The mirror often turns on the accumulation of minor advantages.
For example-I continue to hit land drop #7 and #8 while my opponent is stuck at 6.
I play Pilfered Plans and go up a card on my opponent (and mill a random counter-spell VALUE).
My opponent lands his Jace, and can protect it with counter magic.
My opponent Thoughtseizes a win con.
All this seems understandable right? But many players seem to make hasty choices while playing the mirror. For example I've had my Pilfered Plans countered much more than my Divination every got countered, why? Because it presents a threat that they weren't thinking about, countering Divination is also a pretty big mistake too, unless you think your opponent missed a land drop, then by all means (if post board).
You can also make judgement calls.
For example in one game I had a hand with two lands, and a Negate, my opponent has 5 cards and had shown 2 Thoughtseize in game one, the board is clean.
I draw Hallowed Fountain and shock myself. I have 8 land in play and pass the turn (representing revelation in hand).
My opponent plays Thoughtseize on his turn, I counter it, he counters my counter, I then show him the two lands.
Why did I make these plays? Think for a bit...
I recommend never Dissolving anything but Aetherlings in Game one (if possible) because if it gets through you will lose and your opponent will wait for a tap out or counter magic backup before casting him.
Take out your Azorius Charms, your sideboard should have enough relevant resources that make A.C. subpar postboard.
Take out a Supreme Verdict for a Merciless Eviction post-board. It keeps a stronger more versatile wraith effect, yes it can be countered but we aren't getting aggro'd by creatures anyway.
Don't be afraid to Revelation for 2, it's perfectly normal. Waiting and doing nothing often puts you behind.
Ultimate Price is a good card in my opinion. Let's skip Esper in this discussion as Esper's creature threats are few and protects themselves well.
I prefer it over Doom Blade, because Ultimate Price has targets in every deck while there are decks where Doom Blade is dead. I run 2 Devour Flesh and 1 Ultimate Price main.
Ultimate Price is much better against Mono Black and Rakdos Haste than Doom Blade (still it is weak against Rakdos Haste but at least kills Tormented Hero and Mogis Marauder). Doom Blade kills only Mutavault in Mono Black. I understand that this is a potent threat because whatever Ultimate Price kills, dies to Verdict anyway, but I still se Ultimate Price as a better card overall.
Obzedat, Alms Beast, Militant, Master of Cruelties, Prophet sees almost no play.
Voice, Loxodon, Fleecmane all play in the same deck that didn't put any bigger results for a long time.
Nightveil, Baron, Cackler and all of Gods can't be hit by Doom Blade either (I see Doom Blade as closest alternative for Ultimate Price).
And BTE is just a 2/2 for 2. Sure it pumps devotion but that's it and I don't see myself in a huge need of killing BTE. Reckoner is 3/3 for 3 that is bad against our Barons.
To sum up - if I want point creature removal, I value Ultimate Price higher than Doom Blade. There is only one really problematic creature that gets hit by Doom Blade which is Mutavault and that's it. I think that golem tokens may be a problem too, but I played too few games against decks using Hammer of Purphoros to really get a solid opinion on this.
Our experiences are shaped from different experiences. I've yet to (in over hundreds of games) faced the GP version of haste Rakdos) I've faced Selesnya aggro, in two GP's and many times online. My local meta also has two strong players that love to jam Voice and the Lion.
Ultimate Price in my hand usually kills me against a lot of things. I consider it much worse than Doom Blade because if I want I can always compliment it in the sideboard with Dark Betrayal, that covers all the bases.
Mutavault, Nightveil specter and Boros Reckoner are important problems to deal with at the moment.
I fluctuate between different builds but the one posted in OP may serve as a most base, default build. My last build was
-1 Pilfered Plans
for
+1 Ultimate Price
-1 Azorius Charm
for
+1 Devour Flesh
Esper has hard matchup against fast decks anyway so that's why I cut "draw 2 for 3 mana spell". I don't think it is that crucial and having one isn't something that will save me games, so I'd rather have a bigger chance to play turn 2 kill spell.
There is only one in the deck. I would normally run two but as you said there are a lot of aggro builds right not. Many high-level players are playing 2x Divination without a problem. You are very unlikely to draw PIlfered Plans in your opening hand (this is important), you ARE very likely to draw it at a later time. You become more and more likely against control(ie long games) where you most need it. You shouldn't be so close to death that you have to devote that many slots on t2 removal/bounce effects in the main-board. Of course your meta could be overloaded with aggro. My meta is usually GP or high level tourneys where we see a full display of the meta.
I cut Azorius Charm because it doesn't do anything in most matchups and Devour Flesh is almost the same in matchups I think Azorius Charm is good. I still leave 3 Azorius Charms because I don't want to have too many dead spells against mirror.
