Seriously, is every degenerate deck going to just be some Hermit Druid variant? This one does avoid dying to grave hate the way classic Hermit Druid did. And it allows for basic lands.
And my usual "But it's the control players who are the problem..." (in a whiny, singsong voice)
This is the deck I am going to build. I like the way it plays and already own half the cards needed. I will have to change some things but overall it will still be the same. (I don't own twister or LED but I will proxy LED for now)
Timetwister is overrated. Card is fantastic and oozes with power but its not like "oh i dont have twister, now I cant play thrasios/tymna". Just replace it with another OP af card for T/T. Theres going to be atleast 50 cards that get cut from the list that turn heads anyway; just put one of those in. As for LED; this ones a big deal. It enables infinite mana combos via bomberman and has great synergy with your wheels or opponent's wheels and can even enable DD lines if you go that route now that paradox engine is gone. You definitely dont need timetwister loops to finish the game once drawing your deck; theres so many "90% as good" finishers that effectively close the game the same way.
All jokes aside, I do hope it comes back. Although its rough to interact with, its always fun to see a supported theme that is otherwise trash (dragons, cats, vampires etc etc). What are your thoughts on Emminence?
Honestly, the only request I have is to get the Rules Committee and/or Commander Advisory Group more involved with the site. I wish they officially could become more involved with the site as it was the only thing missing from this one. Having a discussion board is one thing, but having a discussion board that the RC and CAG frequent is even better.
Talk is cheap. You've identified a major problem with the format, so do something about it? On the off chance you do read this,everyone is looking at you to make aggro a viable option. So just... Make the changes? Start with the cards that are doing exactly what you're saying; laboratory maniac, isochron scepter, ad nauseam and food chain for example?
Not a bad card per se, but I dont think this will make it in the deck. Yuriko loves its ninjas as close to the ground as possible. After all, a changeling outcast and fallen shinobi nearly do the same amount of damage (not much of a difference between say, doing 13 damage and 17 damage if you were to reveal a massacre for example). Ultimately you gotta ask yourself "is the 5 or so cmc to cast this worth its play two of your opponents top cards ability" I think the answer is a pretty solid "no" (nice addition for ninja tribal however). On a side note, I am absolutely ecstatic that this set (block hopefully!) has been reprinting both changeling AND ninjutsu. Exciting time to be a Yuriko player.
I swear by Aura Thief. Most enchantments aren't a problem if you control them.
Thats actually a pretty damn good suggestion. Hadn't considered the old aura thief for Yuriko. My deck runs a multitude of ways to kill him too (phyrexian tower, plaguecrafter and toxic deluge et al to name a few). I'll have to give him a go.
Not sure if you have the pockets for them, eldrazi are nice things to hit with yuriko. Desolation twin is 10.
Scroll rack is also really good. Hit with your ninjas, and then see how many connect. Before triggers resolve, scroll rack your big stuff to your deck. I connected with 4 ninjas and scrolled racked 3 eldrazi and a 9 cost card. Together, 40 CMC.
My deck is running paper timetwister, capture of jingzhou and chains of mephistopheles for example, money isnt an issue (to be honest I bought the reserved list cards for this when all 3 of those were under 400 dollars haha). But seriously though, the sky's the limit. As for the eldrazi, i find them to be a bit too clunky. I hear Emrakul, the promised end is borderline playable and can prevent losses when played at the perfect moment, but so far it seems a bit "winmore". My go-to strategy at the moment has been using all 13 time magic spells, tutoring, recurring and chaining them to do like 60 damage to each opponent by turn 4/5. I really should test emrakul out to be honest. I think with timetwister, temporal trespass and time spiral, I just never have the graveyard required to lower it's CMC to a playable level.
I dont really struggle against any enchantment in particular, I just feel like seeing as my list only has 1 enchantment in it, running something like Aura flux for example may be quite effective just for the asymmetrical stax. I just dont know too much about recent sets and was wondering if there was more efficient enchantment hate than said aura flux I suppose. You're right though, maybe the best way to beat enchantments is to just ignore them all together and focus my gameplan. I've heard something about black getting enchantment hate soon-ish. Hopefully its more efficient than running spine of ish sah-type cards.
Generally speaking, you'll find these type of effects mainly in red, but theyre also present in white/blue as well. Firstly, you gotta ask yourself "Am I actually trying to win, or am I just trying to be that "whacky-tabacky planeschase theme guy in the background?". Depending how you answer... depends on what commander, colors and chaos/game changing cards you run.
Hey all. After Changeling outcast got spoiled, I had to start looking at making a slot for it and this made me really look into my decklist. Anywho, theres something thats been bugging me for a while... my list only runs 1 enchantment. Seeing as theres next to a 1% chance of running into the card, I figured I my as well run some "mass enchantment hate" or however you would word it.
