Magic Market Index for April 12, 2019
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  • posted a message on Nicol Bolas, the Ravager - Superfriends
    Had a decent game last night with this deck. I was playing against Karador, Ghost Chieftain, Ravos Soultender/Vial Smasher partners, and something else (I already forgot).

    The game was exceptionally slow for me and Ravos having access to Bounty Agent kind of set me back a little as I could not get Nicol Bolas to stick around. He isn't the most important element of the deck, but I want him to transform if I can. I ended up finally getting rid of it with Crypt Incursion (and gaining 6 life in the process).

    There actually wasn't much for interaction in the game as everyone was kind of slow. I did get a Jace, Unraveler of Secrets to the point I could ultimate him, but he got killed before that could happen. Luckily, the Vial Smasher player didn't realize the Smasher trigger could hit Walkers so Jace survived a little longer than he should have.

    Beyond that, I got down a Chandra, Torch of Defiance which got me a Daretti, Ingenious Iconoclast. I also had a Rowan Kenrith that allowed me to kill off some opposing creatures. At one point, Ravos got down Razaketh, the Foulblooded at which point the board was wrathed. They were able to tutor up two cards though. They also had a Black Market that ended up with 14 counters on it. My board was kind of scary with those 3 walkers (I ticked down Daretti at one point to kill a creature) but still not terrible. Karador tutored off of Protean Hulk for a creature and got...something. I actually don't even remember what it was. What I do remember is that it was *not* something that could blow up an enchantment. As such, Ravos untapped and just cast Torment of Hailfire for X = 21 which just killed us all.

    I kind of forgot about the tutoring they had done but I was super surprised that Karador left the Black Market alone which ultimately allowed the game to just end. It was pretty disappointing for it to end that way. Mostly because it wasn't like it had to end that way and the Black Market should have been blown up.

    As to my deck, Kazuul, Tyrant of the Cliffs got me a few tokens but not many. I wouldn't say it was an issue with Kazuul though as there was very little attacking going on overall. War Tax did help stop some attacks but I was very light on blue mana early on so it wasn't as useful as it could have been. I like both cards though and I think War Tax is pretty good. I don't think this game gave Kazuul the opportunity to really shine but I see the potential.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
  • posted a message on Karador, Ghost Chieftain - War of Attrition
    I played this deck the other day and did very poorly. I kept a sketchy hand mostly because it had 3 lands and decent spells but there was no ramp. And I saw basically no ramp the rest of the game. In fact, I don't think I got above 8 lands the entire game and I almost always had fewer than 2 creatures. I did have a Chainer, Dementia Master down which helped a little as I was able to steal an opponent's Felidar Sovereign so they couldn't get it back from Emeria, the Sky Ruin and it did save me for a little while but it definitely was not enough. I ended up losing this game without having done pretty much anything.

    There is one play I want to call out though because I liked doing it Smile

    The opponent sitting across from me (they were playing Thraximundar I think) had gotten a couple creatures down and slammed a Bane of Bala Ged that had haste due to Garna, the Bloodflame. Now, I was sitting there with 7 lands, Nihil Spellbomb and Chainer and that was it. Meanwhile, an opposing Karador, Ghost Chieftain and Baird, Steward of Argive had built up pretty big board states. Granted, Baird was tough to attack into, but Karador was not. For some reason, the Thrax player thought it was a good idea to attack into me with Bane. This led to me needing to exile a land and the Spellbomb. But, before blockers were declared, I reanimated their Phyrexian Obliterator with Chainer. And I blocked with it. This led to them needing to sacrifice all of their permanents except for 3 lands. After that, they were basically out of the game. It felt pretty satisfying as there was basically no reason I should have been attacked in that situation.

    Overall, it was a terrible game for this deck, but at least I got one good play out of it.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
  • posted a message on Teysa Karlov - Aristocrats
    I had a pretty interesting game last night with this deck. I played against Karador, Ghost Chieftain, Progenitus, Tawnos, Urza’s Apprentice.

    The game was super grindy. I got out Reliquary Monk early which let me blow up something from Tawnos. I ended up casting Toxic Deluge kind of early as Tawnos had a Steel Hellkite that I could see was aiming for me since I had won the previous game and it would have gotten rid of a few rocks that I felt I needed.

    From there, I got Teysa down but almost none of my main cards. No Grave Pact effects and my only sac outlet for the longest time was Ayli, Eternal Pilgrim. My mana wasn't the greatest so having to spend 1 mana to sac things was tough. I did eventually get a High Market and Miren, the Moaning Well down though I never once used Miren since it cost too much and it got blown up later on (along with High Market). The turning point came when I got Kokusho, the Evening Star down. I sacrificed him with Teysa on the board so I gained 31 life total to put me at 61. I had a Beast token as well from Beast Within blowing up something so that gained me some life too. Erebos came down and let me draw more cards.

