seer
Artifact (11)
4x Chalice of the Void
2x Mox Diamond
3x Thorn of Amethyst
2x Umezawa's Jitte
1x Endbringer
2x Faerie Macabre
4x Phyrexian Revoker
2x Ratchet Bomb
1x Sphere of Resistance
2x Tormod's Crypt
1x Warping Wail
2x Winter Orb
@Kaiyla_Han Good luck with the event! Please post how it goes and how the deck runs.
I actually did run it before the current list but honestly goyf just didn't synergize well unless you were matter-reshapering into it (which you have nom control over). I found I'd far rather play any eldrazi than play a goyf so he ended up coming out for the mimics. But we'll see, he may end up back in in place of some non-eldrazi spells. I did in fact once reshaper a Lilly and it was the closest I'll ever get to playing Bloodbraid elf in modern haha.
As far as the sideboard hate against eldrazi I see many people just all over the map on what to suggest. Is it possible to beat eldrazi? YES. But the silver bullets are not all that great. Ensnaring Bridge gets thrown all over, but is that really going to stop eldrazi? The deck can splash literally any color and Nature's Claim seems pretty good then. I've been arguing that modern needs to be playing more sweepers for years, that is extraordinarily powerful against the deck and sets them back a ton. But again, it's not going to do much if TKS has ripped your hand right apart.
TL;DR I have no idea what is going to happen with this deck, but it's not going to be around in its current state for long. That much is for sure.
Nice write up man and congrats on the record. It really saddens me that my time with this deck is probably limited but it is damn fun to play. I also went 4-0 undefeated yesterday but against a much different field as you'll see. All decks were pretty competitively built despite not being tier 1.
1x Cavern of Souls
4x Eldrazi Temple
2x Eye of Ugin
1x Forest
3x Ghost Quarter
1x Llanowar Wastes
1x Overgrown Tomb
2x Swamp
3x Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
3x Verdant Catacombs
2x Wastes
Planeswalker (3)
3x Liliana of the Veil
1x Conduit of Ruin
4x Eldrazi Mimic
1x Endless One
4x Matter Reshaper
3x Oblivion Sower
4x Reality Smasher
4x Thought-Knot Seer
1x Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger
Sorcery (8)
4x Ancient Stirrings
2x Inquisition of Kozilek
2x Thoughtseize
Instant (4)
2x Dismember
2x Warping Wail
1x All Is Dust
1x Chalice of the Void
1x Damnation
3x Feed the Clan
3x Nature's Claim
2x Nihil Spellbomb
2x Spellskite
1x Surgical Extraction
1x Vampiric Link
I fully concede that my list is not 100% optimized but it still runs quite well and is stupidly explosive at times while being able to go the late game better than most midrange decks.
My matches were:
UB Mill: 2-1
In the game I lost the library burn was just really fast. Made me wish I packed one of the eldrazi titans of old. Also helped that the guy didn't draw a piece of removal in any game. Brought in Nihil Spellbombs to turn off his snapcasters from recurring glimpse the unthinkables and chalice on one to turn off a lot of other things. All in all ripping apart his hand with huge bodies paved the way to victory (when wouldn't it?).
Mono-R Goblins: 2-1
I feel like burn is better in general, but also better against this deck where I can also pump out creatures pretty fast but mine will often trade and live. This deck can be surprisingly explosive at times, it's nothing to scoff at to see Foundry Street Denizen swing in for a crazy amount of damage. Feed the clans did work since ferocious can almost always be turned on.
Mono-R Goblins: 2-1
Yup, again. Though this time I was able to play an Overgrown Tomb, laugh as my opponent played Blood Moon, float a green and Nature's Claim it. Claim is one of the main reasons for me going into Green apart from Stirrings and Feed the clan. Say what you want but a blood moon in the past has made the games borderline unplayable for me unless you happened to get a Wastes.
Taking Turns: 2-0
I've never beaten this deck in the past, and when i was playing BW<> I handily lost everytime. The longer the game goes the closer they probably get to "going off" and never giving you another turn. Again, Nature's Claiming proved huge on a Dictate of Kruphix which is the key card to make sure their deck never runs out of gas. Backed up by timely discard and Liliana I was finally able to take down this menace which seriously packs more punch than you would think. Gigadrowse is bonkers in the right deck like this one.
Other note, are that many builds trying out Matter Reshaper? I haven't tested enough to figure out the optimal list for it. It might be BG, but I like the idea of a body with built in value and death-deterrent.
Side note: I'm loving Warping Wail in this deck. Even without the presence of Twin for mode 1, the other modes are still crazy valuable. Whether it's ensuring you land a Thought-Knot the next turn, countering plenty of relevant targets, or exile I haven't yet been disappointed with running it as a 2-of, maybe even going up to 3.
Sometimes its just a 3/2, but sometimes it helps me kill: Bob, Etched Champion, Signal Pest, Goblin Guide, Swiftspear, Eidolon of the Great Revel, etc. I won't say it's always incredible, but it has some amazing application and I can't see going below 3 in a list.