Anyone know of any stax-y cards that screw over enchantments either as a one-time effect or an ongoing type of effect in U/B? The way I see it, stax cards are always best when they affect you significantly less than your opponents (for example, my list runs cursed totem as it barely affects my list at all) and it just makes sense to include some anti-enchantment stax. My knowledge on the sets over the last 2 years is extremely limited (IRL my free-time is quite affected as of late) and maybe theres some new stuff you could suggest.
(Also, general yuriko thread. Tell me things that have been working for you or haven't been as great as you'd thought they would be )
Ooooh boy I love when these threads pop up. They really show peoples' knowledge of EDH and how aware/unaware they are of how broken the format truly is. To my core I don't believe the format can be treated as "competitive" in the slightest, therefore cEDH is a bit of a joke to me, albeit that's because the RC has made it this way.
Nevertheless this is my view on the topic; pretty much everything that is banned should stay banned because I'd break them if they left the banlist. As for what to ban...
Fast mana. Game can't really feel like skill is involved when you lose to someone before you play a second land. Thats just RNG. Who likes losing to RNG?! If I had to pick which exactly to ban I'd say its the cEDH's Power4 (Sol Ring, mana crypt, mox diamond and chrome mox). Banning mana vault after that couldn't hurt either. Once the fast mana is taken out we'd have meaning ful interactions with one another, not "race and ignore your opponents" type meta
Thrasios, Triton Hero: This slimy bastard is everywhere. When half the players at your LGS and many other cEDH circles play this little guy you know the RC has failed. He single handedly is putting a strangehold on the entire meta and is forcing everyone to build around him and compare their speed against his. Tymna the weaver just makes him even more broken. If your aim is to win, why build anything else?
Ad Nauseam: Most broken card in edh. Hands down. Who thought allowing "Pay 5 mana, win the game" would be a good idea? Either ban this silly card or lower life totals to 30 IMO. To be honest, i feel like lowering life totals to 30 would be the healthiest change to ever come to edh as it would allow aggro to be competitive and actually playable against combo. Maybe.
Flash. This with Protean hulk says "Pay 2 mana; win the game". Some mong really dropped the ball allowing this one to be legal. Coming across this makes you question who makes the rules for this game.
aetherflux reservoir: Probably an unpopular opinion I'll admit, but I feel like this was just too good of a weapon for storm decks. It made them go from highly playable to straight up "EDH is a game of combo". Its too good. Ban it IMO. Let em go back to tendrils of agony and mind's desire etc etc
Food chain: Tazri has become too consistent now and theres always gonna be commanders that will make the card say "pay 3 mana, get infinite mana". Just ban it to prevent further abuse.
Laboratory maniac: No, its not fancy. No, it takes no skill to do a setup with it. Doomsday for example says "pay 3 mana, win the game" with labman being legal. Its not fun to play against, takes not much skill to pull off after a little bit of practice and is just really unhealthy for competitive play in general. Ban this and it'll fix a lot of problems.
The chain veil: Card by itself is fine but combined with teferi, temporal archmage the card is beyond broken. Its format warping and should have been banned years ago.
Theres roughly 10 more format-warping cards but i'd say these are the obvious ones. Theres always going to be strong cards, but sometimes cards can be so broken when built correctly that it can make edh commander-selection feel like 15 commanders to pick from instead of 870+. No card should EVER say "Pay X; Win if no response"... Its just not fun after the first time for many, many people. I mean, you gotta remember this question is subjective too, so someone could come along and say I'm completely wrong and that winning on turn 3 consistantly is extremely fun and skill-based. Everyones different and theres gonna be a lot of differing opinions on this topic. Hopefully this little response gives you an idea of just my viewpoint on this anywho
I am loving this idea of ashnod's altar, phyrexian altar and earthcraft (combination of any of these 2 will suffice to make infinite etb and mana, just need an outlet really, which prossh has plenty of). Earthcraft's drawback of only being able to untap basic lands will definitely hurt, but between nature's lore, bloodstained mire, verdant catacombs, wooded foothills, crop rotation (if its the winning turn) and a few other goodies I'm sure I'll be able to prioritize a basic land when needed. I run tainted pact so my basic land count is only 6 (regular and snow-covered).
I do rely on food chain and it does win many, many games, but for games where my opponent exiles it fully, I'd like to have a streamlined "Plan B", rather than just relying on general goodstuff and Prossh doing Prossh things. I still win many games when its gone, I'm just asking for advice on which direction to take the deck when thats the case. But yeah over reliance on a single card is just dumb without silence or grand abolisher like I said, hence me asking for advice.
I love my Prossh, skyraider of kher deck, but as of late, my playgroup has been running things like extract, praetor's grasp, sadistic sacrament and bitter ordeal type cards and relying on just riftsweeper to get food chain back hasn't been cutting it for me. So fellow Prossh players, what do you guys do if food chain is truly out of the question? Just simply attacking with Prossh is what I've been doing and it works sometimes I guess but I want to really have a proper backup wincon if "Plan A" fails.