    Around this time, Karador and Tawnos kind of ganged up on Progenitus as their board was getting out of control (they were running "God-Tribal") so they have a bunch of gods turned on with Phenax milling people. Luckily, they were able to kill him off.

    A few turns later, I cast White Sun's Zenith for X=8 and gained 16 life off that (while splitting the damage between 2 people). The board got wrathed but that was fine as Tawnos had 14 myr tokens and a Myr Battlesphere. After a while, I built back up and got Dark Prophecy and Midnight Reaper on the board so I could draw a bunch of cards. Along with Krav, the Unredeemed I could have drawn 18 cards. I ended up only drawing 13 as I did not have many left so I got rid of the Midnight Reaper first. Had I thought about it, I would have made sure to draw even fewer.

    I did try to cast White Sun's again, but it got countered and exiled so that was out of the question.

    A few turns later, I was at 3 cards left in my library along with 46 1/1 flying tokens from a Hallowed Spiritkeeper dying and Teysa giving me an extra trigger. I swung for lethal at both players only to get got with a Settle the Wreckage. Amazingly, my 3 card library didn't have 46 basics for me to get, so I got no value (though I wouldn't have pulled any basics anyway). Then, Karador wrathed the board with Hour of Revelation. I got back Carrion Feeder and Hallowed Spiritkeeper[/c] off of Phyrexian Reclamation (I tried to get Mikaeus, the Unhallowed back too but Tawnos exiled him with Scrabbling Claws. Not that it mattered as I really only needed the first two and Claws couldn't stop me from getting them.

    Using these, I got down Spiritkeeper which got me 28 tokens. I swung out at Karador and killed them and then, with 0 cards in my library, I swung 27 at Tawnos. They had 3 blockers and 21 life so I just barely had enough damage to get through for lethal.

    The game was a nail biter until the end and I am lucky to have come away with the win but overall it does show that the deck is proving to be resilient and powerful even without the main cards. Obviously, with as many cards as I was drawing, I was able to get some Grave Pact effects which helped as well as being able to recur Archon of Justice and Karmic Guide (with Mikaeus around) to get rid of some very important permanents. Notably, I got rid of all of Karador's sac outlets so that I could exile their creatures (like Avacyn and a few others) without having to worry about them coming back.

    After this game, I would be lying if I said I didn't start thinking of the issue of not having a library and contemplating adding in Elixir of Immortality or even just an Eldrazi Titan. I am not sure if either makes sense as this game went on for 2 hours and I still won. If I can't win a game in 2 hours and deck myself instead, I probably don't really deserve to win that game. On the other hand, being able to shuffle things back in can be game breaking for the others and adding in an Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre also gives me some added removal or Kozilek, Butcher of Truth gets me card draw. I might think of one of them to add in later.

    The deck performed very well for not really getting its engine going until really late of keeping the board clear with Grave Pact effects. Ayli was the most disappointing card I used because she costs mana to use her sac ability. I did (finally) get to use her Exile ability but a few early plays were hindered by not having enough mana to do what I needed to do with her. Granted, she was instrumental in keeping me going but I feel that basically any sac outlet there would have been. I don't know if her exile ability and gaining life from her sac ability are enough to keep her in over a free sac outlet. The main issue is that the other 2 drop free sac outlets aren't that great so I don't think there is an obvious swap.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
  • posted a message on Finale of Promise + Increasing Vengeance
    Yes, this works. Since you are casting both spells at the same time, you choose what order to cast them. As long as you cast Vision first, it will be on the stack and a legal target for Vengeance. And, since you cast Vengeance from the Graveyard, it will copy Vision twice.
    Posted in: Rumored Card Rulings
  • posted a message on [[Official]] Modern Prices Discussion
    Quote from Joban8 »

    Yeah, I'm not expecting it to move the prices of regular printings either. However, this is the kind of lineup that would actually make me consider buying one; I'd probably give it a go if I actually needed a Jace, Ugin, or both. Alas, I do not, so I'll continue avoiding these Timmy boxes like they're an engineered plague. I sincerely hope Gavin's comments a few month ago about how, without Masters sets, WotC would be sprinkling Modern reprints throughout miscellaneous other products weren't referring to ******* mythic edition boxes as one of those reprint outlets.

    Speaking as someone who has tried to buy the other 2 Mythic Edition boxes the minute they came out online, it is nearly impossible to get them (in my opinion) anyway. I think you need some sort of high tech computer, which I don't have.