Mind sharing your list by any chance?
I've found ramp to be crucial in a competitive meta. You get way too far behind, Meren is super powerful but super grindy. Your value comes from turn-to-turn plays and not as usually the explosive ones EDH is known for. Meren builds seem to more closely resemble well-oiled machines but if a cog gets thrown in them they fall behind. I've added mana dorks to the mix to pump out an early Meren, plus they're fine to sac since they can come right back. I cannot stress enough how good Devoted Druid is for this deck.
1x Cavern of Souls
4x Caves of Koilos
4x Eldrazi Temple
2x Eye of Ugin
3x Ghost Quarter
4x Marsh Flats
1x Plains
1x Shambling Vent
2x Swamp
2x Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1x Vault of the Archangel
Creature (14)
4x Blight Herder
1x Conduit of Ruin
4x Oblivion Sower
1x Ulamog, the Ceaseless Hunger
4x Wasteland Strangler
1x All Is Dust
2x Duress
2x Inquisition of Kozilek
1x Thoughtseize
Artifact (9)
3x Expedition Map
2x Nihil Spellbomb
4x Relic of Progenitus
Instant (6)
1x Go for the Throat
4x Path to Exile
1x Utter End
2x Celestial Purge
2x Lingering Souls
2x Memoricide
2x Spellskite
3x Stony Silence
1x Thoughtseize
2x Timely Reinforcements
1x Vampiric Link
Game 1: 4 color Gifts Ungiven
Win: 2-0
Pretty wacky games, a lot of back and forth interaction. But the MB grave hate was a huge boon and kept his deck in check. Both games I was able to land sowers and eventually search up and cast Ulamog to get in there for the win. Game 2 he sided in Lingering Souls and brought me down to TWO LIFE and I was able to claw my back out. He also used Secure the Wastes and this game alone made me a believer in Blight Herder where before I was on the fence about his worth.
Game 2: Jund
Win: 2-1
Played against this guy a lot, good friend. I love games where you can play fast because you just know what you're doing. I play jund a lot myself so we were both eager to see if this was as one-sided as everyone on these forums says. I will say this: It's certainly in our favor but you definitely still need to work for it. Junds ability to go T1 discard into T3 Fulminator Mage (a lot of people are running Fulmy mb now) can definitely keep this deck in check. We tended to have very back and forth games but this decks top decks tend to be more powerful than Junds. Blight Herder is also very strong here where Lilly becomes worse and you can gain time.
Game 3: Aggro Slivers
Win: 2-1
I know, slivers. You may not think its competitive but you would be surprised, this deck takes down a lot of games at our shop because for whatever reason modern players tend to not see the value in running board wipes. That being said, the game came down to whether or not I drew an All is Dust and cast it. In Game 3 it came down to a lethal turn with the wipe in my hand and I drew the Urborg I needed to cast it. I don't feel this deck has a particularly horrid aggro matchup since it can sort of meet the opposition midway if you have timely discard and spot removal into a wipe.
Game 4: 4 Days Undoing Affinity
Loss: 0-2
Games were fun, but affinity went a little to fast in each of them. I've played against it a number of times and my win percentage is about half and half. Things that are great include: Strangling an Etched Champion, blocking an Etched Champion, Sowering Blinkmoths/Inkmoths to your side for flying blockers. Things that aren't so great include: Mainboard All is Dust and Go for the Throats (lols).
In general really enjoying the deck, I don't think its bonkers but I could see an argument for Eye of Ugin being banned one day. I have Thought-Knot Seers and Matter Reshapers in bound and I'm strongly considering the mono-black build. I think the mana in this deck is ok but it could be a lot smoother and the OGW cards are very interesting and powerful for this. I also like the idea of running a playset of Ghost Quarters and some amount of Tectonic Edges mb so I don't even have to slot land-hate in the side. Whether or not Heartless Summoning makes it in remains to be seen for me, the card seems good but my issue is it's ALWAYS been good, but never quite been "there." Perhaps this is the deck for it but it just seems like a fragile enabler to me right now.
Looking forward to seeing this deck's future, it's definitely got the ability to rumble with the best of them!
I can see that, but you could also argue that now you have an easy card to side out when you want to bring those in without diluting the deck. I may be on the hype train, but I think this card has potential even if its not an all star. Fixing for Lilly is strong, making a sorin or Elspeth, Knight-Errant more playable MB is strong as well.
I'm confused, this helps your top decks by allowing you to look at three cards instead of one (four if you include the draw you have into Oath). And at the late point in the game it shouldn't matter to pay one green to find a 2-4 mana spell and still be able to cast it. I'm still not sold on it entirely, but I do think that it can be the flex spot that still hangs in the air for those not running Bob, for a while I tried Courser of Kruphix and it was subpar. Thanks for the response though.