Please explain how Azorius Charm "doesn't do anything in most match ups". It buys tempo in any deck with a creature count, it cycles for another card against control, etc
Our sideboard different hugely though. All cards you have in your sideboard are cards I at least considered. There is a one exception: Merciless Eviction. I don't know how much this is an upgrade from Supreme Verdict. Sure it kills planeswalkers but this is 6-mana counterable kill spell that will almost never have most than two targets and usually will have one. I am afraid it is not reliable enough. It also has "Pithing Needle" problem - it kills your permanents too. I don't like it.
Counterable isn't too relevant here. This comes in as a powerful card against control. For example, they counter your Jace and play Jace, you are a little behind, they and an Elspeth and look way behind. (They tapped out for Elspeth) You kill their planeswalkers 2-1, they have two D-Spheres out, you have none (or one), you exile them. They have a God out, that's beating your face, you just need to wrath, etc)
I don't bring in Pithing Needle against control usually so that point is irrelevant. I use it against the Gruul planeswalkers deck, Maze's End, etc It's a value/versatility card.
I'd keep two Supreme Verdicts for Barons, random Elspeth tokens or Sin Collectors. I don't think that many people will side in Soldier of Pantheon against us. This tech demands siding in 4 Soldiers and I think there are lot of better cards to pack in.
It's happened to me enough that I'm aware of the technique and am prepared to fight it.
I am torn between D-Sphere/Downfall count. I tried 3/3, 4/2, 4/3. I really like Downfall. It is worse than D-Sphere only in Mono B and Mono U matchups. I really feel like I want to play 3/3 split with one Sphere in side but on the other hand this seems like a wasted sideboard slot. I don't like playing tapout game, I'd rather have as many instant as possible. IDK. Keep in mind that Downfall does not get hit by Gainsays or random Glare of Heresy/Destructive Reverly/etc.
You're forgeting that Hero's Downfall can't deal with the God's which are powerful in the decks running them. MonoU, MonoB, the Red deck, G/R devotion.
This thread is inspired by another thread I saw while browsing The Source. My question involves the way that missed triggers work, in particular the fact that you are not responsible for pointing out your opponent's triggers.
For example, it is perfectly legal to ignore your opponent's triggers if they don't remember them. If you cast any spell straight into a Chalice of the Void, give them a chance to respond, and they say alright without signalling at their Chalice, you may legally resolve the spell.
My question is: is this how the rules should work? More importantly, if you don't think it is ideal, how would you fix the rules on missed triggers?
Personally, I think that it is fine, but I also know that some people hate it. However, no one has brought up a better rule. Curious to hear your thoughts and logic!
The DCI considers remembering beneficial triggers to be a skill-testing part of the game. I for one think it's an important aspect of the game. It's one of many things that separate good players from bad players. We all have friends that constantly miss triggers and reminding them in casual games just makes their bad habit worse.
I am the judge at our FNM as well as play, if I see cheating or rules violations I'll speak up but when it comes to missed triggers (including non benefical ones) I don't say anything until after the game. The main reason I don't speak up about minor things like that is I think it's unfair to the other players if there's no one standing over my match but I'm standing over theirs.
Actually at Competetive REL judges aren't allowed to remind players of things like Soldier of the Pantheon triggers or for example if someone forgets his Archangel of Thune counters trigger. The judge would actually be breaking the rules if he reminded the player. We have very specific rules about missed triggers.
I can drop the cyclonic rift (which I used in place of a 4th Azorius Charm for the possible overload effect) to add my 4th Architect. Also, I would rather try and fit in Divination as opposed to go up to 27 lands unless that wouldn't work.
Why don't you want to play 27 lands? That's normal with your build. You have a very demanding manabase with double Blue, double white and double black spells if you have 27 lands that gives you 7 untapped lands as opposed to 6 which can be a big deal. You also are more likely to hit your land drops which is important for this deck.
Should most-likely be 27 lands as your top end spells are quite expensive and you aren't running Divination to smooth your draws.
Obzedat out for Blood Baron main board.
Jace, Architect of Thought is possibly the best card in Standard at the moment, you must run 4. The Cyclonic Rift is pretty loose, another Dissolve in more normal for this deck.
True, but the value of planeswalkers is in their versatility. Just going straight to ultimate is folly. I know, it's why Timmy loves planeswalkers, while Spike loves their versatility and Johnny says "another card for Gilder Bairn! w00t!"
You don't have enough lands! You should also run 4 Temple of Abandon's will help smooth your draws a little better as well. Add another land, likely Forest and trade out four lands for T.O.A. also take out a Ruric Thar for a cheaper card, three is a bit much.
after playing the last few weeks on mtgo, I've preferred price over blade. Most of the meta is filled with Esper, black devotion, blue devotion, and r/g devotion and price hits just as many if not more targets from my experience. I will remain confident with heroes downfall, my choices between my 2cmc removal depends on what I'm looking to face. For example, right now my list is doom blades main, pharika cure and betrayal in the aside along with a singleton far // away to respond to the occasional stray blood baron. Most people would criticize only one sac effect and 0 devour flesh in my 75 but i haven't had much issue with the mirror. U/w has given me more fits from control than other Esper decks.