    I have a fairly new and expensive computer, but if I still am always "too late." If anyone has any insight on what programs I need to NOT be last, I'm all ears and thank you. Grin
    The Mythic Edition for RNA had a window of more than a day to get the boxes. They were on sale for about 10 hours total, taken down, and then posted again later which stayed up for a while. I don't think a slow computer is your problem there Smile

    The one for GRN was just awful because Hasbro's site is awful. There isn't a lot you could do there except try over and over. I submitted 4 or 5 orders and only 1 went through because they all said they failed. Luckily we don't have to worry about that anymore.

    Because they are going through eBay, I don't expect any issues other than how quickly they sell out. What I do is go to the Hasbro Toy Shop storefront on eBay and keep refreshing around 3:00 ET until I see them. Adding to the cart and checking out takes basically no time. At least, it didn't for RNA. And I did all of mine on my phone. Now, this is certainly a better box so they will likely sell out quicker but I don't think there is any special method to getting these.
    Posted in: Modern
  • posted a message on Signature Spell Book Gideon
    Quote from kingfede85 »
    I don't understand why people keep forgetting a couple of basic financial lessons:
    A) Reprints cause cards to lose value
    B) Cards whose cost depends only on the number of copies available tank after a large reprint.

    The only two cards that are really valuable here are PtE and RiP, with Worship following those two. You'll find the other 5 around 1$ immediatly after the release because they're either marginal or unplayed.

    I'm not saying it's a bad product: the art is gorgeous and I will purchase it for sure if I find it at the right price, but it's not the super product some people are implying it is and I think we can safely put as a fact that it contains less playable cards than Jace's one, too.
    If you look at it the other way around, Martyr's Bond, Rest in Peace, Path to Exile, and Worship are all above $7 currently. Without this product, they remain above $7. So, yes, this product *will* drop those prices (except for Path to Exile in the long term) to make them less valuable. I think the exciting factor (beyond the art) *is* the financial impact to these cards. I don't want to have to pay $9 for a Rest in Peace for example. This is a great sideboard card and being able to get it cheaper is good news to those that don't already have it.

    I would argue that the only "dud" in this box is Shielded by Faith (and maybe Blackblade) but the rest all see play across different formats. Jace's box had Blue Elemental Blast and Threads of Disloyalty as "duds". Not much of a difference in count to be honest. Maybe the playable cards in Jace's box were more powerful (thanks to Brainstorm, Counterspell, and Mystical Tutor) but the number of playable cards are the same. And 6 out of the 8 cards in Jace's box are around $2 or below so saying Gideon's cards will do that same is just saying that is how these types of products work.
    Posted in: The Rumor Mill
  • posted a message on Current issues with the comprehensive rules of Magic
    Quote from peteroupc »
    If something makes Growth-Chamber Guardian enter the battlefield with a +1/+1 counter on it, does Growth-Chamber Guardian get that counter before it enters, while it does so, or after it does so?
    The first Gatherer Ruling already covers the interaction . At least, it says it will trigger which your posts suggest is what you are looking for. I am not sure if the exact timing it really relevant if you just want to know if it triggers or not. Are you simply waiting on Eli to point out where in the CR this is covered?
    Posted in: Magic General
  • posted a message on God-Eternal Bontu and Sacrifice effects to Draw her again.
    Disciple of Bolas

    Morbid Curiosity will allow you to draw her again as the trigger to put her back in the library goes on top of the spell being cast and will thus resolve before that spell. This is due to needing to sacrifice a creature as part of the cost rather than during resolution. Disciple on the other hand will not since you sacrifice her during the resolution of the ability so the trigger to put her back will not go onto the stack until the trigger is done resolving and you have already drawn cards.
    Posted in: Magic Rulings
  • posted a message on Masterpieces
    Quote from Trov »
    Quote from Impossible »
    That misleading title, though. I thought WotC had brought back the actual Masterpiece series. Instead it's just the stupid Mythic Edition again. Womp womp.

    I had the same problem, almost went nuts and then noticed the next posts saying it was 250 bucks so yep, mythic edition it is, no masterpieces :/
    To be fair, these *are* Masterpieces as categorized by Wizards. They even say "Masterpiece" on the bottom of the cards.

    On a long term-note, I wonder if they will do more Masterpieces like this. I vastly prefer this distribution method of getting these kinds of cards. It just so happens that they started this with planeswalkers due to the story arc of planeswalkers. If they do this again with another set (maybe every set if they only give us 8 promo cards) it can be anything with any frame treatment.
    Posted in: The Rumor Mill
  • posted a message on [POLL] Planeswalkers as playable generals
    Quote from illakunsaa »
    Quote from FunkyDragon »
    Quote from illakunsaa »
    Ashiok isn't fun? Stax often leads to fun and interesting gameplay.
    ...said no sane person, ever. I don't know how you play stax, but every game I've ever played against stax has been slow, miserable, grindy, and something we wanted to forget and never repeat again. Most people I know play Magic to play Magic. They don't play to not play.

