Yeah, for sure, I realize this is finalized long before the other stuff happened, I was just pointing at that at this point that middle line of text is basically moot. I mean it shares the same problem that Drannith Magistrate now has, in Standard at least. It's basically useless.
the creature half of adventure cards cast from exile. also i’m not saying the deck is great but i’ve seen a mono u build on arena recently that features gadwick, maybe it has a home there? i also agree with the idea that the discard outlet could be its main function and every other feature just extra goodies.
i understand the people upset that this card doesn’t fulfill their flavor expectations, or were excited for a new edh card. i do not understand people claiming the card is bad (at least in standard), if rdw stays as it is currently he nearly shuts them down (especially the cavalcade versions), not to mention shutting down cat/oven and just generally hindering any creature strategy. in standard he either belongs in a black devotion list, (possibly sb), or in control also possibly sb, but i’d play it main bo1 it is far too good at shutting down the two best aggro decks in standard for it to be getting the hate it is.
hello, considering redeeming for this deck on arena, i’m curious about your game 1 against rdw. looking at both your original post and your update, i think you are definitely moving in the right direction. i typically play best of one, but i’m also curious about including cry in the sb, seems antisynergistic.
additional question, if you were to play the same deck bo1 what changes would you make to the mb, if any?
i had imagined some number of nightveil predator in the sb, but if you consider that card core you could replace dreamcaller siren. i excluded doom whisperer partially for curve, partially for budget, but if you have the one, could be worth cutting some things to add a land or two and the one whisperer.
this is my attempt at a super budget ($22 without sb) version of cycling, mana base improvements would be the obvious first step to improving the deck, if you had a better mana base including cast out would be a great option.
the main gimmick here is trying to use U cost cycle spells to get out a turn 3 hollow one and/or quickly power up a vile manifestation or shadowstorm vizier
This is a budget brew i've been working on which attempts to take advantage of powerful cards like Ammit Eternal with draw backs that can be exploited for benefit with hapatra, vizier of poisons and obelisk spider. The deck's price tag with side board comes to just over 30$, with obvious upgrades to be made in the mana base. I haven't had a chance to test yet, hopefully will within the next day or so. All feed back is welcome, including nonbudget upgrades
another note i excluded nest of scarabs from my main deck because of feeling it was probably too low impact but it does probably deserve sb slots for quick recovery vs control.
so quick priority question, if you exile coco with spell queller, and then they kill spell queller when you have an avacyn out, would she flip first or would they cast coco first?
i just ordered some missing pieces to get this deck online, after having tested it a bit i was very impressed by the how the deck performed, and it's cost. i made a couple alterations to the orginal list, but ultimately am much fonder of the orginal direction than the one that utilizes from under the floorboards. here is my take:
The main difference lies in my choice to mb gaea's revenge, a choice i made because i worry about going to time often, and from what i've seen, although obviously a card for the control mu, it works well as a finisher vs aggro, once board dominance is obtained, it dodges almost all standard removal especially the types any noncontrol deck would play. also i agree wholeheartedly with the op's choice to drop to one alms of the vein, i never wanted to see two and never had any problem getting it after i dropped it to one. besides that i like grasp of darkness more than ultimate price and, while far from ideal, i like the ability to stack them vs things niether price nor grasp can kill alone. because of a slightly diminshed ability to kill X/5+ i decided to bump ruinous path to 4, which i think might also be necessary vs pw heavy decks, and i like how it offers the deck another, although bad, way to close the game.
my sb is still very loose, i know i want at least 1X virulent plague and a second seasons past for anything running discard, i'll probably end up with infinite obliteration as a one of, besides those we have various narrow removal spells, extra numbers of mb cards. kalitas seems good, but i have my reservations, anyone have any feelings on him, and which match ups (more specifically than aggro) that he really shines vs? also while i don't play from under the floorboards i enjoy the idea of risen executioner as beat stick vs control out of the board, once they have sbed all their exile removal, he can also help diversify the win con package so well timed discard doesn't hose us.
also cockatrice still seemed good in playtesting, if i could have more chimeras it probably wouldn't be neccessary but as it stands he serves the purpose very well.
i could try playtesting dictate though i think it would probably favor low curve aggro decks, who are more like to draw threat after threat, as jank as i know it is the thought to splash black to play dictate with notion thief had crossed my mind ^.^'
i'm about to playtest a refined list, i'll post results and the updated list with sb.
the creature half of adventure cards cast from exile. also i’m not saying the deck is great but i’ve seen a mono u build on arena recently that features gadwick, maybe it has a home there? i also agree with the idea that the discard outlet could be its main function and every other feature just extra goodies.
additional question, if you were to play the same deck bo1 what changes would you make to the mb, if any?
4 nightveil sprite
4 kitesail freebooter
4 warkite marauder
4 thief of sanity
2 dreamcaller siren
2 spell pierce
4 curious obsession
4 dead weight
2 chart a course
2 cast down
4 drowned catacomb
7 island
5 swamp
i had imagined some number of nightveil predator in the sb, but if you consider that card core you could replace dreamcaller siren. i excluded doom whisperer partially for curve, partially for budget, but if you have the one, could be worth cutting some things to add a land or two and the one whisperer.
4 enigma drake
4 cryptic serpent
4 opt
4 crash through
2 unsummon
2 spell pierce
4 shock
4 chart a course
4 strategic planning
4 lightning strike
1 vance's blasting cannons
2 evolving wilds
1 hostile desert
9 island
3 mountain
the main gimmick here is trying to use U cost cycle spells to get out a turn 3 hollow one and/or quickly power up a vile manifestation or shadowstorm vizier
4 vile manifestation
2 vizier of tumbling sands
4 nimble obstructionist
4 curator of mysteries
4 hollow one
3 archfiend of ifnir
1 abandoned sarcophagus
4 hieroglyphic illumination
1 new perspectives
4 desert of the glorified
4 desert of the mindful
4 submerged boneyard
2 ipnu rivulet
2 ifnir deadlands
7 island
2 swamp
new perspectives probably doesn't belong here, and i'm unsure about the land numbers without testing, to play up the gimmick more vizier of tumbling sands and/or without weakness could be solid choices.
This is a budget brew i've been working on which attempts to take advantage of powerful cards like Ammit Eternal with draw backs that can be exploited for benefit with hapatra, vizier of poisons and obelisk spider. The deck's price tag with side board comes to just over 30$, with obvious upgrades to be made in the mana base. I haven't had a chance to test yet, hopefully will within the next day or so. All feed back is welcome, including nonbudget upgrades
another note i excluded nest of scarabs from my main deck because of feeling it was probably too low impact but it does probably deserve sb slots for quick recovery vs control.
4 hapatra, vizier of poisons
4 channeler initiate
4 ammit eternal
4 obelisk spider
2 plague belcher
4 attune with aether
4 hapatra's mark
2 shed weakness
4 grind // dust
3 driven // despair
4 aether hub
4 hashep oasis
4 foul orchard
1 swamp
4 forest
4 stinging shot
2 hour of glory
4 lay bare the heart
2 yahenni's expertise
3 lost legacy
idea for version with scorpion god (37$, without sb)
4 servant of the conduit
4 channeler initiate
4 ammit eternal
4 obelisk spider
2 plague belcher
3 the scorpion god
3 hapatra's mark
3 grind // dust
3 driven // despair
4 ifnir deadlands
4 aether hub
4 hashep oasis
4 foul orchard
1 cinder barrens
1 swamp
4 forest
4x Transgress the Mind
2x Ultimate Price
4x Grasp of Darkness
1x Alms of the Vein
1x Mind Rot
3x Read the Bones
4x Ruinous Path
1x Pulse of Murasa
3x Languish
4x Dark Petition
1x Nissa's Renewal
1x Seasons Past
1x Behold the Beyond
1x Gaea's Revenge
4x Llanowar wastes
4x Evolving Wilds
2x Blighted Fen
8x Swamp
3x Forest
The main difference lies in my choice to mb gaea's revenge, a choice i made because i worry about going to time often, and from what i've seen, although obviously a card for the control mu, it works well as a finisher vs aggro, once board dominance is obtained, it dodges almost all standard removal especially the types any noncontrol deck would play. also i agree wholeheartedly with the op's choice to drop to one alms of the vein, i never wanted to see two and never had any problem getting it after i dropped it to one. besides that i like grasp of darkness more than ultimate price and, while far from ideal, i like the ability to stack them vs things niether price nor grasp can kill alone. because of a slightly diminshed ability to kill X/5+ i decided to bump ruinous path to 4, which i think might also be necessary vs pw heavy decks, and i like how it offers the deck another, although bad, way to close the game.
my sb is still very loose, i know i want at least 1X virulent plague and a second seasons past for anything running discard, i'll probably end up with infinite obliteration as a one of, besides those we have various narrow removal spells, extra numbers of mb cards. kalitas seems good, but i have my reservations, anyone have any feelings on him, and which match ups (more specifically than aggro) that he really shines vs? also while i don't play from under the floorboards i enjoy the idea of risen executioner as beat stick vs control out of the board, once they have sbed all their exile removal, he can also help diversify the win con package so well timed discard doesn't hose us.
also cockatrice still seemed good in playtesting, if i could have more chimeras it probably wouldn't be neccessary but as it stands he serves the purpose very well.
i'm about to playtest a refined list, i'll post results and the updated list with sb.