Revelations seems like a sideboard card at best an can't really save you when you are behind. If you really need maindeck ways to gain life play courser. Remember the format will speed up and so Ascendancy doesn't help the game plan of, "kill the opponent". If you are really concerned with card draw that much play Shaman. At least he will buff the team when they hit. For me the only real way to make Temur is to make it RG style with more disruption and a better lategame. This "protect the queen" style is something something other colors do better and kinda hinders all the threats you could play with Temur. It seems more in line with David McDarby's Temur control and not everyone else's Temur Midrange/Aggro. Also Monastery Siege is not really maindeckable unless you really need card draw or protection. And there are no profitable ways for us to take advantage of the discard outside of TC. Surrak is not really maindeckable since he is a 5 drop and, as I stated, the format will speed up to beat the UB control deck so having him in your opening hand makes it a mull to 6. Sure he gives your guys trample and uncounter-ability but those abilities are almost only good versus Elspeth and various control decks.
Instead of those sub-par maindeck cards try some walkers like Chandra, Xenagos or Sarkhan. They offer reusable advantage and can virtually gain you life.
With this "protect the queen" strategy, would you just want to play temur control and run planeswalkers which seem like they'd be better queens then Surrak?
1. Shaman of the great hunt
2. Crater's claws, lightning strike, stubborn denial, polukranos
3. pretty much any temur colored cards, except flamewake Phoenix
4. Not main-deckable but could be 1-2 in the sideboard
5. I predict it will only be maindeck in control
6. No, going over the enemy is our evasion
7. Rec sage or polis crusher, mostly only creature based removal
@Afosz Fruit of the First Tree seems like a trap, especially with all the exile based removal that is and will be prevalent. It also gums up the 4 drop slot.
Yes but Whisperer is almost strictly worse then Caryatid, and it dies to any removal spell. Regarding the mana base issues I run this, (See below), without any problems. But I think that all the mana bases can all run 1-2 Confluences without to much damage, but I would only do it if you run some number of Coursers.
this is the list i'm currently playing/toying around. It's very stable and i'm surprised about it's speed.
However, i love courser but i wanna try to make this deck even more aggro, putting maybe a playset of fanatic of xenagos instead of her.
Thoughts?
Try Rabblemaster in for Courser if you need to go more aggressive. And put Wild Slash over Magma Jet, it can go to the face and creatures, It is pure value.
I think Outburst would be better as aBoon Satyr, but it doesn't have synergy with Rabblemaster or treasure cruise. I think going up yo 4 yavimaya coast and 1 shivan reef can offset the need to use mana confluence, as out mana is already fairly great.
Just based on his stats, I rarely see opponents wincing at a Boon Satyr, which comes down a turn earlier but swings at the same time as the Shaman. There are so many ways to take care of a 4/2 body. The pump ability on the Shaman could be relevant, but I'd be surprised. It's an ability we've seen before, and it's usually dismissed as a win-more ability that only goes off because you had a better board state to begin with. If you want a good example of a relevant pump ability, look at that gorgeous white-green dragon. Bolster on him is uhhhhmazing. Finally, the card draw ability is just too expensive to really matter unless you're playing a control variant of Temur that is holding open mana for counterspells - and I don't think that's what Temur wants to do to begin with.
I'd just as soon play a Polukranos with a beefier body and eat an opponent's creature the next turn.
I think the draw card ability is nice when you get to topdeck mode and you have a few power 4+ guys out and a bunch of mana dorks. I think the draw card is good for most Temur decks, because there is always a super grindy matchup versus abzan and drawing more could seal the game. But I disgress I think his pump is the best feature "leveling up" your mana dorks even if they get in once or twice.
How is the Shaman worse then a Polukranos in a low cmc temur deck? It pumps your guys and draws cards? You would be more R then G but getting all that power seems like a fair trade off. And his ability will trigger even if he'd doesn't attack. But I can see an argument where they go turn 2 or 3 Courser and you can't ever swing with him. essentially timewalking you.
Okay moving the topic away from Ascendancy, since people are clearly split on it. What do we take out or shift around to add Shaman of the Great Hunt, Whisperwood Elemental, Monastery Siege, and Yasova Dragonclaw. Obviously the cards get less playable as the list goes on.
I think cutting out the top end (5+ drops) and making the deck more lean is the way to go with the Sorcerer, it seems like he wants to follow up a Rabblemaster or Knuckleblade then draw cards to close the game out quickly.
What I've heard and agreed with is that Whisperwood is good for the more aggressive matchups, as it kills all of tokens as burns x/1's and x/2's. And when you Manifest a hooded hydra you can flip it for GG and still get the counters!
Siege just seems like gas against control, but the matchup is already good to begin with.
The new Khan appears to get better if you can beef her up, but unfortunatly there are not a lot of cost effective ways to do that in standard at the moment.
Be on the lookout for the RG Legendary Dragon, I really hope she won't dissipation. Maybe its like "Ferocious - Whenever a Dragon you control attacks, search your library for a creature with power 4 for or greater, reveal it, and put in onto the battlefield tapped and attacking or put in into your hand."
With Temur I want to be casting guys every turn that are threats or ramp me into threats. And as I've said before, what happens when you don't draw that Ascendancy at the beginning of the game, then you risk drawing it later when that card could've been a threat.
I'd drop Pulse, Altar and and Time Sieve (if you get to a point to take infinite turns, seems like you may have already won) and replace them with FoW main (unless your local meta has no combo).
Seems like you might want your 4th FoW, and 4th Ancestral Visions main also, which I would drop Vaults for perhaps? I might also try running Ponder in place of Vault. It's cheaper and replaces itself. I could see Vault being more useful for combo decks, but you loose card advantage which seems like your goal.
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I don't think I can drop the pulse, with no way to remove things MB outside of Force makes the deck weak when it loses the counter wars.
I agree, Temur ascendancy is a card that asks to make you feel bad. Early game is messes up your curve, and late game it is worse then a basic land. Also Kibler's list this week is garbage, I fail to see how it can beat any other deck in the format; save UB control and other tier 2 decks.
Instead of those sub-par maindeck cards try some walkers like Chandra, Xenagos or Sarkhan. They offer reusable advantage and can virtually gain you life.
2. Crater's claws, lightning strike, stubborn denial, polukranos
3. pretty much any temur colored cards, except flamewake Phoenix
4. Not main-deckable but could be 1-2 in the sideboard
5. I predict it will only be maindeck in control
6. No, going over the enemy is our evasion
7. Rec sage or polis crusher, mostly only creature based removal
@Afosz Fruit of the First Tree seems like a trap, especially with all the exile based removal that is and will be prevalent. It also gums up the 4 drop slot.
3 Mountain
2 Shivan Reef
3 Frontier Bivouac
4 Yavimaya Coast
4 Temple of Abandon
2 Wooded Foothills
2 Temple of Mystery
Try Rabblemaster in for Courser if you need to go more aggressive. And put Wild Slash over Magma Jet, it can go to the face and creatures, It is pure value.
I think the draw card ability is nice when you get to topdeck mode and you have a few power 4+ guys out and a bunch of mana dorks. I think the draw card is good for most Temur decks, because there is always a super grindy matchup versus abzan and drawing more could seal the game. But I disgress I think his pump is the best feature "leveling up" your mana dorks even if they get in once or twice.
I think cutting out the top end (5+ drops) and making the deck more lean is the way to go with the Sorcerer, it seems like he wants to follow up a Rabblemaster or Knuckleblade then draw cards to close the game out quickly.
What I've heard and agreed with is that Whisperwood is good for the more aggressive matchups, as it kills all of tokens as burns x/1's and x/2's. And when you Manifest a hooded hydra you can flip it for GG and still get the counters!
Siege just seems like gas against control, but the matchup is already good to begin with.
The new Khan appears to get better if you can beef her up, but unfortunatly there are not a lot of cost effective ways to do that in standard at the moment.
Be on the lookout for the RG Legendary Dragon, I really hope she won't dissipation. Maybe its like "Ferocious - Whenever a Dragon you control attacks, search your library for a creature with power 4 for or greater, reveal it, and put in onto the battlefield tapped and attacking or put in into your hand."
I don't think I can drop the pulse, with no way to remove things MB outside of Force makes the deck weak when it loses the counter wars.