    Slow games? How so. If you can only untap one permanent, play one spell or draw no cards then your turns should be pretty quick. Sounds like a player error to me
    They didn't say slow turns; they said slow games. Those are completely different things. Are you suggesting that not being able to do anything (or having to wait multiple turns cycles to do something) somehow speeds up the game? Your experience may be different than mine, but the stax games I have played in focused on locking people out and then slowly grinding everyone to death with whatever the stax player had to end the game. The games take forever to end *because* players can't interact and players just get to slowly see their life total or library dwindle away.

    Games being miserable I just your personal preference. I personally find turn 3 emrakuls miserable but what do I know. I'm just some insane person.
    Turn 3 Emrakul would potentially be miserable though I am not sure by how much since it is a one shot that takes your turn and then gives you a turn back. How much are they really doing to you on turn 3 to mess anything up?And then, after that, she is just a big beater. That is leagues different than stax. And, even if it was the same, bringing it up has no relevance to the current discussion. Unless your point is that "things already exist that are unfun for me; let's add things that are unfun for others". Which is ludicrous.
    Posted in: Commander Rules Discussion Forum
  • posted a message on Mowu, Loyal Companion
    I made a decision on a few cards to add and cut. I am not sure how many are the right choice and a couple cuts (like Armory of Iroas) are on the line but I cut them due to just needing space for other cards. To start with, here are the changes:

    Since I am trying to be a bit more aggressive, I felt Constant Mists and Animation Module weren't that great. Primeval Bounty is pretty ggood but is high on CMC and I generally want to be doing other things there. Ring of Kalonia and Armory are tough as they are consistent counters, but I needed room somewhere and I like the other cards for other things. Biogenic Upgrade is decent but Solidarity of Heroes can usually do just as much for cheaper And yes, I know I get up to 4 more counters out of Upgrade but the cost, and being limited to a Sorcery, doesn't seem worth it.

    I explained most of the adds above, but I wanted to add in Enchantment and Artifact removal and tried to go with repeatable removal. The land's are utility lands for obvious purposes. I only included 1 cycling land because that is all I have right now. If I like Tranquil Thicket, I will probably add Desert of the Indomitable later.

    Deathtouch was added for the reasons above and I went with the 2 I did because they are cheap. I decided against Quietus Spike for now as its trigger should usually be irrelevant since I should be dealing a bunch of damage in one go. Plus, the mana cost and equip cost being {3} made me shy away from it.

    Early goldfishing with the most recent changes suggests my card draw is pretty solid which might lead me to slotting in a Reliquary Tower at some point. Since I am mono-G, it won't really hurt my mana very much and the benefit can be pretty large.
    Posted in: Multiplayer Commander Decklists
  • posted a message on Signature Spell Book Gideon
    Quote from Manite »
    Weird that they picked the objectively worst Gideon for the spellbook. I guess because it's his original card, with his full (post-Bant) name? Is Signature Spellbook: Nissa going to be Elf-tribal?
    I guess it depends on what format you are talking about but Gideon Jura has won me a bunch of games in Modern in Esper Control. The 1-of in the deck has been really good and I can't think of any other version of Gideon that would fit in that slot and do what he does.

    But, I do agree that they most likely went with the original card (or because it is the full name) just like they did for Jace.
    Posted in: The Rumor Mill
  • posted a message on Signature Spell Book Gideon
    A couple things to note:

    This is the first foil printing of Martyr's Bond.

    Rest in Peace is *not* Standard legal (this was an error in the article).

    Doublestrike does *not* let you attack twice (another error in the article).

    Overall, it looks pretty sweet. I will definitely pick up the Gideon because I like the frame and will likely pick up Rest in Peace as well. Path to Exile is also a welcome inclusion as that card can always use more printings.
    Posted in: The Rumor Mill
  • posted a message on Double Strike, Trample, and blocker death
    That is false. Wherever you learned that from may have been confusing the situation with one where the attacker does not have trample. If the attacker does not have trample, the 2/2 will die and there will be nothing to deal the "second strike" damage to so it simply isn't dealt. Adding trample allows you to trample over <nothing> to the player.
    Posted in: Magic Rulings
  • posted a message on Proliferate and Sagas
    The way the Sagas work is that whenever a counter is place on it, the appropriate Chapter ability (or abilities) triggers. This is determined by looking at how many counters it had before getting a counter on it and then how many it has after. So, if you go from 0 counters to 2 both ability 1 and 2 go on the stack at that time. If you go from 1 to 3, both 2 and 3 will trigger. This means that there is no way to repeat a chapter ability without first removing counters. The relevant rule is:

    714.2b. "{rN}--[Effect]" means "When one or more lore counters are put onto this Saga, if the number of lore counters on it was less than N and became at least N, [effect]."
    Posted in: Standard (Type 2)
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