The point of this thread is to help decide what type of backup wincons to build it toward. I play IRL so I don't want to spend money until I'm happy with the direction its going toward and who better to ask then you guys . At the moment, I'm leaning toward making it a stormy version (ad nauseam into mana vault/mana crypt/sol ring/dark ritual/cabal ritual/etc etc into aetherflux reservoir. The problem I'm finding with a stormy build is I really want silence and grand abolisher if I'm going to do such things, but you know, Jund. This leads me to the other direction I'm considering taking it; Doing a really controlley backup wincon ala tainted strike, temur battle rage, psychotic fury and purphoros, god of the forge type shenanigans.
I guess I'm a little lost whether I should make it a storm backup or Voltron-control backup. What are your thoughts on this? Any alternate ideas even? Maybe there's a third option I'm not taking into consideration enough? Thanks in advance for any advice
How many creatures are strong enough to 1-hit kill in a Xenagos, god of revels deck, assuming a player is still at 40 life? So far I've heard of Malignus, phyrexian hydra, putrefax and phyrexian juggernaut. I really thought there was more than that, but green/red really are my least played colors
Maybe you guys know of any? Thanks in advance for any suggestions
Edit: not sure what happened to the title lol. It said "how many creatures are strong enough to 1-hit an opponent in a xenagos deck?". It got cut off when I posted it :/
Timetwister is overrated. Card is fantastic and oozes with power but its not like "oh i dont have twister, now I cant play thrasios/tymna". Just replace it with another OP af card for T/T. Theres going to be atleast 50 cards that get cut from the list that turn heads anyway; just put one of those in. As for LED; this ones a big deal. It enables infinite mana combos via bomberman and has great synergy with your wheels or opponent's wheels and can even enable DD lines if you go that route now that paradox engine is gone. You definitely dont need timetwister loops to finish the game once drawing your deck; theres so many "90% as good" finishers that effectively close the game the same way.
Talk is cheap. You've identified a major problem with the format, so do something about it? On the off chance you do read this,everyone is looking at you to make aggro a viable option. So just... Make the changes? Start with the cards that are doing exactly what you're saying; laboratory maniac, isochron scepter, ad nauseam and food chain for example?
Land Ramp: burgeoning
Mana Dork: deathrite shaman
Mana Rock: mana crypt
Ritual: dark ritual
Mana fixing: I know this answer sucks... but a healthy dose of Fetches and ABUR lands
Creature Spot Removal: rending volley
Artifact/Enchantment Spot removal: natural state
Sweeper: toxic deluge
Complete Board Wipe: cyclonic rift
Best Counterspell: Mana drain
Tutor: demonic tutor
Ongoing Card draw: mystic remora
Mass Card Draw: ad nauseam
Best Card Filtering: Mirri's guile
Graveyard hate: extirpate (dont forget, is also a counter against Vampiric tutor et al.!)
Reanimation: reanimate
Utility card (multitool): Got a really strong feeling the new Tale's end is going to be an absolute house
Best Aggro Creature: serra ascendant
Best Defensive Creature: baleful strix
Best Hatebear: aven mindcensor
Best Mana Denial: stasis
Best Stax Card: null rod
Best Anti-Combo Card: flusterstorm
Most Oppressive Card: thrasios, triton hero. His threat hangs over a game like a looming shadow starting from turn two
Best Land Card: gaea's cradle
Best offensive Buff: tainted strike
Best Protection buff: aspect of mongoose
Most Degenerate Wincon: laboratory maniac
Most Degenerate Commander Card: Probably urza, lord high artificer. It breaks without even trying to break it.
Just my opinion of course, I'm sure many will agree with some and disagree on others I listed. Just my experience.
Not a bad card per se, but I dont think this will make it in the deck. Yuriko loves its ninjas as close to the ground as possible. After all, a changeling outcast and fallen shinobi nearly do the same amount of damage (not much of a difference between say, doing 13 damage and 17 damage if you were to reveal a massacre for example). Ultimately you gotta ask yourself "is the 5 or so cmc to cast this worth its play two of your opponents top cards ability" I think the answer is a pretty solid "no" (nice addition for ninja tribal however). On a side note, I am absolutely ecstatic that this set (block hopefully!) has been reprinting both changeling AND ninjutsu. Exciting time to be a Yuriko player.
Thats actually a pretty damn good suggestion. Hadn't considered the old aura thief for Yuriko. My deck runs a multitude of ways to kill him too (phyrexian tower, plaguecrafter and toxic deluge et al to name a few). I'll have to give him a go.
My deck is running paper timetwister, capture of jingzhou and chains of mephistopheles for example, money isnt an issue (to be honest I bought the reserved list cards for this when all 3 of those were under 400 dollars haha). But seriously though, the sky's the limit. As for the eldrazi, i find them to be a bit too clunky. I hear Emrakul, the promised end is borderline playable and can prevent losses when played at the perfect moment, but so far it seems a bit "winmore". My go-to strategy at the moment has been using all 13 time magic spells, tutoring, recurring and chaining them to do like 60 damage to each opponent by turn 4/5. I really should test emrakul out to be honest. I think with timetwister, temporal trespass and time spiral, I just never have the graveyard required to lower it's CMC to a playable level.
Anyone know of any stax-y cards that screw over enchantments either as a one-time effect or an ongoing type of effect in U/B? The way I see it, stax cards are always best when they affect you significantly less than your opponents (for example, my list runs cursed totem as it barely affects my list at all) and it just makes sense to include some anti-enchantment stax. My knowledge on the sets over the last 2 years is extremely limited (IRL my free-time is quite affected as of late) and maybe theres some new stuff you could suggest.
(Also, general yuriko thread. Tell me things that have been working for you or haven't been as great as you'd thought they would be
Nevertheless this is my view on the topic; pretty much everything that is banned should stay banned because I'd break them if they left the banlist. As for what to ban...
Fast mana. Game can't really feel like skill is involved when you lose to someone before you play a second land. Thats just RNG. Who likes losing to RNG?! If I had to pick which exactly to ban I'd say its the cEDH's Power4 (Sol Ring, mana crypt, mox diamond and chrome mox). Banning mana vault after that couldn't hurt either. Once the fast mana is taken out we'd have meaning ful interactions with one another, not "race and ignore your opponents" type meta
Thrasios, Triton Hero: This slimy bastard is everywhere. When half the players at your LGS and many other cEDH circles play this little guy you know the RC has failed. He single handedly is putting a strangehold on the entire meta and is forcing everyone to build around him and compare their speed against his. Tymna the weaver just makes him even more broken. If your aim is to win, why build anything else?
Ad Nauseam: Most broken card in edh. Hands down. Who thought allowing "Pay 5 mana, win the game" would be a good idea? Either ban this silly card or lower life totals to 30 IMO. To be honest, i feel like lowering life totals to 30 would be the healthiest change to ever come to edh as it would allow aggro to be competitive and actually playable against combo. Maybe.
Flash. This with Protean hulk says "Pay 2 mana; win the game". Some mong really dropped the ball allowing this one to be legal. Coming across this makes you question who makes the rules for this game.
aetherflux reservoir: Probably an unpopular opinion I'll admit, but I feel like this was just too good of a weapon for storm decks. It made them go from highly playable to straight up "EDH is a game of combo". Its too good. Ban it IMO. Let em go back to tendrils of agony and mind's desire etc etc
Food chain: Tazri has become too consistent now and theres always gonna be commanders that will make the card say "pay 3 mana, get infinite mana". Just ban it to prevent further abuse.
Laboratory maniac: No, its not fancy. No, it takes no skill to do a setup with it. Doomsday for example says "pay 3 mana, win the game" with labman being legal. Its not fun to play against, takes not much skill to pull off after a little bit of practice and is just really unhealthy for competitive play in general. Ban this and it'll fix a lot of problems.
The chain veil: Card by itself is fine but combined with teferi, temporal archmage the card is beyond broken. Its format warping and should have been banned years ago.
Theres roughly 10 more format-warping cards but i'd say these are the obvious ones. Theres always going to be strong cards, but sometimes cards can be so broken when built correctly that it can make edh commander-selection feel like 15 commanders to pick from instead of 870+. No card should EVER say "Pay X; Win if no response"... Its just not fun after the first time for many, many people. I mean, you gotta remember this question is subjective too, so someone could come along and say I'm completely wrong and that winning on turn 3 consistantly is extremely fun and skill-based. Everyones different and theres gonna be a lot of differing opinions on this topic. Hopefully this little response gives you an idea of just my viewpoint on this anywho
The point of this thread is to help decide what type of backup wincons to build it toward. I play IRL so I don't want to spend money until I'm happy with the direction its going toward and who better to ask then you guys
I guess I'm a little lost whether I should make it a storm backup or Voltron-control backup. What are your thoughts on this? Any alternate ideas even? Maybe there's a third option I'm not taking into consideration enough? Thanks in advance for any advice
How many creatures are strong enough to 1-hit kill in a Xenagos, god of revels deck, assuming a player is still at 40 life? So far I've heard of Malignus, phyrexian hydra, putrefax and phyrexian juggernaut. I really thought there was more than that, but green/red really are my least played colors
Maybe you guys know of any? Thanks in advance for any suggestions
Edit: not sure what happened to the title lol. It said "how many creatures are strong enough to 1-hit an opponent in a xenagos deck?". It got cut off when I posted it :/