Wait, you prefer Price but your not running it...you're running the cards that I said are better.:confused:
For example-I continue to hit land drop #7 and #8 while my opponent is stuck at 6.
I play Pilfered Plans and go up a card on my opponent (and mill a random counter-spell VALUE).
My opponent lands his Jace, and can protect it with counter magic.
My opponent Thoughtseizes a win con.
All this seems understandable right? But many players seem to make hasty choices while playing the mirror. For example I've had my Pilfered Plans countered much more than my Divination every got countered, why? Because it presents a threat that they weren't thinking about, countering Divination is also a pretty big mistake too, unless you think your opponent missed a land drop, then by all means (if post board).
You can also make judgement calls.
For example in one game I had a hand with two lands, and a Negate, my opponent has 5 cards and had shown 2 Thoughtseize in game one, the board is clean.
I draw Hallowed Fountain and shock myself. I have 8 land in play and pass the turn (representing revelation in hand).
My opponent plays Thoughtseize on his turn, I counter it, he counters my counter, I then show him the two lands.
Why did I make these plays? Think for a bit...
I recommend never Dissolving anything but Aetherlings in Game one (if possible) because if it gets through you will lose and your opponent will wait for a tap out or counter magic backup before casting him.
Take out your Azorius Charms, your sideboard should have enough relevant resources that make A.C. subpar postboard.
Take out a Supreme Verdict for a Merciless Eviction post-board. It keeps a stronger more versatile wraith effect, yes it can be countered but we aren't getting aggro'd by creatures anyway.
Don't be afraid to Revelation for 2, it's perfectly normal. Waiting and doing nothing often puts you behind.
Our experiences are shaped from different experiences. I've yet to (in over hundreds of games) faced the GP version of haste Rakdos) I've faced Selesnya aggro, in two GP's and many times online. My local meta also has two strong players that love to jam Voice and the Lion.
Ultimate Price in my hand usually kills me against a lot of things. I consider it much worse than Doom Blade because if I want I can always compliment it in the sideboard with Dark Betrayal, that covers all the bases.
Mutavault, Nightveil specter and Boros Reckoner are important problems to deal with at the moment.
You're forgeting that Hero's Downfall can't deal with the God's which are powerful in the decks running them. MonoU, MonoB, the Red deck, G/R devotion.
The DCI considers remembering beneficial triggers to be a skill-testing part of the game. I for one think it's an important aspect of the game. It's one of many things that separate good players from bad players. We all have friends that constantly miss triggers and reminding them in casual games just makes their bad habit worse.
Actually at Competetive REL judges aren't allowed to remind players of things like Soldier of the Pantheon triggers or for example if someone forgets his Archangel of Thune counters trigger. The judge would actually be breaking the rules if he reminded the player. We have very specific rules about missed triggers.
That's fine. I also like Ashiok and am preparing an Ashiok build as well.
You can run it like that, it should be competitive, absolutely still tier 1.
4 Watery Grave
4 Godless Shrine
4 Hallowed Fountain
4 Temple of Deceit
4 Temple of Silence
4 Island
3 Plains
Planeswalkers (5)
4 Jace, Architect of Thought
1 Elspeth, Sun's Champion
Creatures (3)
1 Aetherling
2 Blood Baron of Vizkopa
4 Supreme Verdict
4 Detention SPhere
4 Sphinx's Revelation
4 Azorius Charm
3 Dissolve
2 Hero's Downfall
2 Thoughtseize
1 Devour Flesh
1 Pilfered Plans
2 Ratchet Bomb
2 DoomBlade
2 Negate
2 Gainsay
2 Sin Collector
1 Devour Flesh
1 Jace, Memory Adept
1 Blood Baron of Vizkopa
1 Pithing Needle
1 Merciless Eviction
Why don't you want to play 27 lands? That's normal with your build. You have a very demanding manabase with double Blue, double white and double black spells if you have 27 lands that gives you 7 untapped lands as opposed to 6 which can be a big deal. You also are more likely to hit your land drops which is important for this deck.
Should most-likely be 27 lands as your top end spells are quite expensive and you aren't running Divination to smooth your draws.
Obzedat out for Blood Baron main board.
Jace, Architect of Thought is possibly the best card in Standard at the moment, you must run 4. The Cyclonic Rift is pretty loose, another Dissolve in more normal for this deck.
Good Luck!
I think there is A LOT more to talk about than that and will be delving into it when I have a few free moments.
Theory, tactics and strategy, etc.
There are very few situations where a deck running Domri wouldn't slam an ultimate as it pretty much guarantees a win!
Wait, you prefer Price but your not running it...you're running the cards that I said are better.